mike danny
Bionic Poster
Yes, because Carlos was in his mid to late 30’s
Carlos Alcaraz vs Rafael Nadal after playing their first slam at age 21
- Thread starter Hitman
- Start date
RS
Bionic Poster
M4tchP0int
Rookie
we might see something hilarious , like carlos having 10-12 slams up until 27 yo when djokovic had only 6 slams. he might be 5 slams ahead and finish 5 slams behind Novak after turning 27 lol.
Not as dramatic as what it was For Nadal-Djokovic-Federer at the end of 2010 but still.
Sport
G.O.A.T.
LOL, no.
Raz lost to 37 and a half years old Novak at the AO in 4 sets, while Nadal pushed peak 24 years old Novak to 5 in Melbourne.
Besides, Raz is notoriously struggling on hard, he did nothing noteworthy in 2023, 2024 and (so far) 2025 in Slams on hard courts. To assume Raz is better on hard than Nadal is incompatible with empiral evidence.
Sport
G.O.A.T.
Likely on grass because he's already on 2 W titles at age 21, yeah, I can buy it.
Now, likely on hard courts is too much of a stretch. The guy lost in 4 against geriatric Novak in Australia, while Nadal pushed peak Nkvak to 5 in Melbourne in 2012. If Raz can't beat geriatric Novak, how can he win 6+ Slams on hard against the field? He's also lost to the likes of Medvedev and Zverev in Slams on hard. I don't think it's that likely that Raz wins 6+ Slams on hard in the Sinner era, but we'll see.
nolefam_2024
Bionic Poster
Calling Djokovic geriatric will gain you nothing. I see how nole rolled over opponents in Miami and shanghai on hc anyway. Only guy who is better than him on hc seems sinner.
The Blond Blur
G.O.A.T.
Imagine still calling RAFA the “clay courter” when he has the DCGS, 10 MS1000s on HC, the OSG on HC, won Queens and Wimby back to back etc. Calling him a clay courter not only makes Fedovic look bad, it makes the posters who call him that look even more ignorant than they already are.
M4tchP0int
Rookie
cherry picking is not empirical evidence that can be used to validate your theory. I can say Alcaraz is 5-2 on HC vs Sinner and therefore that with the added bonus of 2 year advantage, Raz will have at least 6 HC slams vs someone he owns as a big match player. Thinking Raz will win 2 AO and 4 USO , which means 3 more USO in practice is not extraordinary. let's say he has 15 slams years of competitive opportunities (20yo to 35yo). He " just need" to win 5 out of 30 slams opportunities and perhaps a bit less by taking injuries into account. Winning 1 out of 6 slams in average without Novak and Roger and with only a HC specialist with fragile stamina and Body is quite conservative actually. The only thing we don't know is who he is gonna face on HC after the next 5 years.
nolefam_2024
Bionic Poster
Yes. Raz last year bulldozed his way past sinner at both iw and Beijing.
The_Order
G.O.A.T.
More non-clay slams than anyone apart from Pete, Fed and Djok...
And he got most of those by beating prime Fed and Djok...
Otacon
Hall of Fame
Fed didn't lose because he was physically exhausted due to his age.
mike danny
Bionic Poster
Age can affect you in other ways too.
DSH
Bionic Poster
Furthermore, he would have won many more titles on hard and grass courts if he hadn't had Federer and Djokovic as opponents.
Otacon
Hall of Fame
He was simply less strong mentally than the other two IMO.
Mustard
Bionic Poster
Federer's approach was different. He'd do the hard work in training and in practice, and would then expect it to all come together on the match court. Nadal and Djokovic were much more point to point players, especially important points. Nadal and Djokovic also differed in that one represented order and the other represented chaos. Nadal grounded things in routines and staying in the present, while Djokovic had a sense of destiny that it was "meant to be". Federer would get frustrated if it didn't all come together as expected. Federer famously said in frustration in the 2011 US Open semi final press conference "How could he (Djokovic) hit a shot like that when match point down?". But the way Djokovic would see it is "How could I NOT hit such a shot at match point down?".
M4tchP0int
Rookie
Lol as if mental issues of Roger appeared suddenly and magically after 30 yo. Losing to Nalbandian in YEC2005, losing to Safin in AO2005 , Losing to Djokovic in Montreal 2007 , losing to Rafa in Rome2006 , to gasquet in MC2005 having MP's. The only time he was clutch and strong mentally to compensate his physical and tenistic decline was in January to April 2017 and even in that period he managed to put the biggest choke of his career against Donskoy doing all kind of absurd things
mike danny
Bionic Poster
Easier to be mentally strong against an older dude.
Besides, Carlos didn’t play them 40+ times so the comparison to Fed is moot
Im(moral) Winner
G.O.A.T.
Fed came from an injury to play the 2005 YEC. He was on crutches beforehand.
Otacon
Hall of Fame
Indeed, this turned into a sort of reductio ad absurdum, given that Alcaraz wouldn't trade his two Wimbledon final wins for all his losses to Djokovic.
TheGoldenEra1990’s
Hall of Fame
Thought this argument would be put to rest after alcaraz continues to lose to grandad Nole across two difference surfaces and players like Rune and Draper in big matches
messiahrobins
G.O.A.T.
Nadal's career gets more GOATY as time marches on, something i did say would happen years ago.
Mustard
Bionic Poster
Nadal was doing it as a teenager against 22-24 year old Federer
mike danny
Bionic Poster
You know what I mean.Nadal was doing it as a teenager against 22-24 year old Federer
mike danny
Bionic Poster
You started off the argument by saying Carlos beat Djokovic in 2 Wimb finals which the grass GOAT could not do while also omitting that said grass GOAT wasn't 16 years younger than Djokovic and Carlos hadn't played him 50 times to start getting a mental block.
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