Depressed Murray fans check in here

Aussie Darcy

Bionic Poster
But even in his pre-Clayray days he was still making semi-finals at Monte Carlo, Rome and Roland Garros. He was never as bad on clay back then as people think. True, he did suffer the odd beatdown but never as consistently as this, at least not that I can recall. I guess what I really want to know is why has he put Clayray to one side and reverted to the worst of his old clay form? It just looks odd and, coupled with his earlier unexpected struggles on hardcourt this year, seems to indicate some crisis of confidence and probable burnout.
Perhaps getting rid of Mauresmo. I edited my post but you might have quoted just before I edited so i'll say this part again:

Someone made this point on twitter and they're 100% right. What's happened between clay last year and clay this year? No longer with Mauresmo.

Found these stats on twitter in regards to Murray on clay:
With Mauresmo: 88.9% (24-3, 2 titles)
Without Mauresmo: 65% (78-42, 1 title)

Something to ponder.
 

Mainad

Bionic Poster
Perhaps getting rid of Mauresmo. I edited my post but you might have quoted just before I edited so i'll say this part again:

Someone made this point on twitter and they're 100% right. What's happened between clay last year and clay this year? No longer with Mauresmo.

Found these stats on twitter in regards to Murray on clay:
With Mauresmo: 88.9% (24-3, 2 titles)
Without Mauresmo: 65% (78-42, 1 title)

Something to ponder.
But he had Jonas Bjorkman with him when he won his first clay titles at 2015 Munich and Madrid as Mauresmo was on maternity leave. It was Bjorkman who helped him turn into Clayray. They parted at the end of that year after Mauresmo came back to work and I always felt that was a great pity as I liked Bjorkman and thought he worked well with Andy.
 
Last edited:

clayqueen

G.O.A.T.
ROME (AP) — Andy Murray is going to the French Open with his game in tatters.

The top-ranked Murray was eliminated by local favorite Fabio Fognini 6-2, 6-4 before a raucous crowd in his opening match at the Italian Open on Tuesday.

Murray, meanwhile, has had a brief clay-court season, winning five matches (one by walkover), losing four, and failing to defend his Rome title.

“The last couple of weeks has definitely been a struggle and a long way from where I would like to be,” Murray said.

The French Open starts in less than two weeks.

“I need to turn it around quick,” Murray said

Italy’s top player at No. 29, Fognini frustrated Murray with drop shots.

“Fabio did play some good drop shots, but I wasn’t actually making a move or a step towards the ball,” Murray said.

The unpredictable Fognini led 5-1 in the second set and nearly let Murray force a third set with a series of errors but finally closed it out when he served for the match for a second time.

Flavia Pennetta, Fognini’s wife and the 2015 U.S. Open champion, is expecting the couple’s first child any day.

“My tournament could end any moment so I’ve got to enjoy this for now,” Fognini said.

Fans at the Foro Italico chanted for Fognini as if they were at a soccer match, and organizers blasted Neopolitan folk music over the stadium’s loudspeaker after his win.

http://www.tennis.com/pro-game/2017/05/madison-keys-loses-opening-match-for-3rd-straight-tournament/66066/
 

Slice'n'dice

Hall of Fame
Andy is as baffled as the rest of us for his current shockingly poor form but believes he will turn things around:
the hard
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/39949585

http://www.atpworldtour.com/en/news/murray-rome-2017-reaction
He will, his form is obviously going to improve at some point. It's just a case of when, and how much. All too often people make the mistake of writing people off after a few months of bad form.

But he had Jonas Bjorkman with him when he won his first clay titles at 2015 Munich and Madrid as Mauresmo was on maternity leave. It was Bjorkman who helped him turn into Clayray. They parted at the end of that year after Mauresmo came back to work and I always felt that was a great pity as I liked Bjorkman and thought he worked well with Andy.
Who knows really what coach brings what when two are working together like that, maybe it was maybe it wasn't. Either way, the lessons are learned he hasn't forgotten how to play on clay because neither of those two are working with him now, he's struggled on hard courts too. He's in poor form and his confidence is lacking, That's the main issue.
 

3fees

G.O.A.T.
Physical conditioning is why swoons happen, they forget to build there wind up and splat. One cannot take physical conditioning for granted, the time doing it is a must.

Cheers
3Fees :)
 

ruerooo

Legend
Physical conditioning is why swoons happen, they forget to build there wind up and splat. One cannot take physical conditioning for granted, the time doing it is a must.

Cheers
3Fees :)
You know - this part is so interesting because usually Andy is so well-conditioned.
 

Steve0904

Talk Tennis Guru
For what it's worth this looks more like he's still injured (not burnt out) to me to be honest. I didn't think he should've played MC, and I've seen many players go in slumps, but this is so rapid (even more rapid than Djokovic) that I can't help but feel he's still not 100% healthy.
 

TheMusicLover

G.O.A.T.
For what it's worth this looks more like he's still injured (not burnt out) to me to be honest. I didn't think he should've played MC, and I've seen many players go in slumps, but this is so rapid (even more rapid than Djokovic) that I can't help but feel he's still not 100% healthy.
I tend to agree with this. I get this feeling that Murray should have taken some time off, perhaps even the entire clay season if not 100% okay - if only not to hurt his chances for Wimbledon where he's the defending champ after all.

Muzziah, I know it hurts, but perhaps skip RG?
 
But he had Jonas Bjorkman with him when he won his first clay titles at 2015 Munich and Madrid as Mauresmo was on maternity leave. It was Bjorkman who helped him turn into Clayray. They parted at the end of that year after Mauresmo came back to work and I always felt that was a great pity as I liked Bjorkman and thought he worked well with Andy.
Jonas Bjorkman was only there in Munich, and then a hand-over day in Madrid before he left and wasn't there for the rest of the clay season and rejoined at Queens. Not quite sure how, but some sort of myth has errupted around Bjorkman being there for the whole of Andy's 2015 clay season.

Bjorkman spent something like 36 hours - including time for sleeping, eating, and clowning around after football matches - at Andy's clay 10 day training block in Barcelona in 2015. He then left mid-week to go back to Sweden for the end of that dancing show he was in, before linking up with Andy in Munich. Interesting that the sport psychologist Andy was using at the time was also in attendance in Munich but not in Madrid the following week.

Amelie Mauresmo was at the training block for the majority of the time but had to get there from Ostrava after the Fed Cup. I've always been under the impression that it was the collaborative effort of Mauresmo's work with Matt Little and Teresina Goheen on Andy's movement which was the catalyst for improving Andy's clay game. The fact that Andy had a coach who listened when he said 'I'm not comfortable moving on clay' and then helped him to address those issues was significant. Not to mention that his tactics in Madrid that year were as close to perfect as Andy has ever got on clay. Bjorkman played no part in 'scouting' out the opponents that week.

Statistically Andy's 2015 clay season was stronger than in 2016. The difference in results was that he didn't play all of Rome and lost out somewhat with the draw in RG in 2015 - the bottom half kind of collapsed while the top half didn't.

Mauresmo didn't go on maternity leave until after Wimbledon 2015 - she was still very actively coaching Andy during Wimbledon. If Andy had felt that Bjorkman was working well with him and helping him more than Mauresmo, then Andy would have kept him on. But he didn't. The awful performance at the US Open in 2015 is surely a contributing factor to that?

As an aside to all the above, I thought it odd that Teresina Goheen was in Monte Carlo this year for a few days, seemed to not be there for the Ramos Vinolas match there, and I haven't noticed her around Andy's team since. I'd be really interested to know how much of a role she played in the off-season training block in Miami in December, having been present at the December training blocks in 2014 and 2015. Given that Andy's movement hasn't been that good in 2017, and poor on clay, I suspect - but have nothing to back that up - that her role may have been reduced. Think her work with Andy was important to his post-surgery flexibility and movement, and he's having issues with that right now.
 

Mainad

Bionic Poster
Sad and surprised to have to bump this yet again. :(

I guess I was hoping against hope that being back on his favourite surface at one of his favourite venues would inspire him back into some form again especially after his run to the semis at RG but the sheer awfulness of his performance today at Queen's just fills me with gloom! It seems to be a case of 2 steps forward, 3 steps back!!

What's the answer? An extended break? How is he going to get his mojo back? :confused:Will he get it back before this season is done??
 
Last edited:

MarcusInKensington

Hall of Fame
He should forget Shanghai, Paris and the WTFs. Get the US Open over with and then take an extended off-season. Hopefully he will come back full of beans.
 
Not sure what disappoints me more about today, the fact that Andy lost like that, looking clueless and playing dumb shots and like he couldn't think properly, or the fact that his breaking in consecutive matches streak is over. :(

Why has his returning been considerably down on 2015/2016?

What's going on with his net game this year?

On the one hand we've got a narrative which goes 'he was worn out from 2016 and then had an extra gruelling off-season'

On the other hand we've got Ivan Lendl - who can apparently never be criticised for anything ever - complaining the off-season was too short.

How can Andy have been like a zombie at the WTF in 2014, then had an off-season at the end of that year which was at least as long as the one at the end of 2016, in which he basically rebuilt his fitness and big chunks of his game. Yet at the end of 2016 he makes no obvious improvements and his game kind of regresses?

There are a lot of questions and no satisfying or convincing answers.
 

helennnnnn

Professional
Stuart Fraser @stu_fraser

That is Andy Murray's worst defeat by ranking on grass since losing to world No 90 Mardy Fish here at Queen's in 2010.

Murray's run of breaking serve in 136 consecutive matches (stretching back to 2015 US Open) comes to an end as he fails to break today.
 

Mainad

Bionic Poster
Stuart Fraser @stu_fraser

That is Andy Murray's worst defeat by ranking on grass since losing to world No 90 Mardy Fish here at Queen's in 2010.
Mardy went on to make the final that year but lost to his fellow countryman, Querrey.

Murray's run of breaking serve in 136 consecutive matches (stretching back to 2015 US Open) comes to an end as he fails to break today.
It just gets worse and worse but I guess all great runs come to an end at some point!
 

Thundergod

Professional
Sad and surprised to have to bump this yet again. :(

I guess I was hoping against hope that being back on his favourite surface at one of his favourite venues would inspire him back into some form again especially after his run to the semis at RG but the sheer awfulness of his performance today at Queen's just fills me with gloom! It seems to be a case of 2 steps forward, 3 steps back!!

What's the answer? An extended break? How is he going to get his mojo back? :confused:Will he get it back before this season is done??
He needs someone to hurry up and put Murray out of his misery by taking #1 away from him. Clearly the responsibility of being #1 has been too much for him.
 

Mainad

Bionic Poster
He needs someone to hurry up and put Murray out of his misery by taking #1 away from him. Clearly the responsibility of being #1 has been too much for him.
It's good that he got it and can add it to his resumé but it does seem to have proved a bit of a jinx for his game this season!
 

Rebel-I.N.S

Professional
Man, I was just thinking today about when Murray won the WTF and clinched YE #1 at the end of that incredible run.

If that's as good as it gets, so be it...

Murray really is an immortal.
 

Thundergod

Professional
I feel bad for his injury, but I can't believe how lucky he is still holding on to world #1(though it's about to end soon). He's held it like 30 weeks longer than I expected.
 

JMR

Hall of Fame
Ivan is a much better coach for Andy that Mauresmo. He experienced what it's like as a #1 male player and can give insight to Muzz on all that; she can't.
Since Mauresmo was also a No. 1 player who won slams (including Wimbledon, where Lendl failed), your argument boils down to, "Lendl was a male player and therefore is a better coach for Murray." Of course, Murray himself evidently disagreed with that perspective.
 

Meles

Bionic Poster
Perhaps getting rid of Mauresmo. I edited my post but you might have quoted just before I edited so i'll say this part again:

Someone made this point on twitter and they're 100% right. What's happened between clay last year and clay this year? No longer with Mauresmo.

Found these stats on twitter in regards to Murray on clay:
With Mauresmo: 88.9% (24-3, 2 titles)
Without Mauresmo: 65% (78-42, 1 title)

Something to ponder.
She was great.

This is mainly injury and Murray's serve numbers fell off a cliff on clay to probably some of the worst of his career. He needs to copy Federer's move. It will be a challenge to qualify for WTF and he's not winning the US Open. The same could be said for Djokovic and his elbow.:confused:
 

Meles

Bionic Poster
I guess it's fingers-crossed time that the hip injury won't prove too serious. He really does need to rest it though and let it heal properly.
He really needs to take time off. Stats on clay show he had no business playing as his serve numbers dive bombed. He's not healthy pure and simple. His judgement for the clay season with the elbow was poor.
 

BeatlesFan

Talk Tennis Guru
He's not healthy pure and simple. His judgement for the clay season with the elbow was poor.
Muzzy should return after Kim has her baby. He's been "on" for a decade now, so step back from the game and enjoy non-tennis life. Andy's fit enough to return with a vengeance in 2018. Jamie was just saying today that his brother should take a page out of Roger's book:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/tennis/article-4694634/Andy-Murray-skip-clay-season-suggests-brother-Jamie.html
 

Meles

Bionic Poster

Mainad

Bionic Poster
I was just randomly throwing out a number, but I thought he would have lost the WTF, but around IW at latest.
Okay, but having won the WTF and consolidated the ranking, he never was in danger of losing it until the start of the grass season because his nearest rival was defending practically everything up to that point and could not overtake him.
 
Top