A look back at Thiem's 2020 run in Big hardcourt tournaments

[NoleFam]

I know that it's kind of the "in thing" to put down Thiem these days since he hasn't played well at all this year, but let's not forget the level he played last year.


Australian Open - Result = Final

Beat 3 top players in route to the final (Monfils, Nadal and Zverev) and took Djokovic to 5. I think it's the best Slam final he has played in his career and it was on a faster hardcourt too, something that Thiem struggled on earlier in his career, and I think it's the best hardcourt Slam he has played from beginning to end.

US Open - Result = Winner

This is his only Slam win of course although it's surrounded by controversy for the obvious reason but let's not leave out how well Thiem played this tournament. He only dropped one set going into the final. The final was not a good level but let's not forget his impressive takedown of one of the best hardcourt players of the new generation, Medvedev.

ATP Finals - Result = Final

He played exceptionally well here (minus that dead rubber match against Rublev) but for the 2nd year in a row, he lost another thriller in the final. He had impressive takedowns of Djokovic and Nadal, and avenged his loss to Tsitsipas here last year, but Medvedev was waiting and edged him in the final.

So to my fellow Djokovic fans, I know you hate that he got defaulted and feel he had a great chance at the USO, but it would have been a travesty for Thiem not to win one of these titles considering how well he played on hardcourt last year. So I'm not that upset about it now looking back on it. It wasn't meant to be, and I do hope Thiem gets back on track because he's great for the game when he plays like this.

 

[Nadal_King]

Thiem not at his best is seriously not good for Tennis, me as Rafa fan think with thiem struggling rafa may have 1 less challnger at Us open as apart from Djokovic I consider a well playing thiem biggest threat to Rafa, I hooe he gets into peak form in time for Us open

 

[Third Serve]

Thiem-Zverev at the AO is an underrated match, certainly better than their US Open match later on in the year.

 

[The Blond Blur]

Basically, he plays well to make big HC Fs and then MUGS them up, with the exception of the USO where he got out MUGGED.

Disgust.

 

[NoleFam]

Thiem-Zverev at the AO is an underrated match, certainly better than their US Open match later on in the year.

Agreed. Zverev's serve was on in that match too. His serve percentage was like 80%.

 

[Third Serve]

Agreed. Zverev's serve was on in that match too. His serve percentage was like 80%.

A little sad to see how few pages that match thread got lol

 

[Jonesy]

Sad that Thiem run out of juice after last year. Djokovic always had good matches against him.

 

[Third Serve]

Sad that Thiem run out of juice after last year. Djokovic always had good matches against him.

Yeah, they've usually had tight matches. Their match at the ATP Finals in 2019 was easily their best, though.

 

[Kralingen]

Thiem-Zverev at the AO is an underrated match, certainly better than their US Open match later on in the year.

Especially considering the brutal match Thiem had just played with Nadal in the QF.

AO2020 was far, far from a weak Slam in terms of entertainment and level. It saddens me whenever I see people call it a “vultured weak era Slam” - it was one of my favorites in years. Thiem was ridiculous at times. I don’t know why people lack appreciation for it.

 

[Third Serve]

Especially considering the brutal match Thiem had just played with Nadal in the QF.

AO2020 was far, far from a weak Slam in terms of entertainment and level. It saddens me whenever I see people call it a “vultured weak era Slam” - it was one of my favorites in years. Thiem was ridiculous at times. I don’t know why people lack appreciation for it.

I think it's ultimately that Djokovic was ripe for the picking in that final and Theim faltered once he had the finish line in his sights. You could see him getting a bit nervous there. In the end, though, it was a good tournament for him and he reeled off some nice wins in the QF-SF. 2020 AO was quite an enjoyable tournament for me, personally, even if the quality of tennis wasn't the best I'd seen.

 

[NoleFam]

A little sad to see how few pages that match thread got lol

I know right. No love for Thiem on this board?

 

[Rosstour]

Thiem not at his best is seriously not good for Tennis, me as Rafa fan think with thiem struggling rafa may have 1 less challnger at Us open as apart from Djokovic I consider a well playing thiem biggest threat to Rafa, I hooe he gets into peak form in time for Us open

Why? Thiem isn't that good. The sooner he stops clogging the way for the vastly more talented young players, the better.

 

[Third Serve]

Why? Thiem isn't that good. The sooner he stops clogging the way for the vastly more talented young players, the better.

None of the next gen have even surpassed Thiem yet ROFLMAO

there’s still time, I suppose

 

[El_Yotamo]

Make no mistake, Thiem being nonexistent in 2021 is a huge factor for why it's been so poor. I know I know he probably wouldn't have won a big final (though maybe he would've who knows), but still his game is great and he can beat the very best on the biggest stages. I miss him

 

[Rosstour]

Make no mistake, Thiem being nonexistent in 2021 is a huge factor for why it's been so poor. I know I know he probably wouldn't have won a big final (though maybe he would've who knows), but still his game is great and he can beat the very best on the biggest stages. I miss him

If he can beat the best on the biggest stages then why didn't he?

He's been to four Slam finals and was lucky to win that one because Zverev was obviously the better player and choked. The others...he took one set off Rafa in two meetings and took Djok to 5. But was never really close to winning.

 

[El_Yotamo]

If he can beat the best on the biggest stages then why didn't he?

He's been to four Slam finals and was lucky to win that one because Zverev was obviously the better player and choked. The others...he took one set off Rafa in two meetings and took Djok to 5. But was never really close to winning.

Slam finals are not the only big stage. And tbh you just seem like a Thiem hater so I don't see a need to continue this discussion with you since it'll obviously go nowhere...

 

[Hitman]

Yes, The Prince of HC.

 

[Poisoned Slice]

I know right. No love for Thiem on this board?

Meles is not around much these days.

 

[Rosstour]

Slam finals are not the only big stage. And tbh you just seem like a Thiem hater so I don't see a need to continue this discussion with you since it'll obviously go nowhere...

I just think he is massively overrated and his ascent to the top of the game has been treated as an inevitability. I don't understand that. He hits a nice ball but his mechanics are bad and his court coverage isn't elite. He isn't the player he's hyped up to be and we've already seen his best.

 

[NoleFam]

Meles is not around much these days.

Yea he disappeared and I haven't seen him in months. @ForehandCross is our new designated Thiem fan so I look forward to his appearance here.

 

[NoleFam]

If he can beat the best on the biggest stages then why didn't he?

He's been to four Slam finals and was lucky to win that one because Zverev was obviously the better player and choked. The others...he took one set off Rafa in two meetings and took Djok to 5. But was never really close to winning.

Well he did beat Federer for his IW title..lol

 

[Rosstour]

Well he did beat Federer for his IW title..lol

That's not the "biggest stages" though. Slams are.

 

[NoleFam]

That's not the "biggest stages" though. Slams are.

I know and pulling your chain a bit there. I do think you are wrong about Thiem though. His movement is one of the best on the tour when he's fit and playing well, and he improved immensely on the hardcourt surface under Massu, when he used to get rushed a lot on medium and faster hardcourt.

 

[Rosstour]

I know and pulling your chain a bit there. I do think you are wrong about Thiem though. His movement is one of the best on the tour when he's fit and playing well, and he improved immensely on the hardcourt surface under Massu, when he used to get rushed a lot on medium and faster hardcourt.

lol gotcha. He's in good shape but is not an explosive mover. He has actually sort of talked about this. He knows he wasn't born with the legs the Big 3 have.

 

[Deleted member 771911]

In tennis, you are only as good as your last match. Can't be living on past glories.

 

[Dominic & Andrey]

As a Thiem fan this year is tough, I have no real hopes for this season now but I wish he will come back strong in 2022

 

[ND-13]

Not convinced. He is soon going to be 30 and does not have a single slam win beating even aged versions of Nadal and Djokovic.

 

[Rosstour]

Not convinced. He is soon going to be 30 and does not have a single slam win beating even aged versions of Nadal and Djokovic.

That's what I've been saying, he's done. We've already seen his best tennis.

 

[ForehandCross]

Nice thread Nolefam!

Been saying that his downfall has helped it make it a lot easier for Djokovic, not that he may not be winning ways much as he has, he just would have found it a little tougher, and Thiem might have reached finals of both AO and RG in his regular form. It will be much harder to unsettle Thiem like Medvedev in AO and also come back from 0-2 down on clay against Thiem. Djokovic might have lost 1 of the two.



I loved that you acknowledge that Thiem was going to be a big challenge in USOF of last year. Actually he played at an omnious level upto finals but the fact that he very well be winning his first slam there overwhelmed him and that ruined his finals level.



Those who keep saying he won't have been a factor, didn't see that he reached a scary balance where he could outright ball bash and still be consistent. And that's exactly why you saw him take tight TBers against Djokovic and Nadal.


Thieves present injury is most unfortunate as in the 7 games he played on grass on Mallorca were really good. He finally looked he had power and speed,still not by much, but the kind of harrowing level of play he has been this year) .



Thiem is genuinely a good guy, but there is one thing I noticed in his USO celebration: he was impatient in holding the trophy and a little too happy with himself than feeling for Sascha. Now, one can celebrate the slam win and let the moment be theirs, BUT Thiem is considerate and usually he never ever would forget Sascha stands next to him AND after such a defeat . They are best buddies.


This was weird and now I think showed how utterly deep his desire to win a slam ran. Given how big 3 presence always meant slams were near impossible to win, he probably had only thought of somehow winning win.


What to do afterwards was never thought about.


The USO F might have also broken him physically as he was struggling with cramps in the end, and still willed himself to win.


His level on HC is a result of improved consistency under Massu. More on that later.

 

[ForehandCross]

Not convinced. He is soon going to be 30 and does not have a single slam win beating even aged versions of Nadal and Djokovic.

The guy isn't Federer. He is still 27( going 28) A good two years away from 30 and this era players have done well in that age range

 

[ND-13]

The guy isn't Federer. He is still 27( going 28) A good two years away from 30 and this era players have done well in that age range

He will be worth discussing when he is the top favorite to win a major. Till such time, he is one more who needs a backdoor entry to win something. Wonder when that is going to be. Pretty sure it is not while Nadal and Djokovic are active.

 

[The Guru]

When do rankings start to work like normal (not like this half off BS) because if that kicks in soon Thiem's going to have a rough road back to the top of the game.

 

[MichaelNadal]

Short version of the thread:

"How Djokovic sucked the life out of me too"

 

[NoleFam]

When do rankings start to work like normal (not like this half off BS) because if that kicks in soon Thiem's going to have a rough road back to the top of the game.

I think until August or September.

 

[NoleFam]

Also to add to this thread, what Thiem pulled off in 2020 by making the finals of the 3 biggest hardcourt tournaments in the world in the same year is very rare. Even ATGs couldn't do it like Sampras, Agassi, Edberg, Wilander and Becker. The only ones I can think of who actually did it are Federer and Djokovic. Lendl made the finals of all 3 in 1983 but AO was played on grass then and ATP Finals was on carpet.

Federer - 2004, 2006, 2007
Djokovic - 2012, 2013, 2015, 2016
Thiem - 2020

 

[The Guru]

Also to add to this thread, what Thiem pulled off in 2020 by making the finals of the 3 biggest hardcourt tournaments in the world in the same year is very rare. Even ATGs couldn't do it like Sampras, Agassi, Edberg, Wilander and Becker. The only ones I can think of who actually did it are Federer and Djokovic. Lendl made the finals of all 3 in 1983 but AO was played on grass then and ATP Finals was on carpet.

Federer - 2004, 2006, 2007
Djokovic - 2012, 2013, 2015, 2016
Thiem - 2020

I miss good Thiem. I'm not a fan per se but he's a good hard working guy and he's fun to watch. Field's just not as fun without him contending.

 

[D.Nalby12]

Last year Thiem indeed looked like another Murray level player in making. He was playing very consistent Tennis and his level was very high. Unfortunately his career has now derailed too soon

 

[NoleFam]

I miss good Thiem. I'm not a fan per se but he's a good hard working guy and he's fun to watch. Field's just not as fun without him contending.

He's my favorite after Djokovic and I love his game. I liked it more once he learned to hone his power and play with more margins, and strategy. I hope that won't be short lived because his level was so high last year, except clay which is ironic because it's his best surface. Lol

 

[NoleFam]

Nice thread Nolefam!

Been saying that his downfall has helped it make it a lot easier for Djokovic, not that he may not be winning ways much as he has, he just would have found it a little tougher, and Thiem might have reached finals of both AO and RG in his regular form. It will be much harder to unsettle Thiem like Medvedev in AO and also come back from 0-2 down on clay against Thiem. Djokovic might have lost 1 of the two.



I loved that you acknowledge that Thiem was going to be a big challenge in USOF of last year. Actually he played at an omnious level upto finals but the fact that he very well be winning his first slam there overwhelmed him and that ruined his finals level.



Those who keep saying he won't have been a factor, didn't see that he reached a scary balance where he could outright ball bash and still be consistent. And that's exactly why you saw him take tight TBers against Djokovic and Nadal.


Thieves present injury is most unfortunate as in the 7 games he played on grass on Mallorca were really good. He finally looked he had power and speed,still not by much, but the kind of harrowing level of play he has been this year) .



Thiem is genuinely a good guy, but there is one thing I noticed in his USO celebration: he was impatient in holding the trophy and a little too happy with himself than feeling for Sascha. Now, one can celebrate the slam win and let the moment be theirs, BUT Thiem is considerate and usually he never ever would forget Sascha stands next to him AND after such a defeat . They are best buddies.


This was weird and now I think showed how utterly deep his desire to win a slam ran. Given how big 3 presence always meant slams were near impossible to win, he probably had only thought of somehow winning win.


What to do afterwards was never thought about.


The USO F might have also broken him physically as he was struggling with cramps in the end, and still willed himself to win.


His level on HC is a result of improved consistency under Massu. More on that later.

Yea his level falling off definitely has helped Djokovic this year. I can't even deny that and I would say especially at RG where along with Nadal, he has been Djokovic's biggest obstacle there. Tsitsipas was tough but Thiem would have been tougher in top form especially in warm and sunny weather, like it was in the final, where the ball flies through the court more. Plus Thiem has a much more dangerous backhand.

That was the key to his success last year. He was able to be very aggressive and consistent at the same time on hardcourt. In the past, he was just ballbashing and not using his head much out there but not last year as he played very smart, and played more percentage and unloaded on balls where he had the opening. I was quite impressed with his takedown of Medvedev at the USO to be frank because I picked Medvedev before that match.

I didn't notice anything in the USO trophy ceremony last year but I do think he is in a funk and having a letdown after finally winning a Slam. I think mentally that year took something out of him and he's having trouble motivating himself. It's unfortunate that he has this injury as he was trying to get back on track. I do think he will get back to top level though but I hope sooner than later.

 

[King No1e]

I know that it's kind of the "in thing" to put down Thiem these days since he hasn't played well at all this year, but let's not forget the level he played last year.


Australian Open - Result = Final

Beat 3 top players in route to the final (Monfils, Nadal and Zverev) and took Djokovic to 5. I think it's the best Slam final he has played in his career and it was on a faster hardcourt too, something that Thiem struggled on earlier in his career, and I think it's the best hardcourt Slam he has played from beginning to end.

US Open - Result = Winner

This is his only Slam win of course although it's surrounded by controversy for the obvious reason but let's not leave out how well Thiem played this tournament. He only dropped one set going into the final. The final was not a good level but let's not forget his impressive takedown of one of the best hardcourt players of the new generation, Medvedev.

ATP Finals - Result = Final

He played exceptionally well here (minus that dead rubber match against Rublev) but for the 2nd year in a row, he lost another thriller in the final. He had impressive takedowns of Djokovic and Nadal, and avenged his loss to Tsitsipas here last year, but Medvedev was waiting and edged him in the final.

So to my fellow Djokovic fans, I know you hate that he got defaulted and feel he had a great chance at the USO, but it would have been a travesty for Thiem not to win one of these titles considering how well he played on hardcourt last year. So I'm not that upset about it now looking back on it. It wasn't meant to be, and I do hope Thiem gets back on track because he's great for the game when he plays like this.

I was a little upset about the USO win because I thought his recent string of bad results was due to a long mental hangover. If he just got finished off by Zverev at USO, he might've had more motivation to show up at Chatrier in Thieminator mode and blow Nadal off the court, in front of fans. Would've been more satisfying than just waiting out a Zverev self-implosion in an empty stadium (and haters endlessly putting asterisks on it).

Now it's clear that wasn't the case. Can't be too picky anyway, because a win is a win is a win.

 

[King No1e]

Yea his level falling off definitely has helped Djokovic this year. I can't even deny that and I would say especially at RG where along with Nadal, he has been Djokovic's biggest obstacle there. Tsitsipas was tough but Thiem would have been tougher in top form especially in warm and sunny weather, like it was in the final, where the ball flies through the court more. Plus Thiem has a much more dangerous backhand.

That was the key to his success last year. He was able to be very aggressive and consistent at the same time on hardcourt. In the past, he was just ballbashing and not using his head much out there but not last year as he played very smart, and played more percentage and unloaded on balls where he had the opening. I was quite impressed with his takedown of Medvedev at the USO to be frank because I picked Medvedev before that match.

I didn't notice anything in the USO trophy ceremony last year but I do think he is in a funk and having a letdown after finally winning a Slam. I think mentally that year took something out of him and he's having trouble motivating himself. It's unfortunate that he has this injury as he was trying to get back on track. I do think he will get back to top level though but I hope sooner than later.

This is true. Peak Thiem wouldn't have let Djokovic even pick off a set that day, much less 3. A nervous start like that would've been lethal for Djokovic.

 

[NoleFam]

I was a little upset about the USO win because I thought his recent string of bad results was due to a long mental hangover. If he just got finished off by Zverev at USO, he might've had more motivation to show up at Chatrier in Thieminator mode and blow Nadal off the court, in front of fans. Would've been more satisfying than just waiting out a Zverev self-implosion in an empty stadium (and haters endlessly putting asterisks on it).

Now it's clear that wasn't the case. Can't be too picky anyway, because a win is a win is a win.

It was a terrible match to say the least with choking all over the place. Both were nervous with trying to get their 1st Slam win and I think Thiem felt pressure of being the favorite to win that, and Zverev was tight and nervous because it was his 1st time in a Slam final and so much was on the line. I was glad Thiem won but I didn't expect his level to drop like it has after the ATP finals.

Yea he's the rightful winner of that USO.

 

[NoleFam]

This is true. Peak Thiem wouldn't have let Djokovic even pick off a set that day, much less 3. A nervous start like that would've been lethal for Djokovic.

Djokovic would have made a match of it, plus I think he would have felt more urgency to grab that 1st set, but it would have harder to pull that off against Thiem than Tsitsipas. Then again, Tsitsipas versus Thiem in SF would have been a brutal match and they would have killed each other I think, so Thiem would have felt a little tired as well like Djokovic was in the final.

 

[ForehandCross]

Thiem's injury might be a blessing in disguise. I am hoping that this helps him clear his mind. But this might also frustrate him furthermore.


Hopefully he uses the time off and mentally recharges himself. From what I have read he might come back by USO but it's a race against time.

 

[King No1e]

Djokovic would have made a match of it, plus I think he would have felt more urgency to grab that 1st set, but it would have harder to pull that off against Thiem than Tsitsipas. Then again, Tsitsipas versus Thiem in SF would have been a brutal match and they would have killed each other I think, so Thiem would have felt a little tired as well like Djokovic was in the final.

If Thiem had actually managed to get himself into the semis (given what we now know about his injuries), Tsitsipas wouldn't have much to worry about. Peak Thiem however...completely different story. Would've probably made quick work of Tsitsipas in the SF and if Djokovic started the way he did this year, would've run away with the final, too.

 

[NoleFam]

If Thiem had actually managed to get himself into the semis (given what we now know about his injuries), Tsitsipas wouldn't have much to worry about. Peak Thiem however...completely different story. Would've probably made quick work of Tsitsipas in the SF and if Djokovic started the way he did this year, would've run away with the final, too.

No I don't even think peak Thiem makes quick work of the Tsitsipas that played at RG this year. He would definitely have had to work for it but I would pick him to win in the end. Tsitsipas is going to be a RG champion and I think more than once, and is only getting better. I thought Thiem would be the one to win a RG 1st after the Nadal era at RG ended but it may end up being Tsitsipas, especially if Thiem doesn't find his clay game again. This is two years in a row now where he was disappointing at RG.

 

[yokied]

This was slow court weak era trollery and frankly Med does it better.

He won’t be back at the top of the game until 2024 at the earliest. He needs to accept the scale of his stupidity and failures, that he has ground himself into the dirt for no real result. Maybe then he can accept that playing tennis without a plan is not playing tennis at all and commit to playing smart and playing to win. From that point, get a new coach, or listen to his coach, and get his idiot father out of the picture, then starting what is necessary will flow from there.

If he wants to continue at the top level, he needs a full rebuild, with abbreviated swings and better footwork yielding better timing, court positioning and all-round tactics and point construction, also better serve. In other words, the works. In otherer words, do what he should’ve done when transitioning out of the juniors or at the latest 2018 when he had entered physical prime yet was still getting pantsed by the geriatrics.

So 2024 at the earliest but probably more like 2025 AO.

 

[Subway Tennis]

I know that it's kind of the "in thing" to put down Thiem these days since he hasn't played well at all this year, but let's not forget the level he played last year.


Australian Open - Result = Final

Beat 3 top players in route to the final (Monfils, Nadal and Zverev) and took Djokovic to 5. I think it's the best Slam final he has played in his career and it was on a faster hardcourt too, something that Thiem struggled on earlier in his career, and I think it's the best hardcourt Slam he has played from beginning to end.

US Open - Result = Winner

This is his only Slam win of course although it's surrounded by controversy for the obvious reason but let's not leave out how well Thiem played this tournament. He only dropped one set going into the final. The final was not a good level but let's not forget his impressive takedown of one of the best hardcourt players of the new generation, Medvedev.

ATP Finals - Result = Final

He played exceptionally well here (minus that dead rubber match against Rublev) but for the 2nd year in a row, he lost another thriller in the final. He had impressive takedowns of Djokovic and Nadal, and avenged his loss to Tsitsipas here last year, but Medvedev was waiting and edged him in the final.

So to my fellow Djokovic fans, I know you hate that he got defaulted and feel he had a great chance at the USO, but it would have been a travesty for Thiem not to win one of these titles considering how well he played on hardcourt last year. So I'm not that upset about it now looking back on it. It wasn't meant to be, and I do hope Thiem gets back on track because he's great for the game when he plays like this.

Great analysis. That Thiem vs Medvedev USO 2020 match is bookmarked for me as a great example of what Thiem is capable of when he is really feeling it.

It was a dissection of the Medvedev game. I remember thinking that wow, Thiem was really playing with patience and variety to complement his physicality and ball-striking.

If there was a single shot that exemplified his advancement it was his judicious use of the slice in multiple ways: breaking up Med's rhythm in baseline rallies, luring Med into net, or forcing him into low balls with an awkward contact point.

2020 was a great season for him. There were still question marks for me though. His decision-making and match management and the way he was behaving exposing himself to risks during the height of the pandemic playing unnecessary exhibitions etc etc. Its easy for me to imagine a scenario where Thiem at 27 or 28 gets a lot smarter with his playing schedule and efficiency and wins 5-6 more majors.

Like you say, you can't exactly get too upset about Thiem getting a first time finalist like Zverev as a USO final opponent. He deserves some luck given that his other major finals were all Big 4 guys at their favourite major.

 

[Nadal_King]

Why? Thiem isn't that good. The sooner he stops clogging the way for the vastly more talented young players, the better.

Thiem's talent on Clay>>>>>Any youngster on any surface

 

[Rafa4LifeEver]

Thiem's injury might be a blessing in disguise. I am hoping that this helps him clear his mind. But this might also frustrate him furthermore.


Hopefully he uses the time off and mentally recharges himself. From what I have read he might come back by USO but it's a race against time.

Its a wrist injury for Christ's sake, gentleman.
Thiem is unfortunately done now, I feel for him.