Clip of Connors vs Agassi 1988 US Open Video

Walenty

Professional
Hey all,

I rarely post in the former player section, mainly because I've only been watching tennis since around 2007. However, an older video caught my eye:

(warning: it is from a terrible chris chase yahoo article)

http://sports.yahoo.com/tennis/blog...t=AgEMx.8GHgAzhvUtm2ua1bk4v7YF?urn=ten-wp2252

Most interesting was the dynamic of both an all-American QF night match at the US Open, during a period when it was actually common, and the dynamic of Agassi coming off as the punk kid rising to overtake an aging Connors.

I would say the video reinforced my opinion of Jimmy Connors. The guy's a jerk. I would root against him even back then. Nowadays with Fed and Nadal being as humble, or to some boring, as it gets, you don't see any major gamesmanship or playing the crowd as you would with someone like Jimmy or McEnroe. I certainly don't mind.

Agassi certainly wasn't without his faults, I wasn't even born when this match took place during his "rebellious" years, but at least in the end he comes off a very zen-like player; very well-headed.

Looking back on videos of Connors, McEnroe, and watching Americans like Roddick and Gimelstob being their immature selves, it's almost karmic justice that we don't have any top players now. Harrison looks to possibly turn out the same way.

Anyway, this wasn't very coherent, but I'd like to hear your thoughts on the seeming brashness of American players or how these past rivalries compare to rivalries today.
 
Hey all,

I rarely post in the former player section, mainly because I've only been watching tennis since around 2007. However, an older video caught my eye:

(warning: it is from a terrible chris chase yahoo article)

http://sports.yahoo.com/tennis/blog...t=AgEMx.8GHgAzhvUtm2ua1bk4v7YF?urn=ten-wp2252

Most interesting was the dynamic of both an all-American QF night match at the US Open, during a period when it was actually common, and the dynamic of Agassi coming off as the punk kid rising to overtake an aging Connors.

I would say the video reinforced my opinion of Jimmy Connors. The guy's a jerk. I would root against him even back then. Nowadays with Fed and Nadal being as humble, or to some boring, as it gets, you don't see any major gamesmanship or playing the crowd as you would with someone like Jimmy or McEnroe. I certainly don't mind.

Agassi certainly wasn't without his faults, I wasn't even born when this match took place during his "rebellious" years, but at least in the end he comes off a very zen-like player; very well-headed.

Looking back on videos of Connors, McEnroe, and watching Americans like Roddick and Gimelstob being their immature selves, it's almost karmic justice that we don't have any top players now. Harrison looks to possibly turn out the same way.

Anyway, this wasn't very coherent, but I'd like to hear your thoughts on the seeming brashness of American players or how these past rivalries compare to rivalries today.
Hello Walenty, it's nice you''re taking an interest in tennis from the past. Let me note a few things though:

Yes, Connors was a jerk, no doubt about it. On the other hand, Agassi is probably pretty close behind in the jerk department...maybe worse....and unlike Connors, tries desperately to hide it behind a very hypocritical Saint Agassi act. In the match you're referring to, Agassi was still doing his: I'm a fun-loving Christian boy act...which would begin to implode the very next year. Although after the match, he would get criticized for claiming he predicted he would beat Jimmy more easily, and was surprised Connors was that tough. At the time, when the criticism hit...Agassi backpeddled and said that it really wasn't a prediction, that he hadn't meant it that way, that it was a compliment (a story he was still maintaining a year later), but of course, that wasn't true. It was prediction, and he said it in the hopes of humiliating Connors. He hated Connors, and was actually seething that the crowd was pulling for the legend to win. So I think your perception of him being "zen-like" and "well-headed" is not very accurate.

I'm also not sure why you would characterize Federer and Nadal as being so "humble". Federer is certainly not, although granted, he hides it 95% of the time; more and more however, people are beginning to see just how arrogant yet insecure he is. Nadal is VERY well behaved in interviews, but his on-court behavior (though nicely toned down his youth), is hardly without gamesmanship. In fact, I don't remember a player who's entire on-court schtick (by this I mean, his routines, his running around in warm-up, the snarls, the fist pumps, etc) is quite as contrived and designed to intimidate.

However, I certainly agree that they are much better behaved in general than a Connors of Mac, however, I certainly think the previous generation of Americans like Chang, Courier, Sampras, Washington, Wheaton, etc .....were at the least, as sportsmanlike.

Roddick is really not poorly behaved at all these days. In fact, I'd say his sportsmanship on court is at worst: average; with his sportsmanship in interviews being: excellent.
 

jrepac

Hall of Fame
US Players

Hello Walenty, it's nice you''re taking an interest in tennis from the past. Let me note a few things though:

Yes, Connors was a jerk, no doubt about it. On the other hand, Agassi is probably pretty close behind in the jerk department...maybe worse....and unlike Connors, tries desperately to hide it behind a very hypocritical Saint Agassi act. In the match you're referring to, Agassi was still doing his: I'm a fun-loving Christian boy act...which would begin to implode the very next year. Although after the match, he would get criticized for claiming he predicted he would beat Jimmy more easily, and was surprised Connors was that tough. At the time, when the criticism hit...Agassi backpeddled and said that it really wasn't a prediction, that he hadn't meant it that way, that it was a compliment (a story he was still maintaining a year later), but of course, that wasn't true. It was prediction, and he said it in the hopes of humiliating Connors. He hated Connors, and was actually seething that the crowd was pulling for the legend to win. So I think your perception of him being "zen-like" and "well-headed" is not very accurate.

I'm also not sure why you would characterize Federer and Nadal as being so "humble". Federer is certainly not, although granted, he hides it 95% of the time; more and more however, people are beginning to see just how arrogant yet insecure he is. .

I agree with you! Both of them were jerks, Jimmy sometimes off the charts...but they were entertaining. Andre wore many "faces" for the press, I never could quite figure out where he was coming from, in all honesty. But, he was no saint by any stretch. And, your point about Federer, I think is quite true. He is quietly arrogant, if there is such a thing. Frankly, I'd prefer a bit more of this kind of spark in today's game, not less of it. Friction between the players always made people want to watch a match.

I remember this '88 QF fairly well. I think it might've been different if Jimmy had won the 2nd set. But, I also recall being incredibly frustrated in how he took on Agassi; he seemed to believe he could outhit him, which really made no sense to me. Not that Jimmy was a lightweight, by any stretch--he was still Top 10 at 36yrs old---but Andre was a 19 (?) year old kid who simply crushed the ball. Strategy wise, it made no sense and I always felt Connors played better from a strategy perspective in his later years, in most cases, but not this match.

Interestingly, when they met in future exos, and in the USO QF a year later, Jimmy played Andre far differently and with much greater success. He took the ball even earlier than he usually did and came in on nearly every short ball from Andre. This was a far better strategy against someone like Agassi.
 
Hello Walenty, it's nice you''re taking an interest in tennis from the past. Let me note a few things though:

I'm also not sure why you would characterize Federer and Nadal as being so "humble". Federer is certainly not, although granted, he hides it 95% of the time; more and more however, people are beginning to see just how arrogant yet insecure he is. Nadal is VERY well behaved in interviews, but his on-court behavior (though nicely toned down his youth), is hardly without gamesmanship. In fact, I don't remember a player who's entire on-court schtick (by this I mean, his routines, his running around in warm-up, the snarls, the fist pumps, etc) is quite as contrived and designed to intimidate.

However, I certainly agree that they are much better behaved in general than a Connors of Mac, however, I certainly think the previous generation of Americans like Chang, Courier, Sampras, Washington, Wheaton, etc .....were at the least, as sportsmanlike.
I was very impressed with Courier's demeanor after he lost the RG 1993 Final. Classy Courier http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cCF-Q-0_r60
 

Walenty

Professional
Hello Walenty, it's nice you''re taking an interest in tennis from the past. Let me note a few things though:

Yes, Connors was a jerk, no doubt about it. On the other hand, Agassi is probably pretty close behind in the jerk department...maybe worse....and unlike Connors, tries desperately to hide it behind a very hypocritical Saint Agassi act. In the match you're referring to, Agassi was still doing his: I'm a fun-loving Christian boy act...which would begin to implode the very next year. Although after the match, he would get criticized for claiming he predicted he would beat Jimmy more easily, and was surprised Connors was that tough. At the time, when the criticism hit...Agassi backpeddled and said that it really wasn't a prediction, that he hadn't meant it that way, that it was a compliment (a story he was still maintaining a year later), but of course, that wasn't true. It was prediction, and he said it in the hopes of humiliating Connors. He hated Connors, and was actually seething that the crowd was pulling for the legend to win. So I think your perception of him being "zen-like" and "well-headed" is not very accurate.

I'm also not sure why you would characterize Federer and Nadal as being so "humble". Federer is certainly not, although granted, he hides it 95% of the time; more and more however, people are beginning to see just how arrogant yet insecure he is. Nadal is VERY well behaved in interviews, but his on-court behavior (though nicely toned down his youth), is hardly without gamesmanship. In fact, I don't remember a player who's entire on-court schtick (by this I mean, his routines, his running around in warm-up, the snarls, the fist pumps, etc) is quite as contrived and designed to intimidate.

However, I certainly agree that they are much better behaved in general than a Connors of Mac, however, I certainly think the previous generation of Americans like Chang, Courier, Sampras, Washington, Wheaton, etc .....were at the least, as sportsmanlike.

Roddick is really not poorly behaved at all these days. In fact, I'd say his sportsmanship on court is at worst: average; with his sportsmanship in interviews being: excellent.
Very nice post.

I agree with a lot of things you mentioned. I probably should have clarified about Fed and Nadal, their humbleness is mainly either on the court or off, not both. Off the court Fed has always taken stabs at players who beat him with backhanded compliments and such. (Berdych Wimby 10' for just one example) Nadal also does use gamesmanship with MTO's and such. I suppose they both, like most players today, cover up most signs of their dislike for other players, and when they do show it, it is well-calculated. Not so much the case for someone like Connors.

Like I mentioned, all I've ever really seen of Agassi live was of his last few matches, right before retirement. With his book and everything it is kind of easy to see his faults, he definitely has them. I suppose for me it's still easier to like a player like that than someone who complains ad nauseum on the court. That is why no matter how much I try to like Roddick, I just can't. Off the court he's great, on the court it's expected for him to whine whenever he starts losing.

Those are just a few Americans though. The rest are fine. However, Connors, McEnroe, Roddick have all been the most high-profile American at one point or another, which is why I feel their attitudes were embraced, to my dismay.
 

Nadal_Power

Semi-Pro
Article about that

In the quarterfinals of the U.S. Open, Agassi beat the 36-year-old Connors 6-2, 7-6, 6-1 and did something previously believed to be impossible: He infuriated both McEnroe and Connors in the same evening. Early in the third set, Agassi mimicked McEnroe's rocking-anteater service motion and then grinned smack at Mac, who was sitting in a courtside box with his wife, Tatum. She doubled over laughing—it was funny—but the man of the house just glared.

Following the match, Agassi told the press how he had predicted to a friend he would beat Connors "three, three and three, but I didn't know Jimmy would have that much in him."

"That was a bad mistake," replied Connors. "I'll remember that. I'll play him again. Hell, I've followed guys to the end of the earth." Then Jimbo softened: "Now I don't think I'll follow him. I'm not begging for respect. It's a war zone out there. I enjoy playing guys who could be my children. Maybe he's one of them. I spent a lot of time in Vegas."
 

volleygirl

Semi-Pro
Roddick is really not poorly behaved at all these days. In fact, I'd say his sportsmanship on court is at worst: average; with his sportsmanship in interviews being: excellent.


I disagree on Roddick. He acts nice as long as things are going his way on the court but as soon as he gets to a point where hes getting beaten, then he turns into the biggest arse on the ATP. The way he treats ball boys and girls is embarassing and then he berates the chair umpire even when a replay shows he was wrong and the line judges were correct.

Hes also embarassing in interviews after losses, acting like every question he receives was asked by someone from Mars.
 

HBK4life

Professional
I disagree on Roddick. He acts nice as long as things are going his way on the court but as soon as he gets to a point where hes getting beaten, then he turns into the biggest arse on the ATP. The way he treats ball boys and girls is embarassing and then he berates the chair umpire even when a replay shows he was wrong and the line judges were correct.

Hes also embarassing in interviews after losses, acting like every question he receives was asked by someone from Mars.

Had a friend who was a volunteer driver for the Davis Cup this past weak and stated Andy was the biggest Ahole she ever saw.
 

Gizo

Hall of Fame
The 1989 US Open quarter-final between Connors and Agassi was eventful as well. Agassi blatantly tanked the 3rd set of that match, so that he could record the first 5 set victory of his career. After losing the 3rd set 6-0, he pointed 5 fingers towards Bollettieri.
 

urban

Legend
Becker once said, that you do everything on the court to win. Becker himself was no slouch in gamesmanship. Even Sampras had the bad habit of faking illness or fatigue on court. Someone mentioned Wheaton. Wasn't he the guy who went into a near fist fight at the net with Gilbert?
 

Chopin

Hall of Fame
Datacipher's analysis errs once again. Agassi was troubled in his youth and was a jerk for a number of years on the court, but no one save Data will deny that he genuinely did change his behavior on the court as he matured. Connor was consistently a jerk from the first day of his career to his retirement, as evidenced by the OP's video. Frankly, to suggest that Agassi and Connors are in the same league of unsportsman behavior, as Data does, shows a great bias.
 

TMF

Talk Tennis Guru
Datacipher's analysis errs once again. Agassi was troubled in his youth and was a jerk for a number of years on the court, but no one save Data will deny that he genuinely did change his behavior on the court as he matured. Connor was consistently a jerk from the first day of his career to his retirement, as evidenced by the OP's video. Frankly, to suggest that Agassi and Connors are in the same league of unsportsman behavior, as Data does, shows a great bias.
I once saw a highlight video where Connors was going crazy on court. He was really angry…demanded that they replace the chair umpire. He stop playing and screamed straight at the umpire "OUT!", "OUT!", "OUT!"...

It must be really tough to be an umpire during those day.
 

jrepac

Hall of Fame
Very nice post.

I agree with a lot of things you mentioned. I probably should have clarified about Fed and Nadal, their humbleness is mainly either on the court or off, not both. Off the court Fed has always taken stabs at players who beat him with backhanded compliments and such. (Berdych Wimby 10' for just one example) Nadal also does use gamesmanship with MTO's and such. I suppose they both, like most players today, cover up most signs of their dislike for other players, and when they do show it, it is well-calculated. Not so much the case for someone like Connors.

Like I mentioned, all I've ever really seen of Agassi live was of his last few matches, right before retirement. With his book and everything it is kind of easy to see his faults, he definitely has them. I suppose for me it's still easier to like a player like that than someone who complains ad nauseum on the court. That is why no matter how much I try to like Roddick, I just can't. Off the court he's great, on the court it's expected for him to whine whenever he starts losing.

Those are just a few Americans though. The rest are fine. However, Connors, McEnroe, Roddick have all been the most high-profile American at one point or another, which is why I feel their attitudes were embraced, to my dismay.
Sampras, perhaps our very best American player, was never a whiner. He kept a cool demeanor on and off the court, I think. Rarely did he reveal his emotional state.
 

jrepac

Hall of Fame
Article about that
a very arrogant quote from a young Andre and a vengeful, but humorous response from Connors:twisted:

Really, Connors had absolutely nothing to prove to anyone at that stage of his career. He was only a few years removed from his last USO title and was still considered a top player. He was pretty much playing for pride and little else at this stage. Andre was just starting out and could not appreciate Connor's accomplishments at that young age.

I think Andre eventually knew how Jimmy felt, when he too, became the elder statesman of the game. The shoe was clearly on the other foot when Andre hit his mid-30s and he needed cortisone shots to stay in his matches :)
 

jrepac

Hall of Fame
Datacipher's analysis errs once again. Agassi was troubled in his youth and was a jerk for a number of years on the court, but no one save Data will deny that he genuinely did change his behavior on the court as he matured. Connor was consistently a jerk from the first day of his career to his retirement, as evidenced by the OP's video. Frankly, to suggest that Agassi and Connors are in the same league of unsportsman behavior, as Data does, shows a great bias.
I would not say they are in the same league when it comes to bad behavior, but Andre was very much a brat in his early years. Connors was the king of bad behavior, but he did figure out how to win over the crowds, which made a huge difference in his public perception.
 

jrepac

Hall of Fame
I once saw a highlight video where Connors was going crazy on court. He was really angry…demanded that they replace the chair umpire. He stop playing and screamed straight at the umpire "OUT!", "OUT!", "OUT!"...

It must be really tough to be an umpire during those day.
that had to be the Lipton match vs. Lendl....the all time Jimmy Connors explosion; it was a close, tense match in blazing heat and the call was idiotic, to say the least

And, the umpire was in fact one of the all time worst....Jeremy Shales......

Connors, Mac and Lendl all had their run ins with him....

I think he was eventually demoted to being merely a linesman, he was that awful.
 

pc1

G.O.A.T.
I once saw a highlight video where Connors was going crazy on court. He was really angry…demanded that they replace the chair umpire. He stop playing and screamed straight at the umpire "OUT!", "OUT!", "OUT!"...

It must be really tough to be an umpire during those day.
Those umpires used to be really badly abused at times. I think one of the worst things I have seen was when a well known umpire named Frank Hammond defaulted Ilie Nastase is his famous match against John McEnroe in the 1979 US Open. Well Nastase was un-defaulted if there is such a word and Hammond was replaced. McEnroe actually was very well behaved during the match and he beat Nastase and won the tournament.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/sports_blog/2009/09/tennis-mcenroe-nastase.html
 
I would not say they are in the same league when it comes to bad behavior, but Andre was very much a brat in his early years. Connors was the king of bad behavior, but he did figure out how to win over the crowds, which made a huge difference in his public perception.
Heh, you know, as I'm sure all regular readers do, that Chopin and TMF"s responses are just the regular attempts at personal attack on me.

Of course, I do not put Andre's "behavior" in the same category. It is a lie to say claim that I said that. I merely said he was a "jerk" of nearly the same magnitude, and in the very same sentence, specified that he hides it (obviously speaking in terms of behavior):

"Agassi is probably pretty close behind in the jerk department...maybe worse....and unlike Connors, tries desperately to hide it behind a very hypocritical Saint Agassi act."

I specifically mentioned Agassi's "jerk" -like behavior in response to the impression that he was "zen-like". As I mentioned, we now know, that in that general, and indeed, in that specific match, he most certainly was not.

You are quite correct though that Connors, while still behaving badly, learned to win over the crowd. In that sense, he and Agassi are again similar, in that Agassi won over the crowd, by hiding his behavior (which AGAIN...was never in the same class as Connors).

However, that difference is certainly a marked one to me. Connors never really revealed much, but he also didn't really try to mislead very much. His on-court schtick was contrived, but in terms of the underlying attitude, he pretty much said, and always said: hey, this is the way I'm going to be, don't like it? Too bad!
 
a very arrogant quote from a young Andre and a vengeful, but humorous response from Connors:twisted:

Really, Connors had absolutely nothing to prove to anyone at that stage of his career. He was only a few years removed from his last USO title and was still considered a top player. He was pretty much playing for pride and little else at this stage. Andre was just starting out and could not appreciate Connor's accomplishments at that young age.

I think Andre eventually knew how Jimmy felt, when he too, became the elder statesman of the game. The shoe was clearly on the other foot when Andre hit his mid-30s and he needed cortisone shots to stay in his matches :)
Yes....as I mentioned...Agassi backpeddled when the bad press hit, and tried to claim he had not meant it that way. Of course, that was a lie, he meant it exactly as the press portrayed, and really hated Jimmy.

(again...somewhat striking the difference between him and Connors...you can certainly imagine Connors taking a cheap-shot at a player he disliked....but he'd be much less likely to back away from the comment after....I think you could say the man in the crowd was correct...he was a punk!)

The following year, Connors had an interesting reaction as well....Agassi was still trying to smooth over the comment in public a year later, and when Connors was asked about it, he wanted no part of the schmoozing (why would he of course? It made him all the more endearing). Tim Ryan said that Agassi was still trying to worried about the comment and wanted to make sure Jimmy knew it was not a true "prediction" and that he hadn't want to be disrepectful, and asked if Connors was OK with that, and accepted that. Jimmy....LOL....said something like...."oh yeah...that' fine...he's still young...and still in the process of learning what goes over well in the media, and what doesn't....but...I really don't pay attention to what he says to be honest with you! (grinning)....no, he can say say whatever he wants...as long as he can back it up...that's important!"

Heh, pretty astute by Connors, and indeed, showing he knew how to play the role...
 
Very nice post.

I agree with a lot of things you mentioned. I probably should have clarified about Fed and Nadal, their humbleness is mainly either on the court or off, not both. Off the court Fed has always taken stabs at players who beat him with backhanded compliments and such. (Berdych Wimby 10' for just one example) Nadal also does use gamesmanship with MTO's and such. I suppose they both, like most players today, cover up most signs of their dislike for other players, and when they do show it, it is well-calculated. Not so much the case for someone like Connors. .
Yes, I agree...although...I would say Connors was VERY well-calculated....probably much more so than Fed (who's passive-aggressive comments...if calculated...are not well calculated...they are hardly attractive ;-). Connors was calculated not to look calculated...even his "rages" were much more calculate and controlled than a Mac. Connors let it go...usually when he felt it was in his interest....whereas Mac....hated that aspect of himself, but just couldn't seem to control it at all.


Like I mentioned, all I've ever really seen of Agassi live was of his last few matches, right before retirement. With his book and everything it is kind of easy to see his faults, he definitely has them. I suppose for me it's still easier to like a player like that than someone who complains ad nauseum on the court.
That's fair...certainly Agassi's public portrayal of himself was generally very likable. As a long-term, devout fan of Agassi I have the benefit of living through his life and times, following about as closely as anyone could. I think his portrayal has become increasingly hypocritical and contrived over the years. His book for example, while wonderfully written, is full of mistruths, and very blatant omissions....a few long-term Agassi followers on this board have discussed this with me....again...he tried to be very careful how he portrays himself now. What Agassi's true nature is like is a huge topic...won't get into details, but suffice it to say for now, I do not think he is a horrible monster by any means, but he is also far from the evolved, thoughtful, altruistic angel he is sometimes portrayed as. So ironically, as his public image has gotten better and better, it has become increasingly distasteful to me.
 
I remember this '88 QF fairly well. I think it might've been different if Jimmy had won the 2nd set. But, I also recall being incredibly frustrated in how he took on Agassi; he seemed to believe he could outhit him, which really made no sense to me. Not that Jimmy was a lightweight, by any stretch--he was still Top 10 at 36yrs old---but Andre was a 19 (?) year old kid who simply crushed the ball. Strategy wise, it made no sense and I always felt Connors played better from a strategy perspective in his later years, in most cases, but not this match.

Interestingly, when they met in future exos, and in the USO QF a year later, Jimmy played Andre far differently and with much greater success. He took the ball even earlier than he usually did and came in on nearly every short ball from Andre. This was a far better strategy against someone like Agassi.
After that match, somebody (I think Tiriac) wrote an article i read. In it, he said that he had approached Jimmy after and said "why did you play that way?? Way behind the baseline? When you moved up, you had it...but by that time you were getting too tired!"...he said Connors replied "I swear to you, I could not see the ball well". So...I guess that's why Jimmy was falling back more in the court because of...either the lights, or simply not quite having his timing the way he'd like (Jimmy (and many others) sometimes refer to that as seeing the ball well...as I'm sure you know). I agree, that the strategy was disastrous, although somewhat forced by Agassi's game; though, if Connors had been 25, he might well have pulled it off....endurance would not have been such a factor then, and he could have afforded to fall back, and let Agassi run him a bit.

Tiriac then mentioned in his article that he saw an exo a short while later, where Connors did just that against Agassi, and won handily. He said Jimmy came up, took it early, used the pace to hit it back deep and that though Agassi would hit the ball over very very hard a few times in a row, he'd miss on the third or fourth shot, as Jimmy's replies were also coming back quickly. I felt Jimmy also played much smarter at a year end stakes match exo (have mentioned it before a few times on here), though the tennis was patchy there (cold and windy didn't help).

So, you're not the only one who noticed and thought that. I think it's a good call.
 
I disagree on Roddick. He acts nice as long as things are going his way on the court but as soon as he gets to a point where hes getting beaten, then he turns into the biggest arse on the ATP. The way he treats ball boys and girls is embarassing and then he berates the chair umpire even when a replay shows he was wrong and the line judges were correct.

Can you give some examples? I notice Roddick takes a lot of criticism this way, and again, I just haven't seen him do this a lot in recent years. However, that may be because I haven't been following him particularly closely in recent years.

Hes also embarassing in interviews after losses, acting like every question he receives was asked by someone from Mars.
Hmmm.....I always felt he handled the questions quite well in general. Yes, sometimes in a bit of smart-aleck way....but usually with a pretty decent sense of humor. In that sense, I always felt he was one of the better players in terms of handling media. Fluent in english, and having the wit and humor of mainstream North America......
 

Gizo

Hall of Fame
Even in Agassi's later years when he was supposed to be this gentleman 'elder statesman' of the game, there were many examples of bad behaviour by him. These included getting defaulted in San Jose in 1999, refusing to take the microphone and address the crowd after his heavy beating the in the 1999 YEC final, trying to blast a ball at a female linejudge at Wimbledon 2001 against Rafter and walking off the court in a bad mood without the umpire's permission at the 2002 French Open against Ferrero. Even in his final year on the tour, he went into a massive tirade against the officials against Goldstein at Delray Beach.

So basically it is a huge myth to say that Agassi was completely respectful and well behaved during the second period of his career. I imagine can you imagine what the reaction on this board would be, if Federer had refused to address the crowd after one his tournament final defeats to Nadal.
 

Chopin

Hall of Fame
I would not say they are in the same league when it comes to bad behavior, but Andre was very much a brat in his early years. Connors was the king of bad behavior, but he did figure out how to win over the crowds, which made a huge difference in his public perception.
Agreed. The latter is key to Connor's legacy.
 

Chopin

Hall of Fame
Heh, you know, as I'm sure all regular readers do, that Chopin and TMF"s responses are just the regular attempts at personal attack on me.

Of course, I do not put Andre's "behavior" in the same category. It is a lie to say claim that I said that. I merely said he was a "jerk" of nearly the same magnitude, and in the very same sentence, specified that he hides it (obviously speaking in terms of behavior):

"Agassi is probably pretty close behind in the jerk department...maybe worse....and unlike Connors, tries desperately to hide it behind a very hypocritical Saint Agassi act."

I specifically mentioned Agassi's "jerk" -like behavior in response to the impression that he was "zen-like". As I mentioned, we now know, that in that general, and indeed, in that specific match, he most certainly was not.

You are quite correct though that Connors, while still behaving badly, learned to win over the crowd. In that sense, he and Agassi are again similar, in that Agassi won over the crowd, by hiding his behavior (which AGAIN...was never in the same class as Connors).

However, that difference is certainly a marked one to me. Connors never really revealed much, but he also didn't really try to mislead very much. His on-court schtick was contrived, but in terms of the underlying attitude, he pretty much said, and always said: hey, this is the way I'm going to be, don't like it? Too bad!
"ROFL," as you'd say.

"Yes, Connors was a jerk, no doubt about it. On the other hand, Agassi is probably pretty close behind in the jerk department...maybe worse....and unlike Connors, tries desperately to hide it behind a very hypocritical Saint Agassi act."

...a big part of being a jerk who is "maybe worse" than Connors is your behavior on the tennis court; that's what we're talking about here. Yes, Data, someone is a jerk on the "inside," and we know this how? Under your logic, Laver could be the biggest jerk of all time.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lbg6xoS3K3U
 
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...a big part of being a jerk who is "maybe worse" than Connors is your behavior on the tennis court;
Untrue obviously. The criteria by which a "jerk" is judged is obviously rather subjective, however, I don't know anyone other than Chopin who would insist "behavior on the tennis court" is a necessary component. Obviously, there are any number of jerks who have never been on court, numerous amateur players who conduct themselves well on court but are in fact jerks, and of course, even in the pro ranks, we have jerks whose on court behavior is quite good. To give an obvious example, Roscoe Tanner is a far bigger jerk (in the opinion of many I"m sure) than Connors, but his on-court behavior was, in general, quite respectable.
 

Chopin

Hall of Fame
Untrue obviously. The criteria by which a "jerk" is judged is obviously rather subjective, however, I don't know anyone other than Chopin who would insist "behavior on the tennis court" is a necessary component. Obviously, there are any number of jerks who have never been on court, numerous amateur players who conduct themselves well on court but are in fact jerks, and of course, even in the pro ranks, we have jerks whose on court behavior is quite good. To give an obvious example, Roscoe Tanner is a far bigger jerk (in the opinion of many I"m sure) than Connors, but his on-court behavior was, in general, quite respectable.
Data, like the thread about the sons and daughters of professional tennis player, which you turned into a debate about the alleged steroid use of Petr Korda, before the mods deleted your posts after many posters pointed out that you were way, way off-topic, you again try to introduce an "extra-tennis" element to our discussion. Yes, we both know you're trying to hijack this thread to further your agenda, to move your bones (an anti-Agassi agenda). Reading the OP's post, this discussion is clearly about on-court behavior and "gamesmanship" (to quote from the OP), not what's going on inside Agassi's head or in his marriages.
 
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jrepac

Hall of Fame
After that match, somebody (I think Tiriac) wrote an article i read. In it, he said that he had approached Jimmy after and said "why did you play that way?? Way behind the baseline? When you moved up, you had it...but by that time you were getting too tired!"...he said Connors replied "I swear to you, I could not see the ball well". So...I guess that's why Jimmy was falling back more in the court because of...either the lights, or simply not quite having his timing the way he'd like (Jimmy (and many others) sometimes refer to that as seeing the ball well...as I'm sure you know). I agree, that the strategy was disastrous, although somewhat forced by Agassi's game; though, if Connors had been 25, he might well have pulled it off....endurance would not have been such a factor then, and he could have afforded to fall back, and let Agassi run him a bit.

Tiriac then mentioned in his article that he saw an exo a short while later, where Connors did just that against Agassi, and won handily. He said Jimmy came up, took it early, used the pace to hit it back deep and that though Agassi would hit the ball over very very hard a few times in a row, he'd miss on the third or fourth shot, as Jimmy's replies were also coming back quickly. I felt Jimmy also played much smarter at a year end stakes match exo (have mentioned it before a few times on here), though the tennis was patchy there (cold and windy didn't help).

So, you're not the only one who noticed and thought that. I think it's a good call.
Yeah, this has come up before. I know I saw the stakes match; I actually think he may have faced Andre twice in that tourney. I just remember being very impressed on how smartly he played....pretty much turned the tables on Andre by doing what Andre does (i.e. taking it early), perhaps just a shade better. It really threw Andre off his game, as I remember it. That's a strategy that only someone like a Connors (or perhaps Sampras), could pull off against someone like Agassi.

Andre was something of a chameleon over the years; there were all kinds of stories about him and his personal life and his whacky behaviors. Connors, well you pretty much got what you saw...he was blunt and direct, not a lot of subterfuge there, even with all of his on court shenanigans and posturing. But, to his credit, he was always 100% dedicated to his tennis....he took it seriously, where Andre at times seemed like he wanted to run away from it.
 
Data, like the thread about the sons and daughters of professional tennis player, which you turned into a debate about the alleged steroid use of Petr Korda, before the mods deleted your posts after many posters pointed out that you were way, way off-topic, you again try to introduce an "extra-tennis" element to our discussion. Yes, we both know you're trying to hijack this thread to further your agenda, to move your bones (an anti-Agassi agenda). Reading the OP's post, this discussion is clearly about on-court behavior and "gamesmanship" (to quote from the OP), not what's going on inside Agassi's head or in his marriages.
My OP (#2) had several points about a number of players. Your OP (#14) was focused entirely on myself and Agassi. I have subsequently replied to others who wished to discuss other points I made (eg. Roddick). All of these points were came from Walenty's original post.

It's you who are once again resorting to a false, and OT personal attack, since I debunked your last post.
 
Yeah, this has come up before. I know I saw the stakes match; I actually think he may have faced Andre twice in that tourney. I just remember being very impressed on how smartly he played....pretty much turned the tables on Andre by doing what Andre does (i.e. taking it early), perhaps just a shade better. It really threw Andre off his game, as I remember it. That's a strategy that only someone like a Connors (or perhaps Sampras), could pull off against someone like Agassi.
Yes, he did play him twice, but had to default in the final, after beating Agassi in the round robin. It is a strategy that most could not pull off...Connors foot speed, simple, compact strokes, sharp eyes, and feel in his hands were key.

One thing I noticed for sure, is that, even in the stakes match, Connors was hampered by his lowered aerobic capacity. It is almost scary to think of how effective Connors still would have been say..in his last few years, had he the cardiovascular capacity of his youth. (which debunks somewhat the "modern" topspin game) Even when Connors made the semi's at the open, or had sentimental runs elsewhere, one must remember Connors huffing, and puffing, and stalling between points...sometimes between almost every single point. Any player knows how hampered you are in that state....besides reducing footwork, timing, etc, it also restricts strategy so much.

Andre was something of a chameleon over the years; there were all kinds of stories about him and his personal life and his whacky behaviors. Connors, well you pretty much got what you saw...he was blunt and direct, not a lot of subterfuge there, even with all of his on court shenanigans and posturing. But, to his credit, he was always 100% dedicated to his tennis....he took it seriously, where Andre at times seemed like he wanted to run away from it.
I agree. That is another big difference between Connors and Agassi....maybe the biggest. Connors tanked a few matches, but they were very few and far between. Connors definitely gave the fans their money's worth and then some. Perhaps this is also why Connors felt much less of a need to put on such a huge false-front like Agassi.... Connors is great at manipulating his image, and presenting only what he wants you to see, but he sometimes showed the more negative side, because, in the end, he had one unassailable, authentic trait that nobody could argue with: his on-court effort. I think that made him more confident in saying: hey, take it or leave it!
 

jrepac

Hall of Fame
One thing I noticed for sure, is that, even in the stakes match, Connors was hampered by his lowered aerobic capacity. It is almost scary to think of how effective Connors still would have been say..in his last few years, had he the cardiovascular capacity of his youth. (which debunks somewhat the "modern" topspin game) Even when Connors made the semi's at the open, or had sentimental runs elsewhere, one must remember Connors huffing, and puffing, and stalling between points...sometimes between almost every single point. Any player knows how hampered you are in that state....besides reducing footwork, timing, etc, it also restricts strategy so much.
Yeah, as he hit his late 30's there was definitely more of that huffing and puffing. His style of game had to use a lot of energy, I'd think. However he was very good at making the other guy do all the running on the baseline. Again, much like Agassi, Jimmy was a master of moving the ball around the court; really, it was only the top guys like Andre or Lendl (and similar) who could do that kind of thing to HIM. And, he was very fit, by most accounts, if you are to believe what was said about his working on his game and hitting for hours each day. No question, Jimmy put the effort in, and at the end of the day I think that's why so many fans came to appreciate him. Even if he was a complete a#s at times...
 

Chopin

Hall of Fame
My OP (#2) had several points about a number of players. Your OP (#14) was focused entirely on myself and Agassi. I have subsequently replied to others who wished to discuss other points I made (eg. Roddick). All of these points were came from Walenty's original post.

It's you who are once again resorting to a false, and OT personal attack, since I debunked your last post.
Data, I thought it best to make others aware of your anti-Agassi agenda, which you've promoted on a variety of occasions on these Boards. Having done my job, I have little more to say to you in this thread.

Take care of yourself and work hard to let go of your anger.

Best,
Chopin
 

pmerk34

Legend
Hello Walenty, it's nice you''re taking an interest in tennis from the past. Let me note a few things though:

Yes, Connors was a jerk, no doubt about it. On the other hand, Agassi is probably pretty close behind in the jerk department...maybe worse....and unlike Connors, tries desperately to hide it behind a very hypocritical Saint Agassi act. In the match you're referring to, Agassi was still doing his: I'm a fun-loving Christian boy act...which would begin to implode the very next year. Although after the match, he would get criticized for claiming he predicted he would beat Jimmy more easily, and was surprised Connors was that tough. At the time, when the criticism hit...Agassi backpeddled and said that it really wasn't a prediction, that he hadn't meant it that way, that it was a compliment (a story he was still maintaining a year later), but of course, that wasn't true. It was prediction, and he said it in the hopes of humiliating Connors. He hated Connors, and was actually seething that the crowd was pulling for the legend to win. So I think your perception of him being "zen-like" and "well-headed" is not very accurate.

I'm also not sure why you would characterize Federer and Nadal as being so "humble". Federer is certainly not, although granted, he hides it 95% of the time; more and more however, people are beginning to see just how arrogant yet insecure he is. Nadal is VERY well behaved in interviews, but his on-court behavior (though nicely toned down his youth), is hardly without gamesmanship. In fact, I don't remember a player who's entire on-court schtick (by this I mean, his routines, his running around in warm-up, the snarls, the fist pumps, etc) is quite as contrived and designed to intimidate.

However, I certainly agree that they are much better behaved in general than a Connors of Mac, however, I certainly think the previous generation of Americans like Chang, Courier, Sampras, Washington, Wheaton, etc .....were at the least, as sportsmanlike.

Roddick is really not poorly behaved at all these days. In fact, I'd say his sportsmanship on court is at worst: average; with his sportsmanship in interviews being: excellent.
Sorry, but by all accounts Andre was one of the most popular players among his peers on the tour especially as he got older. His comments are telling about how Jimmy acted his entire career.
 

TMF

Talk Tennis Guru
Data, I thought it best to make others aware of your anti-Agassi agenda, which you've promoted on a variety of occasions on these Boards. Having done my job, I have little more to say to you in this thread.

Take care of yourself and work hard to let go of your anger.

Best,
Chopin
Ever since Andre published his book, Data keep hammering at him. Even in a Graf vs. Seles debate, he even go against Graf b/c she is Andres wife.
 

jrepac

Hall of Fame
Sorry, but by all accounts Andre was one of the most popular players among his peers on the tour especially as he got older. His comments are telling about how Jimmy acted his entire career.
Popular? Really? Perhaps at the later stages of his career but I never heard of him being well-liked by anyone in the early to middle stages of his career. Not that it really matters, to be frank. I could care less...I just enjoyed the tennis!
 
Popular? Really? Perhaps at the later stages of his career but I never heard of him being well-liked by anyone in the early to middle stages of his career. Not that it really matters, to be frank. I could care less...I just enjoyed the tennis!
True, I would say he was one of the more disliked players through his early/middle career. In the latter stages, he had solidified his "image" as a elder statesman, though even then, he certainly was not known as a guy who fraternized a great deal.

In any case, I didn't bother responding because the point isn't particularly relevant. Roscoe Tanner was extremely popular among his peers...many of whom stuck by him for decades. (only in recent years have a few spoken about noticing oddities)
 

Gizo

Hall of Fame
Agassi from 1998/1999 onwards, when he was supposed to be this gentlemanly elder statesman for the game, still probably behaved worse in that period than Roddick has done during his career. Yet Agassi received nothing but praise in that time, while Roddick receives nothing but criticism. Very funny.
 
Agassi from 1998/1999 onwards, when he was supposed to be this gentlemanly elder statesman for the game, still probably behaved worse in that period than Roddick has done during his career. Yet Agassi received nothing but praise in that time, while Roddick receives nothing but criticism. Very funny.
Yes, it is interesting, that the mainstream media, not just the fans on this board, gave Agassi a lot of free passes. There were still allegations of tanking and many cases of poor behavior from Andre.


I remember actually seeing Agassi once play Jerome Golmard around 2000. Agassi apparently had an injury, but was playing a tight match with Golmard. Now Golmard doesn't have a particularly good reputation himself, in that he's intense, and certainly does some fist pumping etc. Nevertheless, Golmard didn't do anything particularly offensive that day, he appeared to be pretty intense and excited, as he was edging Agassi out. He did do a some fist pumping, and exhorting, but nothing particularly extraordinary. At one point in late in the match, Agassi hit a very routine winner, turned to Golmard and SCREAMED a primitive, histrionic scream, while pumping his fist. He was mocking golmard, who said nothing. Agassi was RAGING. The crowd, who had been desperately cheering for Agassi to pull through, was...very unconfortable at that point....a weird moment.....everyone was shocked, and nobody was terribly impressed. While I realized that Agassi was on edge, irritated by being on the losing end and Golmard's excitement. It was a bit ridiculous....could one really blame Golmard for being exuberant in pulling off this upset?

Another time, Agassi reputedly repeatedly took out practice racquet after racquet, smashing several in a row, while practicing with Golmard!

Anyways, you can certainly imagine how Roddick would get eviscerated had he done these things!
 

Tshooter

G.O.A.T.
"I think one of the worst things I have seen was when a well known umpire named Frank Hammond defaulted Ilie Nastase is his famous match against John McEnroe in the 1979 US Open."

Frank Hammond was among the first truly "pro" umps and a super nice guy. And the USTA owes him a posthumous apology for removing him from the match.
 
"I think one of the worst things I have seen was when a well known umpire named Frank Hammond defaulted Ilie Nastase is his famous match against John McEnroe in the 1979 US Open."

Frank Hammond was among the first truly "pro" umps and a super nice guy. And the USTA owes him a posthumous apology for removing him from the match.
Yes, that infamous match was a royal screw-up by the administration....poor Hammond deserved better.
 

Cuculain

New User
Connors once said its a war out there, I love this attitude, give me a Mac v Connors grudge match sparks flying brilliant but also passionate tennis over the nicey nicey Fed v Nadal great tennis and we both have great admiration for each other attitude of today..
I prefer Connors upfront on court the other player is the enemy than Agassi's more cynical approach..
Its refreshing to see some passion from Djoko and Murray, showing some emotion on court , totally disagree with Chopin re behaviour on court, I want to see great tennis and some emotion a burning desire to win..If I want to see politeness and etiquette I'll watch bowls.
This is also what made Borg so much fun to watch, because when he played Mac and Connors he was their complete opposite! but if Mac and Connors had been the same as Borg, well we might as well have been watching androids play!
 

Gizo

Hall of Fame
Yes, it is interesting, that the mainstream media, not just the fans on this board, gave Agassi a lot of free passes. There were still allegations of tanking and many cases of poor behavior from Andre.


I remember actually seeing Agassi once play Jerome Golmard around 2000. Agassi apparently had an injury, but was playing a tight match with Golmard. Now Golmard doesn't have a particularly good reputation himself, in that he's intense, and certainly does some fist pumping etc. Nevertheless, Golmard didn't do anything particularly offensive that day, he appeared to be pretty intense and excited, as he was edging Agassi out. He did do a some fist pumping, and exhorting, but nothing particularly extraordinary. At one point in late in the match, Agassi hit a very routine winner, turned to Golmard and SCREAMED a primitive, histrionic scream, while pumping his fist. He was mocking golmard, who said nothing. Agassi was RAGING. The crowd, who had been desperately cheering for Agassi to pull through, was...very unconfortable at that point....a weird moment.....everyone was shocked, and nobody was terribly impressed. While I realized that Agassi was on edge, irritated by being on the losing end and Golmard's excitement. It was a bit ridiculous....could one really blame Golmard for being exuberant in pulling off this upset?

Another time, Agassi reputedly repeatedly took out practice racquet after racquet, smashing several in a row, while practicing with Golmard!
Thanks for this, it's very interesting, and further shows what a huge myth Agassi's gentlemanly image was. There were many occasions in the latter stages of his career when he treated his opponents or the officials with disrespect, yet they were glossed over by the Agassi loving media. He was clever in that he knew whose ass to kiss at exactly the right time.

Anyways, you can certainly imagine how Roddick would get eviscerated had he done these things!
Yes exactly. When Agassi refused to take the microphone and address the crowd after Sampras beat him convincingly in the Year End Championship final in 1999, no-one said anything. Yet if Roddick had done that after one his many tournament final defeats to Federer, imagine the reaction. Or imagine the reaction if Roddick had been defaulted from a match, which happened to Agassi in 1999.
 

Chopin

Hall of Fame
Data's story may not be complete; I don't know, but you boys sound silly when you suggest that there is some type of Agassi conspiracy in the media. I think the simple answer is that most players and fans disagree with Data's take. Repeat: most players and fans disagree with Data's take. It doesn't mean they're right or wrong, but it's important to acknowledge that Data throws a lot of opinions out there. I'd stick to his tennis analysis over his psychology readings, personally.

I assume Data is talking about their match in Toronto in 2000. Perhaps someone has the match and can confirm or deny Data's account.

http://www.atpworldtour.com/Players/Head-To-Head.aspx?pId=G319&oId=A092

P.S. Data, Toronto is possibly my favorite city on the east coast. I love the diversity, the food (best Asian cuisine outside of San Francisco) and the wonderful views of Lake Ontario. It's a gem, and I'm glad you've spent some time there.

Kindest Regards,
Chopin
 

Chopin

Hall of Fame
^Upon researching the match, the Agassi scream came after hitting a big shot to break Golmard to force a second set tiebreaker.

Unfortunately, Data makes it sound a bit different than this account:

"[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss][SIZE=-1]Serving for the match at 6-5, the Frenchman got tentative and nervous, and was broken at 15-40 by a big Agassi return at his feet that was too hot to handle. Andre let loose a primal scream and shot a withering glare at his opponent – "I was thinking a had a little momentum going into the tie-breaker" – and still had a chance to force a third set."[/SIZE][/FONT]
 

Tshooter

G.O.A.T.
Agassi was something of a pri$k before his invention of the philosopher-tennis player, I kiss the crowd after every match routine.
 
Thanks for this, it's very interesting, and further shows what a huge myth Agassi's gentlemanly image was. There were many occasions in the latter stages of his career when he treated his opponents or the officials with disrespect, yet they were glossed over by the Agassi loving media. He was clever in that he knew whose ass to kiss at exactly the right time.
.
Yes, it was definitely one of the...most awkward moments I remember being at during a pro match. Agassi was really just going through the motions at that point. I was actually standing near a Tennis Canada official and a Canadian Davis cup player....the Tennis Canada guy had openly wondered if Agassi was going to default. It certainly seemed as though he might. He was moving oddly, and in terms of strategy...wasn't playing anything like himself. In fact, he seemed torn between trying to give off the impression that he was very injured/not trying anymore, and being annoyed by Golmard and thus wanting to fight back. It was almost like you might see with a sulky junior or club player who is tanking a match.

You could see that if Agassi REALLY wanted, he could be playing better, but at the same time, he probably couldn't play in the ideal way due to (what we assumed) was injury. He looked literally looked stiff....mixed with disinterested, and annoyed. His strategy was all over the map, but started to consist more and more, of half-paced rallies, looping the ball with powder-puff (for him) shots (essentially junk), and occasionally just trying to rip one that came his way. He even rushed the net in ways he wouldn't normally.

Bottom line: Agassi was annoyed as hell that he couldn't play well, that Golmard was going to win, and that Golmard was doing it happily. I think he thought: Hey, you #*(!@(!! I'm not at my best, you should know it, and you shouldn't be taking pride in winning! My feeling was that, sure, that's understandable...but Golmard doesn't necessarily know you're injured (though I am sure he had an inkling by the way Agassi was moving/playing), and moreover, you really can't blame him for trying to be intense.

When Agassi gave the mocking scream, right at Golmard.....it was....disconcerting for everyone. Though the Davis cup player actually started laughing himself and shaking his head. I can only say that it was....well obnoxious and ungracious....even though we all knew that he was clearly not a happy camper out there. I don't remember ever seeing anything quite like that....I've seen players return gamesmanship in kind, but usually they do it in an authentic way ie. they make it look like they mean it....Agassi's was "fake" and clearly meant to be "fake". He just wanted to embarrass Golmard, and make it clear that he was not happy that Golmard was pumping himself up. Maybe you could compare it to Mac mimicking Becker's cough....or Soderling mimicking Nadal....but this was literally a SCREAM! LOL
 

Chopin

Hall of Fame
Yes, it was definitely one of the...most awkward moments I remember being at during a pro match. Agassi was really just going through the motions at that point. I was actually standing near a Tennis Canada official and a Canadian Davis cup player....the Tennis Canada guy had openly wondered if Agassi was going to default. It certainly seemed as though he might. He was moving oddly, and in terms of strategy...wasn't playing anything like himself. In fact, he seemed torn between trying to give off the impression that he was very injured/not trying anymore, and being annoyed by Golmard and thus wanting to fight back. It was almost like you might see with a sulky junior or club player who is tanking a match.

You could see that if Agassi REALLY wanted, he could be playing better, but at the same time, he probably couldn't play in the ideal way due to (what we assumed) was injury. He looked literally looked stiff....mixed with disinterested, and annoyed. His strategy was all over the map, but started to consist more and more, of half-paced rallies, looping the ball with powder-puff (for him) shots (essentially junk), and occasionally just trying to rip one that came his way. He even rushed the net in ways he wouldn't normally.

Bottom line: Agassi was annoyed as hell that he couldn't play well, that Golmard was going to win, and that Golmard was doing it happily. I think he thought: Hey, you #*(!@(!! I'm not at my best, you should know it, and you shouldn't be taking pride in winning! My feeling was that, sure, that's understandable...but Golmard doesn't necessarily know you're injured (though I am sure he had an inkling by the way Agassi was moving/playing), and moreover, you really can't blame him for trying to be intense.

When Agassi gave the mocking scream, right at Golmard.....it was....disconcerting for everyone. Though the Davis cup player actually started laughing himself and shaking his head. I can only say that it was....well obnoxious and ungracious....even though we all knew that he was clearly not a happy camper out there. I don't remember ever seeing anything quite like that....I've seen players return gamesmanship in kind, but usually they do it in an authentic way ie. they make it look like they mean it....Agassi's was "fake" and clearly meant to be "fake". He just wanted to embarrass Golmard, and make it clear that he was not happy that Golmard was pumping himself up. Maybe you could compare it to Mac mimicking Becker's cough....or Soderling mimicking Nadal....but this was literally a SCREAM! LOL
Data, the scream came to break Golmard at 15-40, 6-5 to force a tiebreaker. That's a fact, which you omit.
 
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