Alcaraz vs. Big 3: Season-by-season breakdown !

G

Gastino

Professional
This thread will be a direct a comparison between the big 3's first 5 full seasons on tour and Carlos Alcaraz at the same age. 3 of the 4 gentlemen were born within a month

The year they turned 18​

'99 Federer : 13–17 | Titles: 0 | YE rank: 64
Slams: AO(Q1), FO(1R), W(1R), USO(Q2)
Masters: IW(A), Miami(1R), Monte Carlo(1R), Madrid(1R), Rome(A), Canada(1R), Cincinnati(1R), Shanghai(2R), Paris(1R)

'04 Nadal : 30–17 | Titles: 1 | YE rank: 51
Slams: AO(3R), FO(A), W(A), USO(2R)
Masters: IW(3R), Miami(4R), Monte Carlo(A), Madrid(A), Rome(A), Canada(1R), Cincinnati(1R), Shanghai(2R), Paris(A)

'05 Djokovic : 11–11 | Titles: 0 | YE rank: 78
Slams: AO(1R), FO(2R), W(3R), USO(3R)
Masters: IW(A), Miami(A), Monte Carlo(A), Madrid(A), Rome(A), Canada(Q2), Cincinnati(1R), Shanghai(Q1), Paris(3R)

'21 Alcaraz : 32–17 | Titles: 1 | YE rank: 32
Slams: AO(2R), FO(3R), W(2R), USO(QF)
Masters: IW(2R), Miami(1R), Monte Carlo(A), Madrid(2R), Rome(A), Canada(A), Cincinnati(1R), Shanghai(NH), Paris(3R)

Verdict (18): Alcaraz > Nadal > Djokovic > Federer
At 18, Federer and Djokovic were still finding their feet on tour ,barely winning a match at slams, struggling to crack the top 50. Nadal was already a force on clay, winning his first title and pushing his win-loss record above .500. But Alcaraz edges him here: slightly better record, a quarterfinal run at the US Open (beating Tsitsipas along the way), and a higher year-end ranking. Both won 1 title, but Carlos did it on hard court, which at that age is arguably more impressive for an all-surface future.

The year they turned 19​

'00 Federer : 36–30 | Titles: 0 | YE rank: 29
Slams: AO(3R), FO(4R), W(1R), USO(3R)
Masters: IW(Q1), Miami(2R), Monte Carlo(1R), Madrid(1R), Rome(1R), Canada(1R), Cincinnati(1R), Shanghai(2R), Paris(1R)

'05 Nadal : 79–10 | 1 slam | Titles: 11 | YE rank: 2
Slams: AO(4R), FO(W), W(2R), USO(3R)
Masters: IW(A), Miami(F), Monte Carlo(W), Madrid(A), Rome(W), Canada(W), Cincinnati(1R), Shanghai(W), Paris(A)

'06 Djokovic : 40–18 | Titles: 2 | YE rank: 16
Slams: AO(1R), FO(QF), W(4R), USO(3R)
Masters: IW(1R), Miami(2R), Monte Carlo(1R), Madrid(2R), Rome(Q2), Canada(A), Cincinnati(2R), Shanghai(QF), Paris(2R)

'22 Alcaraz : 57–13 | 1 slam | Titles: 5 | YE rank: 1
Slams: AO(3R), FO(QF), W(4R), USO(W)
Masters: IW(SF), Miami(W), Monte Carlo(2R), Madrid(W), Rome(A), Canada(2R), Cincinnati(QF), Shanghai(4R), Paris(QF)

Verdict (19): Nadal > Alcaraz > Djokovic > Federer
This is where Nadal announces himself as a once-in-a-generation talent. A staggering 79–10 record, 11 titles including his first Roland Garros, and 4 Masters (Monte Carlo, Rome, Canada, Shanghai) plus a Miami final. He finishes world #2 behind only peak Federer. Alcaraz has a brilliant season in his own right, US Open champion, 2 Masters (Miami, Madrid), and becomes the youngest year-end #1 in history. But he can't match Nadal's sheer volume of dominance. Djokovic makes a nice leap to #16 with a French Open quarterfinal and 2 titles, while Federer finally cracks the top 30 but still has zero trophies. Nadal takes this round convincingly.

The year they turned 20​

'01 Federer : 49–21 | Titles: 1 | YE rank: 13
Slams: AO(3R), FO(QF), W(QF), USO(4R)
Masters: IW(1R), Miami(QF), Monte Carlo(QF), Madrid(1R), Rome(3R), Canada(A), Cincinnati(A), Shanghai(2R), Paris(2R)

'06 Nadal : 59–12 | 1 slam | Titles: 5 | YE rank: 2
Slams: AO(A), FO(W), W(F), USO(QF)
Masters: IW(SF), Miami(2R), Monte Carlo(W), Madrid(A), Rome(W), Canada(3R), Cincinnati(QF), Shanghai(QF), Paris(A)

'07 Djokovic : 68–19 | Titles: 5 | YE rank: 3
Slams: AO(4R), FO(SF), W(SF), USO(F)
Masters: IW(F), Miami(W), Monte Carlo(3R), Madrid(QF), Rome(QF), Canada(W), Cincinnati(2R), Shanghai(SF), Paris(2R)

'23 Alcaraz : 65–12 | 1 slam | Titles: 6 | YE rank: 2
Slams: AO(A), FO(SF), W(W), USO(SF)
Masters: IW(SF), Miami(W), Monte Carlo(2R), Madrid(W), Rome(A), Canada(2R), Cincinnati(QF), Shanghai(QF), Paris(QF)

Verdict (20): Alcaraz > Nadal > Djokovic > Federer
The gap between the top two and the rest widens. Federer wins his first title (Milan indoors) and makes his first quarterfinals at Roland Garros and Wimbledon, but he's still a clear fourth. Djokovic explodes onto the scene: 68–19, his first Masters (Miami and Canada), a US Open final, and semifinals at Roland Garros and Wimbledon. He's now world #3 and looks like a future superstar. But Nadal and Alcaraz are on another level. Both win 1 slam (Nadal on clay, Alcaraz on grass at Wimbledon) and 2 Masters. Alcaraz gets the slight edge: 6 titles to Nadal's 5, a better winning percentage (84.4% vs 83.1%), and he beats Djokovic in that legendary Wimbledon final. Carlos by a hair.

The year they turned 21​

'02 Federer : 58–22 | Titles: 3 | YE rank: 6
Slams: AO(4R), FO(1R), W(1R), USO(4R)
Masters: IW(3R), Miami(F), Monte Carlo(2R), Madrid(W), Rome(1R), Canada(1R), Cincinnati(1R), Shanghai(QF), Paris(QF)

'07 Nadal : 70–15 | 1 slam | Titles: 6 | YE rank: 2
Slams: AO(QF), FO(W), W(F), USO(4R)
Masters: IW(W), Miami(QF), Monte Carlo(W), Madrid(F), Rome(W), Canada(SF), Cincinnati(2R), Shanghai(QF), Paris(F)

'08 Djokovic : 64–17 | 1 slam | Titles: 4 | YE rank: 3 | YEC
Slams: AO(W), FO(SF), W(2R), USO(SF)
Masters: IW(W), Miami(2R), Monte Carlo(SF), Madrid(SF), Rome(W), Canada(QF), Cincinnati(F), Shanghai(3R), Paris(3R)

'24 Alcaraz : 54–13 | 2 slams | Titles: 4 | YE rank: 3
Slams: AO(QF), FO(W), W(W), USO(2R)
Masters: IW(W), Miami(SF), Monte Carlo(A), Madrid(W), Rome(3R), Canada(QF), Cincinnati(F), Shanghai(A), Paris(2R)

Verdict (21): Alcaraz > Nadal = Djokovic > Federer
This is the most competitive age yet. Let's break it down:

Federer (4th): Finally looks like a top player. Wins 3 titles (including his first Masters in Hamburg), reaches the Miami final, and finishes #6. But he's still slamless at 21, something that would change dramatically the next year.

Nadal (tied 2nd): Another rock-solid season: 6 titles, his third straight French Open, and 3 Masters (Indian Wells, Monte Carlo, Rome). He also makes the Wimbledon final (losing an epic to Federer) and the Paris Masters final. His 70–15 record is excellent. But for the first time, he doesn't win the year-end #2 (Djokovic pushes him), and he fails to win a non-clay Masters or slam.

Djokovic (tied 2nd): His breakout major season. Wins his first slam (Australian Open, beating Federer in semis and Tsonga in final), plus Indian Wells and Rome Masters. He also makes the Cincinnati final and semifinals at Roland Garros and the US Open. The YEC title (beating Davydenko in final) caps it off. His 64–17 record is slightly worse than Nadal's 70–15, but he wins the direct clash at the Australian Open and proves he can win on hard courts. The YEC gives him equal footing with Nadal this year.

Alcaraz (1st): The Channel Slam puts him over the top. Winning Roland Garros and Wimbledon back-to-back at 21 is absurd — only Borg, Nadal, Federer, and Djokovic have done it, and none that young. He adds Indian Wells and Madrid Masters, making it 4 titles total. The only blemish is a shocking 2nd-round loss at the US Open. His record (54–13) is weaker than Nadal and Djokovic, but two slams at this age trumps everything. He takes the round.

The year they turned 22​

'03 Federer : 78–17 | 1 slam | Titles: 7 | YE rank: 2
Slams: AO(4R), FO(1R), W(W), USO(4R)
Masters: IW(2R), Miami(QF), Monte Carlo(A), Madrid(3R), Rome(F), Canada(SF), Cincinnati(2R), Shanghai(SF), Paris(QF)

'08 Nadal : 82–11 | 2 slams | Titles: 8 | YE rank: 1 | Olympic Gold
Slams: AO(SF), FO(W), W(W), USO(SF)
Masters: IW(SF), Miami(F), Monte Carlo(W), Madrid(W), Rome(2R), Canada(W), Cincinnati(SF), Shanghai(SF), Paris(QF)

'09 Djokovic : 78–19 | Titles: 5 | YE rank: 3
Slams: AO(QF), FO(3R), W(QF), USO(SF)
Masters: IW(QF), Miami(F), Monte Carlo(F), Madrid(SF), Rome(F), Canada(QF), Cincinnati(F), Shanghai(SF), Paris(W)

'25 Alcaraz : 71–9 | 2 slams | Titles: 8 | YE rank: 1
Slams: AO(QF), FO(W), W(F), USO(W)
Masters: IW(2R) Miami(QF), Monte Carlo(W), Madrid(QF), Rome(W), Canada(A), Cincinnati(W), Shanghai(A), Paris(2R)

Verdict (22): Nadal = Alcaraz > Federer > Djokovic
We're getting to the juicy part everyone is very close to their primes now !

Djokovic (4th): Step back year of sorts for Novak, he reaches the final in Miami, Monte Carlo, Rome, Cincinnati, and Paris (winning only Paris). He also makes the semifinals at all four slams ! but loses each time. 78–19 is elite, but 0 slams and 1 Masters title at 22, compared to what Nadal and Alcaraz are doing, leaves him a clear third.

Federer (3rd): The start of his prime. Wins his first Wimbledon ! and 7 titles overall, including a Masters final in Rome and semifinals in Canada and Shanghai. He finishes #2 behind Agassi. A great season, but clearly behind the other three.

Nadal (tied 1st): The Olympic gold medalist and world #1. Wins 2 slams, He defeats Roger in that epic wimbledon final and finally grabs world n1 plus 3 Masters (Monte Carlo, Hamburg, Toronto). He also makes the Australian Open semifinal (losing to Tsonga) and US Open semifinal (losing to Murray). His 82–11 record is the best of the four.

Alcaraz (tied 1st): Started the season slowly losing in the QF in australia but went on an absolute tear once clay season started ammasing 3 masters, making 3 slam finals and winning 2 of them.

I will update this thread at the end of 2026 ! let's see if Carlos can match Roger's 04 season ! Carlos leading the way so far along with Nadal.
 
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NachoGPT said:
Nadal had to compete with Peakerer while Carlos has to compete with carrot boy and a geriatric Djokovic. I find young Nadal more impressive.
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It's not that easy, because young Nadal had many bad losses on hardcourt that had nothing to do with Federer. Alcaraz is much more consistent in anything outside clay.

Also Alcaraz might have the same "problem" as Federer had back then. Because one might say the competition isn't THAT great. However, would both also beat better competition and dominate the same way? Very likely yes...
 
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NachoGPT said:
Nadal had to compete with Peakerer while Carlos has to compete with carrot boy and a geriatric Djokovic. I find young Nadal more impressive.
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While this is true , it's not like he was only losing to Federer on HC, for example he lost Tsonga and Murray in slams that year, lost to gasquet, mardy fish and other random dudes on HC that 08 year. Carlos is clearly the better better player HC at this point and the more complete player.
 
ChrisRF said:
It's not that easy, because young Nadal had many bad losses on hardcourt that had nothing to do with Federer. Alcaraz is much more consistent in anything outside clay.

Also Alcaraz might have the same "problem" as Federer had back then. Because one might say the competition isn't THAT great. However, would both also beat better competition and dominate the same way. Very likely yes...
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It's easy to be consistent when you know you will not have to face any real competition. That really helps your motivation. If he knew he will have to face prime Federer in the final, I doubt he would be making every final.
 
Gastino said:
While this is true , it's not like he was only losing to Federer on HC, for example he lost Tsonga and Murray in slams that year, lost to gasquet, mardy fish and other random dudes on HC that 08 year. Carlos is clearly the better better player HC at this point and the more complete player.
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Yeah, fully agree. He also had those bad losses in 2010 by the way. His most consistent year on hardcourt was actually 2019, and of course 2013. People underestimate how much better as a pure tennis PLAYER he became under the influence of Moya. "Old Nadal" is very underrated while "young Nadal" is slightly overrated.
 
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StrongRule said:
It's easy to be consistent when you know you will not have to face any real competition. That really helps your motivation. If he knew he will have to face prime Federer in the final, I doubt he would be making every final.
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That would be a huge mental issue then (losing against player A because of being afraid of player B), and Alcaraz looks like being the last player to have any mental issues. On the contrary, he might be the mentally strongest player ever. He still has to show it over his whole career of course.

Anyway, I don't see Alcaraz being afraid of anyone. That's not his mentality.
 
StrongRule said:
It's easy to be consistent when you know you will not have to face any real competition. That really helps your motivation. If he knew he will have to face prime Federer in the final, I doubt he would be making every final.
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real comp ? let's not act like Seppi and Youzhny were world beaters ....nadal wasn't that good on HC in 2008 yes I said it. Otherwise he wouldn't be losing to average joe's like Mardy fish. (yes mardy is average in compariosn to a talent like carlos)
 
ChrisRF said:
That would be a huge mental issue then (losing against player A because of being afraid of player B), and Alcaraz looks like being the last player to have any mental issues. On the contrary, he might be the mentally strongest player ever. He still has to show it over his whole career of course.

Anyway, I don't see Alcaraz being afraid of anyone. That's not his mentality.
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:rolleyes:
 
StrongRule said:
It's easy to be consistent when you know you will not have to face any real competition. That really helps your motivation. If he knew he will have to face prime Federer in the final, I doubt he would be making every final.
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2010 Nadal vs 2025 Alcaraz across all surfaces. Who wins?
 
Kralingen said:
Alcaraz went 2-5 over a 3 year span vs. a geriatric Djokovic. This is why JCF had to go. Unfortunately, it’s also completely disqualifying for any sort of GOAT case. The big 3 will always be above Sincaraz.
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huh ??? the big 3 lost to no-balls Zverev lol...they're disqualified from being the GOAT if we're gonna use dumb 1 match logics like this

PS: to top it off it wasnt even prime Zverev but baby zverev !!! cant be goat losing to that :-D
 
Gastino said:
true but we know 2010 was arguably the best year for nadal in terms of level on every surface....carlos is not even 22. Unfair to pick and chose from the primes of the big 3 . the fairest method is to compare them at the same age ..until carlos gets to 30 and past his prime
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2008 Nadal vs 2025 Alcaraz would still be a wash.
 
Gastino said:
real comp ? let's not act like Seppi and Youzhny were world beaters ....nadal wasn't that good on HC in 2008 yes I said it. Otherwise he wouldn't be losing to average joe's like Mardy fish. (yes mardy is average in compariosn to a talent like carlos)
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Incredible how the same people who claim Nadal is mentally the strongest player ever contrive some "he was afraid of real competition" nonsense when he literally had the beating of Fed on outdoor hard in those years lol. So afraid to admit Nadal just wasn't a consistent all-surface demon quite yet simply because it makes Alcaraz look good
 
Gastino said:
huh ??? the big 3 lost to no-balls Zverev lol...they're disqualified from being the GOAT if we're gonna use dumb 1 match logics like this

PS: to top it off it wasnt even prime Zverev but baby zverev !!! cant be goat losing to that :-D
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It was 7 matches.

JCF-coached Alcaraz was on a path to some level of greatness but maybe 15-16 Slams, nothing more.

Perhaps post-JCF Alcaraz can do more.
 
Kralingen said:
It was 7 matches.

JCF-coached Alcaraz was on a path to some level of greatness but maybe 15-16 Slams, nothing more.

Perhaps post-JCF Alcaraz can do more.
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loses.jpg


Can't be GOAT following your logic...
 
Gastino said:
loses.jpg


Can't be GOAT following your logic...
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Nah, it’s normal for older players to lose to younger players in physical prime. Plus, none of these were Slam matches or even really important ones. Fed’s late career Bo3 results have an infinitesimally small impact on his GOAT case.

There’s nearly zero precedent for the contrary. Alcaraz losing huge matches to a geriatric Novak on death’s door is disqualifying. JCF had to go as a result.
 
Kralingen said:
Nah, it’s normal for older players to lose to younger players in physical prime. Plus, none of these were Slam matches or even really important ones. Fed’s late career Bo3 results have an infinitesimally small impact on his GOAT case.

There’s nearly zero precedent for the contrary. Alcaraz losing huge matches to a geriatric Novak on death’s door is disqualifying. JCF had to go as a result.
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davyy.jpg



what is this ?? are you gonna gas davydenko now ?? or nalbandian....? truth of the matter if you wanna start using skewed logic to disqualify players from goat discussions for h2h's than Im afraid nadal is definitely disqualified. You can't lose 6 times to a player who doesn't even have a major ... Novak old or not is the most accomplished tennis player in the history of tennis. I've never heard so much BS in my life.


EDIT: old Novak mops the floor with davydenko ...you can take this statement to the bank !
 
Gastino said:
davyy.jpg



what is this ?? are you gonna gas davydenko now ?? or nalbandian....? truth of the matter if you wanna start using skewed logic to disqualify players from goat discussions for h2h's than Im afraid nadal is definitely disqualified. You can't lose 6 times to a player who doesn't even have a major ... Novak old or not is the most accomplished tennis player in the history of tennis. I've never heard so much BS in my life.
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How exactly could Alcaraz be argued to be better than Novak all time, if he went 2-5 against him when he was physically strong and in his prime while Novak was old and weak ?

This is what I mean by disqualifying. The debate is over before it even begins, essentially.
 
Kralingen said:
How exactly could Alcaraz be argued to be better than Novak all time, if he went 2-5 against him when he was physically strong and in his prime while Novak was old and weak ?

This is what I mean by disqualifying. The debate is over before it even begins, essentially.
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you keep on harping about 2-5 but the h2h is 5-5 lol
 
Gastino said:
This thread will be a direct a comparison between the big 3's first 5 full seasons on tour and Carlos Alcaraz at the same age. 3 of the 4 gentlemen were born within a month which makes this comparison fair and easy to track ...Roger was born 2-3 months later compared to the other 3 but it's really a negligible difference. Here's the season by season comparison :......................
I will update this thread at the end of 2026 ! , let's see if Carlos can match Roger's 04 season ! it'll be interesting to watch the comparison from here on out with Roger actually ! For Novak it will only kick in '27 unfortunately.
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Heh, heh, you in the mood to poke the ever raging monster collectively presenting as the diaspora of BIG 3 diehards??? Man, you're in for a ride. They've got every single argument against even the whiff of an idea that .... ***Shock! Horror*** .... a kid excelling on the current tour could be compared to the 3 Maestros at a comparable age. Never mind the evidence / facts or how superbly he plays. Along with the myth of untouchability, there is that tiresome almost audible gasp of breath and tone suggesting it is blasphemy that comparisons should be made at all. In this context, the premise is " end of topic" or " nothing further to say" etc. Well, feck that.
The 3 Maestros set the benchmark in nuanced and varied ways,were superb and Carlitos is a mere fledgling. But he has learned to fly, dared to dream and achieve what he has in the context he finds himself in. True comparisons will only have meaning at the end of his career, but in the context of your discussion, he is at least as accomplished as they were at the same age. Will be interesting to see how the dude does, but for now, outstanding stuff.
 
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Age-18 season(2004 vs 2021) goes to Alcaraz

Age-19 season goes to Nadal(1-1 in slam titles; but 4-2 edge in Masters titles

Age-20 season goes to Alcaraz. Same on slam and Masters titles. But Alcaraz has edge in total titles at 6-5. And he won 6 more matches all year; despite having the same # of losses

Age-21 season: this goes to Alcaraz. 2-1 edge in slam title

Age-22 season: this is extremely close. But I will go with Alcaraz here. They both had 2 slam titles, 3 Masters titles, and 8 titles overall. Alcaraz had 1 extra slam final and a final at the WTF. His winning pct for the year was also a little bit higher. Nadal went to 10 finals in 19 tourneys played(52.6%). Alcaraz went to 11 finals in 16 played(68.8%).

Age-23 season. Nadal won the AO for the first time, but got injured and didn’t win any other majors. However, he won 3 Masters titles and 5 titles overall and finished world #2. Alcaraz is off to a good start with the AO title and 2 titles out of 2 appearances. Alcaraz should be able to win this year. But I won’t count the chickens before they hatch.

Aggregate stats through age-22 season(2008 fo Nadal and 2025 for Alcaraz).

Nadal
335-77, .813 overall
29-13, .690 vs top-5
47-22, .681 vs top-10

Alcaraz
280-65, .812 overall
28-14, .667 vs top-5
52-24, .684 vs top-10

Alcaraz has definitely held his own here. I would actually give him a paper-thin edge so far, as crazy as that sounds. Hopefully, he can keep this up.
 
Third Serve said:
That was a mistake, I forgot the OP's comparison ended at age 22. Alcaraz obviously hasn't finished his 23 year so that's still in the open.

FWIW I do think 2009 AO Nadal > 2026 AO Alcaraz but that's as far as that comparison can go.
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Fair enough. Carlos should breeze past 09dal in terms of the overall year from here, but compiling a superior one to 04derer is still a tall order.
 
ChrisRF said:
Yeah, fully agree. He also had those bad losses in 2010 by the way. His most consistent year on hardcourt was actually 2019, and of course 2013. People underestimate how much better as a pure tennis PLAYER he became under the influence of Moya. "Old Nadal" is very underrated while "young Nadal" is slightly overrated.
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Nadal lost several years of his career by leaving his uncle Toni in charge of everything.
:(
 
ChrisRF said:
It's not that easy, because young Nadal had many bad losses on hardcourt that had nothing to do with Federer. Alcaraz is much more consistent in anything outside clay.

Also Alcaraz might have the same "problem" as Federer had back then. Because one might say the competition isn't THAT great. However, would both also beat better competition and dominate the same way? Very likely yes...
Click to expand...

Karl has had plenty of uninspiring losses himself. Not so much recently, but Nadal was also peaking at Alc's current age.
 
Kralingen said:
Alcaraz went 2-5 over a 3 year span vs. a geriatric Djokovic. This is why JCF had to go. Unfortunately, it’s also completely disqualifying for any sort of GOAT case. The big 3 will always be above Sincaraz.
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This. Even though it was his weakest slam, his loss against 37 years and 8 months old Nole at AO 2025 was a pretty bad loss IMO. Also lost to 37 yo Nole on clay at Olympics after winning RG... If Carlos was not in his prime he was surely close to it at least IMO
 
Gastino said:
huh ??? the big 3 lost to no-balls Zverev lol...they're disqualified from being the GOAT if we're gonna use dumb 1 match logics like this

PS: to top it off it wasnt even prime Zverev but baby zverev !!! cant be goat losing to that :-D
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You're talking like Carlos dominates the H2H against Zverev lol
It's extremely close and you can argue that Zverev was better when he was facing the big 3.
 
Third Serve said:
I think I would give 21, 22, and 23 to Nadal.
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23 - just started let's see what's coming no ?

22 - is very very close , I can understand that some would pick Nadal

21 - I don't understand your rational here , how can you have nadal as having a better season while only winning 1 slam to Carlos' channel slam ?
 
Gastino said:
21 - I don't understand your rational here , how can you have nadal as having a better season while only winning 1 slam to Carlos' channel slam ?
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The main difference between ‘07 and ‘08 Nadal is how one set played out:

TheFifthSet

Thread 'Nadal in ‘07 vs Nadal in ‘08'

Here’s a contention that’s sure to ruffle a few feathers: I’ve always felt that Nadal in 2007 was about 95% as good as he was in 2008. The chief difference is that 2007 Nadal lost a Wimbledon final by razor-thin margins, whereas 2008 Nadal won a Wimbledon final by even thinner margins. Both finals were spectacular, and I daresay Nadal may have played even better in 2007.

Beyond that, he was leading the points race up to that point in 2007, had (to this day) one of his very best clay court seasons, won Indian Wells without the loss of a set, and navigated through a murderers row of Fish...
  • Like

Meanwhile there’s a comparatively bigger difference between ‘24 and ‘25 Alcaraz unless one defaults to pure outcome-based analysis.
 
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TheFifthSet said:
No one considers Nadal a contender for GOAT on Outdoor HC, where four of those losses took place, and he’s not even Top 40 Indoors, where the other two happened.

Also, not a slam match among ‘em.

For legacy-evaluating purposes it’s definitely not as bad.
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surface GOAThood was never implied , I take exception to the fact that 1 bad loss can take you out of the GOAT conversation, I find it ridiculous tbh. The only bad loss Carlos has had against Novak is 25 AO. We can go match for match if you like , the h2h started when Carlos was 18, the whole objective of this exercice is to make carlos look bad hence the constant impliance of him being in his prime in matches he was 19-21 years old which is ridiculous.
 
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