Discussion in 'Former Pro Player Talk' started by keithchircop, Jul 29, 2007.
I don't know if someone posted it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E_RqYHs-1vY
bill mckay... look around, we are in the tabernacle of tennis
...around 1hr 5mins you see a 21 stroke rally...on fast grass.
Goosehead, I heard Bud Collins mention the "tabernacle of tennis" in that 1978 Wimbledon final video. I do agree that players like Gonzalez, Rosewall, Laver, Borg, Lendl, Connors, McEnroe, and even Agassi and Sampras, would be helped in many ways by the new racquets, strings, shoes, etc. Then, you have the different court dynamics with slower hard courts, grass courts at the AELTC which now tend to tilt the odds in favor of aggressive baseliners, fewer big indoor events, and fewer big "unofficial" matches played in addition to the official events. Connors and Borg had very heavy total match schedules and they spread tennis throughout the world. You have different tennis balls, grips and advanced shoes, easier travel conditions and the list goes on. How would each benefit and have to adapt? They were all so skilled talented and many underestimate their fitness level. It is more about the legs these days though, but what about the hands and skill? Yet, with the conditions the past players played under, in many ways, players like Connors, Rosewall, Borg, Laver, and Gonzalez had it tougher than the players of today. No player faced the media frenzy, without all the cushion players have today, like Bjorn Borg did. I'll say it again, you would not want to face prime Rod Laver or Bjorn Borg aided by modern conditions, especially if they had 1 year to get used to the conditions. They would be so tough and dangerous. If you've only seen the modern game and think they would be easy wins, I would say that respectfully you are wrong. If you played back then, you understand how great those players actually were. What great temperament too with players like Rosewall, Laver, and Borg (after his junior days). With them you saw no excessive celebration, hardly ever any real complaints about calls/crowds/opponents/conditions/tournaments. Also there was no negative demeanor and a lot of modesty and deference to the opponent. They exuded quiet grace combined with steely resolve. Such tough customers as well. Let's put it this way, there is a lot of "marketing" of the current players and game. I do enjoy the top players today, but I'm looking forward to having Nadal back in the mix. I've been watching pro tennis closely since about 1977 so I have had the opportunity to watch many of the Open Era greats.
Ivan Lendl vs. John McEnroe in the 1982 U.S. Open semifinal:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&v=f-EYkuNBtgs (See 11:47 with McEnroe and the cameraman! Then Lendl with some great answers post match.)
(Lendl at the Orange Bowl with a Dunlop)
(Sampras with a wood frame!)
Pretty skinny, youthful looking Lendl, not the honed gladiator of the later 80s.
La Gran Willy !
He was still only 22 then and he definitely got more muscular and fit during the next few years of his career as he really focused on fitness. Yet, you see that with most all tennis players and the population in general. Men tend to keep growing and getting stronger until they are about 25. So, players like Rosewall, Laver, Borg, Connors, Lendl, McEnroe and the list goes on, they tended to be both fitter and stronger at 25 versus 20.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iNiIn7ZVSqY (Bjorn Borg vs. Guillermo Vilas in the 1978 French Open Final. Bjorn Borg lost but 32 games the whole tournament, and won the final 6-1, 6-1, 6-3.)
This is a spectacular documentary about Guillermo Vilas:
Great video Vegito. Vilas was a great player. I had the chance to watch him play live on a few occasions here in Houston during the 1980's. He was a very unique player with some great strokes and great fitness. One of my best friends is a huge Vilas fan. At one of the tournaments in the early 80's, my friend spoke to Vilas at River Oaks after watching a practice on red clay. Vilas proceeded to go to his bag and give my friend his Ellesse shirt. That was very nice of him.
The entire match.
US Open Final 1969:
Great ! Vilas is the best.
Pretty good quality video of two GOATs:
Interesting interview with Borg; watch his eyes--
Very interesting thanks you.
Unfortunately they did not overlap in their primes. One was too young, and the other too old.
But still, a fascinating contrast of styles and play.
true hoodjem, but yes this is how tennis is supposed to be played, in my opinion anyway...
I'm with you: such beauty, speed, placement, and best of all--such thought and strategy.
Plenty of power, but that is not the be all and end all.
Maybe the greatest match of Vilas :
I agree morten and hoodjem, that's a great contrast in styles and play, along with plenty of speed and power. They were inarguably two of the greatest ever, both with such skill exhibited in their shotmaking, but also with great athleticism. As a Bjorn Borg fan, there's no other player I admire more than Rod Laver. That's great wood and gut string tennis played by two of the greatest ever, but of course, you had a very young Bjorn Borg (eighteen) and a older Rod Laver (thirty-six). Imagine them playing at the peak of their powers on all surfaces! We also got to see that great WCT match in 1975. With the newest technology, including gut/poly strings and graphite/comp frames and the latest shoes, across all surfaces, including a style of play Borg would thrive with....
(forget about it!)
See Borg vs. Laver here at 10:20
(1975 WCT Finals played at the old Moody Coliseum in Dallas, Texas)
Check out the angle on Laver's backhand at 13:33. How?
And check out Laver's speed on the point that starts at 14:14. Don't tell me he was not fast. Even Borg seems dumbfounded.
Here's some more contemporary, but also great speed:
(At 4:05 a 106 mph forehand.!?)
That's Lew Hoad watching on at 14:40.
I saw that, and thought "Is that Lew Hoad? It sure looks like him."
Watching his protege.
Yes, you know the atmosphere had to be electric with a big crowd, indoors, with big names like Hoad all watching the great Rod Laver versus a player that was possibly the best 18 year old tennis had ever seen, Bjorn Borg. Even beating Laver at 36 was no mean feat for a player as young as 18. That was a big win for Borg as he was coming up the ranks. I agree that seeing them play each other more often would have been great. They played 7 times in "official" matches per the ATP, with a 5-2 edge for the young Borg versus an older Laver, who was still quite great.
Lots of respect on the court out there.
I have been fortunate to have gone through Laver live, but if I was a new era fan and watched his matches against Connors at Las Vegas and against Borg at Dallas, it would be such a huge contrats to current styles, I´d probably be left with no words...
Did he have a lot of STD's then?
Can anyone find some of these matches?
1980 Wimbledon final
1977 wimbledon final
1980 us open final
1981 French open final
1988 Wimbledon fourth round Lendl
2003 us open semi final roddick vs. nalbandian
1982 Wimbledon final
1980 Wimbledon final
1984 French open final
1999 French open final
2000 Australian open semifinal Sampras vs. Agassi
1992 Wimbledon final
2005 Australian open semi finals (both of them)
The Australian Open matches are available at the AO Vault.
^^a lot of those matches are on youtube mac vs lendl French 84 was all in bits but recently its up in just one or two parts..
most of those wimby matches are up too, decent enough quality.
That vault is crap. the Open tournament was a grass court event for twenty televised years.
Yes. You can find matches of AO in the seventies (for exemple Vilas's matches) on others tennis websites, or even on ****.
Connors career highlights:
Bjorn Borg d. John McEnroe 6-3, 6-4 in the 1980 Stockholm Open Final. Thanks to Moose Malloy for posting this in another thread.
video is unavailable
1992 Wimby F is definitely on youtube. Watched it earlier this year. Great match. Great server vs. great returner.
Bjorn Borg d. Jimmy Connors 6-2, 6-3, 6-2 in the 1979 Wimbledon semifina:
See highlights from both 1979 Wimbledon Semifinals: :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qWFKE7enTE (The Borg/Connors SF and also Tanner d. Dupre 6-3, 7-6, 6-3.)
ATP 1977 French Open Final Vilas vs Gottfried, don´t know why the video says "301+ views ":
Is this the same video?
Another gem showed up, and look at the picture quality.
thanks WCT! please continue to post about rare matches you find(Stockholm etc)
Wow, amazing find! I love Båstad. Beautiful town and center court. Actually was there a couple months ago, not for tennis, but just to enjoy a day out and a nice walk when the sun was shining.
Great interview with Guillermo Vilas in a car!:
lolz amazing quality obviously dititally remastered was looking at the 1981 womens final..and the announcer said anyone nearby who wants to watch live should come down as 200 seats are still available..
its only evert-navratilova imagine watching on tv then going down to kooyong and going straight in to watch 2 all time greats in a major final.
Bjorn Borg d. Victor Pecci 6-3,6-1,6-7(6),6-4 (1979 French Open Final)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PH1OCoZbqu4 (full match)
Lendl v McEnroe Hamlet Cup 1991 Semi-Final.
Very good/excellent quality.
(And the posters on the ludicrous thread about greatest passing shots on the GPPD Forum should look at this to see what proper passing shots look like!).
Patrick Rafter video:
And some other guy with "nice-looking strokes."
Nice find hoodjem!
Here is the full January 1980 semifinal match between Bjorn Borg and John McEnroe at the year end Masters YEC played at NY's MSG. I think this match used to be on YT only in parts.
Borg d. McEnroe 6-7, 6-3, 7-6
Not surprised he did not get far. An Edberg wanna-be but little too cocksure and flakey to me and that one hander looks so oldschool.
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