Can Marty pull a Rafter at the USO?

flymeng

Semi-Pro
He is playing good. I am impressed that he kept up with the Joker. True journey man in the big leagues. His career is on the similar path as Rafter except that he is older and has a different playing style. It could happen if there are major upsets at the USO.
 

JoelDali

Talk Tennis Guru
Mardi is the 2nd best player in the world at this moment according to recent results.

He is easily a NTRP 7.0 player according to the description.
 

Beryl

Hall of Fame
Mardi is the 2nd best player in the world at this moment according to recent results.

He is easily a NTRP 7.0 player according to the description.
Mardiy hasn't been beating top players though. The highest seed he beat at the Roger's Cup was #14 (Wawrinka). Prince Tsonga is the real world #2 right now.
 

flymeng

Semi-Pro
Rafter was 25 when he won the USO. He came out from no where having won 1 tournament. Marty has won 6 tournaments. His game has improved. His serve has improved. He is consistent and can unload big groundstrokes when the opportunity arises. Serving and volleying too, very Rafter like! I wish he would do more of that.

Based on the current ranking, he could play ****** in the USO quarters. Nadal lost early in Canada. If he doesn't make it to the semis in Cincy, I see Mardy beating him at the USO and making it to the semis. BTW, Tsonga was a big disapointment in Canada. Retiring when he knew he was outplayed by the Joker.
 
Rafter was 25 when he won the USO. He came out from no where having won 1 tournament. Marty has won 6 tournaments. His game has improved. His serve has improved. He is consistent and can unload big groundstrokes when the opportunity arises. Serving and volleying too, very Rafter like! I wish he would do more of that.

Based on the current ranking, he could play ****** in the USO quarters. Nadal lost early in Canada. If he doesn't make it to the semis in Cincy, I see Mardy beating him at the USO and making it to the semis. BTW, Tsonga was a big disapointment in Canada. Retiring when he knew he was outplayed by the Joker.
I disagree with Mardy making it past Nadal. But he is playing very well at the moment and should be able to make a run worthy of discussion.

He should've beaten Djoker especially since Novak wasn't playing well at all.
 

hoosierbr

Hall of Fame
Different era. Different players. Fish has really come into his own as of late but he's always underachieved at the slams. Rafter from '97 on was almost always in the second week mix at Wimby and the USO. He made the SF at the French and Aussie Open too.

Mardy is really peaking and we all hope he does well in New York but he's no Pat Rafter.
 

Mustard

Talk Tennis Guru
Quarter finals for Fish at the 2011 US Open, in my opinion, but you never know.

Thinking back to the 1997 US Open, Sampras went into the tournament as the overwhelming favourite. Sampras, at the time, was a dominant world number 1, had won the US Open for the previous 2 years (4 times in all), and was the reigning Wimbledon and Australian Open champion who had just won Cincinnati. Sampras was also the reigning World Championships (now WTF) champion, after that epic Becker match. His toughest challengers were expected to be Muster and Chang.

Muster had a tough first round draw in those days of 16 seeds, drawing Henman, and Muster surprisingly lost in 4 sets. Sampras, the big tournament favourite, lost a fifth set tiebreak match to Korda in the Round of 16, despite leading 3-0 in the fifth set. It shouldn't have been such a shock, as Korda had pushed Sampras to the limit at the same stage of 1997 Wimbledon. Korda lost his quarter final match to Bjorkman after being forced to retire with a head cold.

At the 1997 US Open semi final stage, it looked like Rafter, Rusedski, Chang and Bjorkman would never have better opportunities to win the US Open with Sampras out of the way. Rusedski beat Bjorkman and Rafter beat Chang. Rafter then went on to beat Rusedski in the final and win his first major. John McEnroe said that Rafter was a "one slam wonder", and a bitter Pete Sampras soon joined in, saying that a champion has to come back and defend the title. The Sampras-Rafter rivalry esculated in the summer of 1998 when Rafter started to beat Sampras himself.
 
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JoelDali

Talk Tennis Guru
This thread has reportedly reached Fish's camp. They have been monitoring it steadily. His girlfriend has been GOATing it on her iPhone RSS feed.

"You can make a difference."
---John Walsh
 
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Laurie

Guest
Quarter finals for Fish at the 2011 US Open, in my opinion, but you never know.

Thinking back to the 1997 US Open, Sampras went into the tournament as the overwhelming favourite. Sampras, at the time, was a dominant world number 1, had won the US Open for the previous 2 years (4 times in all), and was the reigning Wimbledon and Australian Open champion who had just won Cincinnati. Sampras was also the reigning World Championships (now WTF) champion, after that epic Becker match. His toughest challengers were expected to be Muster and Chang.

Muster had a tough first round draw in those days of 16 seeds, drawing Henman, and Muster surprisingly lost in 4 sets. Sampras, the big tournament favourite, lost a fifth set tiebreak match to Korda in the Round of 16, despite leading 3-0 in the fifth set. It shouldn't have been such a shock, as Korda had pushed Sampras to the limit at the same stage of 1997 Wimbledon. Korda lost his quarter final match to Bjorkman after being forced to retire with a head cold.

At the 1997 US Open semi final stage, it looked like Rafter, Rusedski, Chang and Bjorkman would never have better opportunities to win the US Open with Sampras out of the way. Rusedski beat Bjorkman and Rafter beat Chang. Rafter then went on to beat Rusedski in the final and win his first major. John McEnroe said that Rafter was a "one slam wonder", and a bitter Pete Sampras soon joined in, saying that a champion has to come back and defend the title. The Sampras-Rafter rivalry esculated in the summer of 1998 when Rafter started to beat Sampras himself.
Nicely put. The rivalry really got hot when Lars Graf overuled an out call on matchpoint and gave the match to Rafter in the 1998 Cincinnati final. Sampras lost his cool completly. That was Rafter's first win in 9 attempts over a 5 year period. Rafter went on to win 3 matches in a row including the 1998 US Open semifinal but complained Sampras didn't give him enough credit.

They patched up their differences in the 1999 Cincinnati repeat final but clearly there was a lot of tension in their matches, they both wanted to beat eachother.

The by product of that tension was that their matches were great quality because both players raised their level against eachother.
 
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Cormorant

Professional
Fish has had so many barren spells in his career that I often feel like I'm observing his game anew when he gets hot and starts stringing results together. For all the flak it gets, that forehand is a lethal stroke, and his regularly lauded backhand has become better defensively so now it's a complete shot. I never imagined that I'd see him outhit and outlast the #1 from the baseline, but that's what happened in Canada during their second set; it really is impressive how well he handles this generation, Federer's the only other senior player who can go toe to toe with the top kids.

His mental stamina has become stronger, and the fitness is pretty robust (provided those injuries stay away), so it's more credible to consider his chances in the 5-set format than before. But he's not beating Nadal in a QF, in later rounds you can be assured that Rafa's playing well and I think Fish has demonstrated he's too inconsistent to beat the #2 across 5. But he can beat Murray, he gives the Scot fits and there are often enough fluctuations in form/intensity from Andy in slam matches that Fish can take breathers at certain stages and not flounder breathlessly like he does against Nadal. Djoko's something of an unknown quantity in a hypothetical QF because he could be contending with fatigue if he's won Cinci also, and he's proven that when's he's a little sub-par he can struggle against fishie; so I give Mardy a shot at that one. Fed? Again, I think Fish will be the victim of his high seeding here because I don't think he's catching out the Swiss in the latter rounds of the USO. I'd give him next to no chance in that one, Roger's just offensive dynamite in the second week of New York.

Lastly, I know the OP's not drawing style comparisons between Fish and Rafter (aside from alluding to the S&V), but watching the Pat of 1997 one wasn't looking at some nobody who seemed to have nothing of the future champion about him. You only needed to see his full-on netrushing in his French Open semi with Bruguera, a magnificent display of forecourt prowess and tenacity on his least favourite surface, to take pause and think, "Hey, this guy could be in for some big time silverware in the future."

As impressive as Fish has been in the face of much adversity (some of his own making), he's rarely been as inspiring to watch as Rafter was in the 1990s.
 
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Laurie

Guest
There are similarities between Rafter and Fish. Rafter lost 7 finals in a row going into that 1997 US Open final, I remember that being mentioned a lot back then.

Fish also likes to serve and volley on first serve and stay back on 2nd serve, a classic 1990s attacking player tactic on hardcourts, revitalised in 2011.

But I think Rafter was a better player at age 25 than Fish is right now. Fish's groundstrokes look very shaky when I watch him play. What Rafter did well was play some short points and some long points - mixed up his game well and improved his backhand to make it very reliable. Rafter also chipped and charged a lot and had great athleticism around the court, including great backhand overhead smashes.

I don't see Fish having Rafter's athleticism or ability to beat the very best players in a big tournament. Therefore I don't see Fish as a contender at the US Open, but he's been doing well.

On another note, I would like to see a player like Tsonga serve and volley on first serve and stay back on 2nd serve, he has the ability and athleticism to do that, plus a very good serve, if he was courageous enough to give it a go.
 
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NadalAgassi

Guest
He couldnt even beat Djokovic playing his worst match of the year. No chance he ever wins a slam, he hasnt even made it past the quarters of one yet and will be lucky to ever do that. Based on Sunday I doubt he ever even wins a Masters.
 
He couldnt even beat Djokovic playing his worst match of the year. No chance he ever wins a slam, he hasnt even made it past the quarters of one yet and will be lucky to ever do that. Based on Sunday I doubt he ever even wins a Masters.
Let's see, Djokovic has lost one match all year and is #1 in the world, so your statement doesn't mean much does it?
 

OddJack

G.O.A.T.
lets revisit this thread after USO, then we will have better idea who is number 2-3-4...

Prediction: Mardy going out before quarters
 
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