Aceing a pro is not as easy as acing a club player. And I hardly ever see aces at the club level.
Beating Pro Players?
- Thread starter mTm28
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Aceing a pro is not as easy as acing a club player. And I hardly ever see aces at the club level.
deltox
Hall of Fame
Your playing in the wrong area then.
Our club teams at 3.5-5.0 all have folks that will get 6-10 aces easily in a match on average.
Thats not saying those would be aces on pros but for you to be seeing them very rarely is odd to me. there is 50+ year old men in our 4.0 division that will get an ace or two every service game.
Maybe there are better returners around here I don't know LOL.
drakulie
Talk Tennis Guru
Let's put it this way.....
Carlos Gomez Diaz (a former pro, high rank of 175), who is now 40 years old, regularly beats young 5.0's with serves that top 130, 6-0, 6-0.
Now imagine this same 5.0 playing one of those "sucky" guys currently ranked 1500 in the world with one atp point.
Sure a 5.0 with a huge serve could get a game off one of these guys if he serves well, and the stars align perfectly. However, it's won't be a frequent happening, and no way they take a set. Not even close.
I'll take this a bit further. A 5.0 acing another 5.0 is hard as hell. Imagine acing a pro ranked in the 200's???
spiderman123
Professional
I once was holding my own against a pro, both of us lefties. Then all of a sudden the guy switched hands, shouted that he is not a lefty and whacked the ball at incredible speed. I switched hands too, returned it for a winner and shouted back "neither am I." Then I woke up and watched Princess Bride again.
deltox
Hall of Fame
sounded more like some Prince of Tennis stuff there
deltox
Hall of Fame
i said pro at the end of the rankings list #1550+ ranked. Go watch a futures event and tell me your local 5.0 wouldnt get a game per set off the ones with one point who never see the 3rd round and only once ever saw the second round...... those guys are like glorified college tennis players to me, well most of them anyways.
spiderman123
Professional
drakulie
Talk Tennis Guru
I've worked "futures events", and 5.0's can't even get into the main draw. They lose in the first round of the qualifying.
Seriously, **YOU** need to go watch "futures events".
vbranis
Professional
I agree with drakulie, guys who reached the 2nd round of a Futures main draw are EXTREMELY GOOD! They've won at least 4-5 matches against solid players if they came through qualies, no cakewalk. Unless you're a strong 5.5, I don't see how you can possibly win a game against those guys (who are ATP ranked). Maybe against some of the guys who lose 1st or 2nd round of qualies a 5.0 can get a couple of games. But not more.
burosky
Professional
When the SAP Open rolls around San Jose a qualifier tournament runs. If I'm not mistaken, even the qualifier tournament has a local qualifier tournament. The local qualifiers is where you will typically see top open players, top juniors or even those few brave souls who are 4.5s and above compete just to get to the qualifier for the pro event. Those who survive the local qualifier moves on to the qualifier for the pro event where they get to play pros who do not have enough points to get in the pro event automatically. Without being familiar with names you can almost always tell who were the ones who survived the local qualifiers. Those were the ones who either got bageled or lost decisively.
Someone who have actually played some pros here said once they find out they are sure to cruise through the match they don't care if they lose a game or two in a set. I agree with that. It wouldn't make sense for them to put forth more effort than necessary when they might need all the energy they need for the next match.
Maybe the more appropriate question would be "If a pro is given enough incentive to bagel you, do you think you'd be able to get a game, much less a set, from a pro unless you are a pro or former pro yourself?"
Someone who have actually played some pros here said once they find out they are sure to cruise through the match they don't care if they lose a game or two in a set. I agree with that. It wouldn't make sense for them to put forth more effort than necessary when they might need all the energy they need for the next match.
Maybe the more appropriate question would be "If a pro is given enough incentive to bagel you, do you think you'd be able to get a game, much less a set, from a pro unless you are a pro or former pro yourself?"
Of course I would!!!! I serve 130 mph but I am only a 4.0. All that topspin they hit is nonsense I will use my "flat" strokes I learned in 1988 to hit deep to the corner and come into net. Today's pros can't volley so I will also draw them in and watch them mess up!
I bet Simon will beat a 5.0 player 0 and 0 by playing left handed.
You are delusional. A 4.0 player serving 130 mph? You see the pros serving 130 mph with ease and "think" you can serve just like them too. Have your serve measured and I bet it would be more like 130 km per hour.
Even Boris Becker, one of the great server of all time, couldn't serve 130mph consistently.
Andres
G.O.A.T.
I have 12 wins over (now) #113 Horacio Zeballos. Of course, I have over 50 losses, and we were kids, but no one is EVER going to take that away from me 
We had a practice match last year when he beat me 6-3, 6-2. He wasn't even trying and I was serving light out. In fact, I think he was also rather sleepy.
If it was a competitive match, I'd be lucky to get a game off him, despite me knowing him so much and being a bad matchup for his game.
Yeah, they're THAT good.
We had a practice match last year when he beat me 6-3, 6-2. He wasn't even trying and I was serving light out. In fact, I think he was also rather sleepy.
If it was a competitive match, I'd be lucky to get a game off him, despite me knowing him so much and being a bad matchup for his game.
Yeah, they're THAT good.
Fedace
Banned
I can't believe that. 2 years ago there was a FAST serve competition in the country that was sponsored by USTA i believe. one of the 4.0 guys served one at 123 MPH and that was the best for USTA 4.0 level guy. There was another guy that was rated 4.5, and he served one at 130.8 MPH and that won the fastest serve competition.
http://nfsctour.com/pressroom.html
http://www.bluegumtennisclub.org/docs/fsc.pdf
Fedace
Banned
Nah, i can beat him if he plays left handed.
Not a chance in hell. All the former pros I've hit with could play excellent tennis playing left handed. I bet Simon can ealily beat a solid 5.5 player left handed.
My point is most of the weekend hackers here have no idea how good the top pros are. I was laughing hard when I read when some claimed they could hit 4 aces in a row to take a game off a pro. Truth is the pros will know where the serve was going even before a 4.5, 5.0 or even 5.5 player hit the ball. It just comes from having spent tens of thousands of hours on the tennis court from an early age. A 4.5 or 5.0 will NOT be able to serve an ace if the pro was playing seriously.
I play a competitive 5.0 tennis and have what I consider a good amateur serve, but against a former pro ranked 250 in the world, every single first serve I hit came back to me deep and fast (some faster than my serve). I couldn't win a single point off this serve or on my second serve. Against a solid open (6.0) player, I can take a game or two if I am playing (serving) really well, but mostly end up losing 0 and 0.
Simon, while unspectacular in his playing style compared to some other pros, is ranked 7th in the world, and chances are he will be a solid 6.0 player or better, playing left handed.
Agreed based on my experience playing against 4.0, 6.0, and former pros. A solid 6.0 player (D1 college player) may take a couple of games if serving big against some pros. 5.5 player? No way.
I want to see Nadal play right handed (his dominant hand) against someone. That would be interesting.
If you are a semi pro or have ever played a pro (current or former), you should know. Every former pro I've hit with could play left handed at my level (5.0) or above. Now, these guys are all retired and in their mid and late 30's who were ranked anywhere from 250 to 800 in the world. Gilles Simon, who was ranked as high as 4 in the world is truly a world class player, who is beaten most of the top pros, including Federer. Need I say more?
I know who's Gilles Simon, he's one of my favorite players with nadal and the djoker.....and fed.
Im 5.0 too, if what you say is true, im very impressed......im shocked.
It's like saying Gilles Simon would beat Serena Williams with his left hand.....wow
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35ft6
Legend
They have that here in LA, too, for the Countrywide Classic. At least they used to. Forget about people with ATP rankings, all these guys you've never heard of come out of hiding to put a beat down on local junior and college studs, and to compete with the top Open guys. People don't realize how many 5.5 and above players there are worldwide. Yes, percentage wise, they make up only a fraction of the people who play tennis, but there are thousands of incredible players out there who could beat 99% of the people on TTW 0 and 0. The top pros are just playing a completely different game. Forget about games, a 5.5 player would be lucky to win points against a top pro.
Exactly, they're not going to try. If Pete Sampras was my friend and we played every day for three years, I'll probably win some games at some point.
A top 100 pro could give you a 40-luv handicap to a 4.5 player and still have a shot at winning 0 and 0. I've played former respectable D-1 college players and their warm up shots were incredibly heavy, can't even imagine what a top 100 pro's warm up shots feel like. Like shots they will never miss because they're putting so little into it, their technique is so superior, their 60% maximum shot is going to feel like a 5.5 player's 90% maximum shot. Much heavier. And they're way more accurate.
And it's been said already, but acing a pro is very different from acing a club player. Those guys read serves way better. It's like saying you might win some points against Lebron James by shooting 3 pointers because you shoot well against your neighbor. Wait until Lebron d's up on you, your shots aren't going anywhere. It's not that quite severe, but just saying, these guys have returned a 1000 times more serves than your partners, they can read serves better, and even if they guess wrong, their bodies move to where it needs to be way quicker. An ace is not an ace in any condition.
Man, I've thought some of the crazy stuff people are posting here but I was like 12. Most of us couldn't beat the top 14 yo, or high school player in the city or area we live in... come on.
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35ft6
Legend
I believe it. In high school, the top singles player in our area played the top kid in the state in a tournament, and the state kid played left handed for a few games and won them all.
I could probably beat a 3.5 and maybe even 4.0 player left handed, or come very close. Their strokes might be better, but my footwork and court coverage is way better.
In my life, I've heard some crazy stories of what pros are capable of doing. Somebody here posted about Luke Jensen playing their top teaching pro with a broom!!! Simone beating a 5.5 left handed, that wouldn't surprise me at all. It's the movement. He would easily get to everything and have plenty of time to hit a left handed shot.
I am not sure if Simon could beat Serena with his left hand. I don't know how good his left hand game is... I do think that there are few guys in the ATP who could beat Serena playing left hand.
That said, Serena will easily beat (even bagel) a 5.5 male player and beat many (if not most) 6.0 players.
Commando Tennis Shorts
Hall of Fame
I don't know. Didn't Martina N get wiped off the court by her 15 year old brother when she was #1 in the world?
I find that hard to believe unless her brother was a top ranked junior looking to get into a pro circuit.
I have also hit with a former WTA pro ranked 80 or so in the world. She hit the ball just as hard as any 5.5 or even 6.0 male players but even more consistent. I ended up losing pretty bad.
Commando Tennis Shorts
Hall of Fame
It was a rhetorical question. Yes, it happened. Now, whether or not Martina was actually trying is a different story
Sarcasm my good friend
Datacipher
Banned
I am suprised by Pmerk's strange assertion. First, to clarify, 130mph is the fastest I have ever been clocked at, but that was one of my exceptional serves, where I wonder what the heck happened (only get these about once a month!!!). GENERALLY, my flat serves are clocked in the teens 113-117 is very common, and the occasional low 120.
Second, I do not believe the "rest" of my game sucks, but in any case, several of my "open" opponents have had consistently bigger first serves. (probably in the 120's fairly regularly). My serve was considered "big", but I'm not terribly tall, so it was not the weapon some guys have. Actually, before I got a bit slower, I always felt my return was a bigger asset.
Finally, I said 5.0+, again...I played open division, usually it was college players, club pros, top juniors, and the occasional fringe satellite player....I'm not really sure what ntrp, you could classify them all at. probably 5.0-6.0. I won more matches than I lost, but not particularly impressive. I never won a "big" open tourney.
Datacipher
Banned
LOL. Funny you say that, the journeymen I hit with could both play around 5.0 level tennis left-handed. An international junior I know of, once one a high school final EASILY playing left-handed for fun. One of those journeymen told me he clocked a 110mph serve lefthanded.
Datacipher
Banned
No. It's true. I certainly couldn't say "all", but one journyman made a general remark to me that "we all could play OK lefthanded..you get bored"...he was referring to himself and other junior peers at the academy he went to...
PS. Also heard of Agassi playing games with a couple of amateurs....one in which he plays you but he doesn't use a racquet. Just catches your shots and throws them, and also playing lefthanded.
drakulie
Talk Tennis Guru
Here is a video of a pro playing one of the posters here on the forum:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YO7SHlXhh4g&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YO7SHlXhh4g&feature=related
P
PERL
Guest
It's very likely to happen indeed. Actually Arnaud Clement played a local tournament with his left hand. His right hand was injured, so he decided to practice his tennis lefthanded, improved quickly and thought it would be good to maintain his footwork playing matches.
He won his two matches 6/1 6/1 and 6/3 6/2. I don’t know much about NRTP levels since I’m not american therefore I couldn’t rate his opponents accurately.
http://www.isegoria.net/2003/02/yahoo-news-novel-way-to-recover-from.htm
Just to summarize,
no we would not even get a game off of a PRO.
Even top D1 players would struggle because they are one trick ponys who rely on a strong forehand or a strong serve to dominate their inconsistent opponents.
Its funny how we watch the pros on TV and we think "well, maybe we can actually take a set off of Santoro"
but good luck with even that.
no we would not even get a game off of a PRO.
Even top D1 players would struggle because they are one trick ponys who rely on a strong forehand or a strong serve to dominate their inconsistent opponents.
Its funny how we watch the pros on TV and we think "well, maybe we can actually take a set off of Santoro"
but good luck with even that.
I generally agree with your point of view, but thats a bad example. That guy looks to be about a 3.0ish player, IMO.
Read the description there said that the bald guy is Murray's fitness trainer.
5.0's look like garbage on video too.
I dont look like garbage on video.
That guy cant even swing the racket. He's off balance, falling over on one shot.
Compared to a pro you look terrible on video. We all do.
i guess i am better off than atleast some people in this forum
i thought only top 5000 pros were ranked
drakulie
Talk Tennis Guru
OK, and your point is????
My point is,,,,, 99% of the posters on this forum would look exactly like that returning Murray's serve.
Maybe not 1st serve, but Murray's 2nd serve is so bad that 1.0 player can return it with ease:twisted:
The video of Rafa warming up was frightening. he pulverizes the ball.
