Can't fathom the humiliation of getting knocked out in 1R

When I see a pro like Osaka FLY to London, only to get eliminated in an hour?
Hotels booked. Relatives flying in. Her whole TEAM was flown in. Now, the media scrutiny. How embarrassing and costly!
This must have cost her $30,000 to fly in and hotel up a large posse of people.

The prospect of playing some meaningless USTA match is truly put into perspective.
Let this be motivation for those who refuse to play in tournaments an hour away because of the "inconvenience"
 
Can you imagine experiencing this as a 10-14 year old junior?
These kids FLY to tournaments and HALF of them get knocked out in the first round.
Your entire family has made this flight or the 10 hour car ride or whatever.

Jesus, I can't imagine what those experiences do to build mental fortitude at such an early age.
When you compare this to the typical complaints lodged by your typical adult rec jackass, it's actually hilarious
 
It's not about the money.
It's about the abject humiliation and embarrassment.
I can't even begin to imagine what that does to light a fire under your ass.
And HALF the players experience this. How utterly brutal.
 

rafazx10

Rookie
Happens to half of the players in the draw.

I think it is even worse at lower levels, futures players have to get to the tournament by Sunday night, sometimes dont play until tuesday or wednesday, just to loose, not get enough money to even pay for food and head to the next tournament.
 

OnTheLine

Hall of Fame
did you see her presser? She got asked a totally legit question .... said she was about to cry and walked out.
Not Impressed. That is not a professional that is acting like a child.

Seems like she has some trouble with the mental side of the game right now ...
 

2ndServe

Hall of Fame
When I see a pro like Osaka FLY to London, only to get eliminated in an hour?
Hotels booked. Relatives flying in. Her whole TEAM was flown in. Now, the media scrutiny. How embarrassing and costly!
This must have cost her $30,000 to fly in and hotel up a large posse of people.

The prospect of playing some meaningless USTA match is truly put into perspective.
Let this be motivation for those who refuse to play in tournaments an hour away because of the "inconvenience"
The loser of the 1st round gets about $50k+ so if everything cost her 30k she's already +20k and her EV is way more than 50k in this tournament with the possibility to win 2.5 million or so, + of course points and endorsements.
 

ShaunS

Semi-Pro
did you see her presser? She got asked a totally legit question .... said she was about to cry and walked out.
Not Impressed. That is not a professional that is acting like a child.
It's easy to forget how tough a situation we ask athletes to be in.

Osaka is only 21 years old. There were a lot of expectations on her, as she's rolling with a new coach on a surface that isn't her best, against an opponent who she's struggled with in the past. The majors are the pinnacle of the the sport, and she's got to go out minutes after losing to discuss her failure. There are no teammates here to band together. Just a young woman and a room full of people to ask why she failed.

This isn't Kyrgios being disrespectful to fans, opponents, and employees. It's a young woman who's exceptionally frustrated with herself.

I shudder to think the kind of behavior you would've gotten from me at age 21 following a huge loss.
 

WestboroChe

Hall of Fame
did you see her presser? She got asked a totally legit question .... said she was about to cry and walked out.
Not Impressed. That is not a professional that is acting like a child.

Seems like she has some trouble with the mental side of the game right now ...
Funny because after her USO win everyone was gushing about her maturity and emotional intelligence. It’s easy when you’re winning.
 

OnTheLine

Hall of Fame
It's easy to forget how tough a situation we ask athletes to be in.

Osaka is only 21 years old. There were a lot of expectations on her, as she's rolling with a new coach on a surface that isn't her best, against an opponent who she's struggled with in the past. The majors are the pinnacle of the the sport, and she's got to go out minutes after losing to discuss her failure. There are no teammates here to band together. Just a young woman and a room full of people to ask why she failed.

This isn't Kyrgios being disrespectful to fans, opponents, and employees. It's a young woman who's exceptionally frustrated with herself.

I shudder to think the kind of behavior you would've gotten from me at age 21 following a huge loss.
I get it .... then she should have done like all the other players who have lost ... go change and compose oneself prior to the presser, meet with your team for 5 minutes to have your talking points .... or don't do it at all and take the fine levied by the GS/WTA
 

ShaunS

Semi-Pro
I get it .... then she should have done like all the other players who have lost ... go change and compose oneself prior to the presser, meet with your team for 5 minutes to have your talking points .... or don't do it at all and take the fine levied by the GS/WTA
It'd be very impressive if she had the self-awareness to do that, but it's not something I'm going to expect from someone her age in that situation.

Really? She came off as a clueless teenager who was thrust into the, like, I dunno, ya know, like, sorta, the spotlight ????
I know. She was 20 years old, and jumped from outside the top 50 to winning the US Open. I can't think of any reason she wasn't more prepared.
 
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What the heck is the question being asked at :43 ?
YOU CAN NOT BE SERIOUS

Look at her first reply. PURE GOLD. Slicer/junkers are KING, even at grand slams
 

Cawlin

Semi-Pro
It's not about the money.
It's about the abject humiliation and embarrassment.
I can't even begin to imagine what that does to light a fire under your ass.
And HALF the players experience this. How utterly brutal.
For Futures and lower tier tours, it absolutely IS about the money. The money probably keeps potential stars from ever getting onto the map.

Losing is losing, by the time they reach pro, they've lost many more matches than either you or I will probably ever play, so they and their families are used to it.

Think about what you spend on tennis - a motivated rec scrub (no offense, but I hope you take my point). Now imagine what you think you might be able to afford to pay as a parent of a potential future star to get a kid of yours launched into the point where they could get a "scholarship" to some place like the IMG Academy (formerly Bollettieri). I'm not asking you to name the number, just think about it... and then realize that it takes many times that amount just to keep an adult moving through the ranks of the lower tours... now think about sponsorship money, endorsement money, tournament winnings, and how difficult all of that is to come by.

Osaka went to Japan because there was no sponsorship for her in the US.

As for the slicing/junker - that's rule #1 of tennis - give your opponent what they are not comfortable with, period.
 

Cawlin

Semi-Pro
Oh, I know the numbers.
I know guys who spend $40,000 a year on their kid's development.
IMG charges $80,000 a year.
Yeah man... so you know... the money is a real and potentially hugely limiting thing - not maybe for someone like Osaka right now, but the sacrifices that people around her had to make to get her here are probably fairly stomach turning for most of us.
 

sureshs

Bionic Poster
Met a guy this weekend at the club whose 11 year old daughter is making waves and already receiving some USTA money and free training at the NTCs. He wants her to go pro. His wife has a job, so he quit his job and is chaperoning her all over the place. He has a scouting report on every good girl in the area, of whom he speaks in demeaning terms. He says he quit his job because it is now or never for his daughter to go pro.
 

MathGeek

Hall of Fame
Let this be motivation for those who refuse to play in tournaments an hour away because of the "inconvenience"
There is only one Wimbledon, and pros can't really play more than one sport.

Tennis is only one of several sports I enjoy - shooting, fishing, Ultimate, mountain biking.

Most weekends, there are competitive shooting events at a range about 20 minutes away. One of my favorite freshwater lakes is 15 minutes. My favorite mountain biking trail is 10 minutes away. And most of those events are much cheaper than tennis tournaments.

I don't mind paying for one or two $50 tourneys a year and even driving an hour or more to them. But there are lots of tennis options cheaper and closer most weekends. And there are even more appealing sports options cheap, close, and fun.
 
Met a guy this weekend at the club whose 11 year old daughter is making waves and already receiving some USTA money and free training at the NTCs. He wants her to go pro. His wife has a job, so he quit his job and is chaperoning her all over the place. He has a scouting report on every good girl in the area, of whom he speaks in demeaning terms. He says he quit his job because it is now or never for his daughter to go pro.
I wonder what the wife's income is.
I predict they get divorced once the wife gets sick of being the breadwinner
 

Cawlin

Semi-Pro
She left crying because her opponent kept slicing
and not hitting the way her coach feeds her easy topspin balls in practice! LOL
Well, ultimately, probably true.

As a pro, though, you have to be tough enough to deal with that. Right now, Osaka is dealing with the very real potential of being just a flash in the pan. If she doesn't get her act together, that's what will happen to her.
 

sureshs

Bionic Poster
I wonder what the wife's income is.
I predict they get divorced once the wife gets sick of being the breadwinner
She is a software engineer. They have one more daughter who is elder. My main concern is that the elder one may not get money for college. And what the younger one will feel when she realizes the implication of her father giving up his job for her.
 
Agreed.

She left because she's not mentally tough yet and that lack of mental toughness and her lack of tennis-smarts are why she lost.
Isn't it mindblowing that one can suggest that the #1 ranked tennis player in the world .... multi GRAND SLAM winnner......does not have tennis smarts?
That even the BEST of the BEST have no idea what they are doing.

Tennis is truly the most insane thing I have ever encountered.
No wonder it sends most people spiraling into gibbering madness.
 

Cawlin

Semi-Pro
Isn't it mindblowing that one can suggest that the #1 ranked tennis player in the world .... multi GRAND SLAM winnner......does not have tennis smarts?
That even the BEST of the BEST have no idea what they are doing.

Tennis is truly the most insane thing I have ever encountered.
No wonder it sends most people spiraling into gibbering madness.
Well, I wouldn't say that she has no idea of what she's doing... I would say she needs work. However, I would say that the situation might be an indication of maybe the depth or the shallowness of the competition at thie highest ranks of the WTA...

The decline of the Williams, and Sharapova have left a rather turbulent situation in their wake.
 

ShaunS

Semi-Pro
Isn't it mindblowing that one can suggest that the #1 ranked tennis player in the world .... multi GRAND SLAM winnner......does not have tennis smarts?
That even the BEST of the BEST have no idea what they are doing.
It is mind blowing to think 'someone' would be crazy enough to suggest the (formerly) top ranked person in the world at anything knows less than some hack... but it's not even the craziest 'someone' has said on here.
 
Isn't it a given that an internet 3.0 with ATP forehand will dominate even the #1 WTA moonballer ?
Around these parts, any 3.0 can crush moonballs for winners from anywhere on the court.
 
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Cawlin

Semi-Pro
For Osaka, the money is irrelevant.
She's a multi-millionaire.
That's not why she left the interview crying
So I've been thinking about this remark a little more, and had the following to add:

For Osaka, the money certainly seemed to be potentially quite relevant when she fired 2018 WTA coach of the year right after winning the AO... perhaps there were other reasons for firing him than money (after winning the ATP honors and her winning two slams, I'm pretty sure there was a raise request) and perhaps there were also other reasons for her leaving the interview crying...
 
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Right, giving 10% of millions to a coach is one matter,
losing a week's worth of airfare/hotels is another.
I wonder what the week costs her.
 

Cawlin

Semi-Pro
Right, giving 10% of millions to a coach is one matter,
losing a week's worth of airfare/hotels is another.
I wonder what the week costs her.
I wonder what it cost her in prize money, future endorsement prospects, and mentally, over the rest of her career...
 

Tenez!

Professional
It's about the abject humiliation and embarrassment.
That's foolish. The Slams are the most prestigeous events in the history of tennis.
Just making it to the R1 places you in the ~100 best players in the world.

Remember there are qualifiers, and qualifiers to the qualifiers! Some have had to win 6 matches just to enter R1.

Nothing embarrassing about losing against a seed. Just a small hiccough on the path the success.
 

Dartagnan64

G.O.A.T.
At this level anyone can beat anyone on any surface. It is what it is. Osaka's game has been off for a while now so this is absolutely not a shocker. In the WTA, players rise and fall all the time. Serena was the last dominant female player. Osaka is morphing into Garbine Muguruzu. Unbeatable one tournament, a first round casualty the next.

Anyway, onto the OP's original posit, that losing in the first round is terrible. To that I say, "That's why you enter doubles and mixed doubles in slams." That way you get some more time in on the courts if your singles goes south.

That and the fact that Wimbledon is essentially the last grass event, it's no biggie to fly home and start prepping early for hardcourt season.
 

kramer woodie

Professional
Even if it cost her $30K to arrange all that, she still came out ahead given that a 1st round loser makes over $56,000 US.
Gemini

She may earn 56,000$ for losing in the first round. However she will not keep it. Why? Taxes on income, both in the UK and the U.S.. Of course, she
will have legal deductions to offset some of the taxes, but I imagine paying for family or friends would not be legal. She will lose money on the blow-out in the first round. Plus, does she stay in England, until her scheduled return flight and continue to incur expense, or does she leave on the next
flight out. Do her guests and family stay at her expense?

Look, I see her as another possible potential Bouchard at this point in time. Has the rest of the WTA gone to school watching her match video, to establish a game plan to neutralize her? Can she raise her level of play to become more constant? Does she have the mental toughness to strike back and remain on top?

Only time and matches will tell the story!!! It is lonely on top, as every opponent under you wants to take you down, down, down!!!

Aloha
 

kramer woodie

Professional
Even if it cost her $30K to arrange all that, she still came out ahead given that a 1st round loser makes over $56,000 US.
Gemini

As an after though, I don't know if she received an appearance fee. All major tournaments pay appearance fees to top players to attract top players, thus the tournaments receive more money from sponsors, because the tournament sells more tickets and viewership revenue. Top players will go where the money is and appearance money helps cover players expenses. Appearance money is taxable also.

Now, if she cannot get into the quarterfinals regularly, that appearance money will dry up. For example, Dustin Brown won't receive appearance money and he will have to qualify to even play in the first round. That means he will have to play 2-3 qualifying matches to even enter into the first round. For him it's all out of pocket, unless he has financial backing.

Also is the first round pay in USD or Euros? I don't know, do you? Regardless, countries want their (what they consider fair) taxes on income!!!

Just think John Lennon might be still alive if he had remained in England. He and Ringo left the high tax rates of England at the time of Prime Minister Wilson (a liberal, progressive, Labor Party Leader) because the tax rate for the wealthy in England was 85%, plus a penalty tax of another
15% on top of the 85%. Just think they wanted 98% of what you created, so that the non-creators would give their vote to the Labor Party. Envy,
jealousy, and laziness as a mass activity. Ringo went to Monaco. George and Paul set up public stock ownership music companies, I seem to remember to avoid the high taxes and remained in England.

Enough, of the story government confiscation deemed to be in the name of fairness. It will be interesting to see if Osaka can overcome the difficulties and remain the top player.

O' please remember that those who call for higher taxes are not stopped from paying more than their required amount. Each an every taxpayer
can volunteer to send it a larger check, if they so desire for government to get more money. It seems that that higher tax rate is for other people,
not them calling for higher rates. Let those and those like them set an example and pay more than they owe first, so that I might be persuaded to pay more.

Aloha
 
Just think John Lennon might be still alive if he had remained in England. He and Ringo left the high tax rates of England at the time of Prime Minister Wilson (a liberal, progressive, Labor Party Leader) because the tax rate for the wealthy in England was 85%, plus a penalty tax of another
15% on top of the 85%. Just think they wanted 98% of what you created, so that the non-creators would give their vote to the Labor Party. Envy,
jealousy, and laziness as a mass activity. Ringo went to Monaco. George and Paul set up public stock ownership music companies, I seem to remember to avoid the high taxes and remained in England.
Let me tell you how it will be
There's one for you, nineteen for me
'Cuz I'm the tax man!
Yeah, I'm the tax man.

Should 5% appear to small
[ah ah, Mr. Wilson]
Be thankful I don't take it all
[ah ah, Mr. Heath]
'Cuz I'm the tax man!
Yeah, I'm the tax man.
 

OnTheLine

Hall of Fame
Anyway, onto the OP's original posit, that losing in the first round is terrible. To that I say, "That's why you enter doubles and mixed doubles in slams." That way you get some more time in on the courts if your singles goes south.

That and the fact that Wimbledon is essentially the last grass event, it's no biggie to fly home and start prepping early for hardcourt season.
I am now trying to picture the one-dimensional baseliner Osaka playing doubles. It would be a disaster.

She is a brilliant ball striker when she is on .... but she won't leave the back court unless she has absolutely no choice.
 

Tenez!

Professional
Just think John Lennon might be still alive if he had remained in England. He and Ringo left the high tax rates of England at the time of Prime Minister Wilson (a liberal, progressive, Labor Party Leader) because the tax rate for the wealthy in England was 85%, plus a penalty tax of another 15% on top of the 85%. Just think they wanted 98% of what you created, so that the non-creators would give their vote to the Labor Party. Envy, jealousy, and laziness as a mass activity. Ringo went to Monaco. George and Paul set up public stock ownership music companies, I seem to remember to avoid the high taxes and remained in England.
I'm sure there's some intelligence in you, despite what you wrote.

When you don't know the difference between average tax rate and marginal tax rate, you don't have to show it.
When you don't realise that building a country, vetting safe technologies, building roads and subsidising schools costs billions, you don't have to show it.
When you can't see that Monaco is the real thief here, since its entire society is based on harbouring rich healthy expatriates who grew up (cost) their home country until adulthood when they no longer wanted to return the favour, you don't have to show it.
 

sureshs

Bionic Poster
I watched the match and the first set went to a TB. It is not the disaster people are imagining it to be.
 

sureshs

Bionic Poster
I am now trying to picture the one-dimensional baseliner Osaka playing doubles. It would be a disaster.
She will learn and improve. That is part of the development of a pro. Fed did not know how to hit over the ball on his backhand till Nadal forced him to, and now he is among the best 1 handers in topspin.
 

Dan Huben

Semi-Pro
It's easy to forget how tough a situation we ask athletes to be in.

Osaka is only 21 years old. There were a lot of expectations on her, as she's rolling with a new coach on a surface that isn't her best, against an opponent who she's struggled with in the past. The majors are the pinnacle of the the sport, and she's got to go out minutes after losing to discuss her failure. There are no teammates here to band together. Just a young woman and a room full of people to ask why she failed.

This isn't Kyrgios being disrespectful to fans, opponents, and employees. It's a young woman who's exceptionally frustrated with herself.

I shudder to think the kind of behavior you would've gotten from me at age 21 following a huge loss.
Your average marine has to make more snap decisions, and face more consequences than bankruptcy or hurt feelings all before the age of 21. It’s ok to be hurt, have tantrums and retreat to a private setting getting prepped for whatever tomorrow looks like. I will not take her age as a reason. She is who she is. Like many of us a completely over-mommied softee who equates a victory in tennis to some higher plane of existence. What is going on is not that big of a deal.

Looking at the team hugs after games, yes some players cry in defeat but many others are hugging and smiling. The fans are the idiots having fist fights in the streets. Players react as they react.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
 

ShaunS

Semi-Pro
Your average marine has to make more snap decisions, and face more consequences than bankruptcy or hurt feelings all before the age of 21.
I don't these kinds of comparisons are useful. It's obvious that people who "work" in life or death situations have more on the line, but it doesn't make the challenges other people face meaningless.

I also don't relish the idea of having a deeper discussion on here about how good of a job our military actually does of training our servicemen/women for their experiences. One-fourth of active duty members in the US display mental health problems (PTSD, depression, etc). Veterans are 1.5x more likely to take their own life than the general population as well. The only positive takeaway is that the overall mental health problem is clear, and there are lots of people who are working to improve it.

I will not take her age as a reason. She is who she is. Like many of us a completely over-mommied softee who equates a victory in tennis to some higher plane of existence.
Everyone's entitled to their opinion. I still think it's a wild overreach to accuse someone of being "soft" because they show emotion in a post match interview.
 
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