StefanosRespecter
Rookie
Ok, so racism is just based on popular social opinions? So Jewish hatred in **** Germany was ok because most Germans agreed with it? That is your logic here.
Badosa playing around with face and wrinkles
- Thread starter onehandbh
- Start date
Yes, eating at a Chinese buffet is not smart
Of course. Just imagine if Germany had won the war.
RoddickAce
Hall of Fame
1. Just because something occurs often does not make it acceptable. Racism itself is common across the world, and is not considered acceptable.
2. No it is not outside the scope. It is an analogy and a type of argumentation strategy I have used in court. If the argument is that black-face is used to portray blacks poorly...then what about making ones eyes so small that they are slits? Are barely visible eyes a beauty standard in spain/europe? Please don't suggest that Badosa is praising asians by making her eyes slits.
3. That is your definition of racism. My definition hinges on whether the action causes the affected group to feel targeted and offended.
Being blonde is not a commonly mocked trait. A more comparable example is going to a country where the average height is lower, then walking around on your knees and taking a photo for social media.
Hmmm that is interesting. I will say I have heard blonde jokes my whole life. It's a pretty mocked trait. Im not interested in getting into some debate about what's racist or not but will say my wife is German and she literally makes fun of people from other German regions who are also German for their various differences. So I dont think the debate is as black and white as many make it.
The debate is black and white? Do I even need to say it?
RoddickAce
Hall of Fame
I see what you mean about blonde jokes, but usually the jokes are not about the physical trait of having blonde hair itself, which is what the "wig" analogy from the other poster would relate to.
However, I could be wrong as I am not blonde so I will myself, not over generalize.
Edit: Also, if one were to wear a blonde wig as means to make offensive jokes, then it just shows that the analogy provided is an example of racism.
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
There are insider jokes that people take with a friendly smile. And there are outsider jokes that are meant to disparage.
People say that Seinfeld couldn't be made today and it's true. The show is shot-through with racism.
Like Badosa, it plays on the stereotypes while trying to play the "just a joker" card.
People say that Seinfeld couldn't be made today and it's true. The show is shot-through with racism.
Like Badosa, it plays on the stereotypes while trying to play the "just a joker" card.
No it's not about the physical trait. It's stereotyped that blondes are stupid/morons. Soooooo I aint sure thats better.
Shakespeare couldn’t be made today either. Thank the true God, Lord Jesus for this. He’s such a disgusting racist
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RoddickAce
Hall of Fame
Yeah, so if it's offensive then the wig example provided by the other poster does not support their own position.
I mean it's an interesting debate to tell you the truth. I mean one could say if an asian person wears a blonde wig and paints their face for a party, or halloween or something, that they are playing a white person. And technically I should be offended. Hmmmm. Well Im not lol.
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
Seinfeld is 30 years old, however, not hundreds of years old. They also acknowledge that there is something wrong with the gag even as they tell it.
So Shakespeare can’t apologize. But Seinfeld can. I hope he does the right thing
RoddickAce
Hall of Fame
But that's the difference between whether a trait is being mocked at the physical level, that I was trying to differentiate.
Slit eyes are mocked for its physical attribute. So someone making those eyes are mocking the trait at face value and it's offensive as is.
I understand from your earlier post that being blonde is not mocked as a physical trait, but rather the generalization of being stupid. While someone wearing blonde wig may not be offensive at face value...what if that person then proceeds to say in a fake dumb voice "i'M dUmB, i'M bLonDe?"
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
But say your an Asian and wear a blonde wig and oh I dont know wearing a bud lite shirt and holding a big mac. Are you not mocking a race and culture? If one dresses in a fat suit and are we not mocking fat people? I really have never been clear where the line is on this subject and dont think most people are. Someone famous once said I know it's pornography when I see it.
Well he isnt wrong. But what's pornography for one person is not for another. I suspect it's the same with this topic. There is obvious racism or sexism and then there is stuff like this. In my opinion anyways.
Correct. Shakespeare should just be banned
Not only cringe, it’s also BS. The Chinese in general, and mainland Chinese in particular, have a very xenophobic and racist culture. You will find a higher percentage of mean people there than in other parts of the world. There are every year racist crimes, the latest was actually the stabbing and murdering of a 10 year old half Japanese boy. They call europeans and Africans all kinds of mean disparaging names. Being very racist makes them also very sensitive to perceived racism against them. They always react very strongly to what they believe is an offense. Search the Dolce Gabbana scandal of a few years ago.
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Bartelby
Bionic Poster
Shakespeare is interpreted rather than banned. For example, Henry V can have its patriotism played up or you can show the war crimes that Henry's invasion of France precipitated.
RoddickAce
Hall of Fame
That does sound offensive to me, and is a completely different example from the other poster's example of a person wearing a blonde wig in Denmark. So your point does not prove their argument correct.
On the flip side, if you are not offended by an asian wearing a blonde wig, holding a big mac and wearing bud lite shirt with the intent to mock the race and culture, then I have no right to judge your decision as an outsider. Much like how non-asians should not tell us whether making slit eyes is offensive to OUR culture or not.
Ya, me too. But I never know what art is
That seems like a lot of work. Easier to just ban it I think. Just to be safe
Yea the subject always confounds me. Whats offensive now is different than what is 30 years ago, and 30 years from now, things will be offensive that were fine in our time.
But in that time period there are always people who will miss the memo and screw up, and things change again.
As long as we can all agree that Margaret Court is evil, I think we’re OK
Exactly.
I would not go as far as calling this racism, but I would certainly consider it extremely dumb. Tennis players in general are not known to be the most intelligent athletes. You can be good at hitting a fuzzy ball with a racket but it doesn’t make you the smartest person.What's with Spain and imitating Chinese people?
Spanish players defend controversial photo
Players on Spain’s Olympic basketball team defended a photo in an ad showing the players using their fingers to apparently make their eyes look more Chinese.www.nbcnews.com
Badosa issues apology amid racism storm for 'offensive' Instagram post
On Saturday afternoon, Badosa suffered defeat in the semi-finals of the China Open at the hands of American star Coco Gauff - who went on to win the tournament.www.dailymail.co.uk
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
Evil is a term belonging to theological discourse, so why would a secularist use that term let alone ban someone on that basis?
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
Bill Lobsalot
Hall of Fame
The world is full of snowflakes.
She’s a religious zealot but I don’t think she’s evil.
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
Was Hitler evil? Or just misunderstood?
Thank god. It’s almost ski season
Clay lover
Legend
I would say this: By racist nowadays people normally also include generalizing a race based on certain traits IN ADDITION TO the irrational hatred of a certain race.
Generalization based on perceived traits is frowned upon because no one wants to be bunched together in a mass just because of some perceived trait they don't even share. I emphasise the "they don't even share" part because not all Chinese people have those eyes - in fact probably around half of them don't.
However, the dislike for being "bunched together in a mass" is also real, even if the trait is objectively common like African Americans being darker in general. They just don't like that being known as their defining trait instead of their individuality.
However you define racism is really not the main point though. Whether you consider generalization racism or not, it should be considered offensive for the reasons I outlined above.
Generalization based on perceived traits is frowned upon because no one wants to be bunched together in a mass just because of some perceived trait they don't even share. I emphasise the "they don't even share" part because not all Chinese people have those eyes - in fact probably around half of them don't.
However, the dislike for being "bunched together in a mass" is also real, even if the trait is objectively common like African Americans being darker in general. They just don't like that being known as their defining trait instead of their individuality.
However you define racism is really not the main point though. Whether you consider generalization racism or not, it should be considered offensive for the reasons I outlined above.
I think if we all work together, we can end racism. Future generations won’t even know what the word means
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
I get cramps
Semi-Pro
I don't know what the news is, but the headline... well, I don't know: “Unprecedented fall of the Spanish pig”.
To be perfectly Candide with you…..
I love Spanish pig. Especially Iberico
zagor
Bionic Poster
In the future there will be no racism because our descendants will be all mixed races. But we might have certain sensitivities between earthlings and Martians
In the future there will be no racism because our descendants will be all mixed races. But we might have certain sensitivities between earthlings and Martians
Thank you! I learned a new word today
Sport
G.O.A.T.
Yeah, because 16 persons from a country are a big enough sample size to generalize the 46+ million inhabitants of its teritory.
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Sport
G.O.A.T.
That picture is from 2008, 16 years ago. Hardly the same social sensitivy toward race issues in 2008 than in 2024, not only in Spain but everywhere else, including the US. I remember the American model Gigi Hadid some years ago posted a picture simmilar to Badosa's one ("mocking" Asian eyes) and she receieved a lot of criticism for it. Saying the US are racist due to Hadid's behavior is an overgeneralization based on the mistake of one individual (if you really believe the US as a whole are a racist country, you would need more than this anecdotical evidence to make such claim). Analogously, Badosa mocking Asian eyes in this era of bigger sensitiviness and awareness that is 2024, just proves she's dumb, but it doesn't mean Spain as a whole is a racist country. That is overgeneralizating from the dumb behavior of one single person, and ignoring the other 46+ million Spaniards that have never mocked Asian eyes in any picture or form.
P. S.: maybe the biggest "argument" you could make that Spain has a "racism" problem is if you consider the social perception toward (especially illegal, and specifically from Moroco and Sub-Saharan Africa) immigration. Many people in Spain oppose to migration from the Moroccan Islamic community, which is entering here massively and in many cases it is done illegaly. Also happens a lot with the sub-Saharan African community. Many have the perception that those inmigrants are unfairly receiving social help payments from the local government, instead of the locals receiving such economic distribution. There's some sort of overall social rejection of the Islamic people and its culture and religion, as well as a rejection of the sub-Saharan African illegal immigration (which is being massive and has no control in some regions such as the Canaries, giving problems in terms of resources and social structures to receive them being saturated). But still, the most voted political party, the one in power, is PSOE, from the left wing and 100% pro-immigration, an openly "woke" party. So it's far from clear that most people here have such mindset, though it is very common. Anyway, are all those pointing to flaws in the immigration system racist? I suppose some are, but not all. Because massive immigration with no regulation does challenge the economic resources of a country and brings its own problems. This is not a simple issue. Overall, I see no evidence that Spain has a "racism" problem bigger than any other European Union or European nation, as in any other European country such as the UK, Germany, France, Italy, etc., there's a sizeable proportion of inhabitans that oppose to the immigration model.
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Lleytonstation
Talk Tennis Guru
Seinfeld is still funny. Dont care what anyone says.
ghostofMecir
Legend
Eh, too many incidents. I’ve also traveled to Spain with an East African girlfriend… I felt the racism directed towards her.
ghostofMecir
Legend
Yes, of course—people dislike those people from Morocco and sub-Saharan Africa primarily because of their immigration status. Sure. Lol
that’s supposed to kind of like them when they play with the national soccer team.
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