A message from Andy

Deuce

Banned
alienhamster said:
Deuce, I admire your ability to stand by all your opinions despite how many of them contradict historical and textual fact. Keep up the elitism and baseless judgmentalism!
Another whose position is weak, and so must resort to such accusations.

Very nice how you deliberately ignore (many) points to which you have no legitimate reply.
 

FedererUberAlles

Professional
It's obvious when people are losing an argument; When the people have to use ad-hominems against their opposition. Come on, show some respect for Deuce.
 

VamosRafa

Hall of Fame
When you use ad hominems yourself, you invite them back at ya, I think.

But I think people shouldn't use them at all. Doesn't TW say, don't get personal???

E.g., instead of saying, "Susan, you overaged cheerleader (and even worse at times)," someone could say, "Susan, we know you do that Nadal site and that may cloud your view of him, but here's why I think you are wrong . . ."

Now, that may be less exciting than calling me Grandma Nadal and other such things, but I'm getting the sense, in recent threads, that people aren't allthat interested in that. There's been some nice, and even interesting, tennis discussions, which is why I like to visit this board.

PS: I told my Mom that this person on a website thought I was 55 years old (20 years older than Andre). She laughed, and said, "Thank God you aren't. Do you know old that would make me?"
 

PM_

Professional
Steve Dykstra said:
I dont often agree with what Deuce writes either, but the way you go about debating it is ridiculous. Posts like this contribute nothing.
Who's debating what???
This is personal-stay out of it.8)
 

Rabbit

G.O.A.T.
VamosRafa said:
When you use ad hominems yourself, you invite them back at ya, I think.

But I think people shouldn't use them at all. Doesn't TW say, don't get personal???

E.g., instead of saying, "Susan, you overaged cheerleader (and even worse at times)," someone could say, "Susan, we know you do that Nadal site and that may cloud your view of him, but here's why I think you are wrong . . ."

Now, that may be less exciting than calling me Grandma Nadal and other such things, but I'm getting the sense, in recent threads, that people aren't allthat interested in that. There's been some nice, and even interesting, tennis discussions, which is why I like to visit this board.

PS: I told my Mom that this person on a website thought I was 55 years old (20 years older than Andre). She laughed, and said, "Thank God you aren't. Do you know old that would make me?"
OK

Susan, I know that you do that Nadal site and that clouds your view of him, but I think you're wrong.

Well, that did feel good. I have put in bold the changes I made to your seed statement.

Grandma Nadal...now that there's funny, I don't care who you are and props to whoever thought of it. That was worthy of Dedans Penthouse.
 

larrhall

Semi-Pro
For Rabbit and Deuce - the long-ago Battle of the Boards was won. I regret ever having participated. You both need to be authorities here. More than that, you need to control the flow of posts, to root out or perhaps discipline those who don't play by the rules. Long time ago, you formed an alliance that at least in part catalyzed in opposition to me. I think what happened was that I was supposed to be gone, vamoos, but I came back...I came back for the tennis and to share ideas with others on these boards, and to avoid you. But each time...conflict...because both of you basically came after me, and I stand up when attacked. Rabbit, you can't own up to your prejudices. You can't admit mistakes. It's my guess that you asked Don or Chris to remove the thread on losing to future pros because it exposed your bigotry, and that might threaten your position. That is as an 'owner' of the Boards....A long time ago you and Deuce engaged in what seemed a coordinated campaign to 'get me' - you had a great time with it. You won. But you are both so possessive and so screwed up that you needed total victory. All or nothing. To me you are both examples of people who get nothing even when you get everything. Enjoy it.
 

larrhall

Semi-Pro
PS.Anyone who jumps into a polluted pool like letsroll911.org, run by people with an agenda and who will lie endlessly to advance what is, in the end, a fascist agenda, deserve to be 'outed.' So my post in regard to the Glickstein match was my first reference to that - to my knowledge that you hang out with this kind of junk. Which is not to say people shouldn't raise doubts about 911 or not criticize a gov't in any country, but simply to say that I will point out that you ride with haters.
 

Rabbit

G.O.A.T.
larrhall said:
For Rabbit and Deuce - the long-ago Battle of the Boards was won. I regret ever having participated.
Apparently not.

larrhall said:
You both need to be authorities here. More than that, you need to control the flow of posts, to root out or perhaps discipline those who don't play by the rules.
Gee, I wasn't the one sending disgusting, unsolicited e-mails as a form of retribution.

larrhall said:
Long time ago, you formed an alliance that at least in part catalyzed in opposition to me.
Another paranoid dillusion. Please don't flatter yourself.

larrhall said:
I think what happened was that I was supposed to be gone, vamoos, but I came back...I came back for the tennis and to share ideas with others on these boards, and to avoid you.
You retired...you came back....you vowed retirement.....you came back....you swore retirement.....you came back......you guaranteed retirement and a last post.....you came back......I don't think I had anything to do with it. Your idea of sharing includes this? Your idea of avoiding me includes this? You're a liar then.

larrhall said:
But each time...conflict...because both of you basically came after me, and I stand up when attacked.
Gee....did I miss something? I have not directed a comment your way. It was you who jumped ugly with me from nowhere.


larrhall said:
Rabbit, you can't own up to your prejudices.
You're insane.

larrhall said:
You can't admit mistakes. It's my guess that you asked Don or Chris to remove the thread on losing to future pros because it exposed your bigotry, and that might threaten your position.
I asked that it be removed because it, like you, was offensive. The comment had nothing to do with his religous affiliation. You still have not addressed a post I made two days prior regarding my beliefs in faith. You have not done so because it would point you up to be the psychotic ass that you are. The guy's name is Shlomo.....slow mo....get it? Tell you what, for convenience, I'll quote it here:

rabbit said:
I agree completely here. I think Mahboob is wrong here. It is not the victim, but the rapist who is at fault. Also, many of the stories that came out of New Orleans were exaggerated and are not true. I realize that some bad things happened, but I don't think it was as prevalent as some would have us believe, much like the time line for getting back into New Orleans isn't going to be months, or weeks, it'll be days.

Also, the Bible teaches many things. One of which is that Jesus was sent here to free us from the laws that were misused in the Old Testament. With regard to the Ten Commandments, Jesus clearly says that "they were sent to help man, not hinder him". This was in response to working on the Sabbath. Jesus healed on the Sabbath and was accused of working on the Sabbath.

All of the laws, including dietary laws, in Deuteronomy were rescinded when in Acts (ch 11), Peter has a vision of a cloth being let down from heaven. The messsage here is that all that is needed is the Grace of God, not observing laws that were designed with the intent of keeping God's chosen people (Jews) separate from the rest of the world. It is clear that the Grace of God is given to all, Jews and Gentiles alike.

I will not make direct comment on the Muslim faith except to say that all of the arguing between Muslims and Christians and Jews seems to me to be like children arguing who is best; whose father can beat up the other. We all end up in the same place. I will also say that what works spiritually for a Jew may not work for me and vice versa. I see my faith as a tool and my reward as salvation. I know that in the Old Testament and through most of the New, women were second class citizens. The message of Christ is one of love for all people, those you like and more importantly those you do not.

It is not religion, but the misuse of religion that causes problems in this world.
This proves you to be a liar. You embody everything you say you hold in contempt. And, to be sure you get context (something you also lie about) here is the link to the entire thread:

http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?p=570011&highlight=jew#post570011

The whole Glickstein/Vince Van Patten reference(s) has been a running joke on these boards forever. I don't see you jumping up and down about poor old Vince. Fact is, you have a problem with me and you try to paint me as someone evil. It's because you are an idiot who cannot deal with facts that you do this. Violence is the last resort of a limited mind. You are definetly no candidate for MENSA.


larrhall said:
That is as an 'owner' of the Boards....A long time ago you and Deuce engaged in what seemed a coordinated campaign to 'get me' - you had a great time with it.
Must you cover the same paranoid dillusion again? I have never had a great time with anything that concerned you. Do you have any friends? Let's see, Deuce and I have planning sessions is it weekly? I make long distance calls to Canada to discuss with him. What can we do to make our lives miserable? I know, let's roust larrhall out of retirement. Let's make some vague reference to an obscure player as bait and see if he takes it. Please, what a sorry, lonely, pitiful existence you must lead.

larrhall said:
You won. But you are both so possessive and so screwed up that you needed total victory. All or nothing. To me you are both examples of people who get nothing even when you get everything. Enjoy it.
Won what exactly? You're the one who keeps talking about winning/losing. The only losing I see here is you losing your freaking mind.
 

Rabbit

G.O.A.T.
larrhall said:
PS.Anyone who jumps into a polluted pool like letsroll911.org, run by people with an agenda and who will lie endlessly to advance what is, in the end, a fascist agenda, deserve to be 'outed.' So my post in regard to the Glickstein match was my first reference to that - to my knowledge that you hang out with this kind of junk. Which is not to say people shouldn't raise doubts about 911 or not criticize a gov't in any country, but simply to say that I will point out that you ride with haters.
What in the good hell are you talking about? This is a lie and you are a liar. It sounds to me like you're the one spending time on that kind of website.
 
larrhall said:
PS.Anyone who jumps into a polluted pool like letsroll911.org, run by people with an agenda and who will lie endlessly to advance what is, in the end, a fascist agenda, deserve to be 'outed.' So my post in regard to the Glickstein match was my first reference to that - to my knowledge that you hang out with this kind of junk. Which is not to say people shouldn't raise doubts about 911 or not criticize a gov't in any country, but simply to say that I will point out that you ride with haters.
Larry, OMG, I know exactly what you mean! I myself use Lestoil in my everyday cleaning regimen to rid my counter tops of grease, grime and stains. And it works just beautifully on floor tiles as well as bathroom tiles--ridding my bathroom of mold spores and bacteria. Which reminds me, I also use to cut a slit in an old shoe box to serve as a piggy bank when I was a kid. And with the money that I saved, I was able to puchase "The Builder's Guide" which is chock-full of useful tips, e.g. (I love this invaluable gem): the reason you can't put footballs on a terra cotta house with a clay barrell-tiled roof is simple:
ice cream has no bones!


Er....Larry? [size=+4]Exactly what in heaven's name are you talking about??![/size]
 

Noelle

Hall Of Fame
Well, goodbye Andy's message. Hello flame war. Or should I just say a meeting between old frenemies?
 
Noelle said:
Well, goodbye Andy's message. Hello flame war. Or should I just say a meeting between old frenemies?
Andy Roddick said:
Yo Larr~wha R U talkin' about?
Noelle my belle: it appears that Andy's message is back in play again.

Ya all a bunch o' retards!!! :) :) :)

Hey Grandma Nadal, did you swipe my PoliGrip off the night table this mornin' ??
 

Noelle

Hall Of Fame
Rabbit, I think we've all made our points with regard to Andy's message. Any personal vendettas among posters could all just be exiled to Rants & Raves as far as I'm concerned (since, of course, I'm not concerned with them at all :lol: ). Not touching those with a pole the length of the circumference of the Earth.
 

Rabbit

G.O.A.T.
Noelle said:
Rabbit, I think we've all made our points with regard to Andy's message. Any personal vendettas among posters could all just be exiled to Rants & Raves as far as I'm concerned (since, of course, I'm not concerned with them at all :lol: ). Not touching those with a pole the length of the circumference of the Earth.
I'd take it elsewhere. But larrhall brought it here and it was unwarranted and uninvited. I made no reference to him at all.
 

alienhamster

Hall of Fame
Deuce said:
Another whose position is weak, and so must resort to such accusations.

Very nice how you deliberately ignore (many) points to which you have no legitimate reply.
Deuce, with pretty much everything I've argued to you I've backed up with references to people, specific time periods, textual statistics, or a specific text/example/uses of language. I haven't responded to many of the things you've said b/c you've said about 300 really opinionated things. If there's something specific you still want to discuss that I haven't responded to yet I'd be happy to. Just post and that's fine.

The one (critical) point you've repeatedly ignored is that context might dictate that the use of what you call lesser standards might be a better writerly choice. (Or to put it differently, that using the standard isn't always better in every case, even for non-canonical writers). You keep falling back on the opinion that "it just is better" or that "it used to be this way," while neither of these arguments has enough proof or can really be argued. It's fine if it's your opinion--just stop acting like it's fact and history.

It's really ironic how you call someone out for being "weak" after you've taken several cheap shots previously--and this is itself an (unspecific) cheap shot. You got that response from me--that you're elitist and baselessly judgemental--because that's what you've shown yourself to be on this issue. You've made absolutely no attempt to acknowledge where I'm coming from.

I think you made some good points about our ability to evaluate "good" or "bad" language, and I can acknowledge that and still disagree with you somewhat. I just don't see that there are clearly better/worse forms of language as univerally as you do. Why is it so hard for to acknowledge anything in the point of views I've presented?
 

GotGame?

Rookie
Nine pages of posts about a tidbit from Roddick!

For all the self-proclaimed Roddick 'dislikers' on this board, you sure do care a lot about his simple message to his fans.
 

VamosRafa

Hall of Fame
Rabbit said:
OK

Grandma Nadal...now that there's funny, I don't care who you are and props to whoever thought of it. That was worthy of Dedans Penthouse.
Sorry, but the props go to a 13-year-old kid on this board. Nice that Dedans still has that "kiddish" side to him. ;-)

But I agree the thread has gone far afield, dredging up stuff I thought was long buried. In fact, bringing out posters I thought were long buried. *lol*
 

Deuce

Banned
larrhall (alias 'Cabbage', 'Elvis Peawood', 'Ribbit', 'Rose Barnfield', etc., etc...) wrote:
"I was supposed to be gone, vamoos, but I came back...I came back for the tennis and to share ideas with others on these boards, and to avoid you."

Actually, no. You were supposed to be gone - vamoos - because you are a highly manipulative, abusively vengeful, dishonest, and delusional individual.

Despite your entirely dishonest claim, you do not at all avoid Rabbit and I. You, in truth, seek us out. This thread is but the most recent example. Did I "go after" you in this thread, or was it you who came after me initially, and entirely without provocation? The answer is clear to see. And it has been this way for 99% of the 'interactions' between you and I on these boards - you "go after" me initially, and without provocation. I merely respond. You have several times - out of the blue - openly accused me on these boards of sending you various viruses and such through E mail. You offered no evidence - because none existed - the false accusations were merely part of your calculated plan to assassinate my reputation here. I'd bet $100 that there were no E mail viruses at all being sent to you at the time - or, if there were, you were deliberately sending them to yourself. For you to claim that you "avoid" me is either dangerously delusional, or mightily dishonest. Or both.

Of course, 'larrhall' was once known as 'Larry Hall', among several other usernames on this board.

He also wrote:
"Long time ago, you formed an alliance that at least in part catalyzed in opposition to me... A long time ago you and Deuce engaged in what seemed a coordinated campaign to 'get me' - you had a great time with it."

Once again, you flatter yourself with feelings of utter self-importance which do not in reality exist. Do you even remember reality, Larry? It seems a long time since the two of you have been in touch.

Hate to burst your ego bubble here, but there have never been anything more than a handfull of E mails over the years between Rabbit and I which made any mention of you. In those few E mails in which you were mentioned, you were mentioned in the mere context of "Did you see what Larry lied about yesterday", and/or "Did you see the trouble that Larry's trying to cause now?" type of thing.

You, on the other hand, created a small army of aliases whose primary purpose was to serve as your 'allies' in your self-created 'war' against Rabbit and I. You would post as 'Larry Hall' and write nasty things about Rabbit and/or I - and then you would post in the same thread as one of your alter-egos, 'Elvis Peawood', or 'Cabbage', etc., and agree with what you had posted about us as 'Larry Hall'. The reason that you possess this obviously ongoing vengeance against Rabbit and I is simply because we were two of the main people who (years ago) exposed you on these boards for what you truly are - and you have resented the hell out of us since then.

I think the reason that you keep leaving the boards, Larry, - complete with a 'farewell' announcement each time - and continue perpetually to return is because you view yourself as Jesus Christ. You see, Jesus supposedly died... and then returned. You no doubt see that you have much in common with Christ, and have merely taken it a step or two further, continually dying what you insist is a 'martyr's death' on these boards, and then perpetually 'resurrecting' yourself from the departed.

All this being said, I'll leave it up to each reader to reach their own conclusion on your mental state.

I have reached my own conclusion - and it is based on this conclusion that I once again ask the powers that be at TW why Larry is still, after all of his very blatant and unprovoked abuses, permitted to participate in this message board, and to continue his abuses.

As always, I await an honest answer.
 

Deuce

Banned
alienhamster said:
Deuce, with pretty much everything I've argued to you I've backed up with references to people, specific time periods, textual statistics, or a specific text/example/uses of language. I haven't responded to many of the things you've said b/c you've said about 300 really opinionated things. If there's something specific you still want to discuss that I haven't responded to yet I'd be happy to. Just post and that's fine.

The one (critical) point you've repeatedly ignored is that context might dictate that the use of what you call lesser standards might be a better writerly choice. (Or to put it differently, that using the standard isn't always better in every case, even for non-canonical writers). You keep falling back on the opinion that "it just is better" or that "it used to be this way," while neither of these arguments has enough proof or can really be argued. It's fine if it's your opinion--just stop acting like it's fact and history.

It's really ironic how you call someone out for being "weak" after you've taken several cheap shots previously--and this is itself an (unspecific) cheap shot. You got that response from me--that you're elitist and baselessly judgemental--because that's what you've shown yourself to be on this issue. You've made absolutely no attempt to acknowledge where I'm coming from.

I think you made some good points about our ability to evaluate "good" or "bad" language, and I can acknowledge that and still disagree with you somewhat. I just don't see that there are clearly better/worse forms of language as univerally as you do. Why is it so hard for to acknowledge anything in the point of views I've presented?
The content of your post is quite ironic, considering that you are making great efforts in many posts trying to 'prove' that I am wrong.
 

alienhamster

Hall of Fame
Deuce said:
The content of your post is quite ironic, considering that you are making great efforts in many posts trying to 'prove' that I am wrong.
I think I'm saying that you're not entirely wrong--you're just mostly wrong. Much of this comes down to difference of opinion, but some of your historical/textual assessments are just not well researched or thought through. It would help your case if you could make the effort to understand the logic of my point of view (instead of making grand, dismissive statements like "you've failed to convince me of anything"). But instead you come off as completely unreasonable (and maybe a little lazy) when you fail to concede anything.

And the "effort" I'm making has something to do with you but more to do with the status-quo attitude you're reinforcing. Standard language use has plenty of institutional and politcal support; non-standard usage needs people to stick up for it. Don't flatter yourself so much.
 

Deuce

Banned
I thank you infinitely for your 'lessons', as well as for your 'advice' on how to "help my case".

I also rest my case.
 

alienhamster

Hall of Fame
Deuce said:
I thank you infinitely for your 'lessons', as well as for your 'advice' on how to "help my case".

I also rest my case.
If you actually did want to learn something, this would have been a more productive discussion/argument. Sorry I asked you to take a position on these boards other than your usual "doler of supreme wisdom."
 

Deuce

Banned
alienhamster said:
If you actually did want to learn something, this would have been a more productive discussion/argument. Sorry I asked you to take a position on these boards other than your usual "doler of supreme wisdom."
I apologize for not realizing the opportunity I had to have you teach me so much.

And you claim that I view myself as being superior?

The irony within your posts continues to be quite overwhelming.
 

jhhachamp

Hall of Fame
Rabbit, I am a little unsure what that thread proved about Larry, I did not see one post by him. I was just trying to research it sort of since I have no idea what he has done to get you two to hate him so much, but unfortunately I can't figure it out.
Also Deuce, I have to agree with alien somewhat in that you do often give off an attitude that you are superior. I fail to see the overwhelming irony in his posts.
 

krnboijunsung

Semi-Pro
Dude, everyone just shut up. Deuce is a better role model than Roddick. Just face the facts, his spelling and grammar will set us straight.

But in all seriousness, in Roddick's online note, I see why he could have written in slang especially since this this letter was posted on a site. I'm still in high school, and I read over a conversation on AIM I had saved from my freshman year, and reading halfway through it, I felt embarassed that I even wrote in slang.

While it can be used to shorten up what you write online, it does set a lower standard of your intellect. I'm not saying Roddick is stupid because he's written like this, but when I read someone who writes like that, it bothers me, so I can see where Deuce is coming from.

But all this nonsense about him not being a good role model because of it, I do not buy into. And since this is a message board, there is no need to get hurt feelings from someone across the country in front of their computer. Especially over something about how some tennis pro writes.

If you don't want a stupid message board fight to break out, don't fire back, just read what whoever has what to say, and just leave it at that.

If I've misinterpreted anything that has been said, let me know.
 
T

tangysox

Guest
lol. Deuce still has his panties all in a twist over Roddick. That's awesome. Well done, Andy.
 

alienhamster

Hall of Fame
Deuce said:
I apologize for not realizing the opportunity I had to have you teach me so much.

And you claim that I view myself as being superior?

The irony within your posts continues to be quite overwhelming.
Yeah Deuce, on this particular topic I am suggesting that I may be more knowledgeable than you. (My research is in English historical linguistics and literature.) But I never said I couldn't learn from you--I'd hope that in a good argument/discussion some learnin' would go both ways. I just get the feeling that you aren't really out on these boards to learn anything, maybe just to complain or pontificate. Sorry if I misjudged your intentions.
 
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