BRIFFIDI - SW1 Racquet Swingweight Machine

[Shroud]

@Shroud No need to scan a QR code. That’s just a convenient way (for some) to go to a URL from paper. You can instead search the app store for Briffidi.

The User Guide is available in the app and on the website. Videos are on YouTube.

Yeah. I was excited and just wanted to get going. But then the hoops came. Ok, I have the app and yes its there but sorry it seems like a bunch of things to do. Maybe people have more time to figure it out, but I just wanted to set it and take a measurement. you know like on the machines in the store. You just put in the racquet and viola there is a reading...yeah I get it. This is affordable.

 

[esm]

Yeah. I was excited and just wanted to get going. But then the hoops came. Ok, I have the app and yes its there but sorry it seems like a bunch of things to do. Maybe people have more time to figure it out, but I just wanted to set it and take a measurement. you know like on the machines in the store. You just put in the racquet and viola there is a reading...yeah I get it. This is affordable.

to be fair though, i am sure the so called the machine from the shops would have to go through the unboxing, assembly, setup and calibration at the start and then have scheduled calibrations to ensure it spits out "correct" numbers for their customers....
yes, it is affordable, and it is also small, and he setup/first tike calibration is pretty easy - plus the voice from the YT setup is pretty cool too...

 

[Irvin]

Yeah. I was excited and just wanted to get going. But then the hoops came. Ok, I have the app and yes its there but sorry it seems like a bunch of things to do. Maybe people have more time to figure it out, but I just wanted to set it and take a measurement. you know like on the machines in the store. You just put in the racquet and viola there is a reading...yeah I get it. This is affordable.

It will probably take you less time to set the SW1 up an take a measurement than it will to drive to the shop and take a measurement.

 

[Shroud]

It will probably take you less time to set the SW1 up an take a measurement than it will to drive to the shop and take a measurement.

Probably since the nearest one is like 5 hours away if not longer.

 

[bfroxen]

Yeah. I was excited and just wanted to get going. But then the hoops came. Ok, I have the app and yes its there but sorry it seems like a bunch of things to do. Maybe people have more time to figure it out, but I just wanted to set it and take a measurement. you know like on the machines in the store. You just put in the racquet and viola there is a reading...yeah I get it. This is affordable.

You do just put the racquet in and take a measurement, after it's set up.

• Ballast. That could be done for you, but it would be expensive. Every time I think about figuring out the packaging for this, I think there are other things I should work on instead.
• Leveling. All swingweight machines require leveling. A bubble level may be easier, but it's less accurate. I chose accuracy, but maybe I should have gone for ease of use, here.
• Calibration. Other machines can be calibrated in the factory. The SW1 can't be, as the "weight" of the phone has an impact. I could probably make it easier for the first time user with some sort of "wizard" in the app, but it's really simple after you've done it once.

Really, it's not hard, and I'm happy to help.

 

[HypnoticLasagna]

• Leveling. All swingweight machines require leveling. A bubble level may be easier, but it's less accurate. I chose accuracy, but maybe I should have gone for ease of use, here.

I was thinking about this not too long ago, it is pretty easy to level, but you have to remove the something to do it. Could you do the leveling via the app using the phone sensors? (Forgive me I dont know the complexity of coding that one, and not sure that is actually easier than the current method)

 

[McLovin]

• Leveling. All swingweight machines require leveling. A bubble level may be easier, but it's less accurate. I chose accuracy, but maybe I should have gone for ease of use, here.
• Calibration. Other machines can be calibrated in the factory. The SW1 can't be, as the "weight" of the phone has an impact. I could probably make it easier for the first time user with some sort of "wizard" in the app, but it's really simple after you've done it once.

Quick question about the leveling & calibration...

If you're only interested in matching frames, how much 'off' can you be before it starts to make a difference? In other words, if I measure Frame 1 and it's a SW of 320, and I want to match Frame 2 to be a SW of "320", at what point does level & calibration come into play?

I'd assume if only matching frames, then leveling would be more important? I really don't care if the app thinks it a 420SW so long as when I match Frame 2 '420' means the same thing...correct?

 

[bfroxen]

I was thinking about this not too long ago, it is pretty easy to level, but you have to remove the something to do it. Could you do the leveling via the app using the phone sensors? (Forgive me I dont know the complexity of coding that one, and not sure that is actually easier than the current method)

I doubt it. The phone sensors seem to drift a bit. I tried a couple bubble level apps with higher display resolution than the iOS Measure app. I put a 1-2-3 block on the cradle and set my phone on its back on the 1-2-3 block. When the apps indicated it was level, it was actually pretty far off. One had a function to "calibrate", but even then, it wasn't repeatable enough to be useful.

The beauty of the current method is that it perfectly levels the oscillation axis. Any other method will introduce some error, as the leveling device will never be perfectly aligned with the axis.

 

[bfroxen]

Quick question about the leveling & calibration...

If you're only interested in matching frames, how much 'off' can you be before it starts to make a difference? In other words, if I measure Frame 1 and it's a SW of 320, and I want to match Frame 2 to be a SW of "320", at what point does level & calibration come into play?

I'd assume if only matching frames, then leveling would be more important? I really don't care if the app thinks it a 420SW so long as when I match Frame 2 '420' means the same thing...correct?

If you're only matching frames and don't care about the actual number, leveling and calibration are not important at all. If the rackets oscillate with the same period (time), then the swingweights are the same.

 

[wagen]

@bfroxen I just got my SW1 (including Swingweight adapter) yesterday and it is awesome.
I am very impressed with what you created.
I read some comments here regarding ease of use (pre-calibrated) or price (too high), and I totally disagree. The quality is top-notch, just because it is 3d-printed and has no glossy paint on it, does not diminish the quality at all. I will always prefer a solid do-it-yourself-calibration method that I can repeat over a pre-calibrated "blackbox"-machine.
Worth every penny, saved me at least USD 1'000.- compared to a Dunlop/Head/... machine and I can now measure Twistweight. And I'd rather give my money to somebody that has a entrepreneur mindset and creates a low-cost high-quality product than giving it to the big companies, so kudos man, great job!
Greetings from Switzerland

 

[Casper777]

@bfroxen I just got my SW1 (including Swingweight adapter) yesterday and it is awesome.
I am very impressed with what you created.
I read some comments here regarding ease of use (pre-calibrated) or price (too high), and I totally disagree. The quality is top-notch, just because it is 3d-printed and has no glossy paint on it, does not diminish the quality at all. I will always prefer a solid do-it-yourself-calibration method that I can repeat over a pre-calibrated "blackbox"-machine.
Worth every penny, saved me at least USD 1'000.- compared to a Dunlop/Head/... machine and I can now measure Twistweight. And I'd rather give my money to somebody that has a entrepreneur mindset and creates a low-cost high-quality product than giving it to the big companies, so kudos man, great job!
Greetings from Switzerland

Totally agree

Another happy Swiss Customer

 

[bfroxen]

@bfroxen I just got my SW1 (including Swingweight adapter) yesterday and it is awesome.
I am very impressed with what you created.
I read some comments here regarding ease of use (pre-calibrated) or price (too high), and I totally disagree. The quality is top-notch, just because it is 3d-printed and has no glossy paint on it, does not diminish the quality at all. I will always prefer a solid do-it-yourself-calibration method that I can repeat over a pre-calibrated "blackbox"-machine.
Worth every penny, saved me at least USD 1'000.- compared to a Dunlop/Head/... machine and I can now measure Twistweight. And I'd rather give my money to somebody that has a entrepreneur mindset and creates a low-cost high-quality product than giving it to the big companies, so kudos man, great job!
Greetings from Switzerland

Thanks. I loved reading that.

 

[Return_Ace]

Do Pickleball players actually care about SW?

 

[Casper777]

Do Pickleball players actually care about SW?

Kids just want to do like the big boys

 

[bfroxen]

Do Pickleball players actually care about SW?

Some do. I had several inquiries about it and sent out a few prototype adapters earlier. I haven’t seen much data, but here’s a video that shows a good sized range between three of the same paddle.

 

[gold325]

Do Pickleball players actually care about SW?

@bfroxen

Awesome sauce. I wanted to ask (not really but sounds better than way) for it but didnt want to get shamed (not that I care) by all the Tennis-Or-Nothing players.

Placing my order tommorow. I will get the 0 cm adapter only because I want to see the bigger numbers.

I also use the XSPAK paddle.... not that anyone cares.

 

[gold325]

Some do. I had several inquiries about it and sent out a few prototype adapters earlier. I haven’t seen much data, but here’s a video that shows a good sized range between three of the same paddle.

I used to watch David Henrys old tennis stringing videos on Youtube (Inspired Tennis).... Always wondered where he went. And now thanks to your linked video I know he is alive and well. Feels good for some reason!

 

[Znak]

Out of curiosity does this machine ever go on sale?

 

[gold325]

Out of curiosity does this machine ever go on sale?

Nope. Someone asked this before. It beleive a more of a passion project that is 3D printed - I think he was planning to raise the price because of rising costs of everything.

 

[Znak]

Nope. Someone asked this before. It beleive a more of a passion project that is 3D printed - I think he was planning to raise the price because of rising costs of everything.

Cheers thanks for the reply

 

[EggSalad]

Out of curiosity does this machine ever go on sale?

No but it’s worth every penny.

 

[Soundbyte]

No but it’s worth every penny.

It has been a game changer. Especially if you customize frames or demo / play various frames.

Just being able to see the variations is huge. Sometimes I'll have frames that are close to identical on static weight and balance, only to have a 6-10 pt difference in swingweight.

 

[Znak]

I ended up picking one up, very excited!

 

[Return_Ace]

It has been a game changer. Especially if you customize frames or demo / play various frames.

Just being able to see the variations is huge. Sometimes I'll have frames that are close to identical on static weight and balance, only to have a 6-10 pt difference in swingweight.

Same with changing string.

A secondhand frame i bought had Poly/Gut in it, 318SW and I customised it to 323 SW.

Ended up restringing it with full poly and it jumped to 329 SW, so took off the tape i put on it.

 

[Casper777]

Same with changing string.

A secondhand frame i bought had Poly/Gut in it, 318SW and I customised it to 323 SW.

Ended up restringing it with full poly and it jumped to 329 SW, so took off the tape i put on it.

6 points of SW that's exactly the diff I notices between same gauge multi and poly thanks Briffidi

Amazing piece of gear

 

[FrankyRelax]

I'm a briffidi fan boy. If he's starts making t-shirts and promo gear I'll buy it all. Love this machine.

 

[initialize]

Keep this hush hush, but I have a brand new one that's ready to be sold if anyone knows what I mean lol. In original shipping box and everything

 

[jace112]

Looks like a really nice piece of engineering. First results were very accurate and consistant!
Look forward to carry on few more tests.
BTW, Brian is a really nice and comprehensive guy. Happy to be one of the first reviewer in France.

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[CroPlayer]

I just ordered the machine yesterday. It is unfortunate that there are no shops in Croatia that offer swingweight measurement services. So far, I have done everything through the swingtool application, but there are a lot of variables and time needed for the result, which is not 100% accurate after all. This is much simpler and I can't wait to try the device.

 

[Znak]

I just put the machine through some initial tests, and found the calibration and leveling a little tricky at first, but I'm sure it'll get easier over time. One thing I noticed that created a decent amount of variance was if my racquet wasn't exactly perpendicular on SW tests, or exactly parallel on TW the readings varied a decent amount. Does anyone have any tips how to get your racquet in the optimal position when testing?

Thanks

 

[bfroxen]

I have an article on the effect of orientation error. For just SW measurements, it’s not terribly important, but it is when determining TW from the difference between the two orientations.

I often place a racquet in the cradle, tighten the strap, and then twist it back-and-forth a bit. You can feel where it aligns best with the bevels.

For TW, before I had the TW adapter, I’d align the racquet by sight, which usually required moving around a bit to get a view with a good reference on the machine.

I think Irvin has mentioned hanging a string with a weight along the head of the racquet to ensure it’s plumb. A bubble level could also be used.

 

[Znak]

I have an article on the effect of orientation error. For just SW measurements, it’s not terribly important, but it is when determining TW from the difference between the two orientations.

I often place a racquet in the cradle, tighten the strap, and then twist it back-and-forth a bit. You can feel where it aligns best with the bevels.

For TW, before I had the TW adapter, I’d align the racquet by sight, which usually required moving around a bit to get a view with a good reference on the machine.

I think Irvin has mentioned hanging a string with a weight along the head of the racquet to ensure it’s plumb. A bubble level could also be used.

Much appreciated, will try for the next time

 

[AMGF]

Why is the TW measurement so far off the TWU data? Anyone knows how TWU measure their TW?

Also from the Tennis Spin vid, they get 13.6 for the Boom Pro while TWU gets 14.6. Could we assume that if the pros frame are at 15-16, then on the TWU it would mean 16-17.

What do you guys think?

 

[bfroxen]

I don't know how TWU measures twistweight. I'd also be interested in knowing.

I'm pretty confident in the data from the Briffidi Twistweight Adapter. I've determined that the SW1 is very linear, and the way twistweight is determined by measuring the racquet and adapter and then subtracting the adapter, there aren't a lot of sources for significant error. I've also validated that added weight affects the measurements as predicted.

I also just had another idea to validate it. A piece of PVC pipe sits nicely in the support arms of the twistweight adapter. One of my reference rods has a length of 347.04 mm and mass of 161.73 g. The theoretical moment of inertia about an axis through the C.G. is 16.45 kg·cm². I just measured 22.73 - 6.26 = 16.47 kg·cm² first try with the twistweight adapter.

 

[AMGF]

I don't know how TWU measures twistweight. I'd also be interested in knowing.

I'm pretty confident in the data from the Briffidi Twistweight Adapter. I've determined that the SW1 is very linear, and the way twistweight is determined by measuring the racquet and adapter and then subtracting the adapter, there aren't a lot of sources for significant error. I've also validated that added weight affects the measurements as predicted.

I also just had another idea to validate it. A piece of PVC pipe sits nicely in the support arms of the twistweight adapter. One of my reference rods has a length of 347.04 mm and mass of 161.73 g. The theoretical moment of inertia about an axis through the C.G. is 16.45 kg·cm². I just measured 22.73 - 6.26 = 16.47 kg·cm² first try with the twistweight adapter.

That's the kind of good info we need. It means that however TWU measures tw, the SW1 is accurate. I don't why there is a difference and it would be interesting to see how TWU gets their numbers.

I also did some testing on my side by adding some lead at 3-9 just to see and the tw does rise consistently and seems to follow expectations with regards to actual value.

All in all the actual number doesn't mean much. As long as it is constant. The TWU numbers are always higher. But the Federer, Nadal and Djokovic numbers were taken on a SW1 and this can definitely serve as a basis as to what pros actually play with. I just thought shop frames were closer based on TWU numbers.

 

[CroPlayer]

The device arrived today. It traveled for three days to Croatia (UPS Express). The device is really well made, I would never say that it was made on a 3D printer. The instructions are very clearly written, in the beginning I had a little trouble with the calibration (my fault because I changed the order of weights for calibration). When I realized where I messed up, I did the calibration in less than two minutes. I was impressed by the precision, especially when you get into groups of measurements that are to two decimal places. There is nothing to say about a patent, the man is a genius. This is a device that will always work reliably. The application is also very well designed, I would like it if in the future the application would have the possibility to write notes in groups, so that some personal specifications could be followed. Hats off to the floor master.

 

[bfroxen]

I would like it if in the future the application would have the possibility to write notes in groups, so that some personal specifications could be followed.

Thanks for the kind words. Currently, none of the measurement data is stored. It's lost when the app is restarted. There are a lot of things to consider when storing data, so instead, I recommend copy-paste to put it elsewhere. You can double-tap on the last measurement value and the summary statistics at the top of the Measurement Group detail page to copy them to the clipboard. I did have a request to export data as a .CSV file, and that's something I may implement in the near term.

 

[ryohazuki222]

Interesting thing on twu twistweight is that I just assumed that meant TW could measure twistweight.
Asked them to measure it so I could get specs on a previous order and they told me that they have no ability to measure twistweight. So definitely seems like twu is doing something unique.

 

[AMGF]

Interesting thing on twu twistweight is that I just assumed that meant TW could measure twistweight.
Asked them to measure it so I could get specs on a previous order and they told me that they have no ability to measure twistweight. So definitely seems like twu is doing something unique.

Good info. So somehow TWU does measure tw. I’m wondering how. Is there a machine that does it besides SW1? If not it means they string the frame and measure by hand. And if that, why are they and SW1 so far apart?

 

[bfroxen]

As far as I know, there are no other commercially-available machines that measure twistweight. @TW Professor seems to have a nice lab, so my guess is that he has some sort of torsion pendulum for measuring twistweight.

I have a few racquets that I can compare with the TWU data:

• Four Microgel Radical MPs (re-issues) at around 13.9 kg·cm² with 0 to 2.0 g at 3&9, so without the lead, they'd range from 13.6-13.9 kg·cm². TWU has 12.64 kg·cm² (-1.1).
• One Microgel Radical OS (probably re-issue) at 15.99 kg·cm². TWU has 17.27 kg·cm² (+1.3).
• Two 360+ Gravity Lites at around 15.0 kg·cm² with 4.8 and 6.3 g at 3&9, so without the lead, they'd range from 14.0 to 14.2 kg·cm². TWU has 14.68 kg·cm² (+0.6).

My data is all strung. I have always assumed that the TWU data is strung, but it's not specified.

 

[bfroxen]

Found a few more for comparison:

• Blade 98 v8 18x20 at 13.6 kg·cm². TWU has 14.44 kg·cm² (+0.8).
• Blade 98 v8 16x19 at 12.7 kg·cm². TWU has 13.3 kg·cm² (+0.6).
• Microgel Radical MP (original issue, I think) at 12.85 kg·cm². TWU has 12.64 kg·cm² (-0.2). I picked this one up used when they were in short supply, and I couldn't match specs with my re-issues. It's less polarized, and I found that some embedded weight in the handle area is further up the handle than my others. Turns out TW is quite a bit different, too.

 

[AMGF]

As far as I know, there are no other commercially-available machines that measure twistweight. @TW Professor seems to have a nice lab, so my guess is that he has some sort of torsion pendulum for measuring twistweight.

I have a few racquets that I can compare with the TWU data:

• Four Microgel Radical MPs (re-issues) at around 13.9 kg·cm² with 0 to 2.0 g at 3&9, so without the lead, they'd range from 13.6-13.9 kg·cm². TWU has 12.64 kg·cm² (-1.1).
• One Microgel Radical OS (probably re-issue) at 15.99 kg·cm². TWU has 17.27 kg·cm² (+1.3).
• Two 360+ Gravity Lites at around 15.0 kg·cm² with 4.8 and 6.3 g at 3&9, so without the lead, they'd range from 14.0 to 14.2 kg·cm². TWU has 14.68 kg·cm² (+0.6).

My data is all strung. I have always assumed that the TWU data is strung, but it's not specified.

I measured my Textreme Beast Pro 100LB (John Isner model). TWU has 351sw and 14,9tw, I have 342sw and 13,25tw. The 342sw can very well be the string choice and a bit underspec frame no biggie. But the 13,25tw is really far off at 1.65 difference!!

 

[Irvin]

Why is the TW measurement so far off the TWU data? Anyone knows how TWU measure their TW?

I don't know how TWU measures twistweight. I'd also be interested in knowing.

I asked @TW Professor how twist weight was measured back in Dec 2016 and never got a response. It always amazed me how they got measurements down to 0.01 kgcm^2. But it doesn’t matter any more I measure TW so I know it‘s correct. I’m not trying to verify the validity of the TWU Twistweight Table.

EDIT: https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/index.php?threads/calculating-twist-weight.578887/

 

[AMGF]

I asked @TW Professor how twist weight was measured back in Dec 2016 and never got a response. It always amazed me how they got measurements down to 0.01 kgcm^2. But it doesn’t matter any more I measure TW so I know it‘s correct. I’m not trying to verify the validity of the TWU Twistweight Table.

EDIT: https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/index.php?threads/calculating-twist-weight.578887/

Wow I guess we’ll never know. I asked the question this week but I don’t think I’ll get an answer now.

Starting now I will only trust SW1 TW data. At least until the professor chimes in on how he gets his tw data. Because with the SW1 I can test and adjust and get repeatable measures. Plus frames seem to behave more in line with SW1 data than TWU.

Today I tested a VCore Pro 330g I have here. SW was bang on with TWU at 332 but again tw is a full point lower at 13.8 vs 14.8.

What’s concerning is the TWU is not always down by 1pt it varies. So it makes either the SW1 or the TWU meaningless. On top of that, I have frames that TWU has more TW than others but when I measure it’s the opposite. For example my Bisner is rated at 14.9 and I get something like 13.7(iirc) and my PSVS are rated at 14.6 and I get 14.0.

 

[jace112]

Don't forget that SW & TW can vary very much from one frame to the other (same model). SW tolerance is sometimes +/-10kg.cm²!
If you take a close look at TWU, you'll find huge differences.
So far, I re-calibrated once the BSW1, and so far so good

 

[bfroxen]

A while back, I developed a release mechanism for the SW1. I don't think I'm going to do anything with it, but I thought it was interesting enough to share.

https://www.instagram.com/reel/CplRopKLnhh/

Many people default to using the tip of the racket to start a measurement, but that's not ideal. I (and Wilson for their new machines) recommend using the cradle. The flex of a racket can store and release a significant amount of energy, which adds error to the measurement. If you're careful to hold it lightly against the stop, it can work, but it's easier to get consistent results using the cradle.

 

[HypnoticLasagna]

A while back, I developed a release mechanism for the SW1. I don't think I'm going to do anything with it, but I thought it was interesting enough to share.

https://www.instagram.com/reel/CplRopKLnhh/

neat application of a compliant mechanism!

 

[ryohazuki222]

A while back, I developed a release mechanism for the SW1. I don't think I'm going to do anything with it, but I thought it was interesting enough to share.

https://www.instagram.com/reel/CplRopKLnhh/

Many people default to using the tip of the racket to start a measurement, but that's not ideal. I (and Wilson for their new machines) recommend using the cradle. The flex of a racket can store and release a significant amount of energy, which adds error to the measurement. If you're careful to hold it lightly against the stop, it can work, but it's easier to get consistent results using the cradle.

Hahahah. Never even occurred to me to use the tip of the racket…!

 

[ryohazuki222]

Seems like the use case for that mechanism is more around if shop owners want to dummy proof the sw1 for any shop kid to give consistent measurements.

 

[AceyMan]

@bfroxen

How's the Android app development coming? It's been a while since the beta updated and it still can't be paired with a SW1 yet.

[edit] oh I guess I can. Pairing worked, nice. (it was clumsy to scan the tag, my sensor is in the middle of the backplate as are many Android phones, iirc.). Good so far.

Thx

(I'm set with a working iPhone 7 but it'd be nice to have "one stop shopping" and use my everyday Pixel phone.)