Alcaraz New Custom Shoes

SDN said:
It will be curious to see if Alcaraz will wear these vapor pro, or a version similar to the shoes he is using now, therefore a little different from the vapor pro and with pieces of vapor 11
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My guess is he continues to endorse the v11

BUT I think all the guys wearing the stock vapor pro 1 (Korda, Rune, etc) will likely use the new color
 
tennis-oly-paris-2024.jpg
 
Subway Tennis said:
We didnt need another reason to love Carlitos, but the way he has held out on Nike, refused to wear the new crap and forced them to actually release a proper tennis shoe is great.
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Guess only the Asian market is getting the rerelease of the vapor pro 1, but the v12 should supposedly be awesome (let’s hope he actually uses it)
 
gino said:
Guess only the Asian market is getting the rerelease of the vapor pro 1, but the v12 should supposedly be awesome (let’s hope he actually uses it)
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nah actually now i see why you said v12 should be awesome, i’ve seen the leaks and they are similar to alcaraz custom vp1. Probably they listened to us and we will finally get something good and that alcaraz wears. Let’s hope in dope colorways and a vp1 outsole.
 
Alee5:D said:
nah actually now i see why you said v12 should be awesome, i’ve seen the leaks and they are similar to alcaraz custom vp1. Probably they listened to us and we will finally get something good and that alcaraz wears. Let’s hope in dope colorways and a vp1 outsole.
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I’m hoping for the same thing dude. I think that it’s too good of a vapor for him to prefer the vapor pro one instead. It looks like a combination of legendary shoes so hopefully he’s on board as well. If he isn’t, they really need to re-issue the vapor pro one to all markets
 
theaceproman said:
o_O, we NEED these shoes to be realeased. Nike would make SO MUCH money if they released these
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I love how we continue the drooling saga but nike couldn’t care less, it’s like they like when we beg them for a product, incredible. I mean i het you’ll release a new vapor pro 3/ vapor 12 in early 2025 but why don’t you give those to us in the meantime? would be easy to do for them and they would probably get half of my savings lol
 
Alee5:D said:
I love how we continue the drooling saga but nike couldn’t care less, it’s like they like when we beg them for a product, incredible. I mean i het you’ll release a new vapor pro 3/ vapor 12 in early 2025 but why don’t you give those to us in the meantime? would be easy to do for them and they would probably get half of my savings lol
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I'd be willing to bet a lot of this has to do with actual sales numbers vs. the perception of interest. Even in this forum you see this dicotemy. How many would looovvveeee to have Djokovic's actual racquet, or a PT57a, or whatever. Yet, take the Prestige Classic 2.0 and how many of those people refused to buy it "now that it was priced so high", or what not. A lot of people say they would buy x. Then, they don't. And allll that investment by Nike or Head or whomever...well, you're not eating those costs so you don't think about the risk. You just want what you want. A relatively few dedicated yet still fickle fans possibly willing to buy some product does not a market make.
 
mtommer said:
I'd be willing to bet a lot of this has to do with actual sales numbers vs. the perception of interest. Even in this forum you see this dicotemy. How many would looovvveeee to have Djokovic's actual racquet, or a PT57a, or whatever. Yet, take the Prestige Classic 2.0 and how many of those people refused to buy it "now that it was priced so high", or what not. A lot of people say they would buy x. Then, they don't. And allll that investment by Nike or Head or whomever...well, you're not eating those costs so you don't think about the risk. You just want what you want. A relatively few dedicated yet still fickle fans possibly willing to buy some product does not a market make.
Click to expand...
Great point! People used to ask for V9.5 and actually someone write here a few years prior to the re-issue they would pay even more from the retail considering how high prices were for some sizes (Not even the most scarce). Still... People let those sit until they rock bottom price and question about the colors and materials. On the other hand people complain for the VP1 when they release and now ask for it. Weird but the most common scenario
 
RNBABOLAT said:
Great point! People used to ask for V9.5 and actually someone write here a few years prior to the re-issue they would pay even more from the retail considering how high prices were for some sizes (Not even the most scarce). Still... People let those sit until they rock bottom price and question about the colors and materials. On the other hand people complain for the VP1 when they release and now ask for it. Weird but the most common scenario
Click to expand...
I think the happy medium for consumers would be to have a dedicated shoe line with proven quality and performance that doesn’t get overhauled too much so people can be assured of a regular shoe. The Vapor pro 1 was an incredible shoe and it made logical sense as a succession through the Vapor line.

The benefit case for Nike is that they could have saved a fortune in R&D and marketing (which I know they don’t like spending in tennis) and kept that shoe going in a longer release window differentiating with colours and little tweaks and they would have sold themselves.

The only reason I can think of for the VP1 line being sabotaged is that Nike feared they went way too low on the price point. They would not have sold many V11s at a much higher price point if they were sitting at retail alongside the VP1s, which were a very fast shoe with no break in time and great tech at a much cheaper price. So they changed the take-down Vapor to the VP 2, which is a far less advanced shoe to the VP 1 and makes the flagship V11 look like a much more advanced shoe in comparison.
 
mtommer said:
I'd be willing to bet a lot of this has to do with actual sales numbers vs. the perception of interest. Even in this forum you see this dicotemy. How many would looovvveeee to have Djokovic's actual racquet, or a PT57a, or whatever. Yet, take the Prestige Classic 2.0 and how many of those people refused to buy it "now that it was priced so high", or what not. A lot of people say they would buy x. Then, they don't. And allll that investment by Nike or Head or whomever...well, you're not eating those costs so you don't think about the risk. You just want what you want. A relatively few dedicated yet still fickle fans possibly willing to buy some product does not a market make.
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I think you are right but i also think that they could have given us those instead of other shoes but since the beginning. Meanwhile alcaraz was wearing a normal vapor pro 1 in 2023, a discontinued shoe, so i think that they just had a bad programmation, but also i see your point
 
Subway Tennis said:
I think the happy medium for consumers would be to have a dedicated shoe line with proven quality and performance that doesn’t get overhauled too much so people can be assured of a regular shoe. The Vapor pro 1 was an incredible shoe and it made logical sense as a succession through the Vapor line.

The benefit case for Nike is that they could have saved a fortune in R&D and marketing (which I know they don’t like spending in tennis) and kept that shoe going in a longer release window differentiating with colours and little tweaks and they would have sold themselves.

The only reason I can think of for the VP1 line being sabotaged is that Nike feared they went way too low on the price point. They would not have sold many V11s at a much higher price point if they were sitting at retail alongside the VP1s, which were a very fast shoe with no break in time and great tech at a much cheaper price. So they changed the take-down Vapor to the VP 2, which is a far less advanced shoe to the VP 1 and makes the flagship V11 look like a much more advanced shoe in comparison.
Click to expand...
Unfortunately it's not the case... Releasing again the V9.5 is the biggest and telling example why this don't work. People asked for them and even the idea was to give a different approach to the cosmetics to don't mess with the main line available and keep both lines profitable. As mentioned before that was not the case and most colorways sit longer than expected.

Nike had V6T and CB (2.3 and 4.3 my personal favorites) in just one year cycle and personally complained about Federer using the same shoe for 3 years and don't make it available to the public, now that change with the big difference of any of most recent shoes are not close to that performance even with big flaws.

The real reason to stop releasing the VP1 is people keep asking for something old that is considered "better" until Alcaraz start winning. This might be the real issue here and a case of study, people want Nike to make something new and innovate in everything tennis related... But! still want something thats old and pretend to not move that much from what they pretend to like everyone and casually is their own sentiment. Its hard to move on but eventually as someone said, they want the "new" for the costumers to buy for the next 10 years not the people who ask for something released 10 years ago and start losing ground to other brands
 
RNBABOLAT said:
Unfortunately it's not the case... Releasing again the V9.5 is the biggest and telling example why this don't work. People asked for them and even the idea was to give a different approach to the cosmetics to don't mess with the main line available and keep both lines profitable. As mentioned before that was not the case and most colorways sit longer than expected.

Nike had V6T and CB (2.3 and 4.3 my personal favorites) in just one year cycle and personally complained about Federer using the same shoe for 3 years and don't make it available to the public, now that change with the big difference of any of most recent shoes are not close to that performance even with big flaws.

The real reason to stop releasing the VP1 is people keep asking for something old that is considered "better" until Alcaraz start winning. This might be the real issue here and a case of study, people want Nike to make something new and innovate in everything tennis related... But! still want something thats old and pretend to not move that much from what they pretend to like everyone and casually is their own sentiment. Its hard to move on but eventually as someone said, they want the "new" for the costumers to buy for the next 10 years not the people who ask for something released 10 years ago and start losing ground to other brands
Click to expand...
I’m not sure why you’re responding to my comment about the VP 1 using the v9.5 as an example. That shoe is a totally different marketing case to the VP 1 as it was essentially a 4-5 generations old shoe and being reissued as a limited edition protro performance shoe. It still sold well because there is a limited but very strong and loyal desire for older but proven technology at the moment in all sorts of consumer areas but it’s the wrong example to use as analogous to the fortunes of the VP1.

My comments were about keeping a steady speed performance line with worthwhile upgrades where applicable but a consistent fit and profile so people know what to expect. They do it with the Nike Court softgoods line. Something similar in hard goods would be nice. The VP1 was a current line that got replaced by a much poorer and very different shoe with older technology in the VP2.

My speculation is that Nike wanted a takedown shoe that wasn’t as much of a competitor to the Vapor 11. The Vapor Pro 1 was too good. The Vapor pro 2 fit the bill perfectly as a “worse shoe” that was cheaper to make. It will still sell but not be a threat to The Vapor 11 which they can anchor off the takedown and sell at a higher price. The Vapor 11 might not have looked so attractive if the Vapor pro 2 was an even better version of the VP 1 at the same price point.

Nike is happy because the Vapor 2 is far cheaper to make than the vp1 and doesn’t threaten the flagship shoe, but as consumers we got screwed royally with Nike not having a proper speed tennis shoe for the first time in probably 20 years.
 
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RNBABOLAT said:
Unfortunately it's not the case... Releasing again the V9.5 is the biggest and telling example why this don't work. People asked for them and even the idea was to give a different approach to the cosmetics to don't mess with the main line available and keep both lines profitable. As mentioned before that was not the case and most colorways sit longer than expected.

Nike had V6T and CB (2.3 and 4.3 my personal favorites) in just one year cycle and personally complained about Federer using the same shoe for 3 years and don't make it available to the public, now that change with the big difference of any of most recent shoes are not close to that performance even with big flaws.

The real reason to stop releasing the VP1 is people keep asking for something old that is considered "better" until Alcaraz start winning. This might be the real issue here and a case of study, people want Nike to make something new and innovate in everything tennis related... But! still want something thats old and pretend to not move that much from what they pretend to like everyone and casually is their own sentiment. Its hard to move on but eventually as someone said, they want the "new" for the costumers to buy for the next 10 years not the people who ask for something released 10 years ago and start losing ground to other brands
Click to expand...
I mean again your kinda right but for me there is a simple explanation: People like me and many others just wants what pros wear for those reasons:
- Usually the shoes looks better.
- They are into the highlights videos of legendary matches, the real history of tennis.
- They can have a “placebo” effect for you and can make you play better by simply mentally thinking you are wearing what “the pro guy” is wearing.

With the 9.5 was a bit different story, Rog actually had the silouette and colorways of the retail shoes most of the time, the only different things were the custom mold and a completely different outsole, but at least the shoes were really similar. And, again, i can see why nike discontinued the carbon fiber shank onto retails models after like 2011, because it can be really expensive and everything, and in today mass production it really can’t be accomplished probably, i don’t know. But carlos shoes it’s:

-Easy to build in terms of materials
-Have mixed things of severals models
-its what carlos actually wears

so it really doesn’t make sense at all, if not that probably Carlos actually agreed to try vapor 11 and to be the face of them but actually after he regretted the decision preferring the vapor pro 1, and so nike, giving that most of amateur tennis players can’t really see a difference, mixed the models in order to make carlos comfortable in his vapor pro 1 but at the same time sponsoring the vapor 11. But again it’s kinda bad, the shoes that he wears would go crazy in terms of makings for nike.
 
Subway Tennis said:
I’m not sure why you’re responding to my comment about the VP 1 using the v9.5 as an example. That shoe is a totally different marketing case to the VP 1 as it was essentially a 4-5 generations old shoe and being reissued as a limited edition protro performance shoe. It still sold well because there is a limited but very strong and loyal desire for older but proven technology at the moment in all sorts of consumer areas but it’s the wrong example to use as analogous to the fortunes of the VP1.

My comments were about keeping a steady speed performance line with worthwhile upgrades where applicable but a consistent fit and profile so people know what to expect. They do it with the Nike Court softgoods line. Something similar in hard goods would be nice. The VP1 was a current line that got replaced by a much poorer and very different shoe with older technology in the VP2.

My speculation is that Nike wanted a takedown shoe that wasn’t as much of a competitor to the Vapor 11. The Vapor Pro 1 was too good. The Vapor pro 2 fit the bill perfectly as a “worse shoe” that was cheaper to make. It will still sell but not be a threat to The Vapor 11 which they can anchor off the takedown and sell at a higher price. The Vapor 11 might not have looked so attractive if the Vapor pro 2 was an even better version of the VP 1 at the same price point.

Nike is happy because the Vapor 2 is far cheaper to make than the vp1 and doesn’t threaten the flagship shoe, but as consumers we got screwed royally with Nike not having a proper speed tennis shoe for the first time in probably 20 years.
Click to expand...
I agree some of your views but not your take on the Vapor 11 and Vapor pro 2. As far as I know and in most markets, VP2 have much better sales than Vapor 11. Also you can find way more pros wearing the VP2 instead of Vapor 11. In any sense, even though Vapor 11 is the supposed most premium shoe of their line, it fails. While Vapor pro 2 is at least an OK-ish model for them from business/sales perspective.
 
arthurli22 said:
I agree some of your views but not your take on the Vapor 11 and Vapor pro 2. As far as I know and in most markets, VP2 have much better sales than Vapor 11. Also you can find way more pros wearing the VP2 instead of Vapor 11. In any sense, even though Vapor 11 is the supposed most premium shoe of their line, it fails. While Vapor pro 2 is at least an OK-ish model for them from business/sales perspective.
Click to expand...
Fair points well made. I agree about the Vapor 11. That has been a disaster imo. Nike has had a very bad run in the last few years with some of its highest tier shoes. Remember the court react Vapor NXT? Man, that was horrible.
 
Subway Tennis said:
Fair points well made. I agree about the Vapor 11. That has been a disaster imo. Nike has had a very bad run in the last few years with some of its highest tier shoes. Remember the court react Vapor NXT? Man, that was horrible.
Click to expand...
Also for Vapor pro 2, while I am not sure if it is cheaper shoes for Nike to produce, I definitely think it is not a paid of bad shoes performance wise.

It is relatively lightweight and I do not find it as clumsy or bottom heavy as Vapor 11 or weird as the Vapor NXT you mention. I recently scoop two pairs of Vapor pro 2 at very steep discount, around USD50 for the core white colorway and USD80 for the wimbledon colorway and in my opinion they worth every buck I paid for them.
 
Subway Tennis said:
Fair points well made. I agree about the Vapor 11. That has been a disaster imo. Nike has had a very bad run in the last few years with some of its highest tier shoes. Remember the court react Vapor NXT? Man, that was horrible.
Click to expand...
If the vapor NXT had the vapor 11 uppers it would be a very great shoe for the more supported ride. The nxt’s weren’t that bad apart from the heinous upper and tongue
 
Subway Tennis said:
I’m not sure why you’re responding to my comment about the VP 1 using the v9.5 as an example. That shoe is a totally different marketing case to the VP 1 as it was essentially a 4-5 generations old shoe and being reissued as a limited edition protro performance shoe. It still sold well because there is a limited but very strong and loyal desire for older but proven technology at the moment in all sorts of consumer areas but it’s the wrong example to use as analogous to the fortunes of the VP1.

My comments were about keeping a steady speed performance line with worthwhile upgrades where applicable but a consistent fit and profile so people know what to expect. They do it with the Nike Court softgoods line. Something similar in hard goods would be nice. The VP1 was a current line that got replaced by a much poorer and very different shoe with older technology in the VP2.

My speculation is that Nike wanted a takedown shoe that wasn’t as much of a competitor to the Vapor 11. The Vapor Pro 1 was too good. The Vapor pro 2 fit the bill perfectly as a “worse shoe” that was cheaper to make. It will still sell but not be a threat to The Vapor 11 which they can anchor off the takedown and sell at a higher price. The Vapor 11 might not have looked so attractive if the Vapor pro 2 was an even better version of the VP 1 at the same price point.

Nike is happy because the Vapor 2 is far cheaper to make than the vp1 and doesn’t threaten the flagship shoe, but as consumers we got screwed royally with Nike not having a proper speed tennis shoe for the first time in probably 20 years.
Click to expand...
I use the V9.5 as a more coveted shoe and still the results were not the expected and people have far less negative comments compared to the VP1. Considering the V9.5 is just 3 generations old (VP1 next year will be 2) the difference is not that much and still think the people looking for a reissue is smaller than people looking for something new and innovative.

As fas as I remember, until Alcaraz won his first major. Commets about the VP1 and the inward desing were not most people cup of tea so the placebo effect might be part of this "superior" kind of scenario compared to the VP2. If any other pro used the VP2 and make a deep run the perception would be different.

V11 is not a bad shoe considering is not what a Vapor used to be or is known for, Musetti and Pericard use it and apparently retail so... might not be as bad or inferior. Can't comment on the quality or how cheap those shoes are.

I'm pretty sure Nike is not happy with their models, considering how much ground they lost in the last 10 years to another brands, more comfortable and performance oriented shoes from other brands are now more seen than ever before
 
RNBABOLAT said:
I use the V9.5 as a more coveted shoe and still the results were not the expected and people have far less negative comments compared to the VP1. Considering the V9.5 is just 3 generations old (VP1 next year will be 2) the difference is not that much and still think the people looking for a reissue is smaller than people looking for something new and innovative.

As fas as I remember, until Alcaraz won his first major. Commets about the VP1 and the inward desing were not most people cup of tea so the placebo effect might be part of this "superior" kind of scenario compared to the VP2. If any other pro used the VP2 and make a deep run the perception would be different.

V11 is not a bad shoe considering is not what a Vapor used to be or is known for, Musetti and Pericard use it and apparently retail so... might not be as bad or inferior. Can't comment on the quality or how cheap those shoes are.

I'm pretty sure Nike is not happy with their models, considering how much ground they lost in the last 10 years to another brands, more comfortable and performance oriented shoes from other brands are now more seen than ever before
Click to expand...
I agree, I made this point in another thread but having recently tried it (finally) it's a good shoe but it really shouldn't be called a vapor because it doesn't reaaallly behave or perform like one. I really think they should have called it something else, but I get why they didn't.

Feels like since the 9/9.5 Nike only gets the vapor 'right' once every other generation.
 
Guys do someone has a pair of carlos customs? Im starting to collect and swap customs, i could swap with a pair of custom sample On’s made for Iga
 
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