Aramid/Kevlar String users

[Ripper]

I've read that no matter what you hybrid it with, nat gut or poly (to go to the extremes), the feeling will be the same, basically, because it has zero playability. The other string is just there to complete the string job. Is this true? It sounds logical to me.

I've read this at a couple of web sites. Here's one: http://www.*************.com/ABOUT6.html

Anyway, this is the part I'm refering to:

"Synthetic Aramid Hybrid String Sets
The number one priority of Aramid Hybrid strings is absolute durability. Players buying this string are either chronic string-breakers or those who prefer string with a completely dead feel.

Hybrid strings are a combination of two types of strings. The strings most prone to breakage are the mains. In this type of set-up, the mains are usually made of Aramid derivative. Kevlar is the most popular one. The choice of cross strings varies. It can be anything from nylon to synthetic gut.

The idea is that a more playable cross string will blend favorably with the much less playable Kevlar. Advertising claims offer a superior combination of durability and playability. Not exactly.

There is no other string that works well enough with Kevlar to compensate enough for its poor playability.

Unless you need the ultimate in durability because you are breaking strings very frequently, choose another type of string. This type of string offers the least feel, least power, usually the least spin capability, and least amount of vibration damping. In terms of performance, it is the worst type of string you can buy.

Advantages
Durability.
Dead feel maximizes control by minimizing any kind of trampoline effect."

I kind of agree with everything, except where it says that this type of string has the least spin capability.

 

[Cruzer]

An Australian website had a reference to Kevlar strings bascially saying the only thing they should be used for is fixing the fences at the tennis club.

 

[Midlife crisis]

I've read that no matter what you hybrid it with, nat gut or poly (to go to the extremes), the feeling will be the same, basically, because it has zero playability. The other string is just there to complete the string job. Is this true? It sounds logical to me.

One way to think about it is to consider each type of string as a coil spring. Kevlar, having high stiffness, is a stiff coil spring. Another string, like a synthetic gut, will be a much less stiff coil spring.

If you stack the two coil springs together and press on it, even using the softest coil spring will make only a very small difference in the force it takes to compress both, and this difference is probably going to be difficult to notice over the force required to compress the stiffer coil spring.

As a reference, many kevlar strings have RSI measured stiffnesses in the range of 600-1000 lbs/in. Poly strings range from 200-400 lbs/in., synthetic guts between about 150 and 250 lbs/in. and gut strings between 80-120 lbs/in. Mixing a gut string with a kevlar string really would be using the gut only to hold the kevlar in place.

 

[dmastous]

I think saying "...it has zero playability. The other string is just there to complete the string job" is to not recoginze what effect the kevlar may have. Install all kevlar and you will have an extremely dead feeling racquet. Install all gut (or synthetic) and you will have a relatively lively feel. Combine them and the Kevlar will deaden the liveliness of the gut. To me this equates to more control.
So it is doing something. In my case it's something I need. I don't like a lively stringbed, but don't want an extremely stiff stringbed either. I'd like some feel with some durability. I think combining kevlar with gut (or synthetic gut) does that for me.
It also allows me to get away with an 18 gauge mainstring, which gives me additional spin.

 

[Ripper]

I think saying "...it has zero playability. The other string is just there to complete the string job" is to not recoginze what effect the kevlar may have. Install all kevlar and you will have an extremely dead feeling racquet. Install all gut (or synthetic) and you will have a relatively lively feel. Combine them and the Kevlar will deaden the liveliness of the gut. To me this equates to more control.
So it is doing something. In my case it's something I need. I don't like a lively stringbed, but don't want an extremely stiff stringbed either. I'd like some feel with some durability. I think combining kevlar with gut (or synthetic gut) does that for me.
It also allows me to get away with an 18 gauge mainstring, which gives me additional spin.

Well, I'm going to start experimenting with aramid/kevlar strings. I'm planning on trying different hybrid combinations, at the same time. I want to see, for myself, if there's a difference and, exaclty, how much this difference is. Hopefully, I'll report back, if my arm is still functional enough to use the keyboard

 

[LowProfile]

...Combine them and the Kevlar will deaden the liveliness of the gut.

I think what it's saying is that kevlar is such a dead string that it will deaden the liveliness of any string you hybrid it with to the point that it plays like a full kevlar job.

 

[ChicagoJack]

One way to think about it is to consider each type of string as a coil spring. Kevlar, having high stiffness, is a stiff coil spring. Another string, like a synthetic gut, will be a much less stiff coil spring.

If you stack the two coil springs together and press on it, even using the softest coil spring will make only a very small difference in the force it takes to compress both, and this difference is probably going to be difficult to notice over the force required to compress the stiffer coil spring.

As a reference, many kevlar strings have RSI measured stiffnesses in the range of 600-1000 lbs/in. Poly strings range from 200-400 lbs/in., synthetic guts between about 150 and 250 lbs/in. and gut strings between 80-120 lbs/in. Mixing a gut string with a kevlar string really would be using the gut only to hold the kevlar in place.

Bingo

The 1st number is stiffness, higher # = stiffer. The list provided is based on 100 for natural gut as a baseline, so when you see 849 as stiffness on the kevlar/aramid strings, it means that string is 849% stiffer than gut. Note: This is machine testing, not play testing results. The source is the United States Racquet Stringers Association, circa 2004. They've changed the testing procedures recently, I've noticed a few more recent charts being slightly different, but telling the same story overall. Here is a partial list.

100-100-100-100 Pacific Prime Gut Imperial 17
113-103-99-86 Babolat VS Team 17
113-103-99-85 Wilson Natural Gut 16

[..]

213-116-93-102 Technifibre X1 Biphase 1.24
226-116-92-126 Wilson NXT Tour 17
232-119-91-100 Gamma TNT2 17
241-116-93-152 Babolat Conquest 16

[..]

251-115-93-170 Babolat Pro Hurricane 17
277-118-92-173 Lux BB Orig 16
296-118-92-194 Lux BB Orig Rough 16

[..]

568-148-82-186 Forten New Age 18
697-156-78-119 Forten Aramid Gear 15
818-161-76-181 Gamma Infinity 16 Hybrid
849-161-78-270 Ashaway Crossfire II 16 Hybrid

1. Kevlar, even as a hybrid setup is stiff as hell. Off the charts. Does not really matter what you hybrid it with. If you are on the quest for the ultimate spin weapon, this probably wont deter you. Risk of injury did not deter me either. I used Forten Aramid Gear for nearly two years, but switched to more comfortable string after realizing the string has no spin magic in and of itself. The low power level simply allows me to swing for the fences and still have ball still stay in the court. Had to taper down using poly, before coming back home to multifibre gradually.

2. It's also very difficult to volley with as the spin of the incomng ball really grabs the string bed. If youve hit a good deep approach to a corner you might get a defensive slice slowly waffling back to you at net. you really have to fight to keep the ball from slushing out of the string bed and into the net on these types of volleys. For a doubles specialist, it took me an embarrasingly long time to figure this one out. I kept hitting volleys that "felt right" but were landing way short or clipping the net. When I realized I needed to over compensate the spin of the incoming ball, when volleying, I started to question the usefullness of this material to me.

3. There is no ultimate spin string in my opinion. I spent 9 years looking for it. What I found was string that allowed me to change my stroke, or not change my stroke, have the ball land in, or out, come off the string bed at higher, or lower, slower, or faster trajectories. That's it. That's all there is. This is just my experience, I'm sure there are many folks with quite different experiences from mine, and who would disagree.

-Jack