Biggest hole in a players resume?

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Chadillac

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The three biggest i can think of are.

Nadal not winning the tour finals
Pete not winning the french
Borg not winning the us open

I would rank them borg since he had 4 chances, nadal had two finals and sampras, who never made a final.

Btw, is there a masters tournament fed hasnt won? I saw he won cincinnati 6 times, reguarded as the top ms by many experts here.
 
Yes there is. Novak is the closest one of trio.
And talking about resumes is a bit premature in nadals case.
 
xan said:
Yes there is. Novak is the closest one of trio.
And talking about resumes is a bit premature in nadals case.
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Very good one, i forgot he doesnt have a french. He maybe #1 since he is such a great claycourter and it suits his style of play.
 
Chadillac said:
The three biggest i can think of are.

Nadal not winning the tour finals
Pete not winning the french
Borg not winning the us open

I would rank them borg since he had 4 chances, nadal had two finals and sampras, who never made a final.

Btw, is there a masters tournament fed hasnt won? I saw he won cincinnati 6 times, reguarded as the top ms by many experts here.
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MC and Rome.



So, no, no voids worthy of mention.

Some would have the audacity to claim that he lacks a single title in the exhibition previously championed by Nicolas Massu. Which, well... yeah.
 
Chadillac said:
Like Rick Flair said, to be the man you have to beat the man. In feds case he beat the man who beat the man in the 2009 final.
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No, he just got lucky that someone was able to knock out a player he has never been able to beat at that place.

Do you think it means more to win a Slam beating the top seeds who played like top seeds or get lucky off having them lose early, and beat their conquerors (who more often than not, can't replicate the form they produced in beating the top player)?
 
HewittAlwaysDisappoints said:
No, he just got lucky that someone was able to knock out a player he has never been able to beat at that place.

Do you think it means more to win a Slam beating the top seeds who played like top seeds or get lucky off having them lose early, and beat their conquerors (who more often than not, can't replicate the form they produced in beating the top player)?
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Usually its beating the seeds because the player peaked for one match and lost the following round. Robin went to the final, he was playing the same. Kinda like Cilic at last years us open. He didnt go dustin brown and lose the next round after a big match.
 
Well, let me phrase it this way; when a child who wants to play tennis professionally goes to sleep, what do they dream of? Winning majors, or having a bigger number in the W column against certain players who grow up to be a thorn in the side?

Perfect world, both. But it's not a perfect world, and I know which one I'd pick.
 
YEC/WTF is big, but slams are on another level, atleast from today's perspective I guess.

90's Clay said:
Federer has 2 big holes. Nadal (Which is actually more like a grand canyon than a hole) and to a lesser extent Nole.
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This is grasping at straws, Novak is not a hole in Fed's resumee (let alone a big one). Novak is a 6 years younger all-time tennis great, it's very reasonable to expect he'd eventually get a winning record against Fed when the latter is playing and still reaching slam finals at 33-34 (not to mention they're neck to neck 7-6 in slams and 20-20 overall).

Fed could have quit in 2012 but he decided to soldier on, using losses in his 30s (with Fed's mileage) to the current best against him is just low. Especially coming from someone who always called guys like Hewitt and Safin clowns and Agassi in his 30s old.
 
The biggest hole in a players resume is without a doubt Djokovic's and Sampras's no French Open title. Having an abysmal record against one of your main rivals, if not the main rival as the "hole" is absolutely laughable. Tennis is about winning titles, not seeing who can win a certain H2H, LMAO!!
 
Novak And The Net. said:
The biggest hole in a players resume is without a doubt Djokovic's and Sampras's no French Open title. Having an abysmal record against one of your main rivals, if not the main rival as the "hole" is absolutely laughable. Tennis is about winning titles, not seeing who can win a certain H2H, LMAO!!
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Djokovic's career is far from over. I think we have to wait until all is said and done before we enter this conversation about his hole.

Seems like you haven't gotten over the final recently. Take it easy.
 
It is a sad day for tennis when Djokovic wins something, I'll give you that. And no, we don't have to wait until all is said and done. OP asked for the biggest holes in a players resume, and it's the no FO title for Sampras and Djokovic. Anything else mentioned is ludicrous and shows a low IQ.
 
Novak And The Net. said:
It is a sad day for tennis when Djokovic wins something, I'll give you that. And no, we don't have to wait until all is said and done. OP asked for the biggest holes in a players resume, and it's the no FO title for Sampras and Djokovic. Anything else mentioned is ludicrous and shows a low IQ.
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Really?
 
Pete's lack of a FO final is a the biggest hole. Borg not winning the second most prestigious slam of his day is the second IMO - though Borg was unlucky to face both Mac an Connors there. You'd need to be an ATG USO player to sneak through those 2.
 
Novak And The Net. said:
It is a sad day for tennis when Djokovic wins something, I'll give you that. And no, we don't have to wait until all is said and done. OP asked for the biggest holes in a players resume, and it's the no FO title for Sampras and Djokovic. Anything else mentioned is ludicrous and shows a low IQ.
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Lay off the goods. If you think Federer was worthy of winning the final then you are too biased. Djokovic outplayed him.
 
TheSopranos said:
Lay off the goods. If you think Federer was worthy of winning the final then you are too biased. Djokovic outplayed him.
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What? All I'm saying is that it's a sad day when the Faker can play his boring baseline game on every surface against sh1tty competition. Which right now, is every day.
 
zagor said:
This is grasping at straws, Novak is not a hole in Fed's resumee (let alone a big one). Novak is a 6 years younger all-time tennis great, it's very reasonable to expect he'd eventually get a winning record against Fed when the latter is playing and still reaching slam finals at 33-34 (not to mention they're neck to neck 7-6 in slams and 20-20 overall).

Fed could have quit in 2012 but he decided to soldier on, using losses in his 30s (with Fed's mileage) to the current best against him is just low. Especially coming from someone who always called guys like Hewitt and Safin clowns and Agassi in his 30s old.
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Would Pete be able to win 14 slams against a competition of 14-slam and 9-slam in the current era? The answer is clear.
 
90's Clay said:
Federer has 2 big holes. Nadal (Which is actually more like a grand canyon than a hole) and to a lesser extent Nole.
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From 98-02 Sampras won 4 slams when the next generation was Rafter, Henman, Moya. From 08-12 Federer won 5 slams when the next generation was Nadal, Djokovic and Murray :D
 
NatF said:
From 98-02 Sampras won 4 slams when the next generation was Rafter, Henman, Moya. From 08-12 Federer won 5 slams when the next generation was Nadal, Djokovic and Murray :D
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Agassi was still playing close to peak tennis from 99-02 last I checked.
 
90's Clay said:
Agassi was still playing close to peak tennis from 99-02 last I checked.
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I guess that makes up for him being MIA in 93, 96, 97 and 98 e.g. most of Pete's prime :D

Interesting that Agassi was close to his peak in 2002, but as soon as Sampras retires he'd old and broken down...

Not that Agassi comes close to making up for the rest of the Big 4 anyway.
 
TheSopranos said:
Feds 10-23 against Nadal. That should be tough to swallow.
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...... for the ************* and some bitter Sampras fans, just because they have so little to fall back to.

And I am saying that just because I don't see why would they clutch at it when everybody knows what the h2h means.

I would challenge anyone, that is not enamoured with stats or tennis history to try to quote the 10 most important h2hs today (or even in the open era if he pleases) and he can correctly mention more than 2/3 (irrespective of who has the upper hand.
 
Tennis_Hands said:
...... for the ************* and some bitter Sampras fans, just because they have so little to fall back to.

And I am saying that just because I don't see why would they clutch at it when everybody knows what the h2h means.

I would challenge anyone, that is not enamoured with stats or tennis history to try to quote the 10 most important h2hs today (or even in the open era if he pleases) and he can correctly mention more than 2/3 (irrespective of who has the upper hand.
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Not just Nadal's fans or Sampras' fans. Any fan can see that it's the most embarrassing hole among the all-time greats resumes.
 
AngryBirds said:
Not just Nadal's fans or Sampras' fans. Any fan can see that it's the most embarrassing hole among the all-time greats resumes.
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Can you quote off the top of your head the ten most important h2hs in the Open era or, if you prefer, in todays game.

Prove that h2hs mean something to you (apart from that ONE h2h).

EDIT: Come on, man! 5 minutes should be enough with Google.

EDIT2: 20 minutes

EDIT3: 2 hours

:rolleyes:
 
Last edited:
mike danny said:
Really? More than never winning the FO?
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Sampras never really tailored his game to play on clay anyway. Not winning the FO is definitely a big hole, but not an embarrassing hole if we consider the fact that Sampras' game is exclusively geared toward very fast surfaces. Federer getting beaten by Nadal across all surfaces(not just clay), however, is a real embarrassment.
 
AngryBirds said:
Sampras never really tailored his game to play on clay anyway. Not winning the FO is definitely a big hole, but not an embarrassing hole if we consider the fact that Sampras' game is exclusively geared toward very fast surfaces. Federer getting beaten by Nadal across all surfaces(not just clay), however, is a real embarrassment.
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So Sampras gets bonus points for never tailoring his game for clay? As a GOAT candidate it was his duty to win on all surfaces.

Federer did just that. Won on all surfaces. And it doesn't mattet he lost to Nadal. Most of the matches were at RG and they played only once in the HC slams when Fed was in his prime. Fed still remains one of the beest players ever on HC and grass, maybe even the best. Can't say the same for Rafa who is not even top 5 on HC and grass.
 
People like the poster you are replying to will forever be haunted by:

Federer having a fabulous US open 2008 after the heartbreak at Wimbledon the same year and
Having a fabulous RG09 Wimby09 after the hearbreak at the AO09 and
Having a fabulous AO10 after the heartbreak at US Open 09 and
His run at the Wimbledon 2012 and the reclaiming of the #1 spot breaking the record in the process with both Nadal and Djokovic at the peak of their powers and
even Winning the Davis cup 2014 and and and ....

the Legend.
 
1) Borg - not winning US Open (being 4 times runner-up) & Australian Open, although he took a part only once there.
2) Sampras - not winning French Open (and only once breaking through Semifinal)
3) Lendl - not winning Wimbledon (being there 2 times runner-up and 5 times in semifinal)
4) Djokovic - not winning Roland Garros (being 3 times runner-up and 4 times in semifinal)

I think Djokovic's case will be closed sooner or later.
 
Not winning all 4 slams is the biggest hole for multiple slam winners.

The second biggest hole is never ranked #1 and end the year #1(e.g. Murray), and never won the YEC(e.g. Nadal, Wilander).
 
I'd say being #1 is more important than winning the YEC. As far as resume holes go- Pete's lack of a FO, Borg's lack of a USO, Lendl's lack of a Wimby, and as of now Djokovic's lack of a FO.
 
We cannot fault Borg, Pete and Lendl as surfaces then were vastly different.

In today's homogeneous environment, not winning a WTF or a major is a bigger hole. Imagine if the surfaces today were as vastly different as it was then, it makes me wonder how many different majors these players would have won.
 
Lendl skipped the clay court season to get ready for Wimbledon. Andre did it why couldn't Pete do it when Pete>Andre? Borg play in 4 USO finals and lost them all, no excuse for that. Borg also won on grass when the difference between grass and clay is greater than hard and clay. The USO was also played on clay from 1974-77.
 
Djokovic has 4 Rome Masters, 2 Monte Carlos and 1 at Madrid on clay.

He's got 3 French Open Finals, none where he's even made the 5th set. It's him and it's not even close.

In comparison, Sampras won a single Masters clay title in Rome. While Borg faced the all-timers at the USO concentrating a lot of time on grass and clay.


As far as Nadal's WTF, he's missing Miami and Paris with only 1 title at Cincinnati and 3 in Canada.

Djokovic should have a French Open title soon though.
 
Donnie Brasco said:
Lendl skipped the clay court season to get ready for Wimbledon. Andre did it why couldn't Pete do it when Pete>Andre? Borg play in 4 USO finals and lost them all, no excuse for that. Borg also won on grass when the difference between grass and clay is greater than hard and clay. The USO was also played on clay from 1974-77.
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Even though the surfaces were vastly different, they were good enough to make SF and finals. There were surface specialists then and players did not have the luxury of a protected 32 seed system
 
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