At which point do players switch to ''pro stock'' racquets?

[DonDiego]

I keep reading on this forum that most pros don't use the retail version of this or that racquet, that they have ''pro stock'' frames or whatever... I don't necessarely question this, but I'm wondering:

Any young player has to start with a retail racquet, right? And from the vast choice of ''player's frame'' on TW and elsewhere, they can use a stick that will work even when they get on the Pro tour. So why exactly would a player, say 18 years old or older, would suddenly start looking, or get offered, a ''special'' frame that you can't find in stores? From what I understand, players don't often change racquet, and if they've made it to top juniors with a specific model, most would be reluctant to change, right?

So how does this happen exactly? (If, of course, this is really happening on a large scale)

 

[EasternRocks]

I would say when they get fully sponsored and are professional. It is then where the companies will go to a player and ask them if they want to work on a personal level to customize a frame to their liking.

 

[Long Face]

My understanding is many "pro stocks" nowadays are/come from older models that had been discontinued. The pros had grown up playing those models, and ask racquet manufacturers to supply them in the form of "pro stocks".

 

[darklore009]

pro-stocks are rackets that used to be in production before they discontinue to the public. The pro is able to get their hands on them because of their contract.

 

[thebigz]

Long Face is right. For example as a twelve year old I grow up playing APD 2013, but years later by the time I turn pro. The APD I played would no longer in the market. I would ask Babolat to supply me with my old APD with whatever paintjob they want. That's how pro stocks come from

 

[Fuji]

Depends on the company and depends on the ranking. I know Head is a lot more willing to give out prostocks than Wilson is. Outside of the couple H22's I've bought used, I've never seen any get them at my club where a ton of Div1 players and ex-pros play. However, I've seen a couple of TGKs and PT's from Head from really low ranked pros. It's all who you know and what your contract looks like.

-Fuji

 

[Sirius Black]

I've wondered this too. I know a former D1 player who plays with a stock blade. You'd think that people would play with what they grew up on, but since pro stocks aren't available to the public, I don't know how the switch would work.

 

[LapsedNoob]

I've wondered this too. I know a former D1 player who plays with a stock blade. You'd think that people would play with what they grew up on, but since pro stocks aren't available to the public, I don't know how the switch would work.

That's just the thing. Many folks don't switch to a pro-stock more than their frame of choice gets discontinued and pro stock is the only way they can get it.

A guy playing the current Blade might end up playing a pro stock identical to it in ten years when the buying public no longer has access to anything similar.

 

[15Love]

Pro stocks are just lighter versions of retail racquets (some pros have custom molded frames but not very many). You can get a pro stock version of currently available retail racquets like the Graphene Prestige MP. You can also get pro stock versions of older racquets like the PT57 and PT10 but I've heard Head is trying to shift new players to using pro stock versions of current racquets.

The reason most pros would want a pro stock is for the customization. Since they come lighter, you can put weight in the places you want it and not have the racquet weigh a ton. Other options are custom length, flex, and string patterns.

 

[Bendex]

Lets use Nick Kyrigos as an example... lets say he grew up with the Xi 98. He starts making some money, so he decides he now wants all his rackets to go through Priority One, to make sure they are all exactly the same weight and balance, with a custom handle. He also knows that pro frames are given extra care in production.

So he calls the people at Yonex and says, "I'd like 10 pro-stock Xi 98s delivered to P1, please."

Yonex then sends P1 bare bones frames with no weighting and no handle. P1 does them up and sends them to Nick.

Yonex then says, "we'd like to market a hip new racket for the younger generation called the Ai 98." So they start painting Nick's Xi frames to look like Ai frames.

Years go by, and the Xi frames are long out of production. Nick doesn't see a reason to change frame, as he has made his own adjustments over the years, in consultation with P1 and the pro-stock engineers.

 

[anubis]

When you sign an endorsement deal with a racquet manufacturer, you have access to any and every racquet they've ever made (more or less).

For instance, if you sign with Head and you really, really like the i.Prestige mold, you can order as many of them as you want from Head, even though they're currently not selling them to stores anymore.

 

[Moveforwardalways]

Pro stocks are just lighter versions of retail racquets (some pros have custom molded frames but not very many). You can get a pro stock version of currently available retail racquets like the Graphene Prestige MP. You can also get pro stock versions of older racquets like the PT57 and PT10 but I've heard Head is trying to shift new players to using pro stock versions of current racquets.

The reason most pros would want a pro stock is for the customization. Since they come lighter, you can put weight in the places you want it and not have the racquet weigh a ton. Other options are custom length, flex, and string patterns.

Pretty sure pro stocks are actually a good bit heavier than retail.

 

[SpinToWin]

Pretty sure pro stocks are actually a good bit heavier than retail.

Nope, they aren't.

 

[Fuji]

When you sign an endorsement deal with a racquet manufacturer, you have access to any and every racquet they've ever made (more or less).

For instance, if you sign with Head and you really, really like the i.Prestige mold, you can order as many of them as you want from Head, even though they're currently not selling them to stores anymore.

Again, depends on the company and who you are. Head for example doesn't like giving out old moulds to just anyone. They'd much rather have their guys using prostocks of current frames. It's why you're seeing less and less of the PT10 / PT57A's come up these days. They're a lot more selective...

I know guys sponsored by Head and Wilson, and they don't just get to pick anything they want.

-Fuji

 

[leohaegger]

Pro stocks are just lighter versions of retail racquets (some pros have custom molded frames but not very many). You can get a pro stock version of currently available retail racquets like the Graphene Prestige MP. You can also get pro stock versions of older racquets like the PT57 and PT10 but I've heard Head is trying to shift new players to using pro stock versions of current racquets.

The reason most pros would want a pro stock is for the customization. Since they come lighter, you can put weight in the places you want it and not have the racquet weigh a ton. Other options are custom length, flex, and string patterns.

Man, congrats!!! This is one of the most enlightment post i have ever seen about pro stock racquets!!!

 

[Stratsworth]

Nope, they aren't.

Yeah, I would imagine that the weight of 'pro stock' racquets is roughly the same as retail, since a lot of customization (e.g. adding weight) is the norm. Pro racquets definitely weigh more than your average rec player's racquet after the fact, though.

I'm curious to know the average weight of a pro racquet. What do you think, STW, 12.5- 13.5 oz.? I have no idea.

 

[SpinToWin]

Yeah, I would imagine that the weight of 'pro stock' racquets is roughly the same as retail, since a lot of customization (e.g. adding weight) is the norm. Pro racquets definitely weigh more than your average rec player's racquet after the fact, though.

I'm curious to know the average weight of a pro racquet. What do you think, STW, 12.5- 13.5 oz.? I have no idea.

In their normal form, pro stock racquets probably are much lighter than retail racquets, but they are customized to be more pro spec. It depends what you consider to be pro stock I suppose, but I consider it to be the light racquet since most pro players get these and use fairly unique customizations on them (few players use the same customization) to get them to their preferred specs.

The average for static weight has been decreasing in recent years, so perhaps slightly lower than what you suggested. Impossible to know without doing a study though.

 

[Fuji]

Yeah, I would imagine that the weight of 'pro stock' racquets is roughly the same as retail, since a lot of customization (e.g. adding weight) is the norm. Pro racquets definitely weigh more than your average rec player's racquet after the fact, though.

I'm curious to know the average weight of a pro racquet. What do you think, STW, 12.5- 13.5 oz.? I have no idea.

After the fact yeah, they normally weigh more. However hairpins (blank prostocks) start at around 260-280g usually. I remember a couple years ago someone compiled a bunch of data and it worked out to being right around 12.5oz strung and 6(ish) points HL as the "average" pro spec.

-Fuji

 

[bluetrain4]

So, if pro stock frames are just discontinued models, are "custom molds" a myth?

I would imagine that professional customization is much more common than a custom mold.

 

[Fuji]

So, if pro stock frames are just discontinued models, are "custom molds" a myth?

I would imagine that professional customization is much more common than a custom mold.

Custom moulds exist, they just aren't super common. Like one of the "custom" frames I have is Grigor's old 93. That was completely custom for him / Fed.

-Fuji

 

[HRB]

Right about when some company is impressed enough by your play to give you racquets, so for 90% of us...never.

 

[Fuji]

Right about when some company is impressed enough by your play to give you racquets, so for 90% of us...never.

It's a lot easier than you think. I suck at tennis and have been sponsored.

-Fuji

 

[HRB]

It's a lot easier than you think. I suck at tennis and have been sponsored.

-Fuji

You can't "Suck" and be sponsored. Please define "suck", you haven't reached Pro? I don't know any sub 5.0's getting their sticks paid for, if so why? Are you playing for a charity organization, or a sponsored school...that'd make sense.

 

[Fuji]

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[RanchDressing]

I was playing men's 5.0, have a decently high ranking in Canada (for 5.0), and coach at a couple of clubs. I'm not that great a tennis player, but a large pull for getting sponsored is coaching. If companies find out you coach at a half decent club a lot of the time they are willing to give you free stuff.

-Fuji

This is exactly true. Volkl gives out frames, bags, head tape, string, desktop toys, giant banners etc.

But you don't get pro stock, you get retail frames.


As for custom moulds, most of the discontinued frames are usually modified in some way. Either in layup or mould or both. I doubt they use the actual same moulds as they did for retail sticks.

 

[eelhc]

I was playing men's 5.0, have a decently high ranking in Canada (for 5.0), and coach at a couple of clubs. I'm not that great a tennis player, but a large pull for getting sponsored is coaching. If companies find out you coach at a half decent club a lot of the time they are willing to give you free stuff.

-Fuji

This is exactly true. Volkl gives out frames, bags, head tape, string, desktop toys, giant banners etc.

But you don't get pro stock, you get retail frames.

As for custom moulds, most of the discontinued frames are usually modified in some way. Either in layup or mould or both. I doubt they use the actual same moulds as they did for retail sticks.

Babolat is probably the most aggressive at this... All of this stuff really costs next to nothing. Smart marketing.

 

[Fuji]

This is exactly true. Volkl gives out frames, bags, head tape, string, desktop toys, giant banners etc.

But you don't get pro stock, you get retail frames.

Yup this is true. I jokingly asked my rep if I could snag some prostocks off him (was with tech at the time) and his response was "well I can send you some of the LTD 315s, they are close enough."

I know when I got my first package with them, I got a tour bag, some frames, clothes, string, banners, stickers, etc. Generally everything that has a logo on it (outside of shorts for some reason...)

-Fuji

 

[RanchDressing]

Yup this is true. I jokingly asked my rep if I could snag some prostocks off him (was with tech at the time) and his response was "well I can send you some of the LTD 315s, they are close enough."

I know when I got my first package with them, I got a tour bag, some frames, clothes, string, banners, stickers, etc. Generally everything that has a logo on it (outside of shorts for some reason...)

-Fuji

Hahahaha yeah. Still a cool deal if you ask me. My old coach was always looking for something of the old prestige line. He ended up settling for the c10's. That's how I originally got introduced to volkl strings; he gave me a spare set (had like 10 sitting in his bag, a rainbow of colors lol).

Babolat is probably the most aggressive at this... All of this stuff really costs next to nothing. Smart marketing.

Yeah totally. Couldn't be smarter really. Great technique. Especially for club coaches. People get thrashed with XXX brand frame and they naturally want it too. Doesn't Babolat do this with college athletes too?

 

[LapsedNoob]

Yeah totally. Couldn't be smarter really. Great technique. Especially for club coaches. People get thrashed with XXX brand frame and they naturally want it too. Doesn't Babolat do this with college athletes too?

Most of the guys at the big D1 in town get Babolats that way. Additionally the pro-shop connected to the tennis center on campus is Bab only. Sounds like a good deal. They sponsor and then the shop sells them exclusively.

 

[RanchDressing]

Most of the guys at the big D1 in town get Babolats that way. Additionally the pro-shop connected to the tennis center on campus is Bab only. Sounds like a good deal. They sponsor and then the shop sells them exclusively.

Yeah it would be a great deal. I'm sure they'd get a lot of really nice top $ stuff. I definitely wouldn't mind getting some free pro-pulses or pure strikes or apd's

 

[chrischris]

Pretty sure pro stocks are actually a good bit heavier than retail.

nope not as a rule..normallly the hairpins tend to leave room for modifying.. using silicone and lead.

 

[dnj30]

Nope, they aren't.

They usually end up being heavier after modifications. But in stock form they are lighter so as to allow for a lot of weight to be added where needed.

 

[citybert]

Lets use Nick Kyrigos as an example... lets say he grew up with the Xi 98. He starts making some money, so he decides he now wants all his rackets to go through Priority One, to make sure they are all exactly the same weight and balance, with a custom handle. He also knows that pro frames are given extra care in production.

So he calls the people at Yonex and says, "I'd like 10 pro-stock Xi 98s delivered to P1, please."

Yonex then sends P1 bare bones frames with no weighting and no handle. P1 does them up and sends them to Nick.

Yonex then says, "we'd like to market a hip new racket for the younger generation called the Ai 98." So they start painting Nick's Xi frames to look like Ai frames.

Years go by, and the Xi frames are long out of production. Nick doesn't see a reason to change frame, as he has made his own adjustments over the years, in consultation with P1 and the pro-stock engineers.

Think this is fair and well known. Another one is when djokovic switched from wilson to head but is probably still using a wilsom raquet with a head paint job. Cant hate on a guy for going to the highest bideer tho.

 

[Cerps]

Think this is fair and well known. Another one is when djokovic switched from wilson to head but is probably still using a wilsom raquet with a head paint job. Cant hate on a guy for going to the highest bideer tho.

He is basically using the same racquet that he was using with before he went to wilson. Which is a liquidmetal radical mold...

 

[DonDiego]

Wow thanks guys, I hadn't check this thread for a while, and I must say it's one of the most informative on this forum.

 

[roger presley]

Think this is fair and well known. Another one is when djokovic switched from wilson to head but is probably still using a wilsom raquet with a head paint job. Cant hate on a guy for going to the highest bideer tho.

I think Djokovic was one of the reasons why Wilson made H22 in the first place and the other guys that came from Head to Wilson.