Damaging loss for Djokovic

weelie

Semi-Pro
While Medvedev played hit and hope tennis and will never do that sort of thing again (130mph 2nd serves is desperation)
Hitting 1st serves as your 2nd serves is a viable tactic. If you can hit 70% and win more than 70% of those points, you are winning around 50% (or more) of those points, which is winning a good stat for 2nd serve points. I remember some old article discussing that some players should serve two 1st serves. Anyway, if you do it all the time, you might lose the surprise element.

A loss here and there might only serve Djoker well. Medvedev on the other hand, has won too much already on this HC trek, will be taken out by some young hot gun on a good day. Nole is still very much the favorite for US Open. Nadal is the 2nd, but could well get injured etc. Federer has not played much, and has not won much, this year.
 

vex

Hall of Fame
While Medvedev played hit and hope tennis and will never do that sort of thing again (130mph 2nd serves is desperation) for Djokovic being 2 behind Nadal at Masters 1000 level is going to grate with him, as is the fact Nadal bagelled Medvedev a week ago.

Psychology plays a huge part in sport and Nadal is 2-1 v Djokovic in new york and add to that recent events should the almost inevitable Nadal Djokovic final happen in 3 weeks time (only injury stops it as no player is remotely close to either on hard courts) then Nadal has the edge mentally, also albeit on clay not hard but the last meeting was a bagel and breadstick for Nadal.

Missed opportunitu for Djokovic as had he won cincinatti he would have been clear favourite for USO. Now he probably will be wary of Nadal and historically when Djokovic has doubts he tends to lose to nadal.
You think Djoker ISN’T the clear favorite at the USO? Lol
 

UnderratedSlam

Hall of Fame
Dude...I have already defeated your argument lol. Fact you don't know the difference between North American Hard courts and Australasian hard courts suggests to me you have limited knowledge of tennis.

You cannot have it both ways...if you want to rely on hard court matches from Beijing 2013 on wards...then you have to include Nadal 2-1 Djokovic at USO..it is that simple. Quit being bitter you got owned. lmao.
Just a reminder:

YOU are the one who said that older results don't count, but beforehand you had made the argument that 2010-2013 USO was proof that Rafa has an edge.

So which is it? Old results or newer results? Make a decision and stick with it, otherwise every single forum veteran here will crush your bad logic, just as I am. And I'm not even a forum veteran.

You've contradicted yourself in a legendary fail way, and now you're trying what?

Regarding the difference between CONTINENTS in HC surface... You are desperately trying to create an illusion that experts of Asian HC struggle on American HC and vice versa. Absolute gobbledygook. Perhaps in Asia the ball bounce is ten meters higher than in America?
 

UnderratedSlam

Hall of Fame
The point is Nadal won't even need to worry about facing Nole, some pleb will do him a favour and then he will just beat them - or some other pleb that beats pleb #1 6-1 6-0 6-0 in 52 minutes in the USO final.
I had no idea that Rafa's lucky 2017 USO win left so many tennis fans in the heavy delusion that he is heavy favourite to win USO again.

That's his only non-FO slam win since 2013. And he didn't have to beat either Novak or RF. Very rarely do we have USOs in which a player can lift the trophy without beating one or the other. We had that in 2017, but it won't happen this year or any time soon after.
 

Pantera

Banned
Just a reminder:

YOU are the one who said that older results don't count, but beforehand you had made the argument that 2010-2013 USO was proof that Rafa has an edge.

So which is it? Old results or newer results? Make a decision and stick with it, otherwise every single forum veteran here will crush your bad logic, just as I am. And I'm not even a forum veteran.

You've contradicted yourself in a legendary fail way, and now you're trying what?

Regarding the difference between CONTINENTS in HC surface... You are desperately trying to create an illusion that experts of Asian HC struggle on American HC and vice versa. Absolute gobbledygook. Perhaps in Asia the ball bounce is ten meters higher than in America?
Fella, I am pointing out your utter contradictions lol...and you walked right into it. lmao.

If you are that clueless to not know the difference between North American HC and Australasian all I can do is pity you.
 

Pantera

Banned
Hitting 1st serves as your 2nd serves is a viable tactic. If you can hit 70% and win more than 70% of those points, you are winning around 50% (or more) of those points, which is winning a good stat for 2nd serve points. I remember some old article discussing that some players should serve two 1st serves. Anyway, if you do it all the time, you might lose the surprise element.

A loss here and there might only serve Djoker well. Medvedev on the other hand, has won too much already on this HC trek, will be taken out by some young hot gun on a good day. Nole is still very much the favorite for US Open. Nadal is the 2nd, but could well get injured etc. Federer has not played much, and has not won much, this year.
Nadal a huge favourite on current form, as others have pointed out, Djokovic is not anywhere near the form he showed in Australia.
 

UnderratedSlam

Hall of Fame
Fella, I am pointing out your utter contradictions lol...and you walked right into it. lmao.

If you are that clueless to not know the difference between North American HC and Australasian all I can do is pity you.
I realize that you have now trapped yourself into a dead-end corner and are forced to only post non-sequiturs.

Let that be a lesson to learn, OK? Take a stand and THEN make an argument. Don't post that old results count but then change your stance mid-way on a thread into "older results don't count".

That way you can avoid having to talk around the subject, rather than face my arguments head on.
 

Pantera

Banned
I realize that you have now trapped yourself into a dead-end corner and are forced to only post non-sequiturs.

Let that be a lesson to learn, OK? Take a stand and THEN make an argument. Don't post that old results count but then change your stance mid-way on a thread into "older results don't count".

That way you can avoid having to talk around the subject, rather than face my arguments head on.
Fella, stop crying lol. You were the one who decided to go back to Beijing 2013, stop making yourself look foolish.

As you have now changed your mind, I expect an explanation as to on what basis you think Djokovic is favourite given there has been no HC meeting in North America in over 2 years.
 

UnderratedSlam

Hall of Fame
Fella, stop crying lol. You were the one who decided to go back to Beijing 2013, stop making yourself look foolish.

As you have now changed your mind, I expect an explanation as to on what basis you think Djokovic is favourite given there has been no HC meeting in North America in over 2 years.
You always expect wrong, it's your trademark.

I will merely repeat - again - that you started off saying that older results are very important, then did a 180 and argued that older results don't count.

But at least we all had a nice laugh at your suggestion that Asian and American HC are so completely different that they're almost like different surfaces, like clay and grass.
 

NoleFam

G.O.A.T.
It was disappointing but damaging is a stretch. It would have been great to have the double career Masters but he already has them all had like 33 of them. The Slams are most important for him now. Medvedev played really well and it was one of those days where the opponent is hot and everything is going in. You can't expect him to go for 120 second serves and make 90% of them again consistently. At least Novak has seen that play so if he tries it in the future, it won't catch him off guard.
 

Lew II

Hall of Fame
It's possibly a damaging loss in terms of who ends up as the greatest Masters champion 'cos even if Nadal ultimately finishes ahead, most people would consider Djokovic's resume superior had he completed a Double Golden Masters(hence so many Nadal fans being delighted with last night' s result) but in terms of being damaging for the upcoming US Open? Hmm, not really.
Djokovic has 5 yec and won all masters. He's the greatest outside Slams easily.
 

Pantera

Banned
You always expect wrong, it's your trademark.

I will merely repeat - again - that you started off saying that older results are very important, then did a 180 and argued that older results don't count.

But at least we all had a nice laugh at your suggestion that Asian and American HC are so completely different that they're almost like different surfaces, like clay and grass.
Hahahah you think AO and UO play the same? cannot stop laughing!!!

Do older results count or not? I am leaving it open for you to decide. So cmon, make a decision lol. Don't get all upset, stand up, and make your case. This is all too easy lol.
 

UnderratedSlam

Hall of Fame
Hahahah you think AO and UO play the same? cannot stop laughing!!!

Do older results count or not? I am leaving it open for you to decide. So cmon, make a decision lol. Don't get all upset, stand up, and make your case. This is all too easy lol.
You are internet-LOLing, not reality-LOLing.

We all know what the difference between those two is...
 

LETitBE

Hall of Fame
Hitting 1st serves as your 2nd serves is a viable tactic. If you can hit 70% and win more than 70% of those points, you are winning around 50% (or more) of those points, which is winning a good stat for 2nd serve points. I remember some old article discussing that some players should serve two 1st serves. Anyway, if you do it all the time, you might lose the surprise element.

A loss here and there might only serve Djoker well. Medvedev on the other hand, has won too much already on this HC trek, will be taken out by some young hot gun on a good day. Nole is still very much the favorite for US Open. Nadal is the 2nd, but could well get injured etc. Federer has not played much, and has not won much, this year.
never understood why Muzzard didnt try this
 

Pantera

Banned
The only thing you own is that huge bag of non-facts that you picked up at a garage sale for 3 pennies each.

Whoever sold you that bag, owned you.
You dispute 24-16, or 18 majors in Federer prime compared to 7 Majors in Nadal's prime? or 2 Major difference yet 5 year age gap....which of those is not a fact lmao. I do feel sorry for you now.
 

UnderratedSlam

Hall of Fame
You dispute 24-16, or 18 majors in Federer prime compared to 7 Majors in Nadal's prime? or 2 Major difference yet 5 year age gap....which of those is not a fact lmao. I do feel sorry for you now.
I have no idea what you're talking about. I now realize you've got me confused with other smart people you're arguing with here...

I guess you probably need to go back, re-read, and try to sort things out. Especially user names.

I know, it's so complicated...
 

Pantera

Banned
I have no idea what you're talking about. I now realize you've got me confused with other smart people you're arguing with here...

I guess you probably need to go back, re-read, and try to sort things out. Especially user names.

I know, it's so complicated...
LOl so you actually do not know what 24-16 refers to....thanks for proving you do not actually follow tennis, got you hook line sinker...
 

UnderratedSlam

Hall of Fame
If you follow me, as it seems you do, you will know I only post facts. So 24-16 is a fact as is Nadal 3 UO's in the last decade to Federer's 0.
You mean like that thread a week ago when every single poster disagreed with you...

Er, I meant several threads.
 

Pantera

Banned
You mean like that thread a week ago when every single poster disagreed with you...

Er, I meant several threads.
Only Federer fans disagree...not seen Djokovic fans have an issue, or Nadal fans, or Murray fans. Just Federer's

And as I said to Hitman, I can understand why some people put Djokovic favourite, not a problem with that, but putting Federer in the mix is obvious trolling. Titles are not won by a surname, it is current form.
 

UnderratedSlam

Hall of Fame
Only Federer fans disagree...not seen Djokovic fans have an issue, or Nadal fans, or Murray fans. Just Federer's

And as I said to Hitman, I can understand why some people put Djokovic favourite, not a problem with that, but putting Federer in the mix is obvious trolling. Titles are not won by a surname, it is current form.
Federer being a favourite for USO is trolling?

What you just posted can be construed as trolling. Heavy trolling.
 

vex

Hall of Fame
Nope...he is clear 2nd favourite. Put bluntly he lost to a guy his nemesis Nadal thrashed 3 and 0.
Pretty sure Vegas gonna disagree with ya there

No one is favoring Nadal. Even if Nadal played on fire and Djoker looked pretty meh throughout Djoker would be favored against Rafa in a SF/F match. Rafa has to prove it first
 
D

Deleted member 77403

Guest
The reason the Masters record is not talked about a lot is because Fedfan commentators have ignored it as Fedr does not hold the record. The GOAT debate is centered around Fedr's achievements.
The masters record wasn't even mentioned when Agassi had the record at 17, while Sampras had 11...long before the world knew about the Fedalovic war that was coming. It gave Agassi no leverage over Sampras then, GOAT debate was about slams, weeks at number one long before these guys came along. Historically masters were not part of GOAT debate, so they don't mention it as much. Nadal himself once didn't know the exact number he had, that should tell you how much it really matters in the GOAT debate.
 

Zara

Hall of Fame
The masters record wasn't even mentioned when Agassi had the record at 17, while Sampras had 11...long before the world knew about the Fedalovic war that was coming. It gave Agassi no leverage over Sampras then, GOAT debate was about slams, weeks at number one long before these guys came along. Historically masters were not part of GOAT debate, so they don't mention it as much. Nadal himself once didn't know the exact number he had, that should tell you how much it really matters in the GOAT debate.
That's quite accurate. In the end, it was the slam count together with year-end No. 1. Even WTF wasn't part of the discussion but Sampras thrived on it because he loved playing on carpet.
 

Pantera

Banned
Pretty sure Vegas gonna disagree with ya there

No one is favoring Nadal. Even if Nadal played on fire and Djoker looked pretty meh throughout Djoker would be favored against Rafa in a SF/F match. Rafa has to prove it first
Nadal 2-1 djokovic uso.
 
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