Annacone should be fired, Fed better off on his own or back to Lundgren

[asifallasleep]

The Annacone era Fed lack's imagination and is playing one dimensional all out power tennis when he can't overpower anyone in an era where everyone thrives off of pace.

Fed needs to go back to being a power junk baller. Changes of pace and spin is what separated him from everyone else. He tried to beat Djokovic the same way he tried to beat del Potro in his loss at the Open. Fed cannot beat these guys by trying to out slug them from the baseline.

He cannot hang with the joker, del potro or nadal by slugging it out. The Annacone all out aggression strategy is a bad idea. Changes of pace keeping his opponents out of a good rhythm and then ripping a winner is what Fed does best. Today he tried to hit too many power shots with very limited imagination and never used his slice backhand to his advantage consistently. Most guys today feed off of pace. The joker is a prime example. Nadal tried out slugging del Potro and soon realized a change of pace was necessary to best del Potro and to get him off his game. The moment Nadal began slicing it threw del Potro off.

 

[Tony48]

LOL everyone was worshiping Annacone when Federer won Basel and the WTF.

What happened?

 

[Pwned]

LOL everyone was worshiping Annacone when Federer won Basel and the WTF.

What happened?

Federer made more semis and finals and that somehow upset bad Federer fans.

 

[ruerooo]

Stop yourself, OP.
You said the same thing in another thread and no one paid attention.

You're making a new thread to try and increase your odds?

Okay.

:roll:

 

[asifallasleep]

Stop yourself, OP.
You said the same thing in another thread and no one paid attention.

You're making a new thread to try and increase your odds?

Okay.

:roll:

This was posted about 1 minute after that one, but thanks for your constructive comment. Didn't realise an open forum was subject to your approval. Classy guy.

 

[IvanisevicServe]

I don't think Federer needs Annacone to get beatdowns from Djokovic in semi-finals. What has he accomplished this year, exactly? He beat Wawrinka a couple times?

 

[NadalAgassi]

I don't think Federer needs Annacone to get beatdowns from Djokovic in semi-finals. What has he accomplished this year, exactly? He beat Wawrinka a couple times?

Well last year he was getting beatdowns by Soderling and Berdych in slams. That is far worse than losing to Djokovic at his best.

So he is better now than pre-Annacone. He isnt as good as he used to be or surely wants to be anymore. However that is the function of age and there is no escaping that.

 

[billnepill]

no, if it only was that simple

What will happen if he gets rid of Annacone? Probably nothing special.

Letting Annacone go sounds like a knee-jerk reaction more than a reasonable thing to do.

 

[decades]

The Annacone era Fed lack's imagination and is playing one dimensional all out power tennis when he can't overpower anyone in an era where everyone thrives off of pace.

Fed needs to go back to being a power junk baller. Changes of pace and spin is what separated him from everyone else. He tried to beat Djokovic the same way he tried to beat del Potro in his loss at the Open. Fed cannot beat these guys by trying to out slug them from the baseline.

He cannot hang with the joker, del potro or nadal by slugging it out. The Annacone all out aggression strategy is a bad idea. Changes of pace keeping his opponents out of a good rhythm and then ripping a winner is what Fed does best. Today he tried to hit too many power shots with very limited imagination and never used his slice backhand to his advantage consistently. Most guys today feed off of pace. The joker is a prime example. Nadal tried out slugging del Potro and soon realized a change of pace was necessary to best del Potro and to get him off his game. The moment Nadal began slicing it threw del Potro off.

annocone has an impossible job trying to navigate a stubborn 30 year old player who still thinks he's at the top of his game, to another GS. He deserves a raise and a medal.

 

[veroniquem]

Well last year he was getting beatdowns by Soderling and Berdych in slams. That is far worse than losing to Djokovic at his best.

The only reason why he hasn't lost to Berdych and Soderling this year is because he hasn't had to play them, not because he's better.
Fed is getting older, neither Annacone nor anyone else will make him better. Tennis players don't get better at 30 (especially when their level has been as high as Fed's)

 

[TennisFan3]

The only reason why he hasn't lost to Berdych and Soderling this year is because he hasn't had to play them, not because he's better.
Fed is getting older, neither Annacone nor anyone else will make him better. Tennis players don't get better at 30 (especially when their level has been as high as Fed's)

Well Fed's been playing COUNTRY miles better than he was in F.O and Wimb last year.
And credit goes to Annacone.

Only Djokovic has beaten Federer. Who else has Fed lost too? And seriously, who would beat Djokovic? At AO '11 he was just scary, ditto in Dubai.

And perhaps here in IW as well (unless Nadal plays his A game, but he's been mediocre so far).

There is no disgrace in losing to a red-hot crazy Djokovic who would have beaten pretty much anyone on the tour.

Fed's playing excellent tennis. He is in fact playing better than he did in '09 and '10 when he actually won slams. All credit for that is to Annacone who's incorporate some jaw dropping offense in Fed's game and improved his transition game too.

Fed's not losing because he's playing bad, it's bcoz Djokovic is too good, and the Serb has finally reached a level that, most of us hoped for, but not many believed, he could attain.

 

[mike84]

Roger is 29 years old

stop with this ********

can you just accept that roger is on his way out

you cant fight time

 

[Fedace]

Roger can't handle Novak's serve anymore. there is nothing Annacone can do to help him there. Roger will never beat him again unless novak develops funk on his serve again.

 

[OLYMPICLEGEND]

Federer has played far better since Annacone arrived. Thread makes no sense. Look at Federer in 2010 clay season and Wimbledon.....:evil:

 

[NadalAgassi]

The only reason why he hasn't lost to Berdych and Soderling this year is because he hasn't had to play them, not because he's better.
Fed is getting older, neither Annacone nor anyone else will make him better. Tennis players don't get better at 30 (especially when their level has been as high as Fed's)

I dont think he would lose to Berdych or Soderling right now. He isnt playing nearly as badly as while he was losing to Berdych. And Soderling he has played multiple times since last years French and won easily. So he is better than he was before Annacone. He hasnt lost before the semis of hardly any event for a long time and his worst loss was once to Monfils (after having match points). However he will never return to his mid or even late 2000s level either, and will continue losing regularly to others of the top 3-5 players.

 

[veroniquem]

Well Fed's been playing COUNTRY miles better than he was in F.O and Wimb last year.
And credit goes to Annacone.

Only Djokovic has beaten Federer. Who else has Fed lost too? And seriously, who would beat Djokovic? At AO '11 he was just scary, ditto in Dubai.

Scary? Lol
No he wasn't scary at all and he struggled in several matches in which he should have cruised at AO. He got an easy draw until the semi, that's all (same thing at IW and in Dubai his draw was nothing short of preposterous until the final).
It wasn't a metaphor when I said he didn't have to play Berdych or other tough opponents, it was quite literal. Both in AO and IW he got the quarter literally GIFTED to him by personal doormat Wawrinka. Let's not even talk about Dubai where he played guys out of the top 50.
Throw him a guy like Berdych in the quarter (or Monfils ha ha) instead and you'll see he won't even make the semi.
He's not scary anymore, those days are gone, he's still good but the decline and the lack of "fear factor" precisely is unmistakable (except to Wawrinka naturally ).

 

[AM95]

Federer made more semis and finals and that somehow upset bad Federer fans.

i partially agree with the OP. Annacone took the variety out of fed's game. that helped Fed win the WTF because he stopped slicing and started to hit over his backhand, which let him dictate play and beat nadal in the Final, and make semis and finals of GS and MS events. but to be honest with you, i preferred it when Federer lost early in the MS events and went deep in the GS events. a big problem that i see right now is that Federer seems to have lost his backhand slice, and that was one of the weapons that saw him win 16 majors and dominate the game mostly because he screwed with the pace of his opponents shots.

today, it was really evident that Federer cannot beat djokovic using the tactics Annacone came up with for Nadal (hit over the backhand and try to hit through the court and come into net and finnish the point). when fed started to mix up his game (throw some junk balls at djokovic, either with loopy shots or slices), he won the second set. if he played the match from the start with this strategy, he would be beating djokovic just like he was 5 months ago. Fed also did this in the second set of the AO semi vs Djoko where he was up 5-2, but then went back to playing aggressive and one dimensional WTA style ball bashing.

if i were federer, i would probably sit down with 'cone and work on finding a balance between the aggressive tennis which needs to be used when playing Nadal and the rest of the tour, and the variety tennis that needs to be used when you feed off counterpunchers like djokovic and murray.

 

[AM95]

Scary? Lol
No he wasn't scary at all and he struggled in several matches in which he should have cruised at AO. He got an easy draw until the semi, that's all (same thing at IW and in Dubai his draw was nothing short of preposterous until the final).
It wasn't a metaphor when I said he didn't have to play Berdych or other tough opponents, it was quite literal. Both in AO and IW he got the quarter literally GIFTED to him by personal doormat Wawrinka. Let's not even talk about Dubai where he played guys out of the top 50.
Throw him a guy like Berdych in the quarter (or Monfils ha ha) instead and you'll see he won't even make the semi.
He's not scary anymore, those days are gone, he's still good but the decline and the lack of "fear factor" precisely is unmistakable (except to Wawrinka naturally ).

LOL. Of all people you shouldn't talk about Djokovic having an easy draw. Nadal still hasn't faced a seeded player, less a top 10 player.

 

[TennisFan3]

Scary? Lol
No he wasn't scary at all and he struggled in several matches in which he should have cruised at AO. He got an easy draw until the semi, that's all (same thing at IW and in Dubai his draw was nothing short of preposterous until the final).
It wasn't a metaphor when I said he didn't have to play Berdych or other tough opponents, it was quite literal. Both in AO and IW he got the quarter literally GIFTED to him by personal doormat Wawrinka. Let's not even talk about Dubai where he played guys out of the top 50.
Throw him a guy like Berdych in the quarter (or Monfils ha ha) instead and you'll see he won't even make the semi.
He's not scary anymore, those days are gone, he's still good but the decline and the lack of "fear factor" precisely is unmistakable (except to Wawrinka naturally ).

Perhaps you misread my post, my scary meant Djokovic- NOT Federer . ( The pronoun referring to the last person named in the sentence).

Sure Fed's not beaten Soderling or Berdych because he hasn't had to face them. But I think he would have bested both in routine fashion. To me it's plain that he's much better than he was last year.

He's playing great for a 29 yr old guy. The only problem for Fed is that guys like Djokovic and Nadal (and soon to be Delpo) are in their prime. When Fed was winning slams, these guys were not as good as they are today.

 

[aceX]

Djokovic is in his absolute prime. Federer is 29. It's also just a masters tournament.

 

[Omega_7000]

He's playing great for a 29 yr old guy. The only problem for Fed is that guys like Djokovic and Nadal (and soon to be Delpo) are in their prime. When Fed was winning slams, he didn't have to contend with players of this quality..

This is utter nonsense. Just because Fed is slow now & older doesn't mean the guys he beat during his prime weren't quality players. So in your opinion, if Fed had lost more Majors during his prime, his competition would've been deemed tough?

 

[TennisFan3]

I dont think he would lose to Berdych or Soderling right now. He isnt playing nearly as badly as while he was losing to Berdych. And Soderling he has played multiple times since last years French and won easily. So he is better than he was before Annacone. He hasnt lost before the semis of hardly any event for a long time and his worst loss was once to Monfils (after having match points). However he will never return to his mid or even late 2000s level either, and will continue losing regularly to others of the top 3-5 players.

Good post. That's exactly what I've been saying.

Annacone is doing an excellent job, and he's made Fed better than he was in 2010 and 2009.

Still you can't fight the fact that Nadal, crazy Djoker, and soon Delpo are gonna be in their primes.

 

[veroniquem]

LOL. Of all people you shouldn't talk about Djokovic having an easy draw. Nadal still hasn't faced a seeded player, less a top 10 player.

Sorry, it does seem I misread tennisfan3's post and took the "scary" as applying to Fed. If it applies to Djoko, then I agree of course.
I apologize for the misunderstanding. (I read too fast)
I also agree Fed is playing great for a 29 year old but he doesn't have time on his side and I still think his days are counted regardless of what Annacone does or doesn't do. Also Fed has never been super coachable, he's always been rather stubborn, it's not now toward the end of his career that I see that aspect of him likely to change in any way.

 

[TennisFan3]

Anyway instead of fighting over semantics, let's be happy about the fact that we are seeing much better quality tennis than we've seen in the past couple of yrs when Nadal was injured and Djoker was a pale shadow of himself.

Nadal is on a good run, Djoker is red-hot and crazy this year, Fed's playing pretty well (bested only by Djoker) and Delpo's back and would seemingly get back in the top 5 sooner rather than later. The only disappointment is Murray, but I think even he would be back to his best by Wimb/USOpen timeframe..

 

[veroniquem]

That's true and let's not forget the younger guys like Raonic who are probably gonna keep improving.

 

[DragonBlaze]

That's true and let's not forget the younger guys like Raonic who are probably gonna keep improving.

And Dolgopolov! Or however you spell his name. He is such an interesting player to watch.

 

[Sharpshooter]

After the WTF the ****s were talking about how good Annacone has been for Fed and how he will start dominating again.

Now the ****s want him out! LOL

 

[mandy01]

The Annacone era Fed lack's imagination and is playing one dimensional all out power tennis when he can't overpower anyone in an era where everyone thrives off of pace

.At his age,he can't overpower them.Even a couple of years back,he could and it's hard to let go off.Roger is too used to trying to beat players at their own game.It's not about Annacone or Lundgren.

 

[mandy01]

edit-delete post.

 

[Spider]

Nothing wrong with Federer's game. He just got outplayed by Djokovic. Accept it and things become easy for you to digest.

 

[mandy01]

Also Fed has never been super coachable, he's always been rather stubborn, it's not now toward the end of his career that I see that aspect of him likely to change in any way.

Sure,because you tried coaching him so often......:roll:

 

[Rob_C]

I think you guys are forgetting that he was serving at 2-all, 3rd set, 40-15, and dropped that game, missing an easy backhand 2-3 ft from the net on the 1st pt of that game.

No to mention he had Djokovic 15-40 in his 1st service game of the 3rd set and let him off the hook.

It's definitely gonna be harder for him to beat Djokovic in the future, but it is possible, he just cant afford to lose focus at all.

At least now we might see more Nadal/Fed matches now that he's #3. We'll see what side of the draw he's on in Miami, Nadal's, or Djoker's.

 

[HunterST]

Despite what some people are saying, OP definitely has a point. When Federer tries to out-slug Djokovic, he loses. However, when he puts some air in his shots and plays more patiently he goes on good runs. That's what happened today and at AO. Unfortunately, he gets away from this strategy once he's back in the match. He needs to keep that strategy up against the djoker.


I certainly don't think this is Annacone's fault, though.

 

[flyinghippos101]

Fed has literally been to at least the semi final of every tournament since crashing out of Wimbledon quarter finals, if that isn't amazing consistency since Annacone signed on then I don't know what is. Is he capitalizing on these semis and reaching finals? Yes, he is but not nearly as much as he used to but come on, you're still in fighting condition if you're routinely reaching semis of tournys.

This is such a knee-jerk reaction thread, Fed loses and now it's Annacone's fault? That doesn't seem to make sense. I don't recall Annacone telling Fed to hit as many errors as he possibly could while stubbornly trying to blow Djokovic off the court...

 

[MixieP]

The Annacone era Fed lack's imagination and is playing one dimensional all out power tennis when he can't overpower anyone in an era where everyone thrives off of pace.

Fed needs to go back to being a power junk baller. Changes of pace and spin is what separated him from everyone else. He tried to beat Djokovic the same way he tried to beat del Potro in his loss at the Open. Fed cannot beat these guys by trying to out slug them from the baseline.

He cannot hang with the joker, del potro or nadal by slugging it out. The Annacone all out aggression strategy is a bad idea. Changes of pace keeping his opponents out of a good rhythm and then ripping a winner is what Fed does best. Today he tried to hit too many power shots with very limited imagination and never used his slice backhand to his advantage consistently. Most guys today feed off of pace. The joker is a prime example. Nadal tried out slugging del Potro and soon realized a change of pace was necessary to best del Potro and to get him off his game. The moment Nadal began slicing it threw del Potro off.

Your analysis sounds convincing, especially your comparison to how Nadal handled Del Potro.

 

[Fiji]

If Roger's serve is deteriorating, it is not Annacone's fault. Father time's fault.

 

[Cesc Fabregas]

Its hard for Paul Annacone to work with someone who is very limited at the net like Federer.

 

[Li Ching Yuen]

He can't do **** on a high bouncing court against any of Del Potro, Djokovic, Nadal and a non-depressed Murray.

 

[Bobby Jr]

Well Fed's been playing COUNTRY miles better than he was in F.O and Wimb last year.

Not sure who all the credit goes to but I agree.

Playing how he did even losing today he would have probably won Wimbledon. He's just gotta get back into the habit of serving well the whole match and playing more like he did in the 2nd set than the 3rd set earlier today.

 

[AM95]

Sorry, it does seem I misread tennisfan3's post and took the "scary" as applying to Fed. If it applies to Djoko, then I agree of course.
I apologize for the misunderstanding. (I read too fast)
I also agree Fed is playing great for a 29 year old but he doesn't have time on his side and I still think his days are counted regardless of what Annacone does or doesn't do. Also Fed has never been super coachable, he's always been rather stubborn, it's not now toward the end of his career that I see that aspect of him likely to change in any way.

it doesnt matter. federer's draw was still harder than rafa's.

 

[Fedace]

All Annacone ever does is make flight arrangements and make dinner reservations so how is this possibly his fault ??

 

[Ocean Gypsy]

The premise by the OP is ludicrous. If anything, Annacone has encouraged Federer not to slug it out on the baseline. Being aggressive doesn't mean trying to outhit the other guy, rather trying to outwit him mentally and keep him guessing physically on the court with variety. You don't do that coming over a single backhand against more powerful players. It's suicide for a guy like Federer at this point in his career. Federer is just too stubborn to do what it takes to win against a newer, stronger generation of players. He'll either continue to whither using the old strategy or win one or two or three more slams by adapting to the changing times and creating new strategies to win. He can do it. If he wants to.

I wish when people posted things they would actually read them before hitting "submit" ... it would make for a lot more sensible and responsible posting.

IMO, of course.

 

[Rippy]

How short are people's memories...

After Fed won WTF, Annacone was a genius, and now he should be fired...

We need to see what happens longer term.

 

[RedHotRafa]

AGREED, ANNACONE did nothing for Federer, only made him change his natural 16 times gs champion style, resulting in mug performances in important matches. Sure he can still kill all the smaller guys but when it matters he loses

 

[Talker]

I like Annacone but in and up to the WTF Federer was emotionally in the game.
Now at times he doesn't seem to be fired up much, that's his problem as far as I can see.
Annacone gave him a shot of energy at the beginning, Fed played even the small tournaments with some passion, that hasn't happened in years. But with time it looks like the initial burst of enthusiasm has worn off.
Fed has the game still but needs to find the drive to go the whole match and use what's working, not trying to beat the other guy at his own game.

The second set against Djokovic he was tough, the third set showed less passion for some reason.

One thing that is interesting is that while Djokovic is on fire and playing his best tennis he had a tough time beating a clearly substandard Fed.
If Fed finds the motivation he should beable to get the edge against Djokovic even now.

Maybe this beating will bring out something.

 

[OddJack]

Rodge played a great match, only at 40-15 suddenly lost it which was his fault, nothing to do with Annacone.

Actualy I hope Anna stays around

 

[jackson vile]

LOL everyone was worshiping Annacone when Federer won Basel and the WTF.

What happened?

LOL True That LOL

 

[iriraz]

We cannot compare what happened at the end of year to what`s happening now.Playing indoor obviously allows Federer more options to come to the net,playing aggressive especially on the low bounce WTF court.
In IW for example Federer served like one ace in his match against Djokovic and the Serb was running for every ball and putting into court.Federer had either to hit and hope that his balls hit the line and wins the point or get himself into long rallies.
To beat Djokovic when he plays well is to make winner after winner or hope that the guy will run out of gas after running for so many balls

 

[MichaelNadal]

Federer needs this Lundgren

 

[IvanAndreevich]

We cannot compare what happened at the end of year to what`s happening now.Playing indoor obviously allows Federer more options to come to the net,playing aggressive especially on the low bounce WTF court.
In IW for example Federer served like one ace in his match against Djokovic and the Serb was running for every ball and putting into court.Federer had either to hit and hope that his balls hit the line and wins the point or get himself into long rallies.
To beat Djokovic when he plays well is to make winner after winner or hope that the guy will run out of gas after running for so many balls

I don't know why Federer didn't just keep Djokovic running back and forth a bit longer. He was so far behind the baseline, so it's bound to take a toll on his weak body. Wearing a knee brace also.

Also throw in more droppers for good measure.