Adding one hour: physical training or hitting?

Alien

Alien

Hall of Fame
I currently play three times a week, let´s say 5 hours per week. I would say I am fit for my age and still fast.

I am trying to move my schedule to add another hour of tennis, but I am being offered to join a group that makes specific physical training for tennis (no hitting, intervals, explosion, medicine ball, elastic rope tied to hip, stairs, etc).

Honestly, I cannot see how choosing the physical group could in any event be better than enter the court and do a strong hitting session.

I actually believe it is better to be on the court under almost any circumstances at a non-pro level.

Am I wrong?
 
I think the one hour PHYSICAL is a great idea for the following reasons:

* Body conditioning - help prevent tennis related injuries (e.g shoulder, back).

* Intervals will help improve your o2 capacity and hence your recovery between points when playing.

* Different forms of physical/cardio will improve your fitness overall and should help you be mentally prepared in your matches as well as maintain higher level concentration.

Just my thoughts!
 
Having gone through a hellish hot weather match last week, I would say adding an hour of tough physical training every week couldn't possibly be a bad thing. Match fitness was a major reason I lost.
 
For a recreational player I would suggest time on task is the most important thing (obviously knowing nothing about your level of play or goals etc)
 
Ash_Smith said:
For a recreational player I would suggest time on task is the most important thing (obviously knowing nothing about your level of play or goals etc)
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Thanks. My goal is to keep improving.

My level is unknown as I dont live in the US, I posted my videos in page 1 and 3 here: http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=526609. Let´s say for the purpose of the thread that I am 4.5.

My point is, for instance, if I wanted to improve my cardio, isnt it better to go and do that drill for instance where one hits always paralell and the other one always crosscourts again and again? Or use a basket of balls and kill our legs that way ? Etc, etc?
 
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Alien said:
I currently play three times a week, let´s say 5 hours per week. I would say I am fit for my age and still fast.

I am trying to move my schedule to add another hour of tennis, but I am being offered to join a group that makes specific physical training for tennis (no hitting, intervals, explosion, medicine ball, elastic rope tied to hip, stairs, etc).

Honestly, I cannot see how choosing the physical group could in any event be better than enter the court and do a strong hitting session.

I actually believe it is better to be on the court under almost any circumstances at a non-pro level.

Am I wrong?
Click to expand...

physical training FTW!! if you're already getting 5 hours of tennis in per week... that 1 extra hour will be marginally benefecial to you if it is done with just a hitting session.

an extra hour on physical training will help you to get more out of the 5 hours of tennis your currently doing.

if you were only getting 1-2 hours of tennis in per week, I'd suggest that time be on the court, but 3 hrs+ especially when spread out on 2 or more sessions, that puts you in a position to take the extra time on conditioning.

personally, i get anywhere from 1.5-4 hours of tennis in per week spread out between 1 or 2 sessions.

I probably spend another 7-9 hours lifting weights, doing sprints/bleachers, or plyometrics. That is spread out over 4-6 sessions depending on the week.

The time differential shifts more towards tennis as it gets closer to a competition, but as for long term maintenance/improvement, this training regimen makes every competition (tournament or post season adult league) have a higher peak performance.
 
I would not say that court time is always better for everyone all the time, even if you are already in good shape. In a hitting session you might be able to work on one or two strokes and make some progress, but a dedicated conditioning session will help your entire game. You have to do both.

Just out of curiosity, is there a video of your backhand anywhere?
 
jga111 said:
I think the one hour PHYSICAL is a great idea for the following reasons:

* Body conditioning - help prevent tennis related injuries (e.g shoulder, back).

* Intervals will help improve your o2 capacity and hence your recovery between points when playing.

* Different forms of physical/cardio will improve your fitness overall and should help you be mentally prepared in your matches as well as maintain higher level concentration.

Just my thoughts!
Click to expand...

Govnor said:
Having gone through a hellish hot weather match last week, I would say adding an hour of tough physical training every week couldn't possibly be a bad thing. Match fitness was a major reason I lost.
Click to expand...

I vote/agree physical conditioning.

Saw your vids, nice hitting, definitely seem to be at least 4.5+. I'm approximately in your same boat... play 7-8hrs a week, and I think physical conditioning has improved me considerably (more than adding another 2hrs of hitting). Not only does it get you fit for longer matches, but it enables you to work at high intensity during the few precious hours we have to practice.

From the few lessons I took from guys that played on tour, they stressed the importance of getting in shape to play tennis (tennis does not get you in shape past the 3.5 level).

In running terms... let's say you run an 8 mph pace for a 5k, playing tennis to get into shape is analagous to going out to every day and running an 8 mph pace 5k, and expecting to get faster at running.

For lower level players (eg. 3.5 or below), I can see adding an extra hour to hitting being more important, but at 4.5+, most folks strokes are already developed, just need to keep hitting at a higher intensity, and be able to sustain that for longer, and you need a high level of cardio to keep that up.

Alternative you could end every training day with sprints, and use the extra day of training for resistance training and/or stretching (eg. injury prevention).

my $0.02

edit: i was presuming you weren't in the best physical condition... i read that any murray runs 400s at 60s, and training i've done with some recently former D1 guys says, I need to run a mile under 6, and ideally closer to 5min (for my retriever style of game). Given these metrics, if you're already there, maybe another hitting day would be better or just focus on injury prevention.
 
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Hard to answer this without knowing more about your game, fitness and goals but the best answer would be to add 1 hour on court and time for fitness training. At upper intermediate to advanced levels, fitness can play a big role in performance and injury prevention. You could easily do strengthening and flexibility exercises at home with a just little equipment - small free weights, resistance bands, stability balls and an exercise mat.

Try to do 2 to 3 fitness sessions per week at home for strength and flexibility and add the 1 hour of court time is my recommendation.

If you can only do one or the other, I would add the court time. But, 30 minutes 3 times a week at home can go a long way toward fitness.
 
MisterP said:
I would not say that court time is always better for everyone all the time, even if you are already in good shape. In a hitting session you might be able to work on one or two strokes and make some progress, but a dedicated conditioning session will help your entire game. You have to do both.

Just out of curiosity, is there a video of your backhand anywhere?
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yes same thread page 3 I am hitting some backhands. I have resumed the shot a couple of months ago, still working on it.

https://youtu.be/7_IgxSB9Foc


For better clarity, I take 1 hour instruction a week and I hit / train / play 2 hours in each of another 2 sessions. The reason I do not play more is not that I get tired but rather balance with my family time (not getting divorced because of tennis ;), kid) and work (office from 9am to 7pm, need to bring some money in to pay for the racquets, strings, balls, tennis classes for me and my kid...).
 
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TennisCJC said:
You could easily do strengthening and flexibility exercises at home with a just little equipment - small free weights, resistance bands, stability balls and an exercise mat.

Try to do 2 to 3 fitness sessions per week at home for strength and flexibility and add the 1 hour of court time is my recommendation.
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I can certainly do that, weights, bands, squats while we watch TV. Still I cannot do the sprints, medicine ball or lateral running in my living room.

You can guess hitting is also more fun ;)
 
More court time. As a rec player there are likely many areas that you need to work on so you could use this eztra hour for targetted practice if you wanted. Also, it's supposed to be fun. I love hitting. If I can get an extra hour doing that then my fun level has gone up for the week.
 
I'm an older player and spend far more time on fitness than on tennis. There's a lot of stuff to keep strong, flexible and fit and I like some time to work on a lot of those parts that tennis doesn't work and that sometimes tennis makes worse.

My goal is quality of life as I get older. It just happens to help my court performance as well.
 
Normally I would recommend the on-court training. However assuming you really are 4.5 - you are already very good at tennis. So 5 or 6 hours is just going to maintain your current level - and not improve it.

So you might as well get in better shape. To go from 4.5 to 5 - you are going to need like 20hrs on court time each week (guesstimate).

Now if you were a beginner like a 2.5 - 3.0 then that extra hour is going to make a big difference - and you would have to just do some off-court work by yourself..
 
I just turned 59, and my goal is really to be totally pain free by the time I am 60. In order to get there I am doing a lot more non-impact type exercises and a (very) limited amount of HIT type exercises apart from tennis. When you are young you can do whatever you want, lol! But at some point, if you keep playing lots and lots of tennis with intensity, one or more of the back, hips, shoulders, elbows, knees, wrist, or ankles will develop inflammations that won't go away easily due to the repetitive nature of tennis. You have to change the pattern, stretch some parts, strengthen others, and just rest sometimes!

In short, if you are already getting 5 hours of tennis a week, I would err in favor of balancing it out with an hour of non-tennis exercise.
 
It depends how good/consistent you are atm.

If you have been playing for many years and are already very good and consistent then the hour of physical training is best for you.

For myself. I have been playing just under 2 years and Im not that good yet and Im very inconsistent. But I'm very fit and pretty strong. I only get to play once or twice a week. If I had the choice then for me it would be an easy one. Id take the hour of hitting.

It depends what level your at.
 
Why not add one hour for footwork and footwork focused physical training? Probably worth way more than pure cardio and has the potential to really improve your game, since most recs have relatively bad footwork compaired to their strokes. It will improve basically every part of your game...
 
So finally I added two days of one hour specific tennis physical training, in a group lead by a coach. Been there three weeks and my tennis improved significantly . Stronger than ever already. Also bought a ladder and and some weights and do some exercises while wathcing TV at home.

I keep playing 5 hours a week or more.

For the moment I conclude I was wrong, thanks to the forum for the advice.

Of course I still keep trying to increase my time on court, sneaking one hour here and there. I only hope my wife doesnt file for divorce...
 
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5 hours of court time for an adult barely maintains good hitting.
OP is in very good shape.
Maybe, another hour of court time going for winners and forcing shots, all close to a sideline, with power and balance, so he doesn't have to run so much, so he doesn't need to be in such good shape.
 
Yeah, physical fitness is a pretty good asset. But if the extra time you put into learning tennis helps you better manage your fitness, then thats just as good. You dont necessarily need to be the most fit, you just need to know what you're capable of so you can choose your moments to push yourself.
 
For instance, in the vid OP posted, he's hitting back CC center, while his junior hitting partner is trying to paint the sidelines.
If OP wants to stop that nonsense, he should hit a few CC to the alley, forcing his hitting partner to run wide to reach his ball.
 
This is cooperative hitting. The other guy hits like that without missing, for him it's the "normal way" to hit a practice rally ball when he's not pressured. He probably hits 9 out of 10 in.
If the OP would hit with the same margins he would miss, because the other guy's shot/weight of shot puts pressure on him by default.
It's like a 5.0 hitting with a guy who's top 500. The top 500 guy will play some "cross court rally ball" with the 5.0, and the 5.0 will handle it decently and probably put the ball back in the court, but for him it will feel like a heavy, forcing shot, not a rally ball.
 
Well as I said there the other guy is at a level above mine. I mainly look for pace, depth and consistency when we do cross court. Not sure what he looks for. I think none of us is looking for winning the point. Once we tune up our shots this way it becomes more physical, like open court (aggression after a couple of shots) and eventually matches. At the time of the first videos I wouldn't hit backhands due to TE so I was limited to cross court forehands.
 
Alien said:
Well as I said there the other guy is at a level above mine. I mainly look for pace, depth and consistency when we do cross court. Not sure what he looks for. I think none of us is looking for winning the point. Once we tune up our shots this way it becomes more physical, like open court (aggression after a couple of shots) and eventually matches. At the time of the first videos I wouldn't hit backhands due to TE so I was limited to cross court forehands.
Click to expand...

Thanks, it is clear (at least to me).
 
Alien said:
I currently play three times a week, let´s say 5 hours per week. I would say I am fit for my age and still fast.

I am trying to move my schedule to add another hour of tennis, but I am being offered to join a group that makes specific physical training for tennis (no hitting, intervals, explosion, medicine ball, elastic rope tied to hip, stairs, etc).

Honestly, I cannot see how choosing the physical group could in any event be better than enter the court and do a strong hitting session.

I actually believe it is better to be on the court under almost any circumstances at a non-pro level.

Am I wrong?
Click to expand...

The modern game at all levels is primarily about one thing afaic ...... MOVEMENT !

Once a player has learned the basics of stroke production, anything that improves one's movement on the court will enhance their game several orders of magnitude beyond just hitting lots and lots of tennis balls.

Imho, for every 5 hours a week a player is hitting, they should add at least 1 hour a week for fitness (inc. movement, stretching, etc.). Serious players, even non-pros would also benefit from an additional 1 hour per week working on the mental and emotional aspects of their game.

It's all about optimising the available time to garner the maximum improvement.

If you are just playing tennis for fun, then none of this probably matters. If you are playing matches and don't care whether you win or lose, then none of this probably matters.

But like Brad Gilbert, I don't know too many tennis players who play matches who prefer to lose. If you have a limited number of hours per week to dedicate to improving your tennis, might as well get as much out of them as possible.
 
Karma Tennis - How would you go about working 1 hour per week on the "mental and emotional aspects of your game" ?
 
I'm going to say physical training/fitness. Provided the instructor/coach knows what they are doing, you will likely target all areas of the kinetic chain of your strokes, and do exercises that ensure you are engaging all of your body. As countless posters have said on here, outside the top 200 in the world, minimizing errors and getting as many shots back as possible is the winning formula. By training to build up quickness as well as more stamina, you'll be able to get to shots earlier, do more with them and get some shots back you previously wouldn't have gotten to. Even at the 4.5 level, getting a couple of extra shots back can force mistakes by your opponent.
 
0d1n said:
Karma Tennis - How would you go about working 1 hour per week on the "mental and emotional aspects of your game" ?
Click to expand...

Playing Chess or card games like Poker.
Reading books about Tennis Strategy.
Reading autobiographies of successful people (not just sports-people)
Watching videos of famous tennis players and famous tennis matches (I frequently re-visit the 1980 Wimbledon Men's Singles Final)
Doing Meditation.
Doing Gardening.
Going for Walks in calming environments (eg. Seaside, Mountains, Countryside)

Of course, I don't do all of these things every week. I do a selection of them over a longer period.

The biggest challenge is to pick things that you find engaging and that will work best for you.
 
Alien said:
I currently play three times a week, let´s say 5 hours per week. I would say I am fit for my age and still fast.

I am trying to move my schedule to add another hour of tennis, but I am being offered to join a group that makes specific physical training for tennis (no hitting, intervals, explosion, medicine ball, elastic rope tied to hip, stairs, etc).

Honestly, I cannot see how choosing the physical group could in any event be better than enter the court and do a strong hitting session.

I actually believe it is better to be on the court under almost any circumstances at a non-pro level.

Am I wrong?
Click to expand...
The single most important thing is to wire your nervous system for a specific set of movements. Building thick myelin is what you need, but that happens when you do loads of repetition -- hopefully, some of those are slow, identical shots and shadow strokes to make sure you learn the right movements. You're likely already powerful enough to hit 90mph on both sides, but it does take well insulated nerves to get signals travel fast enough from your head to the rest of your body to coordinate the 90mph shot. So, PLAY, do not train physically -- unless you're so out of shape two sets is too much.
 
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