Bjorn Fratangelo

average age of the top 100 is about 28, remember

I saw him play quite a lot this week, against a bunch of very highly rated up and comers (junior GS winners all over the place), he won the tournament, but it was more about the game he has.

This kid is REALLY good up close.

Just watch out for him, oh, and his ranking as of tonight is 170 :)

And, According to Stan (his coach), he hasn't any points to defend until June, so...
 

okdude1992

Hall of Fame
average age of the top 100 is about 28, remember

I saw him play quite a lot this week, against a bunch of very highly rated up and comers (junior GS winners all over the place), he won the tournament, but it was more about the game he has.

This kid is REALLY good up close.

Just watch out for him, oh, and his ranking as of tonight is 170 :)

And, According to Stan (his coach), he hasn't any points to defend until June, so...
Judging by past history, he doesn't have the typical markers of someone destined for a really great career. But you are right, players are peaking later. Look at Estrella Burgos for crying out loud. I could see him making top 50, or 40 absolute max at some point in the future. But it would seem extremely unrealistic to expect much more than that.

I will say though, he does have a nice well rounded game from what I've seen
 
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It is true that players peak later but coric and zverev are ranked much higher at not even age 18.
I have watched both those from courtside on multiple occasions too.

Bjorn has everything they have and maybe a better forehand, but he also has some really inventive shotmaking to call on.

Sure, I might be wrong, but I might not, too.

Just keep an eye on him, that's all I am saying
 

Gorecki

G.O.A.T.
lets face it. tennis at this day and age is played by "female cats". at the age of 21 Boom Boom had 2 sw17 under his belt, Bjorn Borg had a couple too, and the exemple could go on and on...
 
lets face it. tennis at this day and age is played by "female cats". at the age of 21 Boom Boom had 2 sw17 under his belt, Bjorn Borg had a couple too, and the exemple could go on and on...
and neither of them would win a match against anyone in the top 50 today, sorry, but that's a fact like it or not.
 

Gorecki

G.O.A.T.
and neither of them would win a match against anyone in the top 50 today, sorry, but that's a fact like it or not.
me thinks you dont have the first clue what FACT means
---------------------------------------------------------------------
fact
noun \ˈfakt\

: something that truly exists or happens : something that has actual existence

: a true piece of information


1: a thing done: as

a obsolete : feat

b : crime <accessory after the fact>

c archaic : action

2

archaic : performance, doing


3

: the quality of being actual : actuality <a question of fact hinges on evidence>
-----------------

opinion

noun opin·ion \ə-ˈpin-yən\

: a belief, judgment, or way of thinking about something : what someone thinks about a particular thing

: advice from someone with special knowledge : advice from an expert

: a formal statement by a judge, court, etc., explaining the reasons a decision was made according to laws or rules


1

a : a view, judgment, or appraisal formed in the mind about a particular matter

b : approval, esteem

2

a : belief stronger than impression and less strong than positive knowledge

b : a generally held view

3

a : a formal expression of judgment or advice by an expert

b : the formal expression (as by a judge, court, or referee) of the legal reasons and principles upon which a legal decision is based
 
I have been playing, coaching and watching tennis (at courtside) my whole life (it is my livelihood) and I have watched the game change.

As Pat Rafter said (in Brisbane in 2013), the game has moved on and he could never compete on the tour today with the game he had in 1999.

By all means admire the giants of the past for their magnificent achievements and their enormous talent, but don't let romance blind you to the reality of a modern, global professional sport played by serious athletes.

I am sorry, but the weight of shot and speed of ball apparent on the tour today is quite different to even 10 years ago.

Somebody posted a fascinating interview with Michael Russell here just the other day where he speaks of his transition from his old racquet to what he uses now and makes the point that the speed of ball and the weight of shot on the tour now has forced the switch.

Nobody admires Borg, Becker and co more than me, but a 17 y/o just doesn't have the physical resources to make a real mark on the tour in 2015. Even the rather huge Nick Krygios, despite having some credible results, is having trouble keeping his body together at the higher level already, and he is 19.

Speaking of Krygios, one of the players Bjorn beat this week defeated Nick at Wimbledon Juniors in 2013...

Now, you may well characterize this as 'opinion' as opposed to 'fact', and you may be technically correct, but it doesn't make it wrong...
 
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stringertom

Bionic Poster
A walkover and a retirement on the way to his first Challenger title...I'll need a few more positive results before I'll get on the Bjornwagon.
 

Gorecki

G.O.A.T.
I have been playing, coaching and watching tennis (at courtside) my whole life (it is my livelihood) and I have watched the game change.

As Pat Rafter said (in Brisbane in 2013), the game has moved on and he could never compete on the tour today with the game he had in 1999.

By all means admire the giants of the past for their magnificent achievements and their enormous talent, but don't let romance blind you to the reality of a modern, global professional sport played by serious athletes.

I am sorry, but the weight of shot and speed of ball apparent on the tour today is quite different to even 10 years ago.

Somebody posted a fascinating interview with Michael Russell here just the other day where he speaks of his transition from his old racquet to what he uses now and makes the point that the speed of ball and the weight of shot on the tour now has forced the switch.

Nobody admires Borg, Becker and co more than me, but a 17 y/o just doesn't have the physical resources to make a real mark on the tour in 2015. Even the rather huge Nick Krygios, despite having some credible results, is having trouble keeping his body together at the higher level already, and he is 19.

Speaking of Krygios, one of the players Bjorn beat this week defeated Nick at Wimbledon Juniors in 2013...

Now, you may well characterize this as 'opinion' as opposed to 'fact', and you may be technically correct, but it doesn't make it wrong...
funny. yet as evidence for what you are saying, we could easily take a peak at the other side, where the girls are playing with exactly the same gear, training methods and under the exact same conditions and you have a retired Clijsters that peaked 10 years ago moping the floor with a modern day Petkovic... and a Serena that has been raking slams since 1865...

Oh snap!!!!
 
I'm sorry, but I did not at any time suggest the same situation holds true in the WTA. I don't really watch it much anyway, so I can't comment. (not interested)

So leave your straw man for the suckers, not going to fly here laddie :)

Stringertom, I watched him play the final against the young Korean lad who had carried all before him and Bjorn looked a class above, it was quite a surprise when he dropped the first set as he was dominating the match and after that he ran away with it,
 

Gorecki

G.O.A.T.
I'm sorry, but I did not at any time suggest the same situation holds true in the WTA. I don't really watch it much anyway, so I can't comment. (not interested)

So leave your straw man for the suckers, not going to fly here laddie :)

Stringertom, I watched him play the final against the young Korean lad who had carried all before him and Bjorn looked a class above, it was quite a surprise when he dropped the first set as he was dominating the match and after that he ran away with it,
but but... i was under the impression your knowledge and experience as tennis coach were infalible and could withstand any change in the variables. after all it was a "fact"!

that strawman is ending up to be a tough guy to tackle down.... :twisted:
 
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are you a little bit slow? I have commented only on the ATP, I don't follow the WTA, have no real clue as to the relative standard over time and therefore can and will not comment in any way on it.

I don't really coach girls, either, because I simply don't have time, I am full up already.

I do know that it's almost a different game...

duh

if you can't find an error in my argument, or a misquote. (you will find that is EXACTLY what Pat Rafter said), don't try to introduce a completely unrelated topic.

I understand that you don't agree, but I have yet to see you articulate what experiences or events have led to your conclusion. Do you go to tournaments? Play yourself? Watch it on TV? Are you secretly Oscar Wenger?

But no, just some off topic reference to Serena Williams, who couldn't beat some old german guy in her prime, and an exhibition match. Really? That's what you have?

Not hard to take down, exactly, it can't really stand on its own!
 
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Gorecki

G.O.A.T.
are you a little bit slow? I have commented only on the ATP, I don't follow the WTA, have no real clue as to the relative standard over time and therefore can and will not comment in any way on it.

I don't really coach girls, either, because I simply don't have time, I am full up already.

I do know that it's almost a different game...

duh

if you can't find an error in my argument, or a misquote. (you will find that is EXACTLY what Pat Rafter said), don't try to introduce a completely unrelated topic.

I understand that you don't agree, but I have yet to see you articulate what experiences or events have led to your conclusion. Do you go to tournaments? Play yourself? Watch it on TV? Are you secretly Oscar Wenger?

But no, just some off topic reference to Serena Williams, who couldn't beat some old german guy in her prime, and an exhibition match. Really? That's what you have?

Not hard to take down, exactly, it can't really stand on its own!
lol... you dont even get the irony and i'm the slow one! yes baby... i am oscar wenger, tony roche and napoleon, and i am also a mack truck and a pumpkin!!!

you still cant FACTUALLY prove any of your claims, suposedly based on your gargantuan experience as a tennis coach....

There there Tony Roche...
 
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