Angell 97 comparison and paintjob questions.

panda5566

Rookie
Use the WIlson tour 97/ pro for a long time. Decided to give head prestige ago and liked it as well (previous red ones). Very curious how the current version of angell 97 plays compare to these two.

I hear many good things about angell, esp the quality control. I assume the control is probably similar, but how is the feel, comfort and grip shape? I read that it is foam filled, will that make it even more comfy, or will that kill the feel? Also I'm used to the wilson and current head grip shape, wondering if the B shape is identical to one of these two or just similar?

If anyone can describe the comfort, feel and grip shape to me, that would be nice :)

Most importantly I heard that there was a purple color option, but I don't see any paintjob color options. Can someone tell me where to go for the paint job options?

Thanks
 
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snoflewis

Legend
tried tc97 v4 18x20 315g/310mm in grip C. it's a bit more square than wilson, closer to prince. i've tried the B shape and recall it being closer to a head TK82S pallet than the wilson grip, but it's been a while.

i think these angells are an acquired taste. prestige mp and pro (95" 18x20 and 16x19) and wilson UT/UP 18x20s pocket the ball much more and feel more buttery, especially with poly. the TC97 has a linear flex throughout the frame, but the ball pops off the stringbed way too fast even with a softer poly strung in the low 40s. i think it's a candidate for a gut/poly setup, but that's not a road that i'm willing to go down. the feel is very crisp and clean without feeling raw i think the ultra tour/pro 18x20 is a notch above any modern 95" prestige in any headsize, and both are far far above the tc97 in my opinion.

i believe the purple color was an option for the v2 or v3 (octane pj), but haven't seen any for v4.
 

flanker2000fr

Hall of Fame
Use the WIlson tour 97/ pro for a long time. Decided to give head prestige ago and liked it as well (previous red ones). Very curious how the current version of angell 97 plays compare to these two.

I hear many good things about angell, esp the quality control. I assume the control is probably similar, but how is the feel, comfort and grip shape? I read that it is foam filled, will that make it even more comfy, or will that kill the feel? Also I'm used to the wilson and current head grip shape, wondering if the B shape is identical to one of these two or just similar?

If anyone can describe the comfort, feel and grip shape to me, that would be nice :)

Most importantly I heard that there was a purple color option, but I don't see any paintjob color options. Can someone tell me where to go for the paint job options?

Thanks

I'll try to answer to the best of my ability:

- QC: significantly better than any major brand. All the frames I bought from them arrive within 1g and 1mm from requested specs. Swing weight, if you specify it, will arrive within 2-3 points
- Foam filling: makes for a more comfortable frame, but I guess it's not for everyone. I grew up in the 80's playing foam filled frames, so I'm right at home here, but if someone grew up with e.g. a Babolat, this will feel quite muted
- Grip shape: can't comment on B shape, as I transitioned from Prince into Angell's with the C shape, which is virtually identical
- Color: I think the purple you are referring to is the V3 Octane, which has been discontinued
- Comparison to UT 97 / Prestige: only had 1 hit with an UT 97, and that was years ago, so can't really comment on that. One of my friend has a current generation Prestige Pro, which I got a few hits with, and the TC97 18x20 is not miles off. Feeling is a bit more direct on the TC97, which is expected as it would be ~63RA strung vs. 60 for the Prestige. Most of the difference is felt in the throat / bridge area, which is where I feel the Angell is a bit stiffer. In both cases, these are frames that give you what you put into your shot. If your form is poor, they're not very forgiving. If you've got good form, they're very accurate and rewarding
 

panda5566

Rookie
Thank you both for answering. So to conclude, the QC is the best quality of angell. Other than that, it's personal taste of feel and it's not significantly better than the UT or prestige?
My UT RA is also around 63, but I dont feel my UT to be stiffer than my prestige(60). The feel are different tho, can't describe it in words.

So the foam feel make it a bit comfy and muted feeling? But the feel is also more raw and direct, less buttery than ut/prestige? Haha I'm a bit confused.
Is it safe to say that I probably wont hate it, but depending on the personal taste of feel, I may like it or just get used to it eventually? The QC is a big + for me, so I'm really considering buying one. NO sexy purple octane tho, shame~

Side question: My old UT tours and new UT pro feel different. If I were to describe it it would be that my UT tour is slightly softer or flex significantly more in the head or throat. Not sure if its a QC thing, paintjobs, or just how it is for the new batches in pro versions. I wonder if the new UT pro v4 with purple paint job have the same as the UT pro or tour, or is it different from them? Anyone lucky enough to compare them?
 

Gee

Hall of Fame
I have a lot of experience with the UT and TC97 18x20 (and most other Angell frames).

They are very similar and both fully foam filled frames as well (at least if you customized the UT to the same specs as the TC97). The TC97 is just a crisper version of the UT. So if you prefer the softer flex of the UT and Prestige I think you'll a little bit disappointed with the feel of the TC97.

I rather would recommend you the TC95 that feels much more like the UT if you want to try an Angell for the first time.

However the QC of Angell is much better than Wilson and most other big manufacturers. So it is not a coincidence that your Ultra Tour/Pros can feel different and the swingweight of them can vary a lot as well.
 

flanker2000fr

Hall of Fame
Thank you both for answering. So to conclude, the QC is the best quality of angell. Other than that, it's personal taste of feel and it's not significantly better than the UT or prestige?
My UT RA is also around 63, but I dont feel my UT to be stiffer than my prestige(60). The feel are different tho, can't describe it in words.

So the foam feel make it a bit comfy and muted feeling? But the feel is also more raw and direct, less buttery than ut/prestige? Haha I'm a bit confused.
Is it safe to say that I probably wont hate it, but depending on the personal taste of feel, I may like it or just get used to it eventually? The QC is a big + for me, so I'm really considering buying one. NO sexy purple octane tho, shame~

Side question: My old UT tours and new UT pro feel different. If I were to describe it it would be that my UT tour is slightly softer or flex significantly more in the head or throat. Not sure if its a QC thing, paintjobs, or just how it is for the new batches in pro versions. I wonder if the new UT pro v4 with purple paint job have the same as the UT pro or tour, or is it different from them? Anyone lucky enough to compare them?

For me, the main point about foam filling is that it seems to dampen vibrations, hence the muted feeling. Stiffness is another variable to how a racquet feels. Which explains why I find the Angell more muted, but the Prestige more flexible. I hope this makes sense.

Regarding Wilson, my experience when I got back to tennis 6 years ago after a few decades of hiatus was not positive. I bought 2 PS97 from the local shop, started playing with them and they felt very different. Out of curiosity I weighted them and measured their balance: they were 9g and 5mm apart. From there, I decided to never consider a Wilson product again.

Lastly, like others have mentioned, if you are not a fan of the flex profile of the TC97 where the throat is stiffer than the hoop, the way to go is the TC95, which plays softer and with a constant flex. Don't wory too much about those 2 sq.in. (which in reality are only 1.3 sq.in. according to Angell thenselves), the difference in tolerance and power is minute.
 

Steve Huff

G.O.A.T.
If you're willing to plop down the money for a custom frame like the Angell, I'd also look at a Zus frame. I can't say that one is any better than the other, as I was only stringing them, but where the Angell felt great, the Zus felt damn near perfect. Not saying you should buy one (they're expensive), but you should at least look them up, consider them.
 

panda5566

Rookie
Yeah, thats exactly why I was moving away from my Wilson in the first place, cuz of how their QC is so far apart lol. So the tc97 is stiffer in throat but flexy on the hoop? How would you compare it to a Tecnifibre tf 40 's stiffness? If it's around that stiff feel, then I think I will pass and only look into the tc95 from now on. While people say tf40 is comfy, I found it to be stiffer and much more powerful than my rackets.

So tc95 is technically closer feel to a prestige huh?

- I've never heard of Zus rackets, interesting.
 

flanker2000fr

Hall of Fame
Yeah, thats exactly why I was moving away from my Wilson in the first place, cuz of how their QC is so far apart lol. So the tc97 is stiffer in throat but flexy on the hoop? How would you compare it to a Tecnifibre tf 40 's stiffness? If it's around that stiff feel, then I think I will pass and only look into the tc95 from now on. While people say tf40 is comfy, I found it to be stiffer and much more powerful than my rackets.

So tc95 is technically closer feel to a prestige huh?

- I've never heard of Zus rackets, interesting.

The TC97 is a comfortable frame, but yes, the flex profile is different from that of a TC95, owing to a different beam section in the throat: box beam for the 97 vs. D beam for the 95. The 95 flexes uniformly from the top of the handle to the tip of the hoop, where the 97 feels a bit stiffer in the throat and then flexes in the hoop. Also, the strung RA of the 95 is ~60, which will be closer to that of a Prestige, vs. 63 for the 97. So if what you're after is that plush, old school, flexy feeling, the 95 is the way to go. I can't comment on the TF40 as I have no experience with it. I typically don't like frames that are head heavy.

Leading to my next point: Angell allows for the luxury of picking your weight and balance, and those parameters are going to make a significant difference in terms of how the racquet plays. Obviously, regardless of flex profile, a 300g / 325mm frame will play very different from a 330g / 305mm one, even if you asked Paul to hit a specific SW. I play with a 310g / 315mm set-up with both the 95 and the 97, as I am trying to avoid frames that are too high for static weight these days (too tiring). But I feel that this is probably the lowest static weight one should go for in such traditional player's frames, as they require a bit of mass behind the ball to get any juice. It would also help with stability. Coming from a Prestige, you may want to look at a 315g or 320g with a 310mm or 315mm balance.

Lastly, one thing to know is that those 95/97 18x20 Angell frames are a bit string sensitive, and it takes a bit of research to find the set up that works for your game.
 
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Gee

Hall of Fame
So tc95 is technically closer feel to a prestige huh?

No, not exactly.
The feel of TC95 is much more like the Ultra Tour. Both have a more solid feel and power than the prestige because of the foam filled frames.
If you're looking for an alternative for a prestige I would recommend the K7 Lime as this one is not foam filled either like the prestige.
I played with all these ones at least one year so I know how they feel and play.
 

panda5566

Rookie
Yeah I was going to do the 320g tc97 since it's closest to my UT and prestige, didn't even think much about about other specs. The main concern for me for tc95 is that I worry about going down in head size and that might take a while for me to get used to. I'm quite sensitive to head size or even head shape even if it's just a tiny bit.

BTW I didn't know UT is foam filled? I know that handle is full of foam since I added weight there, but it's actually foam filled inside the whole racket?

My string set up is usually volkl strings, cyclone/ cyclone tour , sometimes others.

The new wilson pro v4 with purple paint job on Wilson site is $369. WTH is this price.
I wish angell has other paintjob options other than the current black brownish, looks plain, but maybe it might actually look better in person. Will there be other paintjob options to customize in the future for the v4, I really dig the last version's octane color. If there will be other paint options, I might wait for it.
 

flanker2000fr

Hall of Fame
Yeah I was going to do the 320g tc97 since it's closest to my UT and prestige, didn't even think much about about other specs. The main concern for me for tc95 is that I worry about going down in head size and that might take a while for me to get used to. I'm quite sensitive to head size or even head shape even if it's just a tiny bit.

BTW I didn't know UT is foam filled? I know that handle is full of foam since I added weight there, but it's actually foam filled inside the whole racket?

My string set up is usually volkl strings, cyclone/ cyclone tour , sometimes others.

The new wilson pro v4 with purple paint job on Wilson site is $369. WTH is this price.
I wish angell has other paintjob options other than the current black brownish, looks plain, but maybe it might actually look better in person. Will there be other paintjob options to customize in the future for the v4, I really dig the last version's octane color. If there will be other paint options, I might wait for it.

Angell changes its paint job every 2-3 years, and seeing that the current paint job is only a few months old, I wouldn't be holding my breath that they change anytime soon. In real life, I find the new one terrific, a deep black gloss that also seems quite resistant to chipping. But that's personal.

I asked Paul why he dropped the Octane paint job, as I too liked it, and he said it had too many quality issues. What is interesting is that it's the same paint currently used for the Wilson Blade series, only difference being that the hue is green for those vs. purple for the Angell's. Tells you all you need to know about Wilson's QC that they should chose to be using this paint when Angell decides to drop it because of a lack of consistency.
 

Tennisist

Professional
Notable differences:
1) Angell 97 is much more powerful than Prestige MP, and even more so than the Ultra Tour / Ultra Pro.
2) Angell has a heavier swingweight (even in light configurations) — probably because of foam.

As a result, it is heavier to wield, but produces much more powerful serves, and stands up strong against heavy-hitters. It feels and behaves closer to Gravity Pro than to either Prestige or UT/UP.
 

panda5566

Rookie
Notable differences:
1) Angell 97 is much more powerful than Prestige MP, and even more so than the Ultra Tour / Ultra Pro.
2) Angell has a heavier swingweight (even in light configurations) — probably because of foam.

As a result, it is heavier to wield, but produces much more powerful serves, and stands up strong against heavy-hitters. It feels and behaves closer to Gravity Pro than to either Prestige or UT/UP.
Thank you for the description, very helpful comparison. What is the swingweight of the 320g one, does anyone know?

As for the paintjob, I didn't know it was glossy, couldn't tell from looking at the pictures. I might actually like it if its glossy.
 

RF_PRO_STAFF

Professional
Thank you for the description, very helpful comparison. What is the swingweight of the 320g one, does anyone know?

As for the paintjob, I didn't know it was glossy, couldn't tell from looking at the pictures. I might actually like it if its glossy.
The paintjob is very glossy.
 

flanker2000fr

Hall of Fame
If you're willing to plop down the money for a custom frame like the Angell, I'd also look at a Zus frame. I can't say that one is any better than the other, as I was only stringing them, but where the Angell felt great, the Zus felt damn near perfect. Not saying you should buy one (they're expensive), but you should at least look them up, consider them.

I had a look at those Zus frames, and they look really interesting. But bl**dy h*ll, 400 bucks a pop, that's really steep. Not sure how much the customs duties are in the US (it's zero in HK where I live), but seeing how weak the British Pound has been the past few months, it was actually cheaper for me to buy an Angell and have it shipped than buy virtually any major brand locally (the HK$ is pegged with the US$).
 
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