Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by FarFed, Jul 10, 2007.
Some thoughts from Nick about the finale.
Is that an interview with a ******** senile who's clueless about tennis and turned down Safin for his "academy" because he didn't think the boy had potential to go pro? If so, why would you want to reproduce whatever nonsense he's spewing now, on this nice tennis discussion forum?
^^Corrected. That should have been in the FAQ list a long time ago.
Are you disputing the historical facts that I presented in my knowledgeable and insightful post, or just flaming me out of spite?
Yes, I think I flamed you (if that's the appropriate terminology to be used here), but it was purely out of irritation. My last comment might have seemed spiteful because I find that you are spiteful yourself, about mostly anyone and anything that is not even remotely within the definition of your notions of acceptability, and you have no problems displaying it time and time again on this "knowlegeable" discussion board. If you think you can blame others for flaming you, then you are the least justified in doing so because you do it most often under the garb of knowledge and restraint.
You might be surprised to know, but I have read a lot of your early posts, and I noticed that your tone has changed dramatically over a period of time, from what I think was "normal" to what is now downright haughty. If you think throwing potshots at members is the way to go about having knowledgeable discussions on an internet board, then fine, it's your choice.
I did not attack you or your posting manner in any way here. You created a thread to celebrate an interview with a certain tennis-related person of Italian descent. I contributed with my opinion as to the credibility of that person as far as tennis related matters are concerned, and backed up my assertions with some historic facts. Now instead of addressing the issues at hand (i.e., the [lack of] credibility of Mr. B. on tennis matters), you continue to scrutinise and insult my personality, including your analysis of the moods and tones of my contributions to the forum over time. I understand why you may feel irritated, but I assure you if you seek out the source of the irritation, it is not my personality, but rather the lack of credibility of the source that you chose to bring up as a subject of your thread here.
All coaches make mistakes. He has produced champions in Agassi, Pierce, Courier, Seles, Sharapova and many others - I think he knows a thing or two about tennis?
I agree with you, I lashed out, and I apologize, ok?
Bollettieri may not be credible according to you, but you could have said so in simpler and less scathing words. Instead you said this:
I posted this article's link to trigger a discussion about the article, not to trigger a discussion about why it was posted in the first place. Isn't that demeaning to the original poster? It's not even a troll-like thread, it's just an article link I would like people to see.
Anyway, I've noticed that you've stayed true to your pattern of attacking players/personalities whom you do not approve of by ridiculing their country of origin and not naming them directly, examples I can quote from your earlier posts:
- Bollettieri - "some Italian"
- Federer - "that German"
- "Agassi" - "Andrew Agassi, that Iranian.".
This trend of posting speaks volumes about the kind of haughty, high-handed attitude you possess.
Anyway, I would like you to know that I did not want to attack your personality in any way, it's just that your tone clearly elicits inflammatory responses from other posters.
Nice article, thank you for the link.
Ok time for bed, little kid. Come back when you have 1/10th of 1% of the man's accomplishments. God Bless Nick Bollettieri, he built a tennis empire from scratch, starting with limited tennis skills. I bet you couldn't even pay enough money for him to accept you into his academy. Respect your elders fool.
Nice...I smell barbecue!
I like my champions shaken, not stirred.
Champions are born, not made.
Hey, Nick's Sonic Serve was great dude!
Talent unguided is talent wasted.
I'm sure the champions Nick has coached have vast innate ability for tennis but their strokes still need to be taught and tactics learned.
OK, let’s just take a few steps back so we can look at the big picture now. Here’s a well known piece from an old interview with the best tennis player of all times – here’s what he had to say about N.B.:
Q: It's well-known that at 14 you joined the tennis school in Valencia, but it gets somehow forgotten that before that you applied to the Bollettieri academy in the States two years earlier.
A: That trip ended in nothing. They refused me, saying they didn't see potential. Like, nothing can be done out of me.
Q: Did yours and Bollettieri's paths cross later?
A: Yeah, a few years back we met and he offered his excuses for his mistake.
Q: Was it pleasant to gloat?
A: On whom? Bollettieri knows nothing about tennis. When I was 12, I was hurting, but I soon understood what kind of man he is.
Clearly, any serious tennis fan should be familiar with this story and should realise that B. has zero credibility as tennis coach or commentator, for his role in that episode alone. Consequently, it would not be reasonable to expect any such tennis fan to read an interview with B., since it would be more logical to simply alert the fellow participants of the thread as to B.’s lack of credibility on the subject, as a sign of respect for their time, which is what I did.
As far as the continued discussion of my own personality flaws and posting traits, my comment on Iranian Agassi was a joking tribute to another thread, which I had made very clear in my later post(s) in the same thread. As for other possible instances of referencing a person’s nationality or ethnicity, I don’t understand why you see a fault with my doing so from time to time. A person’s ethnic background or nationality is an integral part of the person.
Now this part of your post is priceless:
“This trend of posting speaks volumes about the kind of haughty, high-handed attitude you possess. Anyway, I would like you to know that I did not want to attack your personality in any way…”
He "produced" them? I suppose they did train at his academy. Then again, they trained in Florida, perhaps the governor of Florida produced them? Or perhaps George Bush did (since they trained in the U.S.)?
As for knowing "a thing or two about tennis", perhaps you think that, but the best player in the world would disagree. To quote him directly, "Bollettieri knows nothing about tennis."
You are right about limited tennis skills, and you probably know more about God than I do. As for the "academy", why would I want to pay for that, if there are real academies in Spain, and it's a nice place too.
Regarding the "1/10th of 1%", you may wish to consider decimal form next time you want to insult someone with that "wisdom" of yours - 0.1% - it's more compact. Let me know if you need further schooling on the concept of decimals. You are welcome.
SoBad - grow up. I agree, Nick B. isn't exactly a great tennis mind. That being said, there's no reason for you to take such issue with the original post. Put in your two cents on it and then let it be. And do so in a somewhat respectable manner.
OP - you (as well as I) should probably give up on him at this point. He isn't going to change - it's a stupid little game he plays that makes him happy.
I found the article interesting and have to agree with many of his points there.
SoBad stop trying to stir up trouble and proclaim Safin as G.O.A.T. with every chance you get.
I meant I did not originally have intentions of doing so i.e. when you posted your first message. It happened later because of your provocation.
Keep it up, keep taking potshots at others on this board and I'm sure you'll be considered more and more credible.
You're perfect, you're the epitome of perfect message board behavior, you have my salutes, fine? I hope that makes you happy and I sincerely hope that this thread gets buried before you mess it up even further. Although, please feel free to dig it up every time you need to poke fun and get your kicks by ridiculing others.
The voice of reason is just too much to handle, isn't it? You want me to stop posting in this thread, is that what you want?
What makes you think that? In fact I'm totally with you on this, didn't I just laud you for your skills?
Yeah I thought maybe you were trying to be sarcastic, after that whole character assault campaign you had launched against me.
Why is Safin's opinion suddenly so important? I'm sure most players would have good things to say about Nick Bollettieri.
For the benefit of all, let's end here shall we?
Sure, if that's your way of answering my earlier question with affirmative "yes, the voice of reason is just too much for me to handle, which is why I want you to stop posting in this thread".
It would be better if we (not you alone) stuck to relevant posts about the article here, isn't that reasonable enough?
I already appreciated your skills earlier, so I do not see how it could be perceived as a lack of handling reason. You dislike Bollettieri, I reasoned out why that is so (which you quite wrongly perceived as a character assault, which in turn could be perceived as lack of reason on your part, but I won't venture into that), you reasoned that it is because of Safin's experiences with Bollettieri. So there, we all have opinions, we posted them here (although inappropriately).
very nice article, thanks for posting...
Don't make SoBad mad: from the looks of his avatar, he just might go Virginia Tech on all our asses.
OK I see you don't come around these forums much, so may I just inform you that I am one of the nicest posters on all of these boards.
Hahahahahaha. Oh god I shouldn't laugh, I know I shouldn't. Hahahahahaha.
I agree that we should stick to relevant posts about the article. I continue to believe that the issue of B's credibility (or lack thereof, rather) is a relevant one here. There are impressionable kids that may be reading this article, and without some insight regarding B's credibility, they may draw erroneous conclusions. I just wanted them to know the truth.
If results is the final word on how great a tennis mind really is, than Nick B is practically the Albert Einstein of tennis coaching. Nobody else even comes close. He doesn't seem to be the type of guy who has a unique answer for every possible, unique game situation, from what I know he believes in some very simple truths and thinks they apply to every situation more often than not. Get super fit, bit serve, big forehand, and control the center of the court.
The haters are right in some ways, he doesn't get into the game to the atomic level. His way is broad but incredibly effective. And I'm sure when he first started proposing his approach to tennis, everybody thought he was an idiot. But at this point, the results speak for themselves.
List of IMG/Nick B academy alumni, and the way the word "alumni" is being used is certainly up for interpretation:
They're good enough to be able to turn down Safin, yah.
As discussed, he knows nothing about tennis or coaching. He's a fairly good businessman, at the very most.
What do you mean exactly when you say that?
It means when he has accepted and produced players that have won over 50 singles Grand Slam titles combined, he can afford to have rejected Safin and his lowly 2 slams and not lose credibility.
Safin doesn't like anything. You should know that by now.
Well it's Bolletieri or you who I'm gonna listen to in this thread. How do YOUR tennis credentials stack up against his? Started an academy? Taught any grand slam winners? NO!? Well maybe you've won some major titles yourself in which case you probably know what's going on at the highest levels of the game...?
Why are so many people on these forums so eager to rip on people who have actually had hugely successful careers? People rip on Federer for being past it despite winning his last slam, and suggest how the best player in the world should re-model his shots, post that bolletieri of all people knows nothing about tennis, as if they were themselves a tennis god, fair rip on anyone who's doing well! Why!?
Why? Jealousy, of course.
If he knows nothing about tennis, he's the luckiest coach in the world. Like saying Roger Federer is the worst tennis player in the world. Well, if his results are any indication, than he must also be the luckiest terrible tennis player in the world.
They could be so picky that they could turn down a guy with Safin's potential. Obviously, Safin must have some respect for Nick, otherwise why the bitterness? Why be upset if a person with no tennis knowledge doesn't want to coach you? If he truly believes what he's saying, than he should be thanking Nick for everything he's accomplished. In general, people don't want to be coached by people with absolutely no knowledge in the sport they're pursuing.
By the way, even today, it's not like Safin plays like a world beater every day. He's notorious for being mercurial. Is it possible he was even more erratic and temperamental when he was 13 or whatever? Maybe he had a bad day.
Send him your "scientific" analysis. Maybe he'll learn something.
Hey SoBad, you come across as rude and arrogant.
Michael Jordan didn't make it to the team in the first years of HS, because the coach thought he wasn't any good. We all know how that ended.
Michael Jordan at 13 didn't show any signs of his later potential, specially because his potential was, in part, his unbelievable physique, unexisting at 13 years old.
SoBad, I think you're pretty annoying too.
If you go to Nick's academy - it's not just Nick he has a whole team of people that help you with your game. Think more like Rick Pitino - Pitino actually is a pretty good coach and a good salesman to boot. But he has assistants to help with alot of the fundamental skills. It's the same thing in football as well.
I am pretty convinced that you could get help from Nick and his team. I have seen some of his videos and seen guys like his serve doctor giving tips on a slice serve. It's all sound advice IMHO. Nick and his staff know the modern game pretty well - and they adapt studying and learning what the new pros do to be succesfull.
Separate names with a comma.