Alternate Tie Offs for Wilsons

CosmosMpower

Hall of Fame
I've noticed that the Wilson provided instructions usually result in lots of messy string jobs with double blocked holes etc. For example for the Clash 100 they say to tie off mains at 6 throat and crosses at 5 head and 8 throat. Klippermate says to tie off mains at 8 throat and crosses at 8 head and 6 throat. The Klippermate instructions result in a much cleaner string job without any blocked holes or string bundled on top of each other.

I've found the same thing with the Pro Staff 97, the Wilson instructions result in pretty messy/complicated string jobs and the klippermate instructions resulting in much cleaner results. My question is, how does one figure out how what alternate tie offs would result in the best results with no damage to the frame if it's not listed in the klippermate or alternate instructions?

I just did a Clash 108 and following Wilson's instructions, the string for the cross tie off at the throat had to go through a double blocked hole and I was using Weiscannon Ultra Cable and Rock n Blue hybrid which is quite thick. I was able to get the string through but it was not easy. Klippermate did not list instructions for the Clash 108 so would like to know how I can figure out a better way in the future.
 

am1899

Legend
Pretty sure you can string the Clash 108 the same way the Klippermate instructions call for the 100:

Skips: 7, 9 throat & head
MTO: 8 throat
XTO: 5 head, 6 throat
 

CosmosMpower

Hall of Fame
Pretty sure you can string the Clash 108 the same way the Klippermate instructions call for the 100:

Skips: 7, 9 throat & head
MTO: 8 throat
XTO: 5 head, 6 throat

That’s what I suspected but the Wilson provided instructions weren’t exactly the same for the 100 and 108 so I didn’t want to chance it.

How can you tell which alternate tie offs are safe and appropriate? Is there a rule of thumb?
 

esgee48

G.O.A.T.
When the mains end at the throat, you can generally find the tie off hole within 3 holes of where the last main is. The hole will have a larger diameter. For example, last main is 9 ending at throat. You will find the tie off at 7 or 6 throat. For mains ending at the tip, the same also applies. Last main is 9 ending at tip. Tie off will be near 7 or 6 tip. If there are 2 skips such as your clash 108, your last main is 10 and your tie off will be 8 or 6 since 7 and 9 are crosses. If you do 2 piece jobs, there will be another large diameter hole for starting crosses near the first cross. It will be generally within 3 holes of that first cross. These are my rules of thumb when I am doing an old frame and I am too lazy to look it up. This does not really work well for fan shaped patterns. Those, I will look up and if the runs are too long, will do something like a Yonex loop.
 

am1899

Legend
That’s what I suspected but the Wilson provided instructions weren’t exactly the same for the 100 and 108 so I didn’t want to chance it.

How can you tell which alternate tie offs are safe and appropriate? Is there a rule of thumb?

Not really a rule of thumb per thumb per say. I honestly can’t remember if someone recommended that method to me, or if I figured It out on my own. Either way, during many years working in a retail shop, I’ve strung countless Wilson frames like that - ones with 16 mains, where the mains ended at the throat. Not a single problem yet.
 

Wes

Hall of Fame
@CosmosMpower,

Here's the issue... you are creating those double blocked holes (which are not necessary), and making life much harder than it needs to be.
This is because (for all 3 frames you mentioned) you made the mistake of tying off the mains at 6T.
For each of those 3 frames (Clash 100, Clash 108, Pro Staff 97), you should have tied the mains off at 8T, instead of at 6T.

In fact - coincidentally - all 3 of the frames that you mentioned have the exact same pattern, skipped holes, and tie-off locations.
All are 16x19 and start at the Throat.
All skip 7H,9H & 7T,9T
All have mains tie off at 8T.
All have top cross tie at 5H.
All have bottom cross tie at 6T.

Now, double blocked holes do happen on certain racquets, but none of the ones you've mentioned actually fall into this category.


Don't CREATE double blocked holes - that aren't necessary.
See my post here (I explain exactly how to know when this problem will, or won't, arise)...


Furthermore, my recommendation is for you to learn/understand frame design/layout so that you can analyze a racquet on your own - and, therefore, be less dependent on information (and sometimes incorrect information) found via other sources.

This video I made should help you understand/diagnose tie-off locations all by yourself.
 
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CosmosMpower

Hall of Fame
@CosmosMpower,

Here's the issue... you are creating those double blocked holes (which are not necessary), and making life much harder than it needs to be.
This is because (for all 3 frames you mentioned) you made the mistake of tying off the mains at 6T.
For each of those 3 frames (Clash 100, Clash 108, Pro Staff 97), you should have tied the mains off at 8T, instead of at 6T.

In fact - coincidentally - all 3 of the frames that you mentioned have the exact same pattern, skipped holes, and tie-off locations.
All are 16x19 and start at the Throat.
All skip 7H,9H & 7T,9T
All have mains tie off at 8T.
All have top cross tie at 5H.
All have bottom cross tie at 6T.

Now, double blocked holes do happen on certain racquets, but none of the ones you've mentioned actually fall into this category.


Don't CREATE double blocked holes - that aren't necessary.
See my post here (I explain exactly how to know when this problem will, or won't, arise)...


Furthermore, my recommendation is for you to learn/understand frame design/layout so that you can analyze a racquet on your own - and, therefore, be less dependent on information (and sometimes incorrect information) found via other sources.

This video I made should help you understand/diagnose tie-off locations all by yourself.


Thanks I didn't create those double blocked holes, those are the stringing instructions provided on the Wilson website for that frame.

They also have different instructions for clash 100 and 108 which is why I didn’t do the 8T mains and 5H and 6T tie offs I usually use on the clash 100.

I’ll check out your video.
 

CosmosMpower

Hall of Fame
When the mains end at the throat, you can generally find the tie off hole within 3 holes of where the last main is. The hole will have a larger diameter. For example, last main is 9 ending at throat. You will find the tie off at 7 or 6 throat. For mains ending at the tip, the same also applies. Last main is 9 ending at tip. Tie off will be near 7 or 6 tip. If there are 2 skips such as your clash 108, your last main is 10 and your tie off will be 8 or 6 since 7 and 9 are crosses. If you do 2 piece jobs, there will be another large diameter hole for starting crosses near the first cross. It will be generally within 3 holes of that first cross. These are my rules of thumb when I am doing an old frame and I am too lazy to look it up. This does not really work well for fan shaped patterns. Those, I will look up and if the runs are too long, will do something like a Yonex loop.

Thanks that’s exactly what I was looking for. I’ll look for a larger grommet within 3 holes of the last main. Is there risk of damage to the frame of you don’t tie off in the “correct” position?
 

am1899

Legend
Thanks that’s exactly what I was looking for. I’ll look for a larger grommet within 3 holes of the last main. Is there risk of damage to the frame of you don’t tie off in the “correct” position?

In most cases, with Wilson frames like this, you’ll find the hole for the 6th main is the one grommet hole in that area that will be obviously enlarged. I utilize this hole to tie off the bottom cross.

The grommet hole for the 7th main (which I utilize to tie off the outside mains) won’t be as enlarged as the 6th main hole. But that’s ok. Cut the string at an angle. Hold the end with needle nose pliers and gently push it through. It should go through with little fuss.

If you follow the directions as I’ve outlined, it’s inconceivable to me that you could hurt the frame in any way.
 

Turbo-87

G.O.A.T.
I had to use an "alternate" tie off for my cross on a Prince Tour 100T. I couldn't figure out how to tie a good knot where they indicated the cross tie off at the throat. The intersection of strings confounded me. Lol. I ended up tying the cross on another location further down the throat rather than use the one indicated higher up. My knot would have looked ugly there and I couldn't see how I could cinch it up since it is blocked by the main. Seemed like such a tiny workspace.
20210829-113649.jpg
 
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jim e

Legend
You still had a decent amount of room for your typical Parnell knot, but you also could have used the pro knot as that even takes up less amount of room.
 

struggle

Legend
BLX Blade (gold and black) 18x20 is abit confounding. Bottom tie off for X is at 12B (Kmate). Not a great location (tight spot on a cross) and a long run outside the frame.
 

Wes

Hall of Fame
BLX Blade (gold and black) 18x20 is abit confounding. Bottom tie off for X is at 12B (Kmate). Not a great location (tight spot on a cross) and a long run outside the frame.

Correct.
12T is the designated tie-off for the bottom cross on that particular frame (and, as you've indicated, lacks much space).
Send me a PM. I'll give you a few different recommendations when stringing that particular frame.
 

dachness

New User
To use the designated cross tie off you would bring the cross string through the grommet and over the main. Then over and under the cross with the tail returning upward. Repeat for the 2nd loop. When you cinch the first loop it will hop over the main. Same will occur with the 2nd. Most important part being that the tail end is up so the loops are pulled over the main.
 
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