Battle for 2016 YE #1

Who will finish 2016 as ATP no.1?


  • Total voters
    53
  • Poll closed .

chjtennis

G.O.A.T.
On Race to London, Djokovic is sitting at the top with 10,600 pts while Murray second on 9,685 pts. 915 pts is the difference and Djokovic is playing in Paris next while Murray will be playing in Vienna next week prior to Paris. Murray has a good chance to win in Vienna, can collect 500 pts to narrow the gap to Djokovic down to 415 pts with Bercy and WTF left. If it reaches that point, I think year end no.1 can be anyone's between these two. Murray may be very tired by then, but at this stage of the year, he can just put up a last spurt effort, and then take a good holiday afterwards. All he needs is a good run in the last month of the tour and I'm sure he can overcome the physical fatigue by toughening up mentally. Where would you put your money on for YE #1?
 

DreddyTennis45

Hall of Fame
It's gonna be close but it all depends on Bercy imo. Murray has always been a bit iffy there but his confidence is high right now so who knows
 

octobrina10

Talk Tennis Guru
On Race to London, Djokovic is sitting at the top with 10,600 pts while Murray second on 9,685 pts. 915 pts is the difference and Djokovic is playing in Paris next while Murray will be playing in Vienna next week prior to Paris. Murray has a good chance to win in Vienna, can collect 500 pts to narrow the gap to Djokovic down to 415 pts with Bercy and WTF left. If it reaches that point, I think year end no.1 can be anyone's between these two. Murray may be very tired by then, but at this stage of the year, he can just put up a last spurt effort, and then take a good holiday afterwards. All he needs is a good run in the last month of the tour and I'm sure he can overcome the physical fatigue by toughening up mentally. Where would you put your money on for YE #1?
The Race includes 275 points A.Murray earned in the 2015 Davis Cup final, these points will be dropped on Nov.28.
He can become #1 after the Paris Masters or WTF, but he can drop back to No. 2 before the end of the year due to losing the Davis Cup points.
http://www.atpworldtour.com/en/players/andy-murray/mc10/rankings-breakdown?team=singles
 

Luckydog

Professional
It's hard to say. Both Murray and Djo have chance,which one will be the YE #1 depends on his performance in the following 2 months. But one thing is for sure, even if Murray cannot achieve #1 in this season ,he still has a shot in the early stage of 2017.
 

chjtennis

G.O.A.T.
The Race includes 275 points A.Murray earned in the 2015 Davis Cup final, these points will be dropped on Nov.28.
He can become #1 after the Paris Masters or WTF, but he can drop back to No. 2 before the end of the year due to losing the Davis Cup points.
http://www.atpworldtour.com/en/players/andy-murray/mc10/rankings-breakdown?team=singles
You are right, indeed. However, Murray should win both Bercy and WTF unless Djokovic falls early in either one of them. He may be able to afford a loss at the group stage of WTF, but should win all of the remaining tournaments to get to no.1, anyway. If he does that, points from DC will be irrelevant.
 

chjtennis

G.O.A.T.
It's hard to say. Both Murray and Djo have chance,which one will be the YE #1 depends on his performance in the following 2 months. But one thing is for sure, even if Murray cannot achieve #1 in this season ,he still has a shot in the early stage of 2017.
Yes, but this is a rare chance where Murray has tough but realistic chance of finishing a year as no.1. I think he realises this and is trying everything he can to achieve that, Djokovic has so many points to defend, so I also think Murray can overtake him some time early next year, if not this year.
 

Dave1982

Professional
There's no doubt Shanghai result has opened the door for Murray much sooner than many had expected...or at least certainly sooner than I had expected.

Pending the pairs Paris results (and to a lesser extent Murray's Vienna result) am I correct in thinking Murray could actually start WTF as #1 ranked player due to 2015 WTF points dropping early?

The more I look at it the more I think Murray may actually finish the year at #1...Djokovic just doesn't seem to capable at the minute of stringing the required number of wins together to dominate tournaments like he did up until after his FO win.
In a perfect world I'd love to see Murray & Djokovic face off in Final of WTF with YE#1 on the line...kind of feel that would be fitting. In that scenario I'd probably be inclined to back Djokovic as for Murray's great play, we still haven't seen him beat Djokovic.
 

Luckydog

Professional
There's no doubt Shanghai result has opened the door for Murray much sooner than many had expected...or at least certainly sooner than I had expected.

Pending the pairs Paris results (and to a lesser extent Murray's Vienna result) am I correct in thinking Murray could actually start WTF as #1 ranked player due to 2015 WTF points dropping early?

The more I look at it the more I think Murray may actually finish the year at #1...Djokovic just doesn't seem to capable at the minute of stringing the required number of wins together to dominate tournaments like he did up until after his FO win.
In a perfect world I'd love to see Murray & Djokovic face off in Final of WTF with YE#1 on the line...kind of feel that would be fitting. In that scenario I'd probably be inclined to back Djokovic as for Murray's great play, we still haven't seen him beat Djokovic.
Facing off in WTF final? It cannot be better!
Even Murray and Djo will play like they did in last year at the following events before WTF,that means they claim the same points as they did respectively.If Murray wins Djo in WTF final,their positions will exchange!
 

chjtennis

G.O.A.T.
There's no doubt Shanghai result has opened the door for Murray much sooner than many had expected...or at least certainly sooner than I had expected.

Pending the pairs Paris results (and to a lesser extent Murray's Vienna result) am I correct in thinking Murray could actually start WTF as #1 ranked player due to 2015 WTF points dropping early?

The more I look at it the more I think Murray may actually finish the year at #1...Djokovic just doesn't seem to capable at the minute of stringing the required number of wins together to dominate tournaments like he did up until after his FO win.
In a perfect world I'd love to see Murray & Djokovic face off in Final of WTF with YE#1 on the line...kind of feel that would be fitting. In that scenario I'd probably be inclined to back Djokovic as for Murray's great play, we still haven't seen him beat Djokovic.
It just seems to me Djokovic is drained, more mentally although also physically, and wants just to see off the year as soon as possible. I think he is on the verge of visible decline in his game now, which is not surprising how much tennis he's played and how much success he's had in the last 6 years. Murray is still to get to his peak in terms of achievements, not performance, but he may not stay there for long considering his age. I expect it will be close this year between Murray and Djokovic, whichever way it goes, but Murray will be the dominant player next year but we may have different dominant players(no.1s) in 2018.
 

Dave1982

Professional
It just seems to me Djokovic is drained, more mentally although also physically, and wants just to see off the year as soon as possible. I think he is on the verge of visible decline in his game now, which is not surprising how much tennis he's played and how much success he's had in the last 6 years. Murray is still to get to his peak in terms of achievements, not performance, but he may not stay there for long considering his age. I expect it will be close this year between Murray and Djokovic, whichever way it goes, but Murray will be the dominant player next year but we may have different dominant players(no.1s) in 2018.
Absolutely no doubt Djokovic is mentally drained and in need of some time off to reset...will just be interesting to see whether the fight for YE#1 revitalises him or not...I know he's said it's not his focus but hard to think in the heat of battle it's not going to provide him with some motivation.

Should Murray reach number 1 then it's difficult to predict how long his stay at the top might be because I certainly can't see him being as dominant as Djokovic yet I still feel the younger generation is probably at least 12 months off making any real challenge for it....even if Djokovic loses number 1 spot before the end of the year or early next year, I'd be expecting him to reclaim it again at some point.
 

Goosehead

Legend
Djokovic is now entering.,...

............................. "the wilander zone".

after years of success and win..

the wilander zone sees the unfortunate being suffer a mix of decreased mental interest, physical woe and lack of oomph.
 

Bukmeikara

Legend
It's hard to say. Both Murray and Djo have chance,which one will be the YE #1 depends on his performance in the following 2 months. But one thing is for sure, even if Murray cannot achieve #1 in this season ,he still has a shot in the early stage of 2017.
Unless Murray flops, Djokovic wins Paris+WTF and gain a 3000 point advantage :)
 

Rafa the King

Hall of Fame
The Race to London (the race to qualify for WTF in London) will end on the Monday following the Paris Masters (on Nov.7th).

The race for year-end #1 will end on Dec. 31. Andy Murray will lose 275 Davis Cup points on November 28.
Yes but if he wins the race (if WTF points are added) he is number 1. That's what I meant
 

tennis_pro

Bionic Poster
I think 1000 points is too big of a difference at this point of the season. Djokovic would really have to fall off a cliff for Murray to have a legit shot. As it is, I give Murray an 8-10% chance to end the year at no 1.
 

ultradr

Legend
I think Murray can reach #1 within 6 months or so if not this year.
Murray is invading and Djokovic must respond now.

And I have a theory that all #1's from 2003 will end up with career slam.
And another theory i have is that you don't have to be #1 to achieve career slam under post-2003 modern baseline era.
 

BGod

Legend
Still comes down to if Murray wins WTF and Djokovic gets stuck in round robin.

I mean, that's essentially it. Sure there are some sidesteps and whatnot but that's what it'll come down to.
 

nadalfan2013

Professional
They should have awarded points to the Olympics. The ATP didn't want to add any value to it and ended up not awarding points for it. Should have been 1000-1500 points.
It has nothing to do with this. It's because the following year these points can't be defended. It's not a yearly event. It should be 2000 points otherwise equal to the slams.
 

S'in-net

Semi-Pro
YE No.1 is the most important thing

Then, from Djokovic's side of the court : wire to wire No.1
which hasn't been mentioned too much around here...

For that, Djokovic needs to show up in Paris x2...

The (Calendar Year) Paris-double hasn't been done since Agassi 99...
and before that Nastase in 73 (only successful Calendar Year Paris-doubles in the Open Era...)
 
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Rafa the King

Hall of Fame
It has nothing to do with this. It's because the following year these points can't be defended. It's not a yearly event. It should be 2000 points otherwise equal to the slams.
Yet you play the event and put your time and effort into it. No reason for the ATP not to award points and have them drop the following year. It was clear they wanted to disvalue the event just because they were affraid a non-ATP event would gather too much importance.
 

punterlad

Hall of Fame
I place no value on the no.1 ranking as it's a computer game essentially. If two players are close enough as is the case now they can manipulate their schedule to maximise their chances .

I prefer to look at who has won what. Djokovic has won two slams Murray the olympics and a slam. Masters 1000 wise Djokovic has won one more i think.

It's very close. Murray has the two biggest events this year in Wimbledon and the Olympics. But djokovic has won his majors by beating Murray his closest rival and has won more masters 1000.

Murray has won events on all surfaces this year Djokovic hasn't.

For me therefore it is one of the very rare years (over 20 years since it was last the case for me) where the WTF will have some significance. Whoever out of the two of them wins that is the best player this year and the real no.1.

My prediction is that neither of them will win. Murray will be burnt out by time London starts as he has played so much tennis and Djokovic seems to be having a much needed mental switch off.

So if that happens I would say Murray is real no.1 by virtue of having won a tournament on al surfaces which I think should always be given special honour to.
 

punterlad

Hall of Fame
I think 1000 points is too big of a difference at this point of the season. Djokovic would really have to fall off a cliff for Murray to have a legit shot. As it is, I give Murray an 8-10% chance to end the year at no 1.
Djokovic unlikely to make mistake he did in2013. After he lost the ego thumping USO contest to nadal he was desperate to stay no.1 and have everything to stay ahead of nadal but failed . It took a lot out of him and he then surrendered his Australian open title in2014.

Murray seems to be making the same mistake. He may or may not achieve the year end no.1 but he is investing so much into his quest I am certain he will have a poor Australian open which would surrender his ranking as he has 1200 points to defend there. Bottom line is chasing the ranking isn't worth it. As many previous players have said just play a normal schedule and take each event at a time and the ranking takes care of itself. Start playing the computer and ultimately its self defeating
 

Djokovic2011

Bionic Poster
I place no value on the no.1 ranking as it's a computer game essentially. If two players are close enough as is the case now they can manipulate their schedule to maximise their chances .

I prefer to look at who has won what. Djokovic has won two slams Murray the olympics and a slam. Masters 1000 wise Djokovic has won one more i think.

It's very close. Murray has the two biggest events this year in Wimbledon and the Olympics. But djokovic has won his majors by beating Murray his closest rival and has won more masters 1000.

Murray has won events on all surfaces this year Djokovic hasn't.

For me therefore it is one of the very rare years (over 20 years since it was last the case for me) where the WTF will have some significance. Whoever out of the two of them wins that is the best player this year and the real no.1.

My prediction is that neither of them will win. Murray will be burnt out by time London starts as he has played so much tennis and Djokovic seems to be having a much needed mental switch off.

So if that happens I would say Murray is real no.1 by virtue of having won a tournament on al surfaces which I think should always be given special honour to.
Oh dear. :oops:
 

Bukmeikara

Legend
Djokovic unlikely to make mistake he did in2013. After he lost the ego thumping USO contest to nadal he was desperate to stay no.1 and have everything to stay ahead of nadal but failed . It took a lot out of him and he then surrendered his Australian open title in2014.

Murray seems to be making the same mistake. He may or may not achieve the year end no.1 but he is investing so much into his quest I am certain he will have a poor Australian open which would surrender his ranking as he has 1200 points to defend there. Bottom line is chasing the ranking isn't worth it. As many previous players have said just play a normal schedule and take each event at a time and the ranking takes care of itself. Start playing the computer and ultimately its self defeating
So because of winning every possible match in October-November Djokovic lost the AO 14?! This is ridiculous .. And how exactly can you be sure that Murray would have a bad AO, please explain it to me? Nadal played tons of tournaments on his comeback in 2013 and yet had the best season in his career!! How is that possible after he played so many tournaments?!
I place no value on the no.1 ranking as it's a computer game essentially.
It's very close. Murray has the two biggest events this year in Wimbledon and the Olympics.
If the rankings were wrote down on a paper would you give them more value? And how exactly are the Olympics the most important event when half of the top 30 players refused to play them?! Do you think that you know better than them?!
 

Noelan

Legend
Djokovic unlikely to make mistake he did in2013. After he lost the ego thumping USO contest to nadal he was desperate to stay no.1 and have everything to stay ahead of nadal but failed . It took a lot out of him and he then surrendered his Australian open title in2014.

Murray seems to be making the same mistake. He may or may not achieve the year end no.1 but he is investing so much into his quest I am certain he will have a poor Australian open which would surrender his ranking as he has 1200 points to defend there. Bottom line is chasing the ranking isn't worth it. As many previous players have said just play a normal schedule and take each event at a time and the ranking takes care of itself. Start playing the computer and ultimately its self defeating
Djokovic didn't wanted to play Valencia , Basel,or any smaller tournament .He was that desperate:rolleyes:
@octobrina10 so you are saying that Murray could lead the race (not ATP rankings) after the WTF and still finish 2nd? Would Nole then get YE #1?
How come that poster who is all over the board ever since he registrated here with threads he opens doesn't know how tennis ranking works??
Race and ranking list becomes one at the first monday before WFT. So the one who will have the most points at the end of the WTF will be No1 (if player confirmed his No1 status earlier ,he will recive No1 trophy during the WTF )

I remember when two Rafafangirs at the end of 2013 ( you know which ones) argued about how he had 4740 points more than No2 instead 740 .
Srs the level of stupidity that some Nadal have shown here is astonishing.
 
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octobrina10

Talk Tennis Guru
Djokovic didn't wanted to play Valencia , Basel,on any smaller tournament .He was that desperate:rolleyes:

How come that poster who is all over the board ever since he registrated here with threads he opens doesn't know how tennis ranking works??
Race and ranking list becomes one at the first monday before WFT. So the one who will have the most points at the end of the WTF will be No1 (if player confirmed his No1 status earlier ,he will recive No1 trophy during the WTF )

I remember when two Rafafangirs at the end of 2013 ( you know which ones) argued about how he had 4740 points more than No2 instead 740 .
Srs the level of stupidity that some Nadal have shown here is astonishing.
The calendar year will end on Dec. 31.
The ATP year-end No. 1 ranked player is determined as the player at the head of the ATP rankings following the completion of the final tournament of the calendar year.
 
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Rafa the King

Hall of Fame
Djokovic didn't wanted to play Valencia , Basel,or any smaller tournament .He was that desperate:rolleyes:

How come that poster who is all over the board ever since he registrated here with threads he opens doesn't know how tennis ranking works??
Race and ranking list becomes one at the first monday before WFT. So the one who will have the most points at the end of the WTF will be No1 (if player confirmed his No1 status earlier ,he will recive No1 trophy during the WTF )

I remember when two Rafafangirs at the end of 2013 ( you know which ones) argued about how he had 4740 points more than No2 instead 740 .
Srs the level of stupidity that some Nadal have shown here is astonishing.
Firstly I know how tennis rankings work. No need for your pitty little insults. I asked octo, not you, about DC points because I didn't understand what was meant by the post.
 

octobrina10

Talk Tennis Guru
Firstly I know how tennis rankings work. No need for your pitty little insults. I asked octo, not you, about DC points because I didn't understand what was meant by the post.
Flashback (to confirm that the Davis Cup final has been inlcuded in the YE#1 ranking):
BBC, Nov. 4, 2013: "Nadal will clinch the year-end number one ranking if he wins two matches in London.
The task facing Djokovic would remain considerable even if the Spaniard fails, as he would need to win the title in London and go unbeaten in the Davis Cup final later this month."
http://www.bbc.com/sport/tennis/24799868

(The ATP stopped awarding ranking points for Davis Cup victories this year.)
 

clayqueen

Talk Tennis Guru
It has nothing to do with this. It's because the following year these points can't be defended. It's not a yearly event. It should be 2000 points otherwise equal to the slams.
They awarded points for the olympics up to 2012. Rafa got 800 points when he won the gold medal in 2008.
 

punterlad

Hall of Fame
So because of winning every possible match in October-November Djokovic lost the AO 14?! This is ridiculous .. And how exactly can you be sure that Murray would have a bad AO, please explain it to me? Nadal played tons of tournaments on his comeback in 2013 and yet had the best season in his career!! How is that possible after he played so many tournaments?!


If the rankings were wrote down on a paper would you give them more value? And how exactly are the Olympics the most important event when half of the top 30 players refused to play them?! Do you think that you know better than them?!
Ask Djokovic where he puts the olympics ask nadal and ask Murray all of whom know more than u!

As u probably have never touched a racket in your life inwont waste time explaining the nuances of fatigue in sport but Djokovic three awaybthe AO 2014 by chasing a number one ranking that he had little chance of keeping after the beat down by nadal at USO. Murray should take heed. This isn't a debate I was explaining fact
 

punterlad

Hall of Fame
Djokovic didn't wanted to play Valencia , Basel,or any smaller tournament .He was that desperate:rolleyes:

How come that poster who is all over the board ever since he registrated here with threads he opens doesn't know how tennis ranking works??
Race and ranking list becomes one at the first monday before WFT. So the one who will have the most points at the end of the WTF will be No1 (if player confirmed his No1 status earlier ,he will recive No1 trophy during the WTF )

I remember when two Rafafangirs at the end of 2013 ( you know which ones) argued about how he had 4740 points more than No2 instead 740 .
Srs the level of stupidity that some Nadal have shown here is astonishing.
This is how pathetic you nadal haters are. This thread isn't even about nadal yet you lot obsess about him!! Ffs!! Get a grip! The battle wis Djokovic v Murray! Nadal has taken a little end of year holiday so isn't relevant to the rest of the year!! Get over him
 

Noelan

Legend
This is how pathetic you nadal haters are. This thread isn't even about nadal yet you lot obsess about him!! Ffs!! Get a grip! The battle wis Djokovic v Murray! Nadal has taken a little end of year holiday so isn't relevant to the rest of the year!! Get over him
You're hilarious with your utter senseless blabbing dear Gary20:D
 

Bukmeikara

Legend
Ask Djokovic where he puts the olympics ask nadal and ask Murray all of whom know more than u!

As u probably have never touched a racket in your life inwont waste time explaining the nuances of fatigue in sport but Djokovic three awaybthe AO 2014 by chasing a number one ranking that he had little chance of keeping after the beat down by nadal at USO. Murray should take heed. This isn't a debate I was explaining fact
Sorry to disturb you milord ...
 

Lord Anomander

Professional
The question is how much gas has Murray left in his tank? He hasn't performed too well in the previous WTFs, but that might go different this year. But the last weeks must have been hard on Andy, so I'm not sure whether he can keep up the pace the next weeks. His schedule was pretty tough, but the goal to finally become #1 might push him through all this.

I voted for Novak, because the WTF is a tournament he usually performs very well there. Given Andy's current form, I wouldn't be too surprised if he finished as #1. Also it might help Djokovic to find new motivation again. :)
 
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