Best way to hit a short angle: slice or topspin?

[time_fly]

Let's say your opponent gives you a low, short slice roughly up the middle and you decide to go crosscourt short-angle to the sideline with it. This shot can be hit successfully with topspin or slice. How do you choose? Is one way "better" than the other? If you were a rec player like me working on countering slices, which technique would you focus on training first and why? In terms of my own baseline groundstrokes I am more naturally a topspin player, but I think a lot more of the guys around my level slice these short angles so I'm pondering what way to train.

 

[georgeyew]

I would say slice it back. Unless you have really good strokes and timing, it is hard to hit a good topspin off a low slice. Most of the time it will go into the net or go long.

 

[Funbun]

what's the context of this? is your opponent approaching and you have to pass them? or did they give you a short ball and you're given a opportunity to attack?

i would probably just hit topspin to their weaker or farther side, make them run and force a bad ball to finish at the net. no need to do a risky short angle.

 

[Slicehand]

If you are hitting a short angle off a slice, i would say top spin, for a short angle slice the incoming ball must have some height, if not i find its too risky of a shot for the reward

 

[Jonesy]

Topspin.

 

[optic yellow]

Definitely TS. Make it dive over the net and off the court.

 

[S&V-not_dead_yet]

Let's say your opponent gives you a low, short slice roughly up the middle and you decide to go crosscourt short-angle to the sideline with it. This shot can be hit successfully with topspin or slice. How do you choose? Is one way "better" than the other? If you were a rec player like me working on countering slices, which technique would you focus on training first and why? In terms of my own baseline groundstrokes I am more naturally a topspin player, but I think a lot more of the guys around my level slice these short angles so I'm pondering what way to train.

To me, slice would be the easier response as TS would require getting under the ball more.

Also, I would take most short balls as an opportunity to come to the net and by slicing my approach, I keep it low. TS will make the ball sit up more.

Also, I'm more likely to slice my BH so it depends on which side I get the incoming.

Most people will probably vote for TS. My game is structured differently.

 

[5263]

Let's say your opponent gives you a low, short slice roughly up the middle and you decide to go crosscourt short-angle to the sideline with it. This shot can be hit successfully with topspin or slice. How do you choose? Is one way "better" than the other? If you were a rec player like me working on countering slices, which technique would you focus on training first and why? In terms of my own baseline groundstrokes I am more naturally a topspin player, but I think a lot more of the guys around my level slice these short angles so I'm pondering what way to train.

Slice is easier unless you don't slice well. Probably depends on which you do better. TS makes sense if you can hit it much better. Slice if the better shot if you know how to keep it low, short and on a nice angle.

 

[LuckyR]

Either can work, depending on what you're trying to do. The slice has to be low pace since it'll fly long with pace (slice makes the ball sail). However the slice can be controlled easier, that is it can be "placed" to a target that is a very acute angle. OTOH, topspin has to be hit with very high racquet head speed to get the RPMs high, so it will usually lead to higher pace which can be controlled, though that will introduce an element of risk.

 

[LeeD]

Whichever is easier for you.
Conti grip slicers prefer underpin.
If you hold strong grips and don't like volleyball, go for topspin.

 

[antony]

Let's say your opponent gives you a low, short slice roughly up the middle and you decide to go crosscourt short-angle to the sideline with it. This shot can be hit successfully with topspin or slice. How do you choose? Is one way "better" than the other? If you were a rec player like me working on countering slices, which technique would you focus on training first and why? In terms of my own baseline groundstrokes I am more naturally a topspin player, but I think a lot more of the guys around my level slice these short angles so I'm pondering what way to train.

Slice for a slice most likely. Depends on their court position to be honest. If they’re coming in then most likely ill hit with topspin to give them less time, if the ball is high enough

 

[ballmachineguy]

Let's say your opponent gives you a low, short slice roughly up the middle and you decide to go crosscourt short-angle to the sideline with it.

You need to work on your decision making. You are trying to do something difficult with a difficult ball. Be patient and return it right down the middle with slice. Let him become impatient and make the mistake.

 

[time_fly]

You need to work on your decision making. You are trying to do something difficult with a difficult ball. Be patient and return it right down the middle with slice. Let him become impatient and make the mistake.

Obviously at some point the ball is too low and short and you just have to shovel it back and pray. I’m talking about a slice that’s below net level and short in the court, but I can get to it well enough to have some options.

 

[optic yellow]

Obviously at some point the ball is too low and short and you just have to shovel it back and pray. I’m talking about a slice that’s below net level and short in the court, but I can get to it well enough to have some options.

How short in the court and how high off the ground when you get to it?

 

[time_fly]

How short in the court and how high off the ground when you get to it?

Ok, to visualize it a little more, let’s say that I hit a lefty topspin forehand to my opponent’s backhand, and he elects to take it up around chin height, lean in and chop down with the slice. This sends the ball on a descending line over the net with backspin and it lands maybe a few feet inside the service line. If I don’t touch it, it will probably double bounce a few feet inside the baseline. The natural depth to hit it is somewhere around the middle of no-man’s land.

 

[optic yellow]

Ok, to visualize it a little more, let’s say that I hit a lefty topspin forehand to my opponent’s backhand, and he elects to take it up around chin height, lean in and chop down with the slice. This sends the ball on a descending line over the net with backspin and it lands maybe a few feet inside the service line. If I don’t touch it, it will probably double bounce a few feet inside the baseline. The natural depth to hit it is somewhere around the middle of no-man’s land.

How high is it getting at the apex of its bounce?

 

[ubercat]

Slice is easier but in that sitch I would not go short. I d try and slice deep to FH slow with a lot of side. Very difficult ball to attack and quite likely drop short high CC on your FH - yum yum

 

[BlueB]

Slice of the BH, topspin of the FH.

 

[optic yellow]

Slice is easier but in that sitch I would not go short. I d try and slice deep to FH slow with a lot of side. Very difficult ball to attack and quite likely drop short high CC on your FH - yum yum

Oh that is a great option if you don't go TS. Try to paint a corner.

 

[ubercat]

Well over to you. I said slow. My thinking is soft hands. Ideally landing a metre in from tram and BL. What you want is it moving as much sidewy as fwd

 

[optic yellow]

Well over to you. I said slow. My thinking is soft hands. Ideally landing a metre in from tram and BL. What you want is it moving as much sidewy as fwd

Yeah the sidespin is essential there, just like it is on the topspin option to get it diving off the court properly.

 

[antony]

If they’re coming in and your slice lob is good, I’d consider that too.

Slice or if you can topspin low to their backhand and hope for a weak and high reply

Ok, to visualize it a little more, let’s say that I hit a lefty topspin forehand to my opponent’s backhand, and he elects to take it up around chin height, lean in and chop down with the slice. This sends the ball on a descending line over the net with backspin and it lands maybe a few feet inside the service line. If I don’t touch it, it will probably double bounce a few feet inside the baseline. The natural depth to hit it is somewhere around the middle of no-man’s land.

In this case I think the high percentage shot would be a low slice to the open court, or roll a topspin BH to the open cross court if you have time to set up.

 

[Shroud]

Let's say your opponent gives you a low, short slice roughly up the middle and you decide to go crosscourt short-angle to the sideline with it. This shot can be hit successfully with topspin or slice. How do you choose? Is one way "better" than the other? If you were a rec player like me working on countering slices, which technique would you focus on training first and why? In terms of my own baseline groundstrokes I am more naturally a topspin player, but I think a lot more of the guys around my level slice these short angles so I'm pondering what way to train.

slice is easier because it works with the incoming spin. Top would have to reverse the spin. Watch the pros. Often one slice leads to 20 slices in a row...

But why not hit it deep dtm? Why short angle?

 

[optic yellow]

slice is easier because it works with the incoming spin. Top would have to reverse the spin. Watch the pros. Often one slice leads to 20 slices in a row...

Isn't the spin always the same direction after the ball hits the court? I think they slice because it feels like a safer response to try when they are scared they will misread the bounce.

But why not hit it deep dtm? Why short angle?

Short angle takes the opponent's response completely out of the equation.

 

[S&V-not_dead_yet]

Isn't the spin always the same direction after the ball hits the court? I think they slice because it feels like a safer response to try when they are scared they will misread the bounce.

The spin is the same direction but the magnitude is not. You experience that when you receive an incoming slice and you dump it into the net when the same stroke would have cleared the net had the incoming ball been hit with TS.

Short angle takes the opponent's response completely out of the equation.

It may reduce the number of responses but it doesn't eliminate them.

 

[time_fly]

How high is it getting at the apex of its bounce?

Below the level of the net, but probably around the top of the knee at the highest point. Not a racquet-scraper if you can anticipate and move in enough to play it near the apex

 

[toth]

For me it is too difficoult to hit low short incoming ball with two handed backhand topspin.
I have to slice it, however i have difficoulties with it too...

 

[Spin Diesel]

Let's say your opponent gives you a low, short slice roughly up the middle and you decide to go crosscourt short-angle to the sideline with it. This shot can be hit successfully with topspin or slice. How do you choose? Is one way "better" than the other? If you were a rec player like me working on countering slices, which technique would you focus on training first and why? In terms of my own baseline groundstrokes I am more naturally a topspin player, but I think a lot more of the guys around my level slice these short angles so I'm pondering what way to train.

I don‘t think it‘s a good option, trying to hit a short angle from the middle to begin with. You don‘t have a lot of angle to pull your opponent out of position and so you actually just offer a short ball. I would either slice back deep or maybe if I‘m closer to the net try a dropshot, since there‘s less time for the opponent, when I‘m already a bit closer to the net.

Altogether if someone has a great slice which stays really low, I‘d probably slice it back more often than not and wait for one that‘s high enough to attack.

 

[FuzzyYellowBalls]

Let's say your opponent gives you a low, short slice roughly up the middle and you decide to go crosscourt short-angle to the sideline with it. This shot can be hit successfully with topspin or slice. How do you choose? Is one way "better" than the other? If you were a rec player like me working on countering slices, which technique would you focus on training first and why? In terms of my own baseline groundstrokes I am more naturally a topspin player, but I think a lot more of the guys around my level slice these short angles so I'm pondering what way to train.

IF you have the VCore 95 in your hand, whip that topspin effortlessly. That racket just makes that shot so easy.

 

[optic yellow]

The spin is the same direction but the magnitude is not. You experience that when you receive an incoming slice and you dump it into the net when the same stroke would have cleared the net had the incoming ball been hit with TS.

Because there is less incoming topspin you have to reverse your swing generates too much and sends it low?

It may reduce the number of responses but it doesn't eliminate them.

I thought a well hit short angle shot would be impossible for an opponent to reach unless they were cheating up from the baseline anticipating it.

Below the level of the net, but probably around the top of the knee at the highest point. Not a racquet-scraper if you can anticipate and move in enough to play it near the apex

Yeah I love the Nadal reverse FH topspin draw in that situation. Don't even need to short angle it actually. Can just send deep DTM or to a corner depending on where opponent is.

 

[Dragy]

But why not hit it deep dtm? Why short angle?

Yeah same thoughts here. With a lowish ball in the middle, even if short, it’s not very easy to find angles. Deep to the corner where he isn’t, or slice in front of you and take the net - seems better decision.

If this short ball is to the side, going for angle is much more promising. If the opponent is recovering to the middle, angled slice will be great.

 

[Pumpkin]

I don't know if a short angle shot is the best option off a short slice down the middle. If you have the ability then go for it but I would be inclined to drive it into a corner and follow it into the net.

 

[S&V-not_dead_yet]

Because there is less incoming topspin you have to reverse your swing generates too much and sends it low?

I'm not sure if my swing is generating too much TS. I feel like my trajectory is too low.

Think of it this way: when you hit a ball off of a wall, a TS shot will rebound higher than the contact point whereas a slice will rebound lower.

Now imagine your racquet is the wall.

In a rally, the spin changes because the ball bounces before you strike it. But I think the concept is the same, just not as extreme.

Anyway, my explanation may be off but the conclusion is not: if I use my swing that's appropriate for an incoming TS ball, I will dump it into the net if it's a slice instead.

I thought a well hit short angle shot would be impossible for an opponent to reach unless they were cheating up from the baseline anticipating it.

I interpreted "short angle slice" to mean something that lands around the intersection of the SL and alley: challenging but well within reach.

What you're describing I'd call a drop shot. However, as long as the opponent can get a racquet on it, he probably has options [not necessarily good ones].

 

[toth]

I don't know if a short angle shot is the best option off a short slice down the middle. If you have the ability then go for it but I would be inclined to drive it into a corner and follow it into the net.

I think it similar: if this low bouncing ball comes to the middle of the court, you can take it with your forehand wing.
It schould not be a big problem... ( low bouncing short ball to my bh wing is much difficoultier for me...)

 

[nyta2]

slice is easier/less prep needed, topspin if i have time to prepare

 

[optic yellow]

I'm not sure if my swing is generating too much TS. I feel like my trajectory is too low.

Think of it this way: when you hit a ball off of a wall, a TS shot will rebound higher than the contact point whereas a slice will rebound lower.

Now imagine your racquet is the wall.

In a rally, the spin changes because the ball bounces before you strike it. But I think the concept is the same, just not as extreme.

Anyway, my explanation may be off but the conclusion is not: if I use my swing that's appropriate for an incoming TS ball, I will dump it into the net if it's a slice instead.

I'm not doubting the conclusion I'm just curious why it is that way. It sounds like you are trying to say the weaker incoming TS on the slice makes the launch angle lower off the racquet for a given swing which I suppose makes sense. I never consciously thought about having to adjust swing for incoming spin this way which seems like it could be a concerning rabbit hole to get into!

I interpreted "short angle slice" to mean something that lands around the intersection of the SL and alley: challenging but well within reach.

What you're describing I'd call a drop shot. However, as long as the opponent can get a racquet on it, he probably has options [not necessarily good ones].

Honestly I was thinking a TS draw shot landing around there, which I don't think an opponent can get to. Slice gives them more time for recovery so in that case I think you are right and I am wrong about having no ability to respond.

 

[S&V-not_dead_yet]

I'm not doubting the conclusion I'm just curious why it is that way. It sounds like you are trying to say the weaker incoming TS on the slice makes the launch angle lower off the racquet for a given swing which I suppose makes sense. I never consciously thought about having to adjust swing for incoming spin this way which seems like it could be a concerning rabbit hole to get into!

When I see an incoming slice, I'm trying to get lower and lift more. I don't think I'm stopping to think about it. But either way, it beats dumping it into the net!

Honestly I was thinking a TS draw shot landing around there, which I don't think an opponent can get to. Slice gives them more time for recovery so in that case I think you are right and I am wrong about having no ability to respond.

I think it was an ambiguous scenario. In any case, these things rarely have only one right answer.

 

[jimmy8]

slice, mostly flat, slight slice, bump it to the spot you want to hit it - if you're 3.5 or less or your opponent is slow

top spin - if you're 4.0 or more or your opponent is fast

 

[optic yellow]

When I see an incoming slice, I'm trying to get lower and lift more. I don't think I'm stopping to think about it. But either way, it beats dumping it into the net!

It sounds like general bounce height plays a role in this too. I will just continue using my intuition as you do and avoid trying to analyze this exhaustively.

I think it was an ambiguous scenario. In any case, these things rarely have only one right answer.

Yeah it was and I did not specify what I was thinking. Agreed on the second point. TS not always possible or safe feeling + short angle not even necessarily a needed play.

 

[onehandbh]

If the ball is in the middle of the court and low-bouncing and you do not want to hit a slice shot, then it's probably better to hit it to one of the corners. If hitting a forehand, I recommend the deuce corner.

Since it is low-bouncing, the best you can hope for is a slight amount of topspin and some sidepsin. Hit the outside of the ball (reverse forehand).

Same thing can be done on the backhand side, but I find hitting the outside of the ball more difficult with a onehander.

The lower the ball, the more across the ball you have to swing. Same with height. The higher the ball is the more across you have to swing, but in the opposite direction. Until it reaches a certain height where you can switch to an overhead throwing motion (serve-like motion).

 

[Morch Us]

Why other options (other than short angle slice and short angle topspin) are out? Can't you hit a deep slice and volley down next ball ? Or hit another topspin deep back to his backhand again? Or volley it down? Why are all those out of question? Why not a drop shot? Not saying short-angle is a bad idea, just that there are just too many options based on how much trouble you are in and what are your strengths/weaknesses.

let’s say that I hit a lefty topspin forehand to my opponent’s backhand, and he elects to take it up around chin height, lean in and chop down with the slice. This sends the ball on a descending line over the net with backspin and it lands maybe a few feet inside the service line.

 

[HuusHould]

Let's say your opponent gives you a low, short slice roughly up the middle and you decide to go crosscourt short-angle to the sideline with it. This shot can be hit successfully with topspin or slice. How do you choose? Is one way "better" than the other? If you were a rec player like me working on countering slices, which technique would you focus on training first and why? In terms of my own baseline groundstrokes I am more naturally a topspin player, but I think a lot more of the guys around my level slice these short angles so I'm pondering what way to train.

I haven't read the other responses yet, but if it's low, short and central and you want to hit an angle with your reply then the easiest option is an inside out slice with fade (be it deep or a drop shot). If you've got a bit more angle to work with and/or the ball's a bit higher, then topspin is the better option. It just takes a lot of practice. The same way you work on hitting your bread and butter rally ball deep, you need to work on hitting your spots with short angled shots.

 

[Wise one]

Let's say your opponent gives you a low, short slice roughly up the middle and you decide to go crosscourt short-angle to the sideline with it. This shot can be hit successfully with topspin or slice. How do you choose? Is one way "better" than the other? If you were a rec player like me working on countering slices, which technique would you focus on training first and why? In terms of my own baseline groundstrokes I am more naturally a topspin player, but I think a lot more of the guys around my level slice these short angles so I'm pondering what way to train.

Yes.

 

[ChaelAZ]

To me it is a question of, are you trying to keep it low or bounce it high or quick off the court?