Bob Hewitt expelled from Hall of Fame

Also wasn't the HOF aware of the convictions of Bill Tilden? They apparently didn't care. I assume with Hewitt once the charges came to light and then the conviction they acted accordingly.

This is where need to put on our big boy pants and tell it like it is. Homosexuals (and other all "oppressed" classes) are no better and no worse than the "privileged" white male. Therefore when a homosexual screws up call him out on the transgressions and hold him accountable. If a heterosexual rapist is out then the homosexual rapist should also be removed. Statutory rape is still rape, even if the minor consented.
 
darrinbaker00 said:
No, I want him removed because he was convicted twice of molesting teenage boys:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Tilden#Sexuality_and_morals_charges

As I stated earlier, fair is fair.
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You may need to read the history books and Tildens own book for the facts..........yes he admitted to going with teenage male prostitutes - and in fact the second case was a total scam as the 16yr old waited for quite some time to sue Tilden and extort money.

Fact is back then just being gay got you locked up...........Tilden for all his issues never FORCED himself on anyone...........Hewitt on the other had is a scum bag serial rapist who was and is a predator using his tennis to hurt kids. Tilden was famous for keeping his private life away from the court......he mentored quite a few male tennis players and to a one all have defended him and said he never tried to become sexually involved with them.
 
Greatgatsby said:
Also wasn't the HOF aware of the convictions of Bill Tilden? They apparently didn't care. I assume with Hewitt once the charges came to light and then the conviction they acted accordingly.

This is where need to put on our big boy pants and tell it like it is. Homosexuals (and other all "oppressed" classes) are no better and no worse than the "privileged" white male. Therefore when a homosexual screws up call him out on the transgressions and hold him accountable. If a heterosexual rapist is out then the homosexual rapist should also be removed. Statutory rape is still rape, even if the minor consented.
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There was never any charges of rape at all with Tilden........the Tilden he admits he paid young male prostitures- the two cases that got him in trouble with the law were never rape cases.
 
DUROC said:
You may need to read the history books and Tildens own book for the facts..........yes he admitted to going with teenage male prostitutes - and in fact the second case was a total scam as the 16yr old waited for quite some time to sue Tilden and extort money.

Fact is back then just being gay got you locked up...........Tilden for all his issues never FORCED himself on anyone...........Hewitt on the other had is a scum bag serial rapist who was and is a predator using his tennis to hurt kids. Tilden was famous for keeping his private life away from the court......he mentored quite a few male tennis players and to a one all have defended him and said he never tried to become sexually involved with them.
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sureshs said:
Conviction of gays was easy in those days and seldom questioned.
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So convicted rapists should be expelled, but convicted pedophiles shouldn't? Is that what you're inferring?
 
darrinbaker00 said:
So convicted rapists should be expelled, but convicted pedophiles shouldn't? Is that what you're inferring?
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No what I'm saying is it was a very different time and situations..........and Hewitt is a predator that forced himself on students the other didn't.

Tilden went out and paid for or knew where to go (Hollywood connections) where young men were looking to be together. I Never said it was right (NAMBLA is disgusting and rightly outlawed) but there is a huge difference with what Tilden did and Hewitt did..............if you are going to revisit historical persons who had young (very young) consensual gay relations you will need to remove Tchaicovsky, Alexander...just about every great Roman and Greek, Plato, Socrates, Oscar Wilde, Truman Capote, Da Vinci, Michelangelo..........

If anything Tilden should be pitied
 
Tilden was arrested in November 1946 on Sunset Boulevard by the Beverly Hills police and charged with a misdemeanor ("contributing to the delinquency of a minor") for soliciting an under-age male, a 14-year-old boy with whom he was having sex in a moving vehicle. Tilden did not carry his glasses with him and signed a confession without reading it.[17] He was sentenced to a year in prison, but served 7½ months. His five-year parole conditions were so strict they virtually erased all his income from private lessons.[17] He was arrested again in January 1949, after picking up a 16-year-old hitchhiker who remained anonymous until years later, when he filed a lawsuit claiming he had suffered severe mental, physical, and emotional damage from the encounter. The judge sentenced Tilden to a year on probation violation and let the punishment for the charge run concurrently. Tilden served ten months.

sureshs said:
Conviction of gays was easy in those days and seldom questioned.
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Are you suggesting that we are more enlightened today and as a society condone an adult soliciting a teenager for sex? Or are the rules just different for gays? OK for a grown man to solicit a teenage boy, but not OK for a grown man to solicit a teenage girl?

DUROC said:
if you are going to revisit historical persons who had young (very young) consensual gay relations you will need to remove Tchaicovsky, Alexander...just about every great Roman and Greek, Plato, Socrates, Oscar Wilde, Truman Capote, Da Vinci, Michelangelo..........
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Gee, wonder if I could find anyone famous and respected in history that r@ped or sexually assaulted women (or are you OK with the r@pe, just the underage part?). Man, I'd have to really look hard I bet :rolleyes: Are you saying that because they are famous, its OK (provided it's not Michael Jackson of course)?

DUROC said:
No what I'm saying is it was a very different time and situations but there is a huge difference with what Tilden did and Hewitt did..............
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I see, if Hewitt had simply paid these girls for sex, everything would have been OK. Is that what you're saying (though I don't think he paid the hitchhiker. That was just a crime of opportunity and he clearly took advantage of a very emotionally fragile boy and ruined his life.......but its OK, nothing like what Hewitt did :rolleyes:)

I suppose when you are watching that Dateline show where they catch sexual predators in the act, you feel sorry for the predators because they were obviously entrapped? Or only if the predators are gay (because we can't say anything bad about gay people, even if they solicit sex from minors. That just wouldn't be politically correct).

DUROC said:
If anything Tilden should be pitied
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If anything, you should be pitied. So ready to stand up for "gay rights" you defend Tilden's actions. You are a sick person DUROC. And so is Sureshs.
 
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First of all you might need to stop quoting Wikipedia as the site is pretty inaccurate (shock) of what happened with Tilden.........in fact what you quoted and claimed that he "ruined the life of a fragile boy" is ridiculous.I suggest you read the fascinating book by Frank Deford on Tilden that has an excellent and honest review of all the good and bad of Tilden.

All your pontificating does not change that the crimes committed by Hewitt cannot be compared to anything Tilden did...........
 
DUROC said:
First of all you might need to stop quoting Wikipedia as the site is pretty inaccurate (shock) of what happened with Tilden.........in fact what you quoted and claimed that he "ruined the life of a fragile boy" is ridiculous.I suggest you read the fascinating book by Frank Deford on Tilden that has an excellent and honest review of all the good and bad of Tilden.

All your pontificating does not change that the crimes committed by Hewitt cannot be compared to anything Tilden did...........
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http://www.encyclopedia.com/topic/William_Tatem_Tilden_II.aspx

In addition to his money problems, Tilden was increasingly losing control over his proclivity for young boys. During his pro career such an orientation had been well hidden, even though many of the players knew that he would travel with a favorite ball boy. In 1946 he was arrested on a morals charge for engaging in sexual activities with a 14-year-old, and served eight months at a minimum security prison north of Los Angeles. Out of prison, most of his friends had abandoned him. In 1948 he was again arrested, and served another ten months in prison.

Sounds like you and Deford are OK with him traveling with his favorite ball kid? Having sex with minors? And it sounds like he was doing it for years. Exactly how is that so different from Hewitt? Why on earth couldn't Tilden have sex with adults and why are you OK that he continually preyed on children? I think this says A LOT about you. You are one very scary person. If I knew your real identity, I'd most certainly contact the local authorities so they could monitor your actions. If you think Tilden's actions are OK, I'm worried about what you are doing.

You call Wiki inaccurate and then you suggest Deford as apparently unbiased fact? Well, at least I know where you mind is.

Did Tilden solicit sex from a minor, yes or no? What part of soliciting sex with a minor do you find OK. You're repulsive.

Your defense of this man is disgusting DUROC. You should be embarrassed. The fact that you aren't speaks volumes. You're a sick person.

mightyrick said:
Well, it depends on if you consider having sexual relations with 14 year old boys... rape.
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DUROC is OK with this.
DUROC said:
If anything Tilden should be pitied
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Actually, he's more than OK with this. He's decided the real victim isn't the young boys, it's Tilden. Apparently the unbiased book by Deford convinced him.

Disgusting.
 
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Tell me DUROC, are you OK with Tilden's actions just because he's gay? Is it somehow OK for gay men to do this sort of thing? Or would you also be OK with Tilden's actions if he were traveling with his favorite ball girls and soliciting sex with underage girls? In other words, have Tilden do the exact same things he did, just substitute in young girls for young boys. Is it still OK?

Your defense of Tilden disgusts me, but I'd like to see what the basis is. How on earth you can say Hewitt was bad, but Tilden is OK. Give me a serious reply. Tell me what the defense of Tilden was in Deford's book that you found so fascinating to think Tilden deserves to be pitied instead of vilified. To think that his actions are worthy of the Hall of Fame.

Floor is yours DUROC.
 
DUROC said:
There was never any charges of rape at all with Tilden........the Tilden he admits he paid young male prostitures- the two cases that got him in trouble with the law were never rape cases.
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while that is much less bad than rape, as you could say they did it at their own decision, it is still not OK, because those Young prostitutes were not at an Age were they could make such a decsision especially if a financial Situation forced them to do it.
 
dominikk1985 said:
while that is much less bad than rape, as you could say they did it at their own decision, it is still not OK, because those Young prostitutes were not at an Age were they could make such a decsision especially if a financial Situation forced them to do it.
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Just because they were prostitutes does not mean it was necessarily 'their own decision'. Anyone that young that feels the need to prostitute themselves to get by (let alone whether they're being coerced into doing it) is bound to have all sorts of pressures weighing on them.
 
DUROC said:
BS when did Tilden ever rape anyone?????? You want remove him because he was gay?
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I see, missed your first post. If a gay person does anything wrong, we ignore it and blame everyone else. Because he's gay, he's being discriminated against by definition. We need to excuse his actions and pity him. Solid stuff.
 
Not passing judgement on Tilden but here's a pretty in deph article about Hewitt. What a sick *******. Too bad he wasn't caught sooner.

http://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/2...allegations/jWhJkNUrq45U5c6P33jkKO/story.html

edit: from the article:
But John Korff, who was general manager of the Lobsters when Hewitt played for them and now serves as a director at large of the US Tennis Association, expressed displeasure at Conner coming forward.

“Gee, it’s nice of the girl to pop up 35 years later,’’ Korff said. “Give me a break.’’
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A USTA Director says such things! wow
 
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DUROC said:
No what I'm saying is it was a very different time and situations..........and Hewitt is a predator that forced himself on students the other didn't.

Tilden went out and paid for or knew where to go (Hollywood connections) where young men were looking to be together. I Never said it was right (NAMBLA is disgusting and rightly outlawed) but there is a huge difference with what Tilden did and Hewitt did..............if you are going to revisit historical persons who had young (very young) consensual gay relations you will need to remove Tchaicovsky, Alexander...just about every great Roman and Greek, Plato, Socrates, Oscar Wilde, Truman Capote, Da Vinci, Michelangelo..........

If anything Tilden should be pitied
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No pity for one who has any sexual involvement with minors. As for expulsion from the hall of fame, I didn't think that could happen in any sport.
 
here are the distinctions
1. One involved a same sex act ( 'Sodomy' was illegal but this DA did not bring those charges) one was heterosexual
2. One involved a prostitute, one involved students
3. one was charged as a misdemeanor (contributing) the other a crime

None of those distinctions is relevant to the language in the Hall of Fame standard of conduct and that is the standard that is relevant. tilden should be removed.
 
BTURNER said:
None of those distinctions is relevant to the language in the Hall of Fame standard of conduct and that is the standard that is relevant. tilden should be removed.
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That this new found alleged concern with and expertise in interpreting the HOF standards of conduct is what got you to post again after your valuable series of due process lectures on the Bobby Hewitt case is most curious.
 
Tshooter said:
That this new found alleged concern with and expertise in interpreting the HOF standards of conduct is what got you to post again after your valuable series of due process lectures on the Bobby Hewitt case is most curious.
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Not if you finally learn the difference a conviction makes in my argument. But you never will.
 
BTURNER said:
Not if you finally learn the difference a conviction makes in my argument. But you never will.
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Actually I've previously acknowledged your child-like faith in our/any criminal justice system.

Maybe if you could elaborate using some fruit analogies ?
 
Tshooter said:
Actually I've previously acknowledged your child-like faith in our/any criminal justice system.

Maybe if you could elaborate using some fruit analogies ?
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And I have acknowledged your child-like faith in a extra judicial 'hearing' and its 'testimony' and conclusions.
 
BTURNER said:
And I have acknowledged your child-like faith in a extra judicial 'hearing' and its 'testimony' and conclusions.
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Nice try but they're not converse as argued long ago.

But rather then rehash it I simply note, again, very curious that you never liked the Bobby Hewitt case but your interested in the Tilden case. All as a matter of fairness, of course.

I'm sure there's a reasonable fruit analogy to explain it.
 
Tshooter said:
Nice try but they're not converse as argued long ago.

But rather then rehash it I simply note, again, very curious that you never liked the Bobby Hewitt case but your interested in the Tilden case. All as a matter of fairness, of course.

I'm sure there's a reasonable fruit analogy to explain it.
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If there is a trial behind the charge ( not even a conviction), I am interested. If there is not, I don't think that the Hall should act on its impressions of 'guilt' because a charge was filed and is being investigated. I think its conclusions on membership- can wait until the member can actually defend himself against the charges. Their process is premature because it is necessarily incomplete of a viable defense. The defendant in a criminal matter cannot practically defend himself in their process because he is not supposed to say anything to anyone that may compromise his trial testimony. All he can say is "my lawyer says I am not supposed to say anything, but I am innocent and this is a crock"

That was my whole point all along. Their process is unfair because his hands are tied behind his back while they look at their evidence through their lense. I have not figured out why you think the Hall would have to rush this decision before his criminal matter is disposed of. This is not an issue in the Tilden case because he was convicted and there is nothing pending.
 
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BTURNER said:
If there is a trial behind the charge ( not even a conviction), I am interested. If there is not, I don't think that the Hall should act on its impressions of 'guilt' because a charge was filed and is being investigated. I think its conclusions on membership- can wait until the member can actually defend himself against the charges.
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This is a rehash of a portion of a long ago discussion involving issues that we simply disagree on and I decline to revisit them unless you include explanation via fruit analogy.

And also you have been patient with my fruit analogy ribbing so points to you on that.
 
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