Best Clay-court match Rafa has played, yet still lost?

[The Green Mile]

Watching Rafa tear it up on clay this year got me thinking. Any thoughts or ideas? You have 34 matches to choose from.

Spoiler: Clay-court losses

2002 Mallorca - Rochus d. Nadal (6-2, 6-2)
2003 Umag - Moya d. Nadal (6-4, 6-4)
2003 Hamburg - Gaudio d. Nadal (6-2, 6-2)
2003 Barcelona - Corettja d. Nadal (3-6, 6-2, 6-1)
2003 Monte Carlo - Coria d. Nadal (7-6, 6-2)
2003 Bastad - Lapentti d. Nadal (3-6, 6-3, 7-6)
2003 Stuttgart - Gonzalez d. Nadal (6-2, 3-6, 6-2)
2004 Palermo - Mutis d. Nadal (6-3, 6-3)
2004 Stuttgart - Ferrer d. Nadal (6-3, 6-7, 7-5)
2004 Bastad - Gaudio d. Nadal (6-2, 6-3)
2005 Buenos Aires - Gaudio d. Nadal (0-6, 6-0, 6-1)
2005 Valencia - Andreev d. Nadal (7-5, 6-2)
2007 Hamburg - Federer d. Nadal (2-6, 6-2, 6-0)
2008 Rome - Ferrero d. Nadal (7-5, 6-1)
2009 Madrid - Federer d. Nadal (6-4, 6-4)
2009 FO - Soderling d. Nadal (6-2, 6-7, 6-4, 7-6)
2011 Madrid - Djokovic d. Nadal (7-5, 6-4)
2011 Rome - Djokovic d. Nadal (6-4, 6-4)
2012 Madrid - Verdasco d. Nadal (6-3, 3-6, 7-5)
2013 Vina del Mar - Zeballos d. Nadal (6-7, 7-6, 6-4)
2013 Monte Carlo - Djokovic d. Nadal (6-2, 7-6)
2014 Monte Carlo - Ferrer d. Nadal (7-6, 6-4)
2014 Barcelona - Almagro d. Nadal (2-6, 7-6, 6-4)
2014 Rome - Djokovic d. Nadal (4-6, 6-3, 6-3)
2015 Rio de Janeiro - Fognini d. Nadal (1-6, 6-2, 7-5)
2015 Monte Carlo - Djokovic d. Nadal (6-3, 6-3)
2015 Barcelona - Fognini d. Nadal (6-3, 7-6)
2015 Madrid - Murray d. Nadal (6-3, 6-2)
2015 Rome - Wawrinka d. Nadal (7-6, 6-2)
2015 FO - Djokovic d. Nadal (7-5, 6-3, 6-1)
2016 Buenos Aires Thiem d. Nadal (6-4 4-6 7-6)
2016 Rio de Janeiro - Cuevas d. Nadal (6-7 7-6 6-3)
2016 Madrid - Murray d. Nadal (7-5 6-4)
2016 Rome - Djokovic d. Nadal (7-5 7-6)

 

[sportmac]

Hasn't been that many to choose from! I'd say Soderling in '09 but Rafa pulled out of W a few weeks later with knee problems so not sure if that impacted his play.

Do you have the 34 handy?

 

[KINGROGER]

07 Hamburg as that was Nadal at his peak.

08 Rome and 09 Madrid too.

 

[The Green Mile]

07 Hamburg as that was Nadal at his peak.

08 Rome and 09 Madrid too.

08 Rome? Rafa was very poor in that match IIRC. Juan played excellent, but Rafa's movement was seriously hindered in that match. Thanks to that blister. I hear Juan was playing with some injury as well, but it wasn't as apparent. My notes have Rafa at 27 UEs in that match.

 

[The Green Mile]

Hasn't been that many to choose from! I'd say Soderling in '09 but Rafa pulled out of W a few weeks later with knee problems so not sure how if that impacted his play.

Do you have the 34 handy?

As in full match footage?

 

[Backspin1183]

And 10 of those losses were before 2005!

 

[Gazelle]

FO 2015 probably. Some prime Nadal right there, but no one could beat Djokovic that year.

 

[sportmac]

As in full match footage?

Yes, however a list would do.

I've found quite a few sites that talk about his losses but none up to date.

 

[The Green Mile]

Yes, however a list would do.

I've found quite a few sites that talk about his losses but none up to date.

The spoiler in my OP has the list.

 

[6-3 6-0]

FO 2015 probably. Some prime Nadal right there, but no one could beat Djokovic that year.

Wawrinka beat him in the final

 

[Backspin1183]

FO 2015 probably. Some prime Nadal right there, but no one could beat Djokovic that year.

True. This was Djokovic at his very best on clay.

 

[Gazelle]

Wawrinka beat him in the final

Shhhh

 

[sportmac]

FO 2015 probably. Some prime Nadal right there, but no one could beat Djokovic that year.

That was a good one. But he's asking for Rafa's best play and still lost. After the second set Nole was in control. I had thought about Fognini in Barcelona but I don't remember the year. I thought that was a good one.

 

[sportmac]

The spoiler in my OP has the list.

I hate it when people hide stuff in plain site.

 

[The Green Mile]

I hate it when people hide stuff in plain site.

Sorry

 

[Feather]

07 Hamburg as that was Nadal at his peak.

08 Rome and 09 Madrid too.

Have some perspective. Rafa played a 4 hours match against Djokovic and the very next day he played against Roger. It's ridiculous to claim that Madrid 09 is one of the best matches Rafa played and still lost would be an understatement

And in 08 Rome he had foot blisters

 

[tennis_pro]

2011 Madrid/Rome or 2016 Rome - those are 3 matches that he played well and still lost.

 

[Krish872007]

Madrid 2011

 

[Tatenda]

there is absolutely no way to determine that .
it just can't be done , because the fact that he lost tells u everything

now u basically asking which of his loses where he particularly
" not that bad"


I have seen him play a remotely good set and still lose them e.g Monte Carlo 2013 2nd set(minus the tiebreaker)
vs Novak

but even then you can't say that he played better there than he did at Hamburg 07

 

[The Green Mile]

now u basically asking which of his loses where he particularly
" not that bad"

Different wording, but that's what I'm still really still asking for, or wanting to find out anyway.

On hard-court you have a match like Doha 2010 vs Davydenko, Rafa played brilliant tennis yet still came out 2nd best. I just want to find the clay version of this.

It's all subjective I know. Just curious as to what people say.

 

[InsideOut900]

Rome 2011 for me; pretty much the only time when Nadal played at prime level and lost.
Nadal also lost in straights with both sets being routine, which was a very impressive win for Djokovic.

RG 2009, Madrid 2009/2011 and Rome 2014/2016, MC 2013 are all at a similar level, so it is hard to say which would be the 2nd.

Rome 2006 and Madrid 2009 SF would have been top choices, but we all know how they turned out.

 

[Deleted member 716271]

Madrid 2011

 

[AnOctorokForDinner]

Clearly Rome 11. The only clay match where Nadal was playing totally 100% from start to finish, no prolonged blips, yet lost - in straights. Djokovic's best non-major win over Nadal, I say.

 

[NatF]

Madrid or Rome in 2011.

 

[TheMusicLover]

Madrid or Rome in 2011.

And yet another vote for these options.

Funny though: Rome 2006 would have gotten my vote if Rafa had lost that one, but it actually still gets my vote for his best ever level of tennis when ending up winning.

 

[Deleted member 716271]

Clearly Rome 11. The only clay match where Nadal was playing totally 100% from start to finish, no prolonged blips, yet lost - in straights. Djokovic's best non-major win over Nadal, I say.

Rome was one of NDs best. I think He played the same in Madrid just not as glistening highligts but Nads was a tad better there in Madrid than in Rome imo. Before that match he hadnt lost ever to Novak on clay. After losing the first 4 games he seemed poised to win the set then lost it 7-5. In Rome Nads collapsed mentally a tad whereas in Madrid he expected to win and just couldnt get it done.

 

[NatF]

And yet another vote for these options.

Funny though: Rome 2006 would have gotten my vote if Rafa had lost that one, but it actually still gets my vote for his best ever level of tennis when ending up winning.

That sounds like a novel thread title

But yeah if Roger took Rome in 2006 it would have been clearly that match, as it stands it might just be the best match Federer played and lost.

 

[Deleted member 716271]

That sounds like a novel thread title

But yeah if Roger took Rome in 2006 it would have been clearly that match, as it stands it might just be the best match Federer played and lost.

That or AO 05 semi?

 

[NatF]

That or AO 05 semi?

Those 2 were the first ones I thought of.

 

[TheMusicLover]

That sounds like a novel thread title

But yeah if Roger took Rome in 2006 it would have been clearly that match, as it stands it might just be the best match Federer played and lost.

Absolutely, imho.

 

[Nadalgaenger]

That sounds like a novel thread title

But yeah if Roger took Rome in 2006 it would have been clearly that match, as it stands it might just be the best match Federer played and lost.

That Rome 2006 is the best clay court tennis on both sides of the net that I've ever seen. Gorgeous stuff. Both guys were firing on all cylinders.

 

[Nadalgaenger]

Madrid 2011

Agree. Nadal looked very strong in the first set but was actually outmuscled by Djesus/Djokovic 2.0. This is where it started to become obvious that Nadal had doubts against Ultron, doubts that he only really exorcized in 2013 and once again last week!

 

[Steve0904]

I'd say Rome 2011 simply because the conditions suit Nadal even more in Rome than they do in Madrid, but as others have said it's one of those two.

 

[TheMaestro1990]

Rome 11 for me. Nadal was outstanding. Djokovic was just better back then.

 

[vanioMan]

Rome 2011.

 

[Sysyphus]

Roland Garros 2013 semi final


Sincerely,
Chico

 

[Mazz Retic]

One of the clay matches in 2011.

Also Madrid 09

 

[KINGROGER]

Ok take away the 08-09 matches. My vote then goes to 07 Hamburg.

Nadal at his very best but Federer was better and upped his level to god mode.

 

[papertank]

Madrid and Rome in 2011.

 

[Nadal_Django]

2011 Madrid and Rome

 

[Phoenix1983]

When I play well on clay, I am unbeatable, no?

 

[malbaker86]

2011 Madrid/Rome or 2016 Rome - those are 3 matches that he played well and still lost.

This and Rome 2014

 

[guitarra]

Soderling 2009. The only man to down prime Nadal in Paris. Rafa always upped his game for French Open. Despite that Robin just hit through him on that special day - once in a lifetime performance. Also - that was the biggest upset of all time.

 

[2HBH-DTL]

I'd have to say Soderling as well. Nadal should have never went down that year at the French. One of the biggest losses of his career for nadal.

 

[TheAssassin]

One of his three Rome losses to Djokovic.

That Rome 2006 is the best clay court tennis on both sides of the net that I've ever seen. Gorgeous stuff. Both guys were firing on all cylinders.

2005 Rome final was spectacular as well.

 

[Steve0904]

Roland Garros 2013 semi final


Sincerely,
Chico

I wonder now that Djokovic has won RG how bitter Chico is over that particular match today? Interesting thought.

 

[ibbi]

2011 Madrid/Rome or 2016 Rome - those are 3 matches that he played well and still lost.

Rome 2011 has to be in the running for worst match he's ever played :| at one point he was so lost he started hitting actual legit moonballs.

 

[tennis_pro]

Rome 2011 has to be in the running for worst match he's ever played :| at one point he was so lost he started hitting actual legit moonballs.

You are kidding, right? It wasn't even close to 2015 Madrid when he was hitting forehands in the middle of the net. The reason he was hitting moonballs was because he couldn't keep up with Djokovic from the baseline so he was trying something else.

Djokovic was on a different planet in 2011.

 

[Backspin1183]

Agree. Nadal looked very strong in the first set but was actually outmuscled by Djesus/Djokovic 2.0. This is where it started to become obvious that Nadal had doubts against Ultron, doubts that he only really exorcized in 2013 and once again last week!

In 2012. Nadal beat him 3 times on the dirt losing just 1 set.

 

[ibbi]

You are kidding, right? It wasn't even close to 2015 Madrid when he was hitting forehands in the middle of the net. The reason he was hitting moonballs was because he couldn't keep up with Djokovic from the baseline so he was trying something else.

Djokovic was on a different planet in 2011.

No, I'm not kidding. That match in Rome in 2011 was awful. At no point did it ever look like he had a prayer against a guy who had played 3 weeks in a row, had played the epic semi final the night before, and looked absolutely gassed. I'm obviously being over the top claiming it's the worst match he's ever played, but among the significant ones it's definitely one of his most hopeless efforts.