Dallas Open String Choice and Tensions
- Thread starter TennisJrDad
- Start date
innoVAShaun
G.O.A.T.
Dunlop300g
Semi-Pro
So nice to see the Dunlop boys on the list! Dunlop is coming back, baby! Keep hope alive! Get Brooksby back on tour and we're an even 4! What's interesting too is that of the three listed they are all using different frames so that's showing a good appeal across the product lines.
Yeah that was my thought also!
I string at 48lbs, and seem to be on the low end in my circle.
julianokay
Rookie
I think this is mostly because ATP Pros all play with multiple freshly strung racquets every match, so they are playing with that exact tension.
For us club players, we keep the strings in our racquets much longer, so most people string higher to account for that initial tension drop.
Notorious_Junkballer
Hall of Fame
taydbear7
Professional
I'm am seeing it right that is says 9.5 lbs? I know he was at 20 at one point.
Injured Again
Hall of Fame
9.5 kilograms so just below 21 pounds.
socallefty
G.O.A.T.
I think many players switched to low fifties at the rec level when they switched to poly from the mid-high fifties they were using for soft strings. Most have never tried going lower to see if there is a change in performance for comfort, power etc.
The rec players who have tried lower tensions end up playing with low-mid forties just like the pros because you get more comfort and power with very little loss in control. The poly goes dead in 5-20 hours and you have to restring soon anyway,
Steve Huff
G.O.A.T.
I think a lot has to do with the manufacturers' recommendations. When poly's came out, it often said on the package (and some still do) to string at 10% lower than you normally string at. Well, lots of people had their rackets strung at 60# with syn gut, so a 10% reduction would be 54#. So, part of the problem was the manufacturers themselves.
Nostradamus
Bionic Poster
i can't read it,, its too small
Nostradamus
Bionic Poster
That lying Eubanks, he said he uses Black code,,, but he uses the Razor soft ????????
elmaestro10s
New User
What is Hawk 3? I assume its Head Hawk but not sure if its a new version?
Also, seems like Taro Daniel using some Toalson string along with gut
Also, seems like Taro Daniel using some Toalson string along with gut
Probably the white one. Karatsev's string
It's what Head gives to pro players who play with Head Hawk, it's not new. I think I read somewhere here on this forum that it's slightly softer than ordinary white Hawk. I've had some 12m packets of both - Hawk 3 for pro players, and retail Hawk white - for years, always planned to compare but just forgot..
Prestretch syngut/multi? Then you can play until they break
mad dog1
G.O.A.T.
Pro stock strings only available to pros and not the masses! I knew it!
dr. godmode
Hall of Fame
typical... there's a reason we are rec players and they are pro's. they get the good stuff its like cheating i thinkPro stock strings only available to pros and not the masses! I knew it!
The rec player playing in low-mid forties is playing far lower than what pros are playing at. Pro tennis player string life is measured in minutes. A rec player playing with poly strung at 52 for 10 hours is much closer to the low to mid 40s that pros string than someone who strung it at 44 and played with it for 10 hours.
Now if people want to do it because it is more comfortable and they get more power, I can't say anything. But a rec player racquet strung at 44 is simply not the same as a pro player racquet strung at 44 unless the rec player is using fresh strings every 6-8 games.
So I never understood the "String in low-mid 40s just like the pros" argument.
Last edited:
socallefty
G.O.A.T.
That’s why we do it - with very little loss in control compared to 5-10 lbs higher.
GodlessEndeavor
Professional
There are two ways to think about this:
- if you think what the pros are doing is relevant to you, then there are people like Mannarino and a few others who make really low tensions work. So if you're an adaptable player, you can string in the forties and know that even after losing tension, there are still pros out there playing with lower tension and making it work.
- if you think what the pros are doing is not relevant to you, then there are a lot of rec players who string in the low forties and play with it for weeks or months. Same conclusion.
Considering the tension spectrum between 0 lbs and 60 lbs, the vast majority of it is playable with polyester strings. So we really don't have to worry too much - most people can adapt to gradual tension loss.
GodlessEndeavor
Professional
Doesn't Medvedev often use the same racquet for a whole match?
WATCH: Daniil Medvedev lets loose on string habits with Tennis Warehouse | Tennis.com
The former world No. 1 admitted to a less fussy approach to maintaining equipment in big matches, and revealed his preferred string tension in the midst of a career surge.
Medvedev: "I don’t usually change racquets during matches, even in five sets, and I don’t change tension if it’s cold, hot, or whatever.”
Mannarino's super low tension and racquet setup - old Aero with a ton of lead at the top, 360 sw, I think - isn't really that informative for anyone, pros, coaches or rec players. He barely has any take back, basically just half-counterpunches and bunts the ball around practically off the bounce. It's the only thing you actually can do with such a setup. It's also pretty obvious that he easily hits the back fence with that setup if he isn't ultra focused on the ball etc. If he has to hit - not block - a ball above hip level his chances of putting it in the court drastically fall, because his racquet/string setup is a rocket launcher squared
Much more informative is the lowest range of tensions of players who play with setups close to retail, like Tiafoe with a control racquet, or Kyrgios with a power racquet, both light and lower swingweight. They both still block and counterpunch a lot, but that's also how many rec players play, so it's comparable
Medvedev is the only one who does it, so it's a single data point. Saying 'all pros change strings every ball change' is still correct. Medvedev also says that he doesn't hit the ball really, his words. He absorbs and redirects pace, like Mannarino.
Much more informative is the lowest range of tensions of players who play with setups close to retail, like Tiafoe with a control racquet, or Kyrgios with a power racquet, both light and lower swingweight. They both still block and counterpunch a lot, but that's also how many rec players play, so it's comparable
Medvedev is the only one who does it, so it's a single data point. Saying 'all pros change strings every ball change' is still correct. Medvedev also says that he doesn't hit the ball really, his words. He absorbs and redirects pace, like Mannarino.
GodlessEndeavor
Professional
The Secret To Daniil Medvedev's Recent Success | ATP Tour | Tennis
Learn how Daniil Medvedev has used consistency to play his best tennis in recent weeks, winning titles in Rotterdam, Doha, Dubai and Miami. Medvedev is the third seed at the Rolex Monte-Carlo Masters.
www.atptour.com
"Opponents have hit their forehands nearly one mile per hour harder than Medvedev (76.1mph to 75.2 mph) and with more spin (2,784 rpm to 2,467 rpm), but consistency has proven more important."
Just a 1 mph difference and a ~12% difference in spin, I don't think that's a big enough difference to make as strong a statement as "he doesn't hit the ball". Yes he relies more on consistency than power, but he's still hitting hard.
Well go ask him about his statements then. He also said that if he didn't play his defensive counterpunching game that he'd be no. 50 in the rankings
But if I ignore his statements, yes he hits very very clean and super flat, but on average not that hard. He's a counterpuncher, he relies on his opponents giving pace to the ball, which he then redirects without expending too much energy himself. Djokovic and Murray are even better at counterpunching pace but on selected balls, while Medvedev is less pace more consistency, so a more consistent pace overall. Murray will slow down the pace intentionally with slowballing just to force the opponent to hit the ball so the can counterpunch, but Djokovic and Medvedev will speed up the pace themselves if the opponent is slowballing them, just to have some pace to work with
They all intentionally maintain pace, particularly Djokovic and Medvedev, because that gives them opportunity to counterpunch. Medvedev complained a lot in the past about slow courts, slow conditions or slow dead fluffy balls, hated on clay etc, as slow conditions give him less incoming pace to redirect, and force him to actually hit the ball more himself, and then he has to change his game too much, makes errors etc
These are just basics of reactive tennis, nothing new. Statistics and ball speeds don't really mean much if not in full context. It's obvious that people are beating defensive counterpunchers by slowballing them, playing into the body and cross, to take away angles and to force them to actually give pace to the ball. And that's precisely how they play each other, just watch Nadal Djokovic or Murray Djokovic slowballing each other through the middle, there's a million of their matches. Watch Paris Masters 2023 Murray De Minaur as a clear demonstration of all of that in extremes. Just ugly vs uglier, horrific tennis
But if I ignore his statements, yes he hits very very clean and super flat, but on average not that hard. He's a counterpuncher, he relies on his opponents giving pace to the ball, which he then redirects without expending too much energy himself. Djokovic and Murray are even better at counterpunching pace but on selected balls, while Medvedev is less pace more consistency, so a more consistent pace overall. Murray will slow down the pace intentionally with slowballing just to force the opponent to hit the ball so the can counterpunch, but Djokovic and Medvedev will speed up the pace themselves if the opponent is slowballing them, just to have some pace to work with
They all intentionally maintain pace, particularly Djokovic and Medvedev, because that gives them opportunity to counterpunch. Medvedev complained a lot in the past about slow courts, slow conditions or slow dead fluffy balls, hated on clay etc, as slow conditions give him less incoming pace to redirect, and force him to actually hit the ball more himself, and then he has to change his game too much, makes errors etc
These are just basics of reactive tennis, nothing new. Statistics and ball speeds don't really mean much if not in full context. It's obvious that people are beating defensive counterpunchers by slowballing them, playing into the body and cross, to take away angles and to force them to actually give pace to the ball. And that's precisely how they play each other, just watch Nadal Djokovic or Murray Djokovic slowballing each other through the middle, there's a million of their matches. Watch Paris Masters 2023 Murray De Minaur as a clear demonstration of all of that in extremes. Just ugly vs uglier, horrific tennis
GodlessEndeavor
Professional
His statements don't matter that much.
Either he's correct and the difference between hitting hard and not hitting is 12% spin and 1 mph (not much benefit for rec players to learn to hit hard then), or he's wrong and we can ignore what he says.
I think he hits harder than he realises.
If you are a rec player that actually hits like Mannarino, then yea, string in the 40s and play till the strings are dead and you are playing closer to Mannarino's setup.
But that's not the population my comment was aimed at. It applies to all the rec players who THINK what the pros are doing is relevant because they see pros string in the 40s - this thread would be Exhibit A. So they also go string in the 40s. But pros who string in the 40s are actually playing with strings in the 40s. A rec player isn't for the reason I've already highlighted - we don't go through 4 racquets in 2 hours.
"What should I string my racquet at?"
"You should string in the mid 40s because that's what ATP is trending towards"
My point is that line of thinking is absolute non-sense unless you have a style similar to Mannarino and assuming you are a typical rec player who doesn't restring for weeks.
You should try mid 40s because your preferred tension might actually be in the 30s (which to your point is playable to some people). Nothing wrong with that.
If you are a rec player who restrings every 6-10 hours and you want to play a mid 40s ATP setup, then in actuality you need to string in the low 50s.
How often you string is a critical piece of information that needs to be part of any "what should I string my racquet at" discussion. Why does any of this matter? I find this matters because I frankly see too many rec players at the 3.5 / 4.0 level string in the mid 40s, try to emulate pro-style strokes and complain about their balls launching. Of course it is launching. You are trying to hit like Tiafoe but Tiafoe is playing with 42lb. Your 42 lb is actually like 32 lbs.
Last edited:
This last statement is a good point. I start stringing my gut hybrid at 40 lbs, and I play w/ it until it breaks, after applying Babolat elastocrosses. It takes me 2-3 months of playing about 3x/week. By the time my gut snaps, the tension is probably down in the 20s, and I love how much feel/touch at the net I get out of it. I'm using racquets w/ RAs down in the 50s or below, so I can still hit out on serve returns/groundies.
The next time my strings break, I'm going to try 20 lbs fully poly, just to feel what Mannarino's hitting w/.
Players approaching advanced level have another issue with string tension in my experience. They are constantly caught in between, and it repeats again and again over their tennis life
They can't decide whether they actually want to blast the ball, hit cleanly and drive through the ball, or they've watched too much of Andy Murray just blocking the ball, so they emulate it without understanding that a) Murray was/is playing with 370/360 sw so any ball he touches will be flying to the base line easily b) he's working with big incoming pace, new balls, and fresh gut hybrid
Many people just want to elegantly half block the ball without actually committing to hitting through, and they play at such medium pace with similar partners, where loose and old softish poly works great
Then they sometimes hit, or play a competition match, with a clean hitter, who hits through and gives pace to the ball, and they realize, or get the adequate explanation, that their 5 weeks old string is just way too loose for proper hitting through the ball. They can also easily see that their balls just fly when they try to match their partner's hitting. That old loose poly might work with a Blade 18x20 but definitely not with a power racquet
So they are caught in between, when they play with fresh poly, they are half-hitting-half-blocking, at it seems too stiff to them so they even shorten their swing to soften the impact, instead of hitting through with fuller faster swings, to force mains displacement and elastic snap back, they prefer it when it "settles" (I adore that expression btw). And when they play with old poly, which felt great the day before with a lower level partner and slower overall pace, but this time they try to hit through nicely, it doesn't work at all
Plus they don't want the expense of more regular restrings
The solution is easy actually, when their poly is fresh, they should up the pace and hit through, and learn to appreciate new strings, with nice slippery coating and plenty of elasticity, both punchy and totally controlled, but requiring that you actually hit the ball properly. Then they shouldn't forget that experience, and next time continue to drive through the ball with full power until they get into good rythm
Solution is harder cleaner more committed hitting at all times, and being aware of it, and being determined not to half-hit-half-block with 40% swings, not to brush over the ball for no reason etc
Often those players require a coach occasionally perhaps, to just remind them of all of that, and to feed them floaters they would then have to hit, as there's no incoming pace to block back. That's the only way to learn
Once you learn to consistenly hit through any ball and vs any hitting partner, old poly fells like total sh** actually
They can't decide whether they actually want to blast the ball, hit cleanly and drive through the ball, or they've watched too much of Andy Murray just blocking the ball, so they emulate it without understanding that a) Murray was/is playing with 370/360 sw so any ball he touches will be flying to the base line easily b) he's working with big incoming pace, new balls, and fresh gut hybrid
Many people just want to elegantly half block the ball without actually committing to hitting through, and they play at such medium pace with similar partners, where loose and old softish poly works great
Then they sometimes hit, or play a competition match, with a clean hitter, who hits through and gives pace to the ball, and they realize, or get the adequate explanation, that their 5 weeks old string is just way too loose for proper hitting through the ball. They can also easily see that their balls just fly when they try to match their partner's hitting. That old loose poly might work with a Blade 18x20 but definitely not with a power racquet
So they are caught in between, when they play with fresh poly, they are half-hitting-half-blocking, at it seems too stiff to them so they even shorten their swing to soften the impact, instead of hitting through with fuller faster swings, to force mains displacement and elastic snap back, they prefer it when it "settles" (I adore that expression btw). And when they play with old poly, which felt great the day before with a lower level partner and slower overall pace, but this time they try to hit through nicely, it doesn't work at all
Plus they don't want the expense of more regular restrings
The solution is easy actually, when their poly is fresh, they should up the pace and hit through, and learn to appreciate new strings, with nice slippery coating and plenty of elasticity, both punchy and totally controlled, but requiring that you actually hit the ball properly. Then they shouldn't forget that experience, and next time continue to drive through the ball with full power until they get into good rythm
Solution is harder cleaner more committed hitting at all times, and being aware of it, and being determined not to half-hit-half-block with 40% swings, not to brush over the ball for no reason etc
Often those players require a coach occasionally perhaps, to just remind them of all of that, and to feed them floaters they would then have to hit, as there's no incoming pace to block back. That's the only way to learn
Once you learn to consistenly hit through any ball and vs any hitting partner, old poly fells like total sh** actually
Last edited:
Trying to have more of the mindset of Sinner last few months just hitting through full power. I became addicted to fresh poly. I was before like you said. But I still think the reference tension depends on the strings. Some strings I like mid 40, some I like mid 50. But still fresh strings above everything. Gets worse every hour.
einca13
Rookie
The majority of ATP guys play a frame for 7 games, so they string at the tension they want to play at. For me, I get 4-6 hours over 2-3 hitting sessions out of a 16g poly setup before it goes completely dead. So I know that if I string at 48lbs, most of my play will be in the low 40’s. if I was playing just 7 games for a ball change, I would string lower to start with. Two completely different approaches used by ATP guys and the rest of us.
