Best poly to hybrid with natural gut for spin?

[Bucko]

Hello all,
I'm trying to solve my Tennis elbow issue and am about to venture into the world of Klip Natural Gut in the mains. Klip is my price point, so advice on the coated / uncoated would be appreciated too.

My fear is my game will suffer as I'm used to playing with Cyclone 16g, a dead / spin friendly poly. As a frame of reference, I even found Cyclone Tour to have way too much power for my liking.

So what I'm looking for is a dead, spin monster poly to hybrid in the crosses to help tame the power of the natural gut in the mains. Is Cyclone good enough, or is there something better people would recommend?

As a first time Gut user, I'm guessing I want to string it tight to tame the power. My racquet max recommendation is 58 lbs, so guessing this is where I should string the mains. Regarding the crosses, my usual poly set up is 52lbs. Any recommendations on what to tension the poly in a hybrid?

Appreciate all advice

 

[TagUrIt]

I can only speak to my own experience with hybriding gut/poly. I use Luxilon Natural Gut in the mains 58lbs and Luxilon Savage in the crosses 55lbs. I prefer Luxilon it’s a really good quality string. You truly get what you pay for. I’ve always liked shaped polys to hybrid with natural gut. I had Tourna Big Hitter Blue Rough previously, but Luxilon Savage is SAVAGE! There is a concern that the sharp edges could cause issues, but have yet to experience any.

What Klip says about their string:

Legend uncoated gut offers exceptional feel and ball bite but is not as durable as coated gut. Honestly I’m not sure how this could affect playability in a poly hybrid. I’m sure someone has experience with Klip and can weigh in.

 

[Bucko]

I can only speak to my own experience with hybriding gut/poly. I use Luxilon Natural Gut in the mains 58lbs and Luxilon Savage in the crosses 55lbs. I prefer Luxilon it’s a really good quality string. You truly get what you pay for. I’ve always liked shaped polys to hybrid with natural gut. I had Tourna Big Hitter Blue Rough previously, but Luxilon Savage is SAVAGE! There is a concern that the sharp edges could cause issues, but have yet to experience any.

What Klip says about their string:

Legend uncoated gut offers exceptional feel and ball bite but is not as durable as coated gut. Honestly I’m not sure how this could affect playability in a poly hybrid. I’m sure someone has experience with Klip and can weigh in.

Thank you. How does the spin compare to a full poly set up?

 

[Yoneyama]

Kirschbaum Max Power. It is a very low-powered poly, slick and round, and has excellent tension maintenance - way above average for a poly. Your gut/poly stringbed will last a long time with this setup. String the gut 60-62lb and the poly 54-58lb depending on how much power you want to take out of it.

 

[Bucko]

Kirschbaum Max Power. It is a very low-powered poly, slick and round, and has excellent tension maintenance - way above average for a poly. Your gut/poly stringbed will last a long time with this setup. String the gut 60-62lb and the poly 54-58lb depending on how much power you want to take out of it.

Thank you. Low powered sounds good to reduce the power of the gut.

How's the spin compare to full poly?

 

[TagUrIt]

Thank you. How does the spin compare to a full poly set up?

I personally feel you get more longevity out of the strings. So much more control, the natural gut balances the power of the string bed.

 

[nwatts]

I agree max power is a fantastic cross string. Highest marks for control. Spin is very good, but I think msv cofocus gives more spin and power (less control though).

 

[Bucko]

I agree max power is a fantastic cross string. Highest marks for control. Spin is very good, but I think msv cofocus gives more spin and power (less control though).

I want less power, more spin. Thank you

 

[blai212]

I want less power, more spin. Thank you

you’re probably better off using a softer poly like tourna silver 7 tour 17g. While gut/poly is soft, u wont get anywhere near the kind of bite/spin as u would from a spin monster poly like cyclone. If you thought cyclone tour was much too soft, u probably wont enjoy gut/poly. I have had arm problems as well and if u still crave the spin from sharp shaped poly, tourna silver 7 tour 17g mains / signum pro poly plasma pure hextreme 17L crosses is the answer.


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[Yoneyama]

Thank you. Low powered sounds good to reduce the power of the gut.

How's the spin compare to full poly?

I feel like I get more spin and control with gut/poly as long as the tension is correct for the racquet - for me that is the higher tension ranges. One time a couple of years ago when I first got into gut/poly I tried 50lb/44lb with a softer poly cross. It was a spin monster but you had to swing ultra fast to keep the control.

 

[landcookie]

I feel like I get more spin and control with gut/poly as long as the tension is correct for the racquet - for me that is the higher tension ranges.

100% agree with this statement. Recently switched to gut/poly and loving it. Klip Legend 1.30 mains and 1.25 YPT Fire cross. Going to try MP next.

The spin from gut/poly feels very different to a full poly setup. Gut/poly plays a lot more effortless, and full swings have more pace with enough spin to keep it in. No problems creating short angles. Serves are phenomenal.

 

[Brand77]

I used babolats vs in combination with several types of round poly while I had TE. The only thing where I really missed the full poly bed was for slice service. All other shots adjusted within a couple of weeks.
Only when I get tired and more sloppy with my strokes do the balls sail long. And the loss of a little spin is a small price for the amount of comfort the gut brings.

I also tried a full bed of guy recently but my technique isn't capable of dealing with that amount of power.....yet

 

[nwatts]

I want less power, more spin. Thank you

It will be tough to beat max power then. The only other similar recommendation I have is RS Lyon

 

[Bucko]

Appreciate the responses.

 

[tonylg]

What racquet are you using?

I actually use the uncoated Klip gut and love it, but my game isn't so dependent on spin.

Having tried a few dozen polys, I generally use Isospeed Cream. That's a great combo if you want to fix your arm. If you can't control the power, get a lower powered racquet.

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[Bucko]

What racquet are you using?

I actually use the uncoated Klip gut and love it, but my game isn't so dependent on spin.

Having tried a few dozen polys, I generally use Isospeed Cream. That's a great combo if you want to fix your arm. If you can't control the power, get a lower powered racquet.

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I use the Prince Tour 100. I've used Cream before but don't like the spin potential to be honest. I'm hoping the soft gut in the mains will allow me to use a harsher poly cross so a softer Poly like Cream won't be needed.

Interestingly enough, cyclone tour is measured as softer than cream in the TW string stiffness tool.

I've continued to use my full bed Cyclone Tour set up while I wait for the Klip to arrive and I've adjusted well to it, and am playing good tennis with it now. Hoping the more powerful string set up will make adjusting to the gut hybrid a little easier

 

[tonylg]

I use the Prince Tour 100. I've used Cream before but don't like the spin potential to be honest. I'm hoping the soft gut in the mains will allow me to use a harsher poly cross so a softer Poly like Cream won't be needed.

Interestingly enough, cyclone tour is measured as softer than cream in the TW string stiffness tool.

I've continued to use my full bed Cyclone Tour set up while I wait for the Klip to arrive and I've adjusted well to it, and am playing good tennis with it now. Hoping the more powerful string set up will make adjusting to the gut hybrid a little easier

A mate of mine uses the black and orange version with ports. I've never loved ports, but have to admit it really feels like a great racquet. It certainly didn't feel harsh.

Bottom line is, you've got an injured arm using stiff poly. Whatever you choose, err on the side of being too soft rather than not soft enough. Playing is always better than not playing.

 

[landcookie]

It will be tough to beat max power then. The only other similar recommendation I have is RS Lyon

How does RS 1.25 compare to MP or YPTF 1.25 as a cross? I've thought about trying RS as a cross initially but the price tag put me off a little

 

[nwatts]

I've never used PTF, but have used PTP and really like it (except for muted response of string). I can compare MP and RS Lyon though when used as a cross string (NG mains). I've used both strings during playsight data, so I can compare the results fairly accurately.

RS has slightly more power (I get an extra 3 mph)
MP has slightly more control
Spin is about equal (playsight data says my avg forehand is around 1800 rpm with both)
RS shines with its touch/feel/net play.

 

[esgee48]

The best polyester strings are those that have been factory pre stretched. They maintain tension the best, are muted and low powered. This will help tone down the power of the NG. YMMV depending on ref tension. They should be round to minimize cutting into NG. In my book, that means the 18 or 17 Ga stuff from KB ProLine II, Lux 4G or SPPP.

 

[nwatts]

The best polyester strings are those that have been factory pre stretched. They maintain tension the best, are muted and low powered. This will help tone down the power of the NG. YMMV depending on ref tension. They should be round to minimize cutting into NG. In my book, that means the 18 or 17 Ga stuff from KB ProLine II, Lux 4G or SPPP.

I agree those are all solid choices. For some reason, my control suffers a bit with proline II though. touch and feel are amazing with Proline II for a poly.

 

[fuzz nation]

Hello all,
I'm trying to solve my Tennis elbow issue and am about to venture into the world of Klip Natural Gut in the mains. Klip is my price point, so advice on the coated / uncoated would be appreciated too.

My fear is my game will suffer as I'm used to playing with Cyclone 16g, a dead / spin friendly poly. As a frame of reference, I even found Cyclone Tour to have way too much power for my liking.

So what I'm looking for is a dead, spin monster poly to hybrid in the crosses to help tame the power of the natural gut in the mains. Is Cyclone good enough, or is there something better people would recommend?

As a first time Gut user, I'm guessing I want to string it tight to tame the power. My racquet max recommendation is 58 lbs, so guessing this is where I should string the mains. Regarding the crosses, my usual poly set up is 52lbs. Any recommendations on what to tension the poly in a hybrid?

Appreciate all advice

Strongly agree with our pal tonylg in post #17. If you've got tennis elbow going on, dump the poly completely at least until you get back to 100%. Keeping a poly cross would still leave you with a half-bed of poly. Make a more substantial move to a softer string layout - maybe a full bed of natural gut - for the short term and you'll have better odds of making some progress.

I haven't strung any hybrids of natural gut/poly for the local players I know, but the guy I work with in the summers likes to use a hybrid of NXT mains and Luxilon Element crosses. I believe he tensions that combo at around 56 or 57 lbs. in the Clash Tour. If you eventually use a soft main and a poly cross, I think that Element could be an option. Based on what I've heard from a few stronger players I know who use that poly, it does offer a softer alternative to many of the more firm polys (and co-polys) around these days.

 

[Bucko]

Strongly agree with our pal tonylg in post #17. If you've got tennis elbow going on, dump the poly completely at least until you get back to 100%. Keeping a poly cross would still leave you with a half-bed of poly. Make a more substantial move to a softer string layout - maybe a full bed of natural gut - for the short term and you'll have better odds of making some progress.

I haven't strung any hybrids of natural gut/poly for the local players I know, but the guy I work with in the summers likes to use a hybrid of NXT mains and Luxilon Element crosses. I believe he tensions that combo at around 56 or 57 lbs. in the Clash Tour. If you eventually use a soft main and a poly cross, I think that Element could be an option. Based on what I've heard from a few stronger players I know who use that poly, it does offer a softer alternative to many of the more firm polys (and co-polys) around these days.

Element is a harsher poly in my experience, and on the TW stiffness rating.

I understand your point about dumping poly all together. I tried it. And hated tennis. My game suffered. So I'm trying to compromise to the softest set up where I still play decent tennis, and manage the TE through frequency of play.

Appreciate the input

 

[nwatts]

Max power and rs Lyon can be tough on the arm. I think yonex poly pro tour would be a great compromise. It is good in all categories, and has above average comfort. This is what I use as a cross when max power or rs Lyon bothers my arm.

 

[tonylg]

I understand your point about dumping poly all together. I tried it. And hated tennis. My game suffered.

I wasn't saying you had to dump poly, just err on the side of being too soft.

However, you hated tennis? I can play with the crappiest syn gut and still love tennis. Notwithstanding my first sentence, you may actually find that playing without poly allows you to work on parts of your game that are weak and you come back a better player.

If you don't want to pay for gut, there are some crazy soft multis out there. MSV Q10 is like hitting with a pillow.

I hope you get it sorted quickly. My wrist problem is permanent, but it sounds like if you treated your elbow well now, you should come back to 100%. All I'm suggesting is that treat it really well, rather than have it drag on for months or maybe years.

 

[Bucko]

I wasn't saying you had to dump poly, just err on the side of being too soft.

However, you hated tennis? I can play with the crappiest syn gut and still love tennis. Notwithstanding my first sentence, you may actually find that playing without poly allows you to work on parts of your game that are weak and you come back a better player.

If you don't want to pay for gut, there are some crazy soft multis out there. MSV Q10 is like hitting with a pillow.

I hope you get it sorted quickly. My wrist problem is permanent, but it sounds like if you treated your elbow well now, you should come back to 100%. All I'm suggesting is that treat it really well, rather than have it drag on for months or maybe years.

I am happy to pay for gut. I just want to find the softest set up I can play good tennis with

 

[esgee48]

If you have to dump poly crosses, look at Bab Spiral Tek [synthetic gut] and Head Velocity or FXP. All 3 strings are soft, low powered and slippery. Get the white or natural as the non-white ones stretch more.

 

[Bucko]

If you have to dump poly crosses, look at Bab Spiral Tek [synthetic gut] and Head Velocity or FXP. All 3 strings are soft, low powered and slippery. Get the white or natural as the non-white ones stretch more.

How are they for spin?

 

[esgee48]

All 3 strings have low COF, which means the NG will side on them without any issues. One is an SG and the 2 Head strings are multis with a slippery coating. There is a Velocity thread headed by @ByeByePoly and he will try to convert you. I have used SpiralTek and FXP. They are too muted for me, but they can produce spin easily enough in full bed. They also slide back into position like polys for 12-16 hours.

 

[Taveren]

@Bucko you will never get the same spin and ball grab as full poly when using Nat Gut/poly hybrid. You will need to work for it to achieve similar levels of spin potential. Early prep, low to high, bend knees, accelerate rhs etc.

What you get is more comfort, feel, better tension maintenance and snap back from the poly cross.

 

[Bucko]

@Bucko you will never get the same spin and ball grab as full poly when using Nat Gut/poly hybrid. You will need to work for it to achieve similar levels of spin potential. Early prep, low to high, bend knees, accelerate rhs etc.

What you get is more comfort, feel, better tension maintenance and snap back from the poly cross.

Understood. Just searching for the set up to produce the most spin with Gut/Poly

 

[Taveren]

Understood. Just searching for the set up to produce the most spin with Gut/Poly

My string of choice to hybrid with Nat Gut is Isospeed Black Fire, slick and low powered string with good tension maintenance. Allows the Nat Gut to slide and snap back while reigning in the power. But of course YMMV

 

[Addxyz]

How does RS 1.25 compare to MP or YPTF 1.25 as a cross? I've thought about trying RS as a cross initially but the price tag put me off a little

RS is like $1 cheaper than YPTF...

 

[landcookie]

RS is like $1 cheaper than YPTF...

Here in Australia the RS reel is $50 more than yptf.

 

[blai212]

@Bucko if u want great spin, go thin on the poly cross...17L SPPP is my preferred choice...the thinner gauge helps create notching in the gut mains faster but this actually helps promote snapback action. Less durability but more spin. Also, less surface area of the cross string rubbing against the gut mains which means less friction -> better snapback.


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[Rally]

I really like Wilson Revolve 16L with a prestretch (the prestretch is very important) as my cross string. I put 16g gut in the mains at 59 lbs and the Revolve at 56 lbs in my RF97 and 49 lbs for the gut and 46 lbs for the poly in my Pro Staff 90. I get really good tension maintenance after the prestretch on the Revolve and really good performance.

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[Big4]

I recently got a pack of Wilson Natural Gut 16 as a sort of early Christmas gift. I normally play with full bed of BBO, but I was thinking of trying a hybrid because it gets pretty cold where I live in the winter and would like to try a more powerful setup. I have a reel of BBO so I was just planning on putting it in the crosses with the gut in the mains. Would you all say that BBO would be fine as a cross in the hybrid?

 

[speedysteve]

Try Wilson Revolve crosses (Orange) [emoji6]

 

[Bucko]

I am a gut mains poly cross convert now. The TE has improved massively. I've been using Klip mains with Cyclone crosses, the shaped cross obviously reduces the life of the gut.

My next trial will be Klip Coated mains @ 56# with Tourna Black Zone cross @ 52#.

A shame we can't get BZ in Australia, but I have a packet left so going to try it. The slickness should help snap back on the mains and spin, and delay gut breakage.

Anyone run a Klip / BZ hybrid?

 

[blai212]

+1 on revolve cross
Also, if you want a comfortable setup but feel like gut/poly is lacking in bite, try VCT 16g mains at 12-15% lower tension than gut. It feels softer than gut for me and still has spin and durability of poly.


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[brooksgbanks]

Tourna Black Zone is one of my favorite crosses with gut (YTex Square X is also quite good). I've been using Klip Legend Uncoated with TBZ in my competition racquets, and notice only a little loss of spin compared to VCT 16 / ZXPro 17 hybrid, but the comfort level is better and the control (since I string the gut at 57 and TBZ at 54, it's a crisper response to me) with directing shots means I'm still able to hit my spots. Personally, I prefer Uncoated to Coated for the Legend, as I think it's just a tad bit grippier than coated, giving just a bit more spin. Lux NG and TBZ combo is also really nice (slightly more easy power at same tensions, slightly less feel).

 

[Bucko]

Tourna Black Zone is one of my favorite crosses with gut (YTex Square X is also quite good). I've been using Klip Legend Uncoated with TBZ in my competition racquets, and notice only a little loss of spin compared to VCT 16 / ZXPro 17 hybrid, but the comfort level is better and the control (since I string the gut at 57 and TBZ at 54, it's a crisper response to me) with directing shots means I'm still able to hit my spots. Personally, I prefer Uncoated to Coated for the Legend, as I think it's just a tad bit grippier than coated, giving just a bit more spin. Lux NG and TBZ combo is also really nice (slightly more easy power at same tensions, slightly less feel).

I tried both coated and uncoated Klip. Pretty similar for me. The differences didn't require any major adjustments.

Looking forward to trying it with BZ

 

[Bucko]

+1 on revolve cross
Also, if you want a comfortable setup but feel like gut/poly is lacking in bite, try VCT 16g mains at 12-15% lower tension than gut. It feels softer than gut for me and still has spin and durability of poly.


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Loving the gut mains - and so is my elbow!

 

[JustTennis76]

I am using Babolat VS Touch with Prince Tour XC 16L crosses, it's round and very slick, I can forget stringing for 3 months if I have 2 rackets rotating with this setup.

 

[Ramjet]

Am enjoying signum pro poly plasma (sppp) as cross with klip legend mains. 52 for the klip and 48 for the sppp. Nice soft feel with decent spin and controllable power. Stays playable for a very long time (maybe 15+ hours).

 

[jmacdaununder2]

Sounds good; what head size and string pattern are you using?

 

[Ramjet]

Sounds good; what head size and string pattern are you using?

I'm using that setup in a Pure Strike Gen 3 16x19 which is 98inch

 

[cortado]

I had VCore HD 18x20 with 16gut mains, 17 yonex poly tour pro yellow crosses. This seemed to work very well.
Looking at tennis warehouse string comparison tool, the poly tour pro is not the stiffest poly and doesn't have the best tension maintenance, so in future I might try poly tour strike or Head Hawk.