Anton
Legend
Absolutely but we are talking apples to apples comparison of string pattern.
Angell TC95 vs RF97 - Review
- Thread starter Bogdan_TT
- Start date
Absolutely but we are talking apples to apples comparison of string pattern.
I can't and won't contradict you.
It's just my experience, comparing 16x19 with 16x18 or 16x20. They pretty much launch the same to me.
On the other hand, 18x20 lanches much flatter, which confirms your theory.
We may both be right, as the difference between different 16x strings may be small but an 18x string is very noticeable, mainly due to restricted mains movement ;-)
mike84
Professional
I tested friends Angell TC95 recently
27.25''
16x19
63ra
330grams 9 points headlight (felt less)
wilson overgrip
alu power 125 tension 52
compared to my k six 95
other than slight weight difference I didn't notice anything that tc95 did better than ksix 95 and vice versa.
if you stripped all the paint away and did blind test you couldn't tell the difference between the two.
all of these comparisons I read here (not just this thread) feel like its all in your head effect.
27.25''
16x19
63ra
330grams 9 points headlight (felt less)
wilson overgrip
alu power 125 tension 52
compared to my k six 95
other than slight weight difference I didn't notice anything that tc95 did better than ksix 95 and vice versa.
if you stripped all the paint away and did blind test you couldn't tell the difference between the two.
all of these comparisons I read here (not just this thread) feel like its all in your head effect.
Of course it's all in our head
What did you expect? Our reviews are as valid as yours, for exactly this reason Btw, I've been thinking in the last 2 weeks to order a TC90, just for kicks!
27.5"
330g
31.5cm
B2
The_Racketeer
Professional
If you do I'd really like to read a review. I've heard next to nothing about the 90s. From what I understand they are NOT foam filled. If that's the case, I wonder what the stability, plow, comfort, & sweetspot are like.Of course it's all in our head
Btw, I've been thinking in the last 2 weeks to order a TC90, just for kicks!
27.5"
330g
31.5cm
B2
Fireball
Rookie
Is it K Six.one you referring to?
As a K Six.one owner that sounds like sweet music in my ears. But there actually is one big difference between the two, you can buy a new TC95 today and supposedly also tomorrow.
mike84
Professional
Yes, it is.
However you should take my review/comparison with grain of salt, I can play with any frame as long its heavier side/decent high swing weight.
Would feel bad if you picked tc95 and used my "review" as base to buy.
JohnBPittsburgh
Hall of Fame
I think it takes a little time for people to notice all the differences in frames. That's why TW playtests are a month long Imagine your K Six One is a BMW 325i, and you test drove a 700 series. After the 20 min test drive, you might go home thinking, it's basically the same thing as what I already have. Test drives are usually quick, and you don't get to push the car to the limit. Both cars will get you from home to work, and operate the same. But if you ask a BMW 700 series owner, for their thoughts on the car, you will get a totally different answer. They have had the chance to fully experience all that it has to offer. Being able to take it on the freeway and hit top speeds, taking severe turns, and developing a "feel" for the car. So the difference in reviews from someone who test drives a BMW 700, and an owner, would be drastically different I am glad you shared your experience though, and I am in no way trying to invalidate it. People and their preferences are so different, along with their wants and needs. I will be the first person to admit, that I didn't need an Angell frame (or any other frame, honestly), but I am oh so glad I got one.
Imagine your K Six One is a BMW 325i, and you test drove a 700 series. After the 20 min test drive, you might go home thinking, it's basically the same thing as what I already have. Test drives are usually quick, and you don't get to push the car to the limit. Both cars will get you from home to work, and operate the same. But if you ask a BMW 700 series owner, for their thoughts on the car, you will get a totally different answer. They have had the chance to fully experience all that it has to offer. Being able to take it on the freeway and hit top speeds, taking severe turns, and developing a "feel" for the car. So the difference in reviews from someone who test drives a BMW 700, and an owner, would be drastically different I am glad you shared your experience though, and I am in no way trying to invalidate it. People and their preferences are so different, along with their wants and needs. I will be the first person to admit, that I didn't need an Angell frame (or any other frame, honestly), but I am oh so glad I got one.This is the truth.
I've played with my Angells for eight months, averaging 8-12 hours per week on court. When I bought them, I thought I knew what I wanted. My strengths were my first serve and OHBH, weaknesses a forehand that I've been rebuilding and average volleys.
First point for me is head size. I've never managed to hit my backhand with a 100 sq in racquet in the same way I can with a smaller head. I don't know how much of this is mental now, but it's a constant that I appear to be stuck with.
Second was weight. I've played with a number of heavy racquets, all the way up to about 350g unstrung. Balance point obviously needs to move with the weight. What I'd discovered prior to the Angells was that my forehand improved considerably when I dropped the weight to the 300 - 310g range.
Third was grip size. I learnt to play in the 80s, where continental grips and large handles were in vogue. I've been as high as a L5, but came back down to a 4. For the Angell, I opted for a 3, thinking it would help me with the forehand.
I've learnt a lot in the eight months. First up was that there probably isn't a racquet that exists which allows me to play the best version of each of my shots. With the Angell, I could still hit big serves, though not place them quite as accurately. Volleys were a revelation - if I played more doubles, this could be a great racquet. Groundstrokes were reasonable, but not quite as penetrating as I'd like.
Downsizing the grip did indeed help with the forehand. But it meant a little lost stability on the backhand. In part, this may even be due to the shape - for forehand I like the Wilson shape, but for backhand I like it a touch squarer. Think Head TK82S more than Prince.
The string pattern I picked was 16 x 19. I now believe that the extra precision received with an 18 x 20 is better suited to my game.
Ultimately, I think that this racquet made me a slightly better-rounded player, but took away too much from my big weapons. After much pondering, I've decided to go back to my old frames - the Angells will appear in the classifieds once my post has undergone the moderation process.
What are those old frames, you ask? Head TGK 238.1s, the pro stock version of the Prestige MP. I'm not leaving custom behind, I'm just customising a little differently.
Well, this is the natural evolution of an amateur player. Keep on trying, as getting used with a new frame does not mean a matter of life and death. So we change, try, experiment. It's normal and ok.
A pro on the other hand can't afford to throw away half of year to tinker with a new setup. Look at Federer changing. Or Novak changing. They do this maybe once in their pro career. The rest of the time they learn to adapt to the racquet. And to make it part of their body.
It's more fun to be an amateur. It pais better to be a top pro
A pro on the other hand can't afford to throw away half of year to tinker with a new setup. Look at Federer changing. Or Novak changing. They do this maybe once in their pro career. The rest of the time they learn to adapt to the racquet. And to make it part of their body.
It's more fun to be an amateur. It pais better to be a top pro
Backhanded Compliment
Legend
very true... though it costs less to be an amateur than a pro ranked say 300.Well, this is the natural evolution of an amateur player. Keep on trying, as getting used with a new frame does not mean a matter of life and death. So we change, try, experiment. It's normal and ok.
A pro on the other hand can't afford to throw away half of year to tinker with a new setup. Look at Federer changing. Or Novak changing. They do this maybe once in their pro career. The rest of the time they learn to adapt to the racquet. And to make it part of their body.
It's more fun to be an amateur. It pais better to be a top pro
i dont like to change sticks much... it is age that forces me..
what i like about angell is the ability to get identical sticks years apart and a no nonsense approach that gives room for customization to ny weight and balance... I like leather grips and 9 points head light. so many frames that means it's going to be very close to 13 ounces once i add the lead at 3 and 9 for stability too.. i. pretty sure 12.6 oz works better for me than 13 though and its impossible to get these days. there just isnt enough room
unclenimrod
Rookie
I am in the same boat and it was why I went with an angell. room to make small adjustments is a big deal. I make small adjustments for each season because in northern va the temps are so wildly different and I play outdoor year round. Having a super headlight stick that isn't already 12.5+ is of huge value to me
Backhanded Compliment
Legend
exactly... my stringer always comments on all the tiny little bits of lead away from the big pieces but i explain they are seasonal adjustments.... im one of those players that paints lines so i notice and adjust when u start missing everything by 3 -4 inches. angell should give me room to work.
unclenimrod
Rookie
Absolutely. For instance, my angell comes in strung at 349g, about 16g lighter than my stock ps85 (or 12.25 oz vs 12.85 oz with Wilson pro over grips, and 9pts headlight vs 10 respectively). That .6 oz is actually quite a bit of difference depending on where I want to concentrate it. I can polarize or depolarize a frame using that amount. If I were to order another I'd get the exact same frame again.
Anton
Legend
Do they all play EXACTLY same? Because even with same weight and balance they could have slightly different weight distribution.
One of them is just a bit faster through the air. The other 3 play just the same. So I'm using the faster one for my spin game
Backhanded Compliment
Legend
exactly... my stringer always comments on all the tiny little bits if lead but i explain they are seasonal adjustments.... im one of those players that paints lines so i notice and adjust when u start missing everything by 3 -4 inches. angell should give me roon to w
Yeah it is HUGE... I dont like to change sticks often but I do tinker with the seasons. Ultimately that is why I stopped using the Prestige IG MP. I was at 13oz and 9pts Hl (it was an extra heavy stick direct from the factory) and though I loved it didnt give me much tinker room... that and the fact that most players who have played me more than once adopt a strategy of not giving me any pace. Generating pace with a 13oz stick can be a lot of work... so I switched to a slightly lighter and more maneuverable even lower powered stick... 12.8oz. Ive adapted and redeveloped enough of my game that I think I want even more tinker room and a lil free power without giving up maneuverability and precision. I think 12.6-12.7oz should be fine and easy to achieve with the angell (its hard to do with the pacific with my preferred leather grip).
The_Racketeer
Professional
It's funny. You guys are much better players than me, fine tune your racquets to match the seasons, and have hit a much larger variety of racquets. Yet the benefits of a custom Angell frame are just as valuable for you as me. And the fact that Paul has everything from a heavy soft 90sq" to a stiff extended length 105sq" is evidence that you don't need to be an open level player to get the full benefit of owning one of his racquets.
unclenimrod
Rookie
He says as much right on his website. Part of angell's mission statement as a company. Seems to bear out, yes.
So what do you do when the cold season comes? Do you add more weight or do you loosen the strings?
unclenimrod
Rookie
Can't speak for backhanded compliment, but I play with lead in the handle during warmer months to take advantage of the extra bounce on a hot court, and move lead to 3 and 9 during the colder months because there isn't near as much reward for spin on a cold hard court.
Backhanded Compliment
Legend
a tiny bit of lead at 12 usually sometimes 3 and 9 during fall as it cools down
Well having something of quality is always nice and the fact is most of the manufacturers are herding players in a certain direction... all of a sudden Angell is one of the only choices for those of us who want certain things that he specializes in. It really was a shame Donnay was so spazztic as a brand... that said Im pretty sure Angell's quality is far above them. Areal tortoise and hare story. Paul basically doesnt change his designs and eventually the whole marketplace markets and innovates itself away from some core things that tennis players have always wanted... solid, comfortable frames that are relatively maneuverable still.
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I don't get it.
My take is that there is a need to adapt to new cold conditions, as the balls are not inflated anymore, having a colder core, and jump less.
This can be achieved by:
- stringing loose, to put more power into the shots
- increasing racquet mass, thus putting more power into the shots
But, isn't it more consistent to change the string than to alter the weight and balance of the racquet one is already used to?
unclenimrod
Rookie
I don't alter the balance by like 6 points or anything but I do play very different tennis during the two extreme seasons. Flat as a pancake tennis in winter like its 1965, more conservative grips, and lots of rushing the net, with a need for stability to the max. Loosening string tension or changing strings altogether doesn't do much for me there. In the summer I play lots of topspin tho, so I get rid of the stability in favor of a more polarized setup to take advantage of the higher bounce of a ball. Does that make more sense?
Backhanded Compliment
Legend
That's basically why I do it... I do alter string tension and sometimes the string brand but Im talking about very small amounts of lead to vary with the seasons. By late october the air is much colder around here and if it is morning there is often ground fog... to hit through that a tiny tiny amount of lead at 12 really can make a difference... Im not super sensitive to racquet balance so much as my tactics change with conditions and that requires more or less swingweight and polarization... miniscule changes really.
This is interesting. Cold came here as well and what I did was to increase tension... Contrary to popular belief, I start hitting flatter now, as the ball does not jump so much from the ground so I can't put top spin. Any sugestions?
what_army
Professional
Lol
What-army: That is really constructive, just like the profit-margin unecessary trolling you performed in another thread. Are you trolling all my posts now? I really need to learn how to add you on the ignore list on this forum.
Edit: found it!
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