At this rate, will Djokovic tie up the Nadal h2h?

Will Djokovic tie or overtake the h2h with Nadal?

  • Total voters
    55
Firstservingman said:
If they keep actually meeting, then he will, easily.

But I think Nadal might not face Djoker a whole lot more, not necessarily just because of Rafa's likely tank attempts to preserve H2H, but more because he just won't be able to make it far enough at the events where Djokovic is most likely to beat him.

Just like with the Fedal H2H, it would be even or better if they actually met at AO (rebound)/USO/Cincy/Canada/Indoors more during Roger's prime.

Djoker will beat Rafa at Wimbledon all day long these days, but the problem is, so will Darcis.
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I would still like to consider rafa the worlds second best player. But I just cant. I have seen a bit of him during this rio tournament and....... theres nothing else to say. He is struggling on clay even
 
Deficit of 4 matches will be tough to overcome at their level. I thought Djokovic would be leading H2H against Federer quite easily by the end of 2014. Nadal isn't even 30 yet, also. Whichever way it ends up, it will be close.
 
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Noleberic123 said:
I would still like to consider rafa the worlds second best player. But I just cant. I have seen a bit of him during this rio tournament and....... theres nothing else to say. He is struggling on clay even
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Haven't seen Nadal playing in Rio, but his true form can be checked during the upcoming clay season. He usually peaks for FO.
 
Firstservingman said:
If they keep actually meeting, then he will, easily.

But I think Nadal might not face Djoker a whole lot more, not necessarily just because of Rafa's likely tank attempts to preserve H2H, but more because he just won't be able to make it far enough at the events where Djokovic is most likely to beat him.

Just like with the Fedal H2H, it would be even or better if they actually met at AO (rebound)/USO/Cincy/Canada/Indoors more during Roger's prime.

Djoker will beat Rafa at Wimbledon all day long these days, but the problem is, so will Darcis.

The only places they are likely to meet are RG and clay tourneys, where Rafa has the advantage even now.
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Made me laugh with that one. :lol:
 
I actually don't think they'll meet enough for Djoker to tie it up. Rafael just doesn't look right in Rio and he looked downright bad in January. That doesn't mean he's done cause he's 28 (!) but in order to stay at the elite of the elite level of tennis you really have to stay sharp and grind grind grind. He looks far from sharp in Rio, spraying balls all over. I'm beginning to think his body won't allow him to grind like he needs to anymore. But who knows maybe he has a heroic burst in him, I just don't have faith in the sustainability of Rafa's fame ATM.
 
Meh. Who knows. They're close enough to where either one could come out on top. And right now, nothing stands out that would favor one over the other. Djokovic has really good days against Nadal on clay and then Nadal has really good days against Djokovic on hard.
 
tennisfan87 said:
Really? What about the period before 2011 when Djokovic wasn't good enough to meet Nadal regularly on all surfaces? You don't see me counting those against him, do you?

Nadal was more consistent than he is today (up to 2012, after that he has been dealing with many injury problems and decline), so were does that notion 'he isn't consistent enough' come from?

What was he supposed to do? Wait for Novak forever, until he reaches his peak? It all evens out in the end.
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Gotta love the Nole fans eh? Nothing before 2011 counts and 2013 doesn't count for them either. Novak had one great year and two more as #1 when his main opponent missed half of both years. The one year they both played most of the year Rafa took charge and got the #1 ranking back in short order. As for 2015, well we're all just going to have to wait and see.
 
vernonbc said:
Gotta love the Nole fans eh? Nothing before 2011 counts and 2013 doesn't count for them either. Novak had one great year and two more as #1 when his main opponent missed half of both years. The one year they both played most of the year Rafa took charge and got the #1 ranking back in short order. As for 2015, well we're all just going to have to wait and see.
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excuses

Xi82A58.gif
 
vernonbc said:
Gotta love the Nole fans eh? Nothing before 2011 counts and 2013 doesn't count for them either. Novak had one great year and two more as #1 when his main opponent missed half of both years. The one year they both played most of the year Rafa took charge and got the #1 ranking back in short order. As for 2015, well we're all just going to have to wait and see.
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Thats certainly the glass half empty way to look at Djoker's career. Alternatively you could recognize that the better player doesn't play a style that causes him to miss huge chunks of years in what should be his prime. Rafa's an amazing player but his chosen strategy has caused the physical breakdown we see today at a mere 28 years of age. Just take a glance at past his prime Fed chugging along at a generally high level last year. There is NO chance that Rafa is playing like that at Fed's age.

Who knows how the last 2-4 years of Djoker and Rafa's prime will really play out. Djoker could tear and ACL and be done next month. But if you're a betting man, the truth is that Rafa is way behind Djoker right now and needs a serious turn around to even win RG this year.
 
MichaelNadal said:
I know you miss peakdal. Me too :lol:
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I like Rafa and I think he has one last big peak push in him but he's gotta to figure out what he needs to do to make that happen real fast. I would love to see some legit Djoker/Rafa slam finals this year. But yah, Rio has been an eye opener. The funny thing is, as bad as he has looked at Rio, he keeps winning because he's a mentally tough champion. Gotta respect that.
 
vernonbc said:
Gotta love the Nole fans eh? Nothing before 2011 counts and 2013 doesn't count for them either. Novak had one great year and two more as #1 when his main opponent missed half of both years. The one year they both played most of the year Rafa took charge and got the #1 ranking back in short order. As for 2015, well we're all just going to have to wait and see.
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Where are you getting your information? Is this some alternative universe you are in? Fox News?
 
swordtennis said:
Where are you getting your information? Is this some alternative universe you are in? Fox News?
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We all have those windows for our players though. Nadal fans don't count anything on HC before AO 2009. "Baby Rafa" is a favourite saying, and Federer fans like to discount 2008 (except the USO) and all of 2013. :lol:
 
Steve0904 said:
We all have those windows for our players though. Nadal fans don't count anything on HC before AO 2009. "Baby Rafa" is a favourite saying, and Federer fans like to discount 2008 (except the USO) and all of 2013. :lol:
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True and Nole gets caught in the middle and pummeled by Both Fed and Nadal and their fans. Let us be frank Novak has never had it easy. lol
 
tennisfan87 said:
Really? What about the period before 2011 when Djokovic wasn't good enough to meet Nadal regularly on all surfaces? You don't see me counting those against him, do you?

Nadal was more consistent than he is today (up to 2012, after that he has been dealing with many injury problems and decline), so were does that notion 'he isn't consistent enough' come from?

What was he supposed to do? Wait for Novak forever, until he reaches his peak? It all evens out in the end.

Regarding Federer, he too has missed many opportunities to meet Nadal more, especially in 2011 when he kept losing to Djokovic in the SFs, before meeting Rafa. You don't see me counting those, do you?

And Murray, well, he has never been a model for consistency himself, has he?
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You took my post the wrong way. I didn't count anything against Nadal, and it's not like he did it on purpose. It's just (tennis) "life".
 
Backspin1183 said:
After beating Nadal 7 times in a row, Djokovic was 14-16 in the head to head in early 2012. Nadal won 6 of their next matches then. If Nadal is in form again, he's very much capable of beating Novak a few times in a row again.
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Not to mention that #Novak hasn't 'defeated #Rafael in a #grandslam match since #January2012. That is three years!

#PTL #JC4Ever

AngieB​
 
Nadal has pretty much figured out Djokovic now, he will win the majority of their encounters.

Remember that Djokovic is roughly the same age as Nadal as well, so is likely to decline just as fast. Yes, the 'mileage' argument may have held some truth in 2011, but since then, Nadal has had numerous extended periods away from the game to freshen his body up.
 
AngieB said:
Not to mention that #Novak hasn't 'defeated #Rafael in a #grandslam match since #January2012. That is three years!

#PTL #JC4Ever

AngieB​
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Rafa losing to players ranked 100 or above the past three years at a slam. Missing multiple slams. And losing to his beloved pigeon in the most recent slam should be acknowledged when talking about those three years. Where was Rafa the past three slam events when Djokovic was waiting in the business end of the event?
 
Hitman said:
Rafa losing to players ranked 100 or above the past three years at a slam. Missing multiple slams. And losing to his beloved pigeon in the most recent slam should be acknowledged when talking about those three years. Where was Rafa the past three slam events when Djokovic was waiting in the business end of the event?
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Since January 2012 (when Novak last defeated Rafael), Novak is 4-5 in grand slam finals. Would you consider that taking care of business? I would call it "Lendl-it-is".

#Ironically enough, both #Rafael and #Novak have won #equal number of grand slam events during this same period, with #Rafael missing three of those events. #Rafael was 4-2 in grand slam finals.

Quality historic champions always rise to the occasion.

#PTL #JC4Ever

AngieB​
 
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AngieB said:
Since January 2012 (when Novak last defeated Rafael), Novak is 4-5 in grand slam finals. Would you consider that taking care of business? I would call it "Lendl-it-is".

#PTL #JC4Ever

AngieB​
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The fact is that his consistency has kept him in the latter stages while Rafa has been absent or beaten by pigeons or players ranked over 100. He has not always held up his end of the bargain and keep meeting Novak. The last three slams is a clear indicator if this.
 
AngieB said:
Since January 2012 (when Novak last defeated Rafael), Novak is 4-5 in grand slam finals. Would you consider that taking care of business? I would call it "Lendl-it-is".

#Ironically enough, both #Rafael and #Novak have won #equal number of grand slam events during this same period, with #Rafael missing three of those events. #Rafael was 4-2 in grand slam finals.

Quality historic champions always rise to the occasion.

#PTL #JC4Ever

AngieB​
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Making finals (which Djokovic has done) is better than losing in the earlier rounds and not even making the finals (Rafa), unless in your alternate universe it is better to lose early to scrubs.

I know I would rather lose to champions and elite players than to journeymen.
 
powerangle said:
Making finals (which Djokovic has done) is better than losing in the earlier rounds and not even making the finals (Rafa), unless in your alternate universe it is better to lose early to scrubs.

I know I would rather lose to champions and elite players than to journeymen.
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Strange, but for some reason here, Rafa losing to players ranked 100 or above at the same slam for the last three years, while Djokovic plays multiple finals at that very same event, somehow gives Rafa bragging rights, because Djokovic didn't beat him and extends the time...he was Rosol'd instead. :confused:

If Nadal was beating Djokovic everywhere, or at least out performing him in all those slams and it was Novak who was failing to get to him most of the time, then I would have to agree. But that is not the truth.
 
swordtennis said:
True and Nole gets caught in the middle and pummeled by Both Fed and Nadal and their fans. Let us be frank Novak has never had it easy. lol
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Novak brought that upon himself. For Nadal fans, Novak is the biggest rival. For Federer fans, Novak was supposed to stop Nadal from wining more Slams. He not only fails at this ,(last few years) but stops Federer himself from adding another Wimbledon.
 
AngieB said:
Since January 2012 (when Novak last defeated Rafael), Novak is 4-5 in grand slam finals. Would you consider that taking care of business? I would call it "Lendl-it-is".

#Ironically enough, both #Rafael and #Novak have won #equal number of grand slam events during this same period, with #Rafael missing three of those events. #Rafael was 4-2 in grand slam finals.

Quality historic champions always rise to the occasion.

#PTL #JC4Ever

AngieB​
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3385399256_b99a8f27ce_z.jpg
 
Hitman said:
Strange, but for some reason here, Rafa losing to players ranked 100 or above at the same slam for the last three years, while Djokovic plays multiple finals at that very same event, somehow gives Rafa bragging rights, because Djokovic didn't beat him and extends the time...he was Rosol'd instead. :confused:

If Nadal was beating Djokovic everywhere, or at least out performing him in all those slams and it was Novak who was failing to get to him most of the time, then I would have to agree. But that is not the truth.
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But do not forget they met 4 times in Grand Slams since AO 2012. It's not like Novak wasn't given the opportunity to take on Nadal in Slams these last 3 years. They met 4 times and he lost each match.
 
Backspin1183 said:
But do not forget they met 4 times in Grand Slams since AO 2012. It's not like Novak wasn't given the opportunity to take on Nadal in Slams these last 3 years. They met 4 times and he lost each match.
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We all know this. They have played four times since, and Nadal won them all. But, that is not the whole truth, and you know that, and so does everyone else. The whole truth is, that while Nadal has won the four times they have played since AO 2012, he has ALSO failed to beat players ranked outside the top 100 to meet Novak at Wimbledon the last three years, he also has skipped two US Opens since then, and AO which is Novak's best slam...so, while Rafa has beaten Novak four times, three of them were on his best surface...he didn't play or beat Novak in Melbourne. Yes, he waiting in the final last year, but where was he in 2013 and 2015?

The full truth needs to be said here, to be fair to both.
 
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If Nadal drops down the rankings then he won't be able to avoid Djokovic as easily.

At the WTF, each player has a chance to win twice against another player.
Good advantage for Djokovic.

Djokovic will probably pass him.
 
Hitman said:
We all know this. They have played four times since, and Nadal won them all. But, that is not the whole truth, and you know that, and so does everyone else. The whole truth is, that while Nadal has won the four times they have played since AO, he has ALSO failed to beat players ranked outside the 100 to meet Novak at Wimbledon the last three years, he also has skipped two US Opens since then, and AO which is Novak's best slam...so, while Rafa has beaten Novak four times, three of them were on his best surface...he didn't play or beat Novak in Melbourne. Yes, he waiting in the final last year, but where was he in 2013 and 2015?

The full truth needs to be said here, to be fair to both.
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Did you expect them to compete in every Grand Slam final? In the ones they actually did, Novak lost. I know that Nadal fell to Rosol, Darcis and others and couldn't meet Novak everywhere. But if he was good enough to make those finals, you think Novak would have beaten him?
 
Hitman said:
We all know this. They have played four times since, and Nadal won them all. But, that is not the whole truth, and you know that, and so does everyone else. The whole truth is, that while Nadal has won the four times they have played since AO 2012, he has ALSO failed to beat players ranked outside the top 100 to meet Novak at Wimbledon the last three years, he also has skipped two US Opens since then, and AO which is Novak's best slam...so, while Rafa has beaten Novak four times, three of them were on his best surface...he didn't play or beat Novak in Melbourne. Yes, he waiting in the final last year, but where was he in 2013 and 2015?

The full truth needs to be said here, to be fair to both.
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Preach that gospel Hitman.
 
Backspin1183 said:
Did you expect them to compete in every Grand Slam final? In the ones they actually did, Novak lost. I know that Nadal fell to Rosol, Darcis and others and couldn't meet Novak everywhere. But if he was good enough to make those finals, you think Novak would have beaten him?
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No, I don't expect them to compete in every final. But the fact that Nadal skipped so many slams, and lost early so many times at Wimbledon, didn't allow Djokovic the chance to answer that question you just asked. The last three slams Nadal hasn't been up to slam winning mode, while Djokovic has picked up a couple, but just because Nadal didn't get to him, Djokovic gets burned for not having beat Nadal.

Here is a question for you, if Djokovic played Nadal in AO finals after 2012, do you really think Nadal would have won them all?
 
Nadal can't beat Djokovic in matches that never happened but in the ones they did in Grand Slams only one match went the distance, RG 2013. In the other 3 matches, Novak wasn't good enough to take more than a set in each match.
 
Backspin1183 said:
Nadal can't beat Djokovic in matches that never happened but in the ones they did in Grand Slams only one match went the distance, RG 2013. In the other 3 matches, Novak wasn't good enough to take more than a set in each match.
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Oh well, who cares? Nole is #1 by a country mile and Nadal is now #4 and struggling to say the least.
 
Backspin1183 said:
Nadal can't beat Djokovic in matches that never happened but in the ones they did in Grand Slams only one match went the distance, RG 2013. In the other 3 matches, Novak wasn't good enough to take more than a set in each match.
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Didn't really answer his point though, which was a fair one.

That Novak as of recent has been more consistent, whereas Nadal has perhaps had higher peaks when he actually did hit form and hence won those matches when he went deep in slams (my take on it), is probably true.
 
Well its up to Nadal, he preferrs to lose to lesser players earlier than runs at Novak, when hes not in great form.
That will remain the story of this part of his career, he chooses when and where to play,unlike Novak who is always there.
 
Backspin1183 said:
Nadal can't beat Djokovic in matches that never happened but in the ones they did in Grand Slams only one match went the distance, RG 2013. In the other 3 matches, Novak wasn't good enough to take more than a set in each match.
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Exactly my point. His failure to make those matches happen, when Djokovic was there waiting, should not be used a plus point in this statement. Djokovic has beaten Nadal the last time they played at Wimbeldon, and the last they played at AO, and that is his best surface. That is the full truth, and that is fact also. Nadal won three of the matches on his best surface...but played Djokovic zero times on his. This is also fact. This whole he hasn't won since AO 2012 is shrouded...I highly doubt Nadal wins every encounter between them on Plexicushion after AO2012...
 
Hitman said:
Exactly my point. His failure to make those matches happen, when Djokovic was there waiting, should not be used a plus point in this statement. Djokovic has beaten Nadal the last time they played at Wimbeldon, and the last they played at AO, and that is his best surface. That is the full truth, and that is fact also. Nadal won three of the matches on his best surface...but played Djokovic zero times on his. This is also fact. This whole he hasn't won since AO 2012 is shrouded...I highly doubt Nadal wins every encounter between them on Plexicushion after AO2012...
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Fair enough. Still 4-0 since 2012 AO is also true.
 
Djokovic2011 said:
He's been the best player overall for the past four years so I think he would've still been number 1 regardless.
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Federer can say what he wants. Fact is being healthy is part of the game, if he, Nadal and Murray can't stay healthy, their problem. It takes nothing away from Djokovic's accomplishments, he has shown he can beat them all when they are full fit, and his consistency in all events means he would always be knocking on the number one ranking.
 
Djokovic2011 said:
He's been the best player overall for the past four years so I think he would've still been number 1 regardless.
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We'll never know. He was there, others weren't. He deserves the number 1 ranking. It's a shame his rivals don't play full season to compete with him for the number 1 ranking like Nadal did in 2013.
 
Hitman said:
Federer can say what he wants. Fact is being healthy is part of the game, if he, Nadal and Murray can't stay healthy, their problem. It takes nothing away from Djokovic's accomplishments, he has shown he can beat them all when they are full fit, and his consistency in all events means he would always be knocking on the number one ranking.
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Since January 2012, Federer, Nadal and Murray have all had their injury issues. Yet still, Novak only won 4/9 grand slam finals with all three injured and hasn't defeated Rafael Nadal in a grand slam match.

All of which defines the type of historical champion Novak will present himself. Great, but never the greatest.

#PTL #JC4Ever

AngieB​
 
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