Building the perfect tennis player

[George Turner]

What shots would the perfect tennis player have? I'm going for this line up.

Serve; Karlovic
Forehand; Federer
Backhand; Connors
Volley; Mcenroe
Overhead; Sampras
Movement; Borg
Stamina; Nadal
Mental strength; Nadal
Lob; Murray
Drop shot; Federer
Shot variation; Federer
Entertainer; Santoro

And a *worst tennis player* line up (excluding guys never in the top 20, including me.)
Serve; Coria
Forehand; Mardy Fish
Backhand; Karlovic
Volley; Courier
Overhead; Djokovic
Movement, Tomic
Stamina; Sampras
Mental Strength; Monfils and Gulbis tie. heck theres plenty of other candidates.
Shot Variation; Ferrer
Entertainer; Carreno Busta

 

[Username_]

Federer with two forehands

 

[Waspsting]

Nice list. Who do you have for passing shots?

---

'Mental Strength' - Nadal.... that's a tough one

So many different kinds of it

Borg had it in spades... but he quit at age 26, I guess 'long term' mental strength isn't too high

Wilander similar to Borg

Sampras had it in spades... but not on clay, his shoulders would drop first sign of setback

Federer has it in spades long term... but has anyone lost a third of the matches he has after having match points?

Nadal has it in spades... but look at his hard court finals record

Djokovic had it in spades... but fell off a cliff. McEnroe was similar

Connors had it in spades... but he actually lost more Slam semis than he won

Lendl has the choker tag, unfairly maybe, but it's not a point in his favour for sure

Everyone has their holes, so who?

I don't know... can't complain with Nadal among the big fish but a lot of 'em have similar strength claims

 

[George Turner]

All of those players had mental strength, but in all of them there's cases where they mentally unravelled as you say.

Mental strength is hard to determine, Nadal usually lost those hardcourt finals because he's not a natural hardcourt player rather than choking them away. So i rate him top overall. Worst choke i've ever watched is the Wimbedon final of 1975, Connors could barely get the ball over the net against an opponent he should have comfortably beaten.

 

[VladBurn]

1st Serve: Karlovic
2nd Serve: Sampras
Return: Djokovic
Forehand: Federer/ F.Gonzalez
Backhand ( 1 handed ): Wawrinka
Backhand ( 2 handed ): Djokovic
Slice: Federer
Passing shots: Nadal
Forehand volley: Sampras
Backhand volley: Edberg/ Federer
Half volley: Federer
Smash: Sampras
Overhead: Sampras
Lob: Murray
Drop shot: Federer
Shot variation: Federer
Power: Del Potro
Movement/ Footwork: Federer
Stamina: Nadal
Mental strength: Nadal
Speed: Monfils
Agility & flexibility: Djokovic
Fighting spirit: Nadal
Hard working: Nadal/ David Ferrer
Trick shots: Dustin Brown
Entertainer: Monfils

 

[VladBurn]

Bump, would be good to see more posts in this thread

 

[Incognito]

Serve - Sjeng Shalken
Forehand - Gasquet
Backhand - Alberto Berasetuegi
Volleys - Ferrer
Return - Karlovic
Mental strength - Tomic
Movement and speed - Karlovic

 

[Mugu]

1st Serve: Karlovic
2nd Serve: Sampras
Return: Djokovic
Forehand: Federer/ F.Gonzalez
Backhand ( 1 handed ): Wawrinka
Backhand ( 2 handed ): Djokovic
Slice: Federer
Passing shots: Nadal
Forehand volley: Sampras
Backhand volley: Edberg/ Federer
Half volley: Federer
Smash: Sampras
Overhead: Sampras
Lob: Murray
Drop shot: Federer
Shot variation: Federer
Power: Del Potro
Movement/ Footwork: Federer
Stamina: Nadal
Mental strength: Nadal
Speed: Monfils
Agility & flexibility: Djokovic
Fighting spirit: Nadal
Hard working: Nadal/ David Ferrer
Trick shots: Dustin Brown
Entertainer: Monfils

all that and no johnny mac? c'mon... he's gotta squeeze in there somewhere - at least in the volley category.

 

[TheFifthSet]

First serve: Karlovic
Second serve: Isner or Sampras
Kick serve: Edberg
Forehand dtl: Nadal
I/O fh: Federer
FH cc: Federer or Lendl
Fast surface fh: Federer
Slow surface fh: Nadal/Federer/Borg
On the run: Sampras
Fh slice: Santoro
Bh dtl: Djokovic
Bh cc: Agassi
2hbh: Djokovic
1hbh: Laver or Budge
Defense off the bh: Nadal
Slice: Rosewall or Federer
Lob: Riggs
1st serve return: Murray
2nd serve return: Agassi
Bh pass: Hewitt
Fh pass: Nadal
Overhead: Sampras
Fh volley: Rafter
Bh volley: Edberg
Chip-n-charge: Laver
Half-volleys: Agassi
Drop shot: Albert Portas
Speed afoot: Borg
Ball retrieval: Nadal/Djokovic
Defense-to-offense: Nadal
Footwork: Federer
Mental strength: Gonzales
Fitness: Djokovic
Durability: Federer/Connors

 

[BeatlesFan]

I can't believe people actually choosing Ivo for a first serve.

It's Pete for both first and second serves by a margin as wide as the continent of Australia. I guess you guys aren't aware of the truism, "you're only as good as your second serve." If Ivo's serve was so great, explain his complete lack of success on the tour in terms of elite play. He's 38 and has won 8 tournaments.

 

[vex]

What shots would the perfect tennis player have? I'm going for this line up.

Serve; Karlovic
Forehand; Federer
Backhand; Connors
Volley; Mcenroe
Overhead; Sampras
Movement; Borg
Stamina; Nadal
Mental strength; Nadal
Lob; Murray
Drop shot; Federer
Shot variation; Federer
Entertainer; Santoro

Karl over pete on Serve?
Connors over Djoker on BH? Or Agassi?
Borg over Rafa on Movement? Or Djoker?
Rafa over Djoker on Mental Strength? I guess Rafa has an argument at least.

Also gotta add Return and decide amongst Djoker/Agassi/Andy

I like the rest tho.

 

[vex]

Durability: Federer/Connors

Underrated but very important point here.

 

[Pheasant]

For pure speed in his prime, I would take Hewitt. However, Djokovic, Nadal, Monfils, and Borg all have a case.

For 1st serves, I think that Sampras probably deserves it. But let’s see how Kyrgios pans out. His 25 aces in a 2 set match vs Djokovic earlier this year was mind-boggling. Nobody else aces Djoker 25 Times in 2 sets.

I would give the backhand to Safin. That shot was beautiful.

Djoker’s running backhand was clearly the best though.

I would probably take a Djokovic for mental strength.

Djokovic battles Borg for the most fit.

Forehand would be a toss-up between Rafa and Lendl

Versatility goes to Federer.

 

[FD3S]

I can't believe people actually choosing Ivo for a first serve.

It's Pete for both first and second serves by a margin as wide as the continent of Australia. I guess you guys aren't aware of the truism, "you're only as good as your second serve." If Ivo's serve was so great, explain his complete lack of success on the tour in terms of elite play. He's 38 and has won 8 tournaments.

It probably has to do with the difference between the serves of Pete and Ivo as isolated shots and the difference between their (to take a term from Agassi) 'hold games' - the serve + everything else that comes after.

The serve by itself has to go to Karlovic, as you can't teach a serve that comes from having that kind of leverage and height; David Foster Wallace addressed this in String Theory by having one of his footnotes say 'get a protractor and figure it out'. Once the serve gets back into play, however, Pete was way more likely to hold than Ivo because every other tool he possessed as a tennis player was superior by light-years.

I'll put it this way; even though Sampras was way less (read; next to never) likely to be in immediate trouble when his serve came back, I'd wager that Karlovic's serve, whether it be the first or second delivery, wouldn't be coming back as often or it'd be coming back as a weaker return on average.

 

[George Turner]

It probably has to do with the difference between the serves of Pete and Ivo as isolated shots and the difference between their (to take a term from Agassi) 'hold games' - the serve + everything else that comes after.

The serve by itself has to go to Karlovic, as you can't teach a serve that comes from having that kind of leverage and height; David Foster Wallace addressed this in String Theory by having one of his footnotes say 'get a protractor and figure it out'. Once the serve gets back into play, however, Pete was way more likely to hold than Ivo because every other tool he possessed as a tennis player was superior by light-years.

I'll put it this way; even though Sampras was way less (read; next to never) likely to be in immediate trouble when his serve came back, I'd wager that Karlovic's serve, whether it be the first or second delivery, wouldn't be coming back as often or it'd be coming back as a weaker return on average.

Their statistics at holding service games are pretty similar.

Now considering Pistol Petes all round game was light years ahead of Dr.Ivo, you have to assume Ivos serve as an isolated shot was even more effective when he's got far less to back it up with. Simple common sense

 

[aurablaze]

The fact that he has 8 titles means his serve must be a big weapon, since there's plenty of people who are better than him at everything else that don't have a title.

 

[VladBurn]

I can't believe people actually choosing Ivo for a first serve.

It's Pete for both first and second serves by a margin as wide as the continent of Australia. I guess you guys aren't aware of the truism, "you're only as good as your second serve." If Ivo's serve was so great, explain his complete lack of success on the tour in terms of elite play. He's 38 and has won 8 tournaments.

When it comes to Ivo's lack of success, I guess it mostly has to do with his movement ( which is affected by his height a lot ) and also his weak return. He's a giant player and giant players obviously dont have the ability to move good like shorter players do.

 

[Thomas195]

Volley; Courier

Well, Courier certainly had good volleys by today standard. During his time, he volleyed better than Agassi.

Plenty of players have worse volleys than Courier: Andy Roddick, Andre Agassi, current nextgen players, and well, Djokovic.

 

[King No1e]

What shots would the perfect tennis player have? I'm going for this line up.

Serve; Karlovic
Forehand; Federer
Backhand; Connors
Volley; Mcenroe
Overhead; Sampras
Movement; Borg
Stamina; Nadal
Mental strength; Nadal
Lob; Murray
Drop shot; Federer
Shot variation; Federer
Entertainer; Santoro

And a *worst tennis player* line up (excluding guys never in the top 20, including me.)
Serve; Coria
Forehand; Mardy Fish
Backhand; Karlovic
Volley; Courier
Overhead; Djokovic
Movement, Tomic
Stamina; Sampras
Mental Strength; Monfils and Gulbis tie. heck theres plenty of other candidates.
Shot Variation; Ferrer
Entertainer; Carreno Busta

I'm going to do active players only
Serve: Karlovic
2nd Serve: Raonic
Forehand: Verdasco
Backhand: Wawrinka (if 1H), Djokovic if 2H
Volleys: Federer
Lob: Murray
Overhead: Nadal
Movement: Monfils
Passing Shots: Nadal
Consistency: Djokovic
Stamina: Nadal
Fitness: Djokovic
Trick Shots: Monfils
Mental Strength: Ferrer
Reflexes: Tsonga
Aesthetics: Federer
Off-court Personality: Djokovic
Meme Value: PCB

 

[BHServe]

I can't believe people actually choosing Ivo for a first serve.

It's Pete for both first and second serves by a margin as wide as the continent of Australia. I guess you guys aren't aware of the truism, "you're only as good as your second serve." If Ivo's serve was so great, explain his complete lack of success on the tour in terms of elite play. He's 38 and has won 8 tournaments.

Number of titles is completely irrelevant in this case,we are talking about serve, and serve only.

Assumption here is that the serve goes in and no other elements of the game/hold game is assessed. In this case it’s Karlovic’ serve no doubt. If we talk about whole hold game, well, knowing Ivo’s lackluster ground game and basically everything else than serve, I’d rather take Pete as well.

 

[Slightly D1]

I agree with most of these but I would have to put in Nadal's forehand into the discussion for some of these. A big lefty forehand creating different angles to the backhand with an insane amount of spin is what makes it extremely different/irregular and gives a lot of mostly right handed players issues.

 

[Atennisone]

If only taking current playing players

First serve: Ivo Karlovic
Second serve: John Isner
Forehand: Roger Federer
Backhand: Stan Wawrinka
Power: Juan Martin del Potro
Volley: Mischa Zverev
Reflexes: Andy Murray
Speed: Novak Djokovic
Stamina: David Ferrer
Mentality: Rafael Nadal

 

[skaj]

Forehand: Federer
Backhand: Henin
Serve: Sampras
Volley: Edberg
Tactics: Hingis
Touch: Rios
Mobility: Borg
Mentality: Evert
Grace: Mecir
Looks: Kournikova