Depressed Murray fans check in here

Mainad

Bionic Poster
Utter bollocks. Everything Murray has he has worked bloody hard for.
It really is depressing that even some of his so-called fans can come out with such garbage! 'Not a hard worker', 'sense of entitlement', 'spoilt brat' blah blah blah! .....where the fc*k does all this come from? Do they not know him at all?

As for the Lendl business: it was almost certainly not Murray's decision to part with Lendl. He was more shocked by that development than anybody else! For all the great stuff Lendl had done working with Murray it is my opinion that he left him in the lurch at a time when he needed him the most...trying to get back to form following his back surgery. Only a year earlier he had told a BBC reporter that he could see himself coaching Murray to the end of his career! For whatever reason, he completely changed his mind about that and I personally don't think it was a coincidence that he decided to call it quits following Murray's surgery!
 

Mainad

Bionic Poster
I am going with Murray to win Miami hope he bags it he needs a big title.
Indeed. He hasn't won any big titles since 2013 Wimbledon, almost 2 years ago!

However, it is clearly going to be difficult for him with Djokovic in the draw as he hasn't had a win against him since 2013 Wimbledon and last week's semi-final at IW didn't exactly indicate that he is any nearer to accomplishing this! So it looks as if it's going to take a while longer. If Djokovic unexpectedly falls early in Miami or withdraws then of course Murray will have a very good chance!
 

batz

G.O.A.T.
It really is depressing that even some of his so-called fans can come out with such garbage! 'Not a hard worker', 'sense of entitlement', 'spoilt brat' blah blah blah! .....where the fc*k does all this come from? Do they not know him at all?

As for the Lendl business: it was almost certainly not Murray's decision to part with Lendl. He was more shocked by that development than anybody else! For all the great stuff Lendl had done working with Murray it is my opinion that he left him in the lurch at a time when he needed him the most...trying to get back to form following his back surgery. Only a year earlier he had told a BBC reporter that he could see himself coaching Murray to the end of his career! For whatever reason, he completely changed his mind about that and I personally don't think it was a coincidence that he decided to call it quits following Murray's surgery!

I honestly have no idea. What I do know is that by a combination of re-mortgaging the family home and a few K of sponsorship money from RBS, the Murray family were able to fund his 20 months @ Sanchez Casal - until the age of 15 he went to state schools.

I also know that he seems to be playing in a era that includes 3 of the greatest players ever to lift a racket but he still managed to win a couple of slams, an OSG and 9 Masters Series.

I guess he was just entitled to those things.


Re Lendl - I think Ivan disagreed with decision to have the surgery.
 
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J

JRAJ1988

Guest
I completely misinterpreted what the user who was critical of Murray insinuated. I apologize for that, Mainad and Batz.

Murray has worked for what he has got, he wasn't born with a silver spoon in his gob...compared to let's say David Cameron for example. He's battled through adversity for example, Dunblane, the mental scars of a nightmare what 20 years ago? having a group of faux hooligan English Nationalists bash him time and time again since a joke about England's world cup chances in 2006, you get xenophobes like that Fastgrass character who bash Murray because he's British...then you've got the stream of haters who hate Murray for what he looks like and his playing style.

Just since his return in 2014, I've been overly critical of Murray's folding when it matters.
 

batz

G.O.A.T.
I completely misinterpreted what the user who was critical of Murray insinuated. I apologize for that, Mainad and Batz.

Murray has worked for what he has got, he wasn't born with a silver spoon in his gob...compared to let's say David Cameron for example. He's battled through adversity for example, Dunblane, the mental scars of a nightmare what 20 years ago? having a group of faux hooligan English Nationalists bash him time and time again since a joke about England's world cup chances in 2006, you get xenophobes like that Fastgrass character who bash Murray because he's British...then you've got the stream of haters who hate Murray for what he looks like and his playing style.

Just since his return in 2014, I've been overly critical of Murray's folding when it matters.

No worries mate - I think your criticism re folding since his return is fair comment.
 

swordtennis

G.O.A.T.
Indeed. He hasn't won any big titles since 2013 Wimbledon, almost 2 years ago!

However, it is clearly going to be difficult for him with Djokovic in the draw as he hasn't had a win against him since 2013 Wimbledon and last week's semi-final at IW didn't exactly indicate that he is any nearer to accomplishing this! So it looks as if it's going to take a while longer. If Djokovic unexpectedly falls early in Miami or withdraws then of course Murray will have a very good chance!
If he faces anyone else besides Djokovic he takes the title imo. He has not been playing badly. He has a Djokovic problem right now. He needs to get on the grass asap.
 

TTMR

Hall of Fame
It really is depressing that even some of his so-called fans can come out with such garbage! 'Not a hard worker', 'sense of entitlement', 'spoilt brat' blah blah blah! .....where the fc*k does all this come from? Do they not know him at all?

As for the Lendl business: it was almost certainly not Murray's decision to part with Lendl. He was more shocked by that development than anybody else! For all the great stuff Lendl had done working with Murray it is my opinion that he left him in the lurch at a time when he needed him the most...trying to get back to form following his back surgery. Only a year earlier he had told a BBC reporter that he could see himself coaching Murray to the end of his career! For whatever reason, he completely changed his mind about that and I personally don't think it was a coincidence that he decided to call it quits following Murray's surgery!
And why, pray tell, did Lendl "abandon" Murray? To enjoy the sunshine on a beach in Sarasota? Please. It was Murray's behaviour that precipitated the split in their relationship. That's the truth, although I realize taking responsibility for his actions is a bridge too far for the sour Scot, and expecting him to do as such a Munich-like concession as far as his fans are concerned.
 

batz

G.O.A.T.
And why, pray tell, did Lendl "abandon" Murray? To enjoy the sunshine on a beach in Sarasota? Please. It was Murray's behaviour that precipitated the split in their relationship. That's the truth, although I realize taking responsibility for his actions is a bridge too far for the sour Scot, and expecting him to do as such a Munich-like concession as far as his fans are concerned.
Ivan told you all this himself did he? Maybe it was The Voices?

I used to think you were just a bit of a harmless caricature - but your bawbagerry is really starting to show.
 

Mainad

Bionic Poster
And why, pray tell, did Lendl "abandon" Murray? To enjoy the sunshine on a beach in Sarasota? Please. It was Murray's behaviour that precipitated the split in their relationship. That's the truth, although I realize taking responsibility for his actions is a bridge too far for the sour Scot, and expecting him to do as such a Munich-like concession as far as his fans are concerned.
This is a thread for depressed Murray fans. As you are obviously not depressed by any of his setbacks but apparently just feel the need to vent some deep-seated anger and self-righteous justification for his failings, I advise you to express your negativity in the various other threads started by posters of a similar disposition and leave us Murray fans in here to discuss his activities in a more sympathetic manner with each other!
 
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Flint

Hall of Fame
I wonder how Much Murray has improved since the US Open.

His match against Djokovic in both the last 2 slams have been pretty identical.

First 2 sets go to tiebreaks, 1 each, then Djokovic runs away with it.
 

Mainad

Bionic Poster
I wonder how Much Murray has improved since the US Open.

His match against Djokovic in both the last 2 slams have been pretty identical.

First 2 sets go to tiebreaks, 1 each, then Djokovic runs away with it.
Interesting point. That does seem to have been the pattern in their last 3 hardcourt appearances at the Slams:

2015 AO final: 7-6,6-7,6-3,6-0 to Djokovic
2014 USO quarter-final: 7-6,6-7,6-2,6-4 to Djokovic
2013 AO final: 6-7,7-6,6-3,6-2 to Djokovic

I wonder why it is taking so long for Murray to recognise the familiar pattern and break it like he did in their 2012 USO final encounter?
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
Murray IMO needs a faster court to have any chance against Djokovic. On slow ones he doesn't seem to have enough firepower to hit through Djokovic.

Miami is even slower than IW. If Murray plays Djokovic there it is going to get uglier than IW
 

Flint

Hall of Fame
I never understand that. On fast courts he always looks like he is scrambling to get to the ball as its moving away from him so fast.

On slower courts he should be able to be in position.

Plus he looks physically much more muscular than Djokovic so why does he not consistently hit deep?
 

Netspirit

Hall of Fame
Miami is unique in that it is both very slow, and very low-bouncing. Basically, "tennis played on sweaty courts" (it is very humid too). Murray's defensive slices work well, while Nadal's cannot get the kick that normally troubles his opponents.
 
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batz

G.O.A.T.
Murray IMO needs a faster court to have any chance against Djokovic. On slow ones he doesn't seem to have enough firepower to hit through Djokovic.

Miami is even slower than IW
. If Murray plays Djokovic there it is going to get uglier than IW
I think that Miami 'plays faster' than IW if that doesn't sound too stupid. IW is very slow with a high bounce but the ball flys fast through the desert air.

Miami has a much lower bounce and the ball goes through the court faster than at IW - but the humidity means the ball flys more slowly through the air.

Rafa has won IW 3 times but never Miami - I think this fact supports my contention.

Re Murray's record at Miami - people shouldn't forget that he spends more time practising on Centre Court at Crandon Park than on any other court in the world.
 
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decrepitude

Rookie
And why, pray tell, did Lendl "abandon" Murray? To enjoy the sunshine on a beach in Sarasota? Please. It was Murray's behaviour that precipitated the split in their relationship. That's the truth, although I realize taking responsibility for his actions is a bridge too far for the sour Scot, and expecting him to do as such a Munich-like concession as far as his fans are concerned.
Lendl could handle Murray's behaviour, no problem.

I agree with Batz that I think Lendl was against having the back surgery. I also think that it is possible that Andy found the more aggressive way he was playing under Lendl is just not sustainable with a bad back, may even have made a slight problem worse. He seems to feel there is no going back to that way, he needs to find other ways to win. So far he is doing well beating most other players, (Coric and Simon matches aside, I'll come back to them), but he needs to work out another way to beat the top 3.

The Coric and Simon matches (and at least they were QFs, not first rounds) may possibly be because of all the distractions in trying to find somebody to fill in the gaps in his team.

There seems to be an awful lot of "possibly" and "maybe" in this post - but after all, we do not have any inside information, all we can do is make educated guesses.
 

Rebel-I.N.S

Professional
Lendl could handle Murray's behaviour, no problem.

I agree with Batz that I think Lendl was against having the back surgery. I also think that it is possible that Andy found the more aggressive way he was playing under Lendl is just not sustainable with a bad back, may even have made a slight problem worse. He seems to feel there is no going back to that way, he needs to find other ways to win. So far he is doing well beating most other players, (Coric and Simon matches aside, I'll come back to them), but he needs to work out another way to beat the top 3.

The Coric and Simon matches (and at least they were QFs, not first rounds) may possibly be because of all the distractions in trying to find somebody to fill in the gaps in his team.

There seems to be an awful lot of "possibly" and "maybe" in this post - but after all, we do not have any inside information, all we can do is make educated guesses.
Good post.
 

Mainad

Bionic Poster
Lendl could handle Murray's behaviour, no problem.
Agreed. He had been handling it well enough for the previous 2 and a half years and was enjoying working with him so much that he stated he could see it lasting until the end of his career! Personally, I think he changed his mind after the surgery, didn't want to have to deal with a Murray trying to recover form and bolted just when Andy needed him the most. Nice one Ivan!

I agree with Batz that I think Lendl was against having the back surgery. I also think that it is possible that Andy found the more aggressive way he was playing under Lendl is just not sustainable with a bad back, may even have made a slight problem worse. He seems to feel there is no going back to that way, he needs to find other ways to win. So far he is doing well beating most other players, (Coric and Simon matches aside, I'll come back to them), but he needs to work out another way to beat the top 3.
I hope this isn't true but it is my fear as well. Murray needs to play against Djokovic and Federer the way he did in 2008-13 and if he can't recapture that form because of the surgery, then he has major problems. I can't see what other way he can adopt in order to start beating them again!

The Coric and Simon matches (and at least they were QFs, not first rounds) may possibly be because of all the distractions in trying to find somebody to fill in the gaps in his team.
Possibly. He has certainly endured a lot of upheaval lately with his physical problems and major changes to a tried and trusted team.

There seems to be an awful lot of "possibly" and "maybe" in this post - but after all, we do not have any inside information, all we can do is make educated guesses.
That's all we can do unless of course we're Homeboy Hotel with a direct line of communication to the man himself! :wink:
 
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Flint

Hall of Fame
I like this comment from this video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nthn8q4dsOk

"I think Andy messed up with his playing style after Wimbledon. He was playing very well in the clay season and you would imagine he would definitely be a contender for the remaining two GS. Sure he is more confident with his body now but he is playing passive, he looks to be playing more aggressive in this video than he has recently. "

I agree with it. The clay season was the best part of Murrays whole year and he did look like he was playing very well in it. I'd like to see some more of the way he played then. He played with intent.
 
J

JRAJ1988

Guest
I tuned into the Djokovic Murray clash 1 set all, Murray just gives up AGAIN.

I'm tired of it, why give up? "Oh I'm so scared of my former friend"...shoulder barge him, stare him out, stop being so spineless when the heat is on, learn a new language to moan in.

Fuming, really fuming...DAMN IT
 
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Capulin Zurdo

Hall of Fame
Somewhat depressed Murray fan checking in here..

Good effort by Murray to push to a tie break in the first set and winning the second. Though, his body language was not very good; he looked despondent. I really hoped he could have gotten another solid win against the top, but perchance during the clay swing he may.
 

tennisaddict

Bionic Poster
I tuned into the Djokovic Murray clash 1 set all, Murray just gives up AGAIN.

I'm tired of it, why give up? "Oh I'm so scared of my former friend"...shoulder barge him, stare him out, stop being so spineless when the heat is on, learn a new language to moan in.

Fuming, really fuming...DAMN IT
Murray was the better player for first 2 sets, sans the tie break.

The first game of the third set was just bad.
 

Terenigma

G.O.A.T.
Once again he gets rolled over in the last set. Djokovic is just too good for everyone right now, At least Murray is being better than the rest but yeah, not a good sign to be bageled AGAIN.
 

Pagoo

G.O.A.T.
The fact that Murray can't hang with Djokovic in a deciding set is alarming.

Even Federer manages to win some games. Not sure if it is all physical or mental at this point.

He needs to fix it or forget about winning any big titles.

Truly sad. I was elated when he took the second set and then the collapse!
 

Mainad

Bionic Poster
Just what is it with Andy and 3rd sets with Djokovic? Why these constant 3rd set bagels???:(

At least he played much better than he did in IW and could have won it in straights if he had played a better tie-breaker in the 1st set. But that's all ifs, buts and maybes. I don't know why he is giving up so meekly in the deciding set!

It's these 3rd set bagels that are making me a bit depressed. Once he became a top player, bagels against Murray were extremely rare. I can only think of one instance (at 2010 Toronto against Monfils where he still went on to win the match) until the last 5 months where he has now suffered 3 in succession, 2 of them from the same guy, a guy he used to be more competitive with!

Whether its physical or mental or both, Mauresmo has got to get a handle on this or she is not doing her job as coach!
 

*Sparkle*

Professional
I didn't think that final set was meek. He got to deuce a lot on his own serve, saved loads of break points, and got to deuce on Djokovic's serve a lot too.

Murray has always been prone to a terrible first service after he's won the previous set, and he was doing it long before Mauresmo came onto the scene. Blaming her is lazy.

The problem is that having lost that first service game, he couldn't find a way to make the score competitive, but he's not the only one struggling to do that with Djokovic in deciding sets, so again, it's not fair to pin the blame on one coach.
 

D.Nalby12

G.O.A.T.
Djokovic was clearly wasn't top of his game today but Murray missed the opportunity to snap losing streak. Till 4-4 first set Murray played some of his best offensive Tennis breaking Djokovic twice followed by loose service games throwing breaks away.

If he had belief, this could be straight set win for him.
 

Mainad

Bionic Poster
I didn't think that final set was meek. He got to deuce a lot on his own serve, saved loads of break points, and got to deuce on Djokovic's serve a lot too.
It appears you are right. The stats show that Djokovic won just 7 more points than Murray despite the final set bagel so it was a competitive, tight match all the way through.

Murray has always been prone to a terrible first service after he's won the previous set, and he was doing it long before Mauresmo came onto the scene. Blaming her is lazy.
Maybe but Mauresmo is Murray's coach and it's her duty to point out these things. If not, why is she there?

The problem is that having lost that first service game, he couldn't find a way to make the score competitive, but he's not the only one struggling to do that with Djokovic in deciding sets, so again, it's not fair to pin the blame on one coach.
It''s not all her fault of course but Murray has been used to winning big titles with previous coaches. She is the first coach he has had since becoming a top player where this has not happened yet. He's been coming close but he needs someone to help him get over that finishing line again especially when facing Djokovic!
 

*Sparkle*

Professional
Maybe but Mauresmo is Murray's coach and it's her duty to point out these things. If not, why is she there?
Do you really think he doesn't know?

It''s not all her fault of course but Murray has been used to winning big titles with previous coaches. She is the first coach he has had since becoming a top player where this has not happened yet. He's been coming close but he needs someone to help him get over that finishing line again especially when facing Djokovic!
He started to win towards the end of last year, when he spent most of it recovering from the surgery, then building up to full fitness. Two finals and a semi-final in the three biggest events is a good start to the year. He's second in the race. You've obviously got a bee in your Easter bonnet about Mauresmo, but I think you are being unrealistic.
 

Homeboy Hotel

Hall of Fame
Murray could've easily won his opening service game of the 3rd set, but he couldn't put a smash away for the 4th time of asking, lengthy deuce as per usual, then few minutes later its 4-0.

He had chances to hold serve, couldn't take them. I was looking at serve stats every set and I accurately predicted which set would go to a TB and Murray would win the second. What a shame he just couldn't put up a fight in the third.

Who knew Djokovic-Murray has actually become Fedal of tennis. I was expecting something for more equal over the medium term. Only thing that beats this run of losses now is Murray beating Djokovic at RG and/or Wimbledon. :evil:
 

flaspur

Rookie
There seems to be a worrying pattern developing with Murray with regards to mental collapses and match tactics. He got bageled at the World Tour Finals last year against Fed, then again at the AO and now here in Miami, again versus Djoko. Once is one of those things, twice is a concern... three is alarm bells time!

He is clearly lacking the mental strength and more importantly, clarity of mind to maintain his level and stay in the fight and this is down to lack of belief in his game, his strategy and his recent record. Again, I would argue he actually threw that match away rather than got beat - even though the third set suggests otherwise.

Murray should have won the first set. End of. His first two returning games were very impressive. He stepped in, took the ball early and hit aggressively. You could clearly see Novak was rattled right from the start. Murray got the deserved break and was off to a good start and should have kept that level up. Instead of consolidating the break, Murray made poor shot choices and hit straight back to Nolé when a clear court was sat in front of him for easy winners. Why? Because he's over thinking, putting too much pressure on himself by trying to win from the back of the court in long exchanges and knows full well, the ball will come back.

My biggest frustration with Murray (apart from his poor serving) is his lack of net approaches. When he did attack the net (rarely), it clearly put pressure on Novak's shots and you could see he would get some in-roads into Nolé's game. Yet instead, Murray when having pushed Novak wide, would instead be happy to sit back, wait for the deep ball to drop, move backwards (!) and then be straight on the back foot again. This only leads to long, lung busting rallies when a great put away volley would cut off the point and more importantly, send a message across the net saying he's in control. Instead, it's the usual "sit back and hit" Murray and there's only one winner doing that. It was infuriating.

For me, there were least one of two times per game when Murray has put a very good double handed shot out wide to Novak's backhand side that is crying out to be followed in. Ok… so Novak might make a winner, some he won't but it puts that element of doubt (and pressure) into his mind. Will Murray come in, won't he?

Right now, Murray's game is all to predictable. Hit left, hit right… repeat. It's like a practice court drill.

If Mauresmo, after nearly a whole year, can't see the issue right in front of her, I wonder what's she's doing there in the stands as she seems to offer nothing to Murray's game since Lendl departed.
 

icepro

New User
What is there to be depressed about?

Tennis is a game where you better get used to losing...

He is ranked (in a few days time) no 3 in the world, above him is one of the best players to have played the game, and also the current open era grand slam record holder.
He's losing to a guy who is on top form, sometimes you have to accept the other guy is better, and just keep chipping away at your game to make improvements.
The differences are small % things, so be positive and know fairly soon, Nadal and Fed will have retired.
 

Capulin Zurdo

Hall of Fame
Somewhat depressed Murray fan, checking in here...

Very good for Murray to win the third and fourth sets and take the match to five sets, but the last one I was hoping for to be close. Anyhow, SF again at R.G. I think is still a good result.
 

NamRanger

G.O.A.T.
Protypical Murray against Djokovic. He for whatever reason has no belief that he can beat Djokovic in a 5th set, and just mentally implodes for whatever reason and throws all strategy out the window.
 

flaspur

Rookie
Murray's won two titles and and SF at Rolland Garros. Most tour players would take that in a heartbeat. A damn good clay court season no matter who you are!
 

Gary Duane

G.O.A.T.
I think this could have ended very differently if yesterday's match had not been interrupted. Novak tends to start quickly. He's become a front-runner. Murray played himself into the match yesterday.
 

Poisoned Slice

Bionic Poster
I wasn't depressed after the Australian Open final, I was less depressed this time. I have to believe the day is coming soon for Andy Murray. He will beat Novak again. Unless, of course, we are in 2017, and Djokovic has won the last 22. Lets not be over dramatic.

ahhhhhh.

I'm pretty happy after today/yesterday. I'm not down. I know Andy will be upset, but he says he learned a lot. Keep the faith.
 
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Edgecrusher

Professional
I think this could have ended very differently if yesterday's match had not been interrupted. Novak tends to start quickly. He's become a front-runner. Murray played himself into the match yesterday.
I don't think so. If it wasn't the rain they would have suspended play at the end of the fourth set anyway (due to darkness; that's what the Eurosport commentator confirmed). And today Andy was the one who started quickly and won the fourth set.
 
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okdude1992

Hall of Fame
Ehh I guess I'm starting to become a Murray fan. Anyway not disappointed he lost. Just that he capitulated at the start of the 5th and rolled over in the end. Pretty good result, taking it to 5. But looks like more of the same in the end.
 

Rozroz

G.O.A.T.
not here to be negative or gloat.

just that i noticed Murray found a new "way" of getting into a match and also putting especially Djokovic in a sensitive defensive mental state.

yea, i mean the simple way of getting the crowd involved and being "alive". it worked perfectly against Novak in the 3th and 4th,
and also got Murray extra motivated.
it almost felt that the team may thought about this and encouraged Murray to remember this when he's behind.

what i don't understand is why he completely forgot about it in the 5th, and didn't try to use it even just to rattle Djokovic a bit.

anyway, it's a very good mental way of facing Novak and his crowd love problem.

thoughts?
 

JonnyMac

Hall of Fame
not here to be negative or gloat.

just that i noticed Murray found a new "way" of getting into a match and also putting especially Djokovic in a sensitive defensive mental state.

yea, i mean the simple way of getting the crowd involved and being "alive". it worked perfectly against Novak in the 3th and 4th,
and also got Murray extra motivated.
it almost felt that the team may thought about this and encouraged Murray to remember this when he's behind.

what i don't understand is why he completely forgot about it in the 5th, and didn't try to use it even just to rattle Djokovic a bit.

anyway, it's a very good mental way of facing Novak and his crowd love problem.

thoughts?
Well it's clear why the crowd and anybody with a heart hates the Jirking Cheat !

He must be the most disliked world number one in history.

I don't see a great future for the Jirker. When he goes, he won't be remembered fondly.

A truly great champion takes the crowed and the love with him. Ref Rafa, Roger.....

Novak knows this and just can't see why he's not popular. He could win another 20 slams but no one will call 'great'.

His victories are therefore hollow. He's not a true champion, in that he's not the complete package.
 

Rozroz

G.O.A.T.
Well it's clear why the crowd and anybody with a heart hates the Jirking Cheat !

He must be the most disliked world number one in history.

I don't see a great future for the Jirker. When he goes, he won't be remembered fondly.

A truly great champion takes the crowed and the love with him. Ref Rafa, Roger.....

Novak knows this and just can't see why he's not popular. He could win another 20 slams but no one will call 'great'.

His victories are therefore hollow. He's not a true champion, in that he's not the complete package.
well, not fully agree about Novak..
was mainly trying to think why Murray didn't do this simple mental trick he did in the 3rd and 4th which obviously worked.
 
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