Best Strokes in the World Tour Finals

[President]

Basically I want to see how people rank the players in the World Tour Finals on each stroke. I think it should be based off their recent form, so for example Del Potro's forehand is ordinarily great but right now...not so much. I'll go first.

Serve (1st and 2nd):

1. Federer
2. Soderling
3. Djokovic
4. Verdasco
5.Davydenko
6. Del Potro
7. Murray
8. Nadal

Forehand

1. Djokovic (Ordinarily not his main weapon I know, but many of these guys are just in bad form atm)
2. Soderling
3. Davydenko
4. Federer (it was just disgusting to watch in the Basel final, but I have faith it may just be lurking)
5. Verdasco
6. Del Potro
7. Nadal
8. Murray

Backhand

1. Djokovic
2. Murray
3. Davydenko
4. Nadal
5. Soderling
6. Federer (like the forehand...is just bad atm)
7. Verdasco
8. Del Potro (I think it just plain sucks right now)

Movement:

1. Federer
2. Nadal
3. Murray
4. Djokovic
5. Davydenko
6. Verdasco
7. Del Potro
8. Soderling

I don't really feel volleys are much of a factor with this group of players, but I would put Federer Nadal and Djokovic near the top.

Your thoughts?

 

[TheMagicianOfPrecision]

Forehand, Djokovic`s??? Are you serious???
Federer, Verdasco, Soderling all have better forehand than Djokovic.

 

[President]

Forehand, Djokovic`s??? Are you serious???
Federer, Verdasco, Soderling all have better forehand than Djokovic.

Federer's forehand is an UEmachine right now. Honestly, I feel I should have ranked it lower. It's definitely not the best in the top 8 ATM. Ordinarily, I would agree its easily the best in the world (and history), but Federer has not been playing at his usual level.

On the other hand, Djokovic's forehand has been the most solid over the past few weeks. It's not his main weapon, but its always been solid and hasn't broken down lately unlike the others on this list.

 

[dropshot winner]

It's difficult to rate those strokes, it depends on the form of the day of each player.

But Davydenko's serve is definately rated too high, it's worse than Del Potro's and Murray's.

 

[mtr1]

Forehand, Djokovic`s??? Are you serious???
Federer, Verdasco, Soderling all have better forehand than Djokovic.

He said on based on current form. Djokovic's forehand was devastating against Nadal in Paris. Federer, well he lost to Bennateau, proof enough that his forehand isn't "on" at the moment.

 

[President]

It's difficult to rate those strokes, it depends on the form of the day of each player.

But Davydenko's serve is definately rated too high, it's worse than Del Potro's and Murray's.

Del Potro is in really bad form right now, and despite the obvious superiority of Murray's 1st serve (when its on at least), his second serve is a huge liability which Davydenko does not have.

 

[TheMagicianOfPrecision]

Federer's forehand is an UEmachine right now. Honestly, I feel I should have ranked it lower. It's definitely not the best in the top 8 ATM. Ordinarily, I would agree its easily the best in the world (and history), but Federer has not been playing at his usual level.

On the other hand, Djokovic's forehand has been the most solid over the past few weeks. It's not his main weapon, but its always been solid and hasn't broken down lately unlike the others on this list.

Oh...so this list is based on...last 2-3 weeks?

 

[President]

Oh...so this list is based on...last 2-3 weeks?

Yeah..I said current form. If it was a career on the whole thing, I assure you the list would look much different

 

[Blinkism]

Forehand, Djokovic`s??? Are you serious???
Federer, Verdasco, Soderling all have better forehand than Djokovic.

I think he means at the moment- so based on form from the last little while.

In which case, I'd agree.

EDIT: whoops, didn't see the above posts.

Anyhow, I think you need to bump Murray down the movement list- he was sluggish even in winning Valencia.

 

[TheMagicianOfPrecision]

Yeah..I said current form. If it was a career on the whole thing, I assure you the list would look much different

Oh ok sorry I didnt see that, read through it to fast, well yes then i agree on that list i guess...
Lets do another one after the YEC, shall we?

 

[President]

Oh ok sorry I didnt see that, read through it to fast, well yes then i agree on that list i guess...
Lets do another one after the YEC, shall we?

I have a feeling Federer is not going to do well at all this year in YEC, his last matches have been quite bad (well Benneteau wasn't too awful, but Basel was some of the worst tennis I have seen from any player for a while). Hopefully he will surprise me

 

[dropshot winner]

Del Potro is in really bad form right now, and despite the obvious superiority of Murray's 1st serve (when its on at least), his second serve is a huge liability which Davydenko does not have.

I haven't seen Del Potro's last matches, is he really serving that bad?

I agree about Murray's 2nd serve, it's attackable, but his 1st serve is devastating compared to Davydenko's.
Even on a average serving day I'd give Murray the slight edge.

 

[mtr1]

I think Murray's serve and movement should be higher. Nadal is not as quick as Murray since his return, and Murray has been serving quite well of late.

 

[TheMagicianOfPrecision]

I have a feeling Federer is not going to do well at all this year in YEC, his last matches have been quite bad (well Benneteau wasn't too awful, but Basel was some of the worst tennis I have seen from any player for a while). Hopefully he will surprise me

"Save the best for last"-As Vanessa Williams sang, i just read from Magnus Normans blog (Robin Soderlings coach) that Federer looked very sharp and focused on todays practice.

 

[jrod]

"Save the best for last"-As Vanessa Williams sang, i just read from Magnus Normans blog (Robin Soderlings coach) that Federer looked very sharp and focused on todays practice.

Right. If I'm Soderlings coach thats EXACTLY what I want him to hear.

Seriously, I've been watching the older Fed stuff on Tennis Channel and while I know Fed thinks he is playing better these days, my feeling is he is not playing at the same level he was back then. I mean, even though he lost the match to Nalby, he was still hitting shots that he would either not get to today or simply miss.

The other thing I sense that is different is his belief. In those older matches you can see there is a calm, focused confidence, like a cat waiting to pounce on it's prey. These days what I see is fear and disbelief creeping in. I really miss the old Fed.

 

[Lsmkenpo]

Hard to judge current form, because the mental part of the equation is being overlooked in the rankings, some of these players had more at stake in the last few tournaments than others.

With the Wourld Tour Finals looming you cannot expect maximum effort from some of the top players who had already qualified, I am sure Federer and Nadal were not exactly distraught over losing in these last few tourneys.

I am certain we will see a magical return to form for them, at the tour finals.

 

[TheMagicianOfPrecision]

Right. If I'm Soderlings coach thats EXACTLY what I want him to hear.

Seriously, I've been watching the older Fed stuff on Tennis Channel and while I know Fed thinks he is playing better these days, my feeling is he is not playing at the same level he was back then. I mean, even though he lost the match to Nalby, he was still hitting shots that he would either not get to today or simply miss.

The other thing I sense that is different is his belief. In those older matches you can see there is a calm, focused confidence, like a cat waiting to pounce on it's prey. These days what I see is fear and disbelief creeping in. I really miss the old Fed.

Yeah, its a sad thing that he is past his very best, his prime, but sometimes he still looks like the player of 2005-2007, after all he is still no1 in the world at 28 years old and reached all 4 GS-finals.

 

[JoelDali]

Fail thread.

 

[jrod]

Yeah, its a sad thing that he is past his very best, his prime, but sometimes he still looks like the player of 2005-2007, after all he is still no1 in the world at 28 years old and reached all 4 GS-finals.

Right, which brings up a question. Are any of these matchups the best of 5 sets?

Fed does better in best of 5 sets. I thought the final was the best of 5 but I'm not sure any more....

 

[President]

Right, which brings up a question. Are any of these matchups the best of 5 sets?

Fed does better in best of 5 sets. I thought the final was the best of 5 but I'm not sure any more....

I believe they are best of 3 sets. Obviously this is a hindrance to Federer as he seems to need a lot of time to get his act together these days

 

[President of Serve/Volley]

Best Ball Striker: Davydenko.

 

[President]

Best Ball Striker: Davydenko.

Why should this be a category? He may be the cleanest striker of the ball but his forehand and backhand are clearly not the most effective.

 

[President of Serve/Volley]

Why should this be a category? He may be the cleanest striker of the ball but his forehand and backhand are clearly not the most effective.

Mr. President, it should be a catagory, at least when considering their forehand and backhand strokes are determined by their quality of the strike.


Take Federer, Federer's backhand isn't as clean as he used to hit it...

 

[cesarmo03]

Serve (1st and 2nd):

1. Federer
2. Soderling
3. Murray
4. Djokovic
5. Davydenko
6. Verdasco
7. Del potro
8. Nadal

Forehand

1. Verdasco
2. Soderling
3. Federer
4. Djokovic
5. Nadal
6. Davydenko
7. Del Potro
8. Murray

Backhand

1. Davydenko
2. Djokovic
3. Murray
4. Nadal
5. Soderling
6. Federer (like the forehand...is just bad atm)
7. Verdasco
8. Del Potro (I think it just plain sucks right now)

Movement:

1. Federer
2. Nadal
3. Davydenko
4. Murray
5. Djokovic
6. Verdasco
7. Del Potro
8. Soderling

 

[kishnabe]

No way is Federer moving aswell as Nadal, Djokovic and Murray. In terms of footwork for shot setup he is still up there, but defensively I think the other 3 are more willing to chase balls down.

Also Djokovic even when in top form, does not possess the forehand shotmaking of a Federer.

I disagree about Djokovich's shot making in forehand. I mean he can reach close to Federer forehand potency, watch 2007 Montreal Djokovich vs Federer. Clear Example.

 

[Deleted member 25923]

Right. If I'm Soderlings coach thats EXACTLY what I want him to hear.

Seriously, I've been watching the older Fed stuff on Tennis Channel and while I know Fed thinks he is playing better these days, my feeling is he is not playing at the same level he was back then. I mean, even though he lost the match to Nalby, he was still hitting shots that he would either not get to today or simply miss.

The other thing I sense that is different is his belief. In those older matches you can see there is a calm, focused confidence, like a cat waiting to pounce on it's prey. These days what I see is fear and disbelief creeping in. I really miss the old Fed.

Exactly my thoughts. He was hitting sick shots in that LOSS! That match could've easily been his, and Nalby was playing great.

That's why I downloaded the 05 Miami Final. To see the old Fed again. Were there any other great showdowns during Fed's prime (preferably a win )

 

[Anaconda]

Everything about this thread is wrong. Guys like soderling and del potro have the best serves. Federer has the best forehand any day of the week.

FAIL THREAD!!!!

 

[Agassifan]

but Basel was some of the worst tennis I have seen from any player for a while

exaggerate much?

 

[jrod]

Everything about this thread is wrong. Guys like soderling and del potro have the best serves. Federer has the best forehand any day of the week.

FAIL THREAD!!!!

Speaking of EPIC FAIL...how can anyone conclude Soderling and DelPo have better serves than Federer? This is certainly not supported by any results. When the OP refers to the serve I assume he is talking about how effective the player is with their service game and not some irrelevant stat like biggest kick or fastest or prettiest.

 

[President]

Speaking of EPIC FAIL...how can anyone conclude Soderling and DelPo have better serves than Federer? This is certainly not supported by any results. When the OP refers to the serve I assume he is talking about how effective the player is with their service game and not some irrelevant stat like biggest kick or fastest or prettiest.

More than that, I am talking about their recent form. Federer's forehand is clearly not the greatest in the game at the moment. If this list were not about recent form, but rather the overall career it would definitely look a lot different.

 

[djones]

What are you planning to do with that list?

If we made a list every single week, put in in the computer, then we can see a nice graphical curve (formed by our subjective view) for each players form thru out the season.