I was wondering if someone could explain to me the differences between the gamma Progression II 602FC, the gamma X-6FC and the eagnas flash 767. It is obvious from pictures I've seen the base and upright arm are different on the X-6FC (advantages?, disadvantes?) and the eagnas machine looks just like the Progression II 602FC but with the swivel clamp base from the X-6FC. Also the eagnas model appears to have different clamps in the picture I'm seeing, but maybe those are the badmiton clamps? If anyone has any experience with these machines, any or all, and has any advice I'd appreciate it.
Differences in these machines
- Thread starter stox
- Start date
gocard
Semi-Pro
I have the X6-FC and it is a great machine - very sturdy and solid. The base construction looks different from the 602-FC but I think it is just the appearance that is different. At first I thought the arm might be flimsier than the one on the 602 b/c it wasn't a complete solid piece, but I have absolutely no problems with it. You just need to make sure you have the piece fully screwed in and it stays in place just fine.
I don't have experience with the other machines but I am very satisfied with mine.
I don't have experience with the other machines but I am very satisfied with mine.
nousername
Rookie
well, i just received a Flash 767, and i also briefly had an alpha pioneer DC plus. there might be some useful info especially here or here.
i haven't seen or used either of the gammas, so i can't directly comment. but the eagnas certainly has better clamps and clamp bases than either of the gamma machines. the 767 clamps are metal and not composite, and the bases are spring assisted (very nice) and the gammas are not.
the Flash 767 comes with badminton clamps and tennis clamps. some of the pictures on Eagnas' website show the 767 with their old style tennis clamps, but these new ones are what it currently comes with. also if you didn't notice, the 767 is $369 and not $399 at their actual webstore.
from my experience owning an alpha and an eagnas, i can would certainly say there is no difference in the part quality, but i think eagnas does cut corners in their pre-assembly/assembly. to me the later is no big deal, and worth the cost b/c i don't mind tweak things myself a little. here are a few of the things that weren't quite right out of the box:
- the rubber pad that goes in the tool tray was completely free. i had to go buy my own adhesive to attach it.
- pads on the mounting stock were similar, they just have a few press-fit knobs that line up with screws in the mounting stock. overall, it's not that secure and is better with some adhesive. also, these "pads" are plastic not rubber. the pics of both the eagnas and the gammas look like nice rubber pads, but these eagnas ones are not (i'd be curious what the gammas are like).
- the adhesive holding "diamond-dust" on the gripper was peeling back just a bit, i had to add a little super glue to hold it down.
in addtion, eagnas save cost by making the customer do some final assembly steps. no big deal, but the flash 767 did have 1 tricky part: installing the tension rod. the instructions say something about it "sliding in easily", not ture. i need to get some vice-grip pliers on it, so i could work it back and forth to slide it in. i had to apply a fair amount of force, and since it's going into a composite/plastic assembly i had to be careful. you also have to be sure the set screw lines up properly with the recess in the rod. on my first attempt, it wasn't perfect so i ended up stripping the set screw a bit. but after it got lined up right it was fine. these details/tips are not in the instructions. the gammas have this same composite assembly, so these issue might be the same... unless, it comes pre-installed.
i also don't care that much for the plastic gripper, and the plastic cover on the turn-table. BUT these were known expected things, and the gamma 602FC has the same.
so did i like anything about the 767? yes... the mounting is awesome. better than the alpha pioneer dc plus. i like the fact that the 4 shoulder supports are secured from below the arms with thumb-screws. the screws probably aren't needed, but they sure make me feel like the racquet is much more secure. in addition, the mounting stocks are MUCh easier to secure. the 767 comes with big strong sliding rods, instead of small knobs like the pioneer DC plus. in addition, the rods comes with smooth round balls on the end, making them much more comfortable to grab. esp since they need to get really tight.
overall, i'm happy with my 767, and i don't mind the corners they took b/c it saved me $100 (even more than that b/c you actually get more with the 767 b/c of the better clamps).
btw - i haven't yet strung any racquets with my 767 yet (just got it last week), and once i do i'll post a review (much like the above) and i'll try to get some pics up too.
let me know if you have any questions... or if you want some pics let me know.
i haven't seen or used either of the gammas, so i can't directly comment. but the eagnas certainly has better clamps and clamp bases than either of the gamma machines. the 767 clamps are metal and not composite, and the bases are spring assisted (very nice) and the gammas are not.
the Flash 767 comes with badminton clamps and tennis clamps. some of the pictures on Eagnas' website show the 767 with their old style tennis clamps, but these new ones are what it currently comes with. also if you didn't notice, the 767 is $369 and not $399 at their actual webstore.
from my experience owning an alpha and an eagnas, i can would certainly say there is no difference in the part quality, but i think eagnas does cut corners in their pre-assembly/assembly. to me the later is no big deal, and worth the cost b/c i don't mind tweak things myself a little. here are a few of the things that weren't quite right out of the box:
- the rubber pad that goes in the tool tray was completely free. i had to go buy my own adhesive to attach it.
- pads on the mounting stock were similar, they just have a few press-fit knobs that line up with screws in the mounting stock. overall, it's not that secure and is better with some adhesive. also, these "pads" are plastic not rubber. the pics of both the eagnas and the gammas look like nice rubber pads, but these eagnas ones are not (i'd be curious what the gammas are like).
- the adhesive holding "diamond-dust" on the gripper was peeling back just a bit, i had to add a little super glue to hold it down.
in addtion, eagnas save cost by making the customer do some final assembly steps. no big deal, but the flash 767 did have 1 tricky part: installing the tension rod. the instructions say something about it "sliding in easily", not ture. i need to get some vice-grip pliers on it, so i could work it back and forth to slide it in. i had to apply a fair amount of force, and since it's going into a composite/plastic assembly i had to be careful. you also have to be sure the set screw lines up properly with the recess in the rod. on my first attempt, it wasn't perfect so i ended up stripping the set screw a bit. but after it got lined up right it was fine. these details/tips are not in the instructions. the gammas have this same composite assembly, so these issue might be the same... unless, it comes pre-installed.
i also don't care that much for the plastic gripper, and the plastic cover on the turn-table. BUT these were known expected things, and the gamma 602FC has the same.
so did i like anything about the 767? yes... the mounting is awesome. better than the alpha pioneer dc plus. i like the fact that the 4 shoulder supports are secured from below the arms with thumb-screws. the screws probably aren't needed, but they sure make me feel like the racquet is much more secure. in addition, the mounting stocks are MUCh easier to secure. the 767 comes with big strong sliding rods, instead of small knobs like the pioneer DC plus. in addition, the rods comes with smooth round balls on the end, making them much more comfortable to grab. esp since they need to get really tight.
overall, i'm happy with my 767, and i don't mind the corners they took b/c it saved me $100 (even more than that b/c you actually get more with the 767 b/c of the better clamps).
btw - i haven't yet strung any racquets with my 767 yet (just got it last week), and once i do i'll post a review (much like the above) and i'll try to get some pics up too.
let me know if you have any questions... or if you want some pics let me know.
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AZTennisKid
New User
Save up and get a Prince NEOS...
Hey gocard, I was wondering if you could tell me in your opinion how well those clamps work? Also was wondering are the pads for the racquet mounting are plastic or rubber like nousername asked.
Nousername, that sounds like an awful lot of poor workmanship. I'm not sure I could trust a company that does that poor of a job. About the clamps, those are the ones I saw but they are 3, I guess you'd call them teeth?, instead of the 5 teeth ones that seem to be on it's counterpart and in your opinion what makes them better than the gammas? Also the Gamma 602FC seems to have spring assisted clamp bases as well.
AZTennisKid, the prince neos may be a good machine but personally I do not like the idea of a 2 point mounting system and feel that a drop weight machine would be more accurate than one with a reel (also no calibration needed) and I'm in no hurry to string racquets.
Nousername, that sounds like an awful lot of poor workmanship. I'm not sure I could trust a company that does that poor of a job. About the clamps, those are the ones I saw but they are 3, I guess you'd call them teeth?, instead of the 5 teeth ones that seem to be on it's counterpart and in your opinion what makes them better than the gammas? Also the Gamma 602FC seems to have spring assisted clamp bases as well.
AZTennisKid, the prince neos may be a good machine but personally I do not like the idea of a 2 point mounting system and feel that a drop weight machine would be more accurate than one with a reel (also no calibration needed) and I'm in no hurry to string racquets.
nousername
Rookie
yeah, it might seem like "a lot" of poor workmanship to some people, but not really to me. i'm not really sure how others companies compare (like gamma), but do i know a little about alpha so i can speak to that. if you ready my "alpha story" in the first link i provided, you will quickly see i didn't fair any better with them. i'd suspect gamma is the same way. yes, eagnas customer service is poor (but not as bad as people claim, esp once you become a customer), whereas gamma and alpha have great customer service, but from all the talk on these boards, it seems clear to me that customer service quality is equated directly with the perceived product quality (... granted, that is somewhat understandable, since it's always difficult to do anything truly objectively and without bias). but those evaluations definitely skews the scales, esp if you are like me and looking for the best value. since i've now owned both an alpha and an eagans, i can affirm that there is very little difference in the actual quality of the machines.
as for the clamps, the 3-tooth ones are the ones that the flash 767 will ship with. these are also what other's have referred to as the "babolat style" clamps. the top babolat machines come with clamps that look almost identical to the eagnas 3-tooth clamps. also, if you reference this post you will find that gamma's "quick-action" clamped are NOT spring assisted, but instead what they call "switch-action" are the spring assisted ones. the 602 comes with the former.
gocard
Semi-Pro
Hi stox, my clamps are working great. The ones I have are the metal ones and not the composite-plastic looking ones and they are very sturdy. The first time I ever strung, the string kept on slipping out but that was because I didn't tighten the clamps enough to hold the string. You can adjust the clamps pretty easily and I can clamp/unclamp with one hand - you don't need to use a ton of force to use the clamps.
I think the pads that you are referring to for mounting the racquet are smooth plastic - I don't have any problems with them. Hope that helps!
nousername
Rookie
the pads i was referring to are the large black ribbed ones on the main mounting stocks. i have the eagans flash 767 and mine are plastic. also, mine can easily be removed, b/c they just have a press-fit attachment, what about yours? i would have preferred if there was some sort of adhesive.
either way, it's not a big deal since the racquet doesn't actually rest on the pads.
Did you order those clamps seperately or are they the ones that actually come with the machine now?
mista-k
Rookie
to backup nousername>
Alpha gets parts from China and Taiwan (source-Alpha Rep)
as for labor China charges $2 and Taiwan $8
(source:Eagnas "stay out" thread)
Eagnas=china
Alpha=????______
I wish I could advise you to buy Eagnas as it sounds like the machines would be of the same quality anyways...and yet I would like to avoid buyers remorse
on the other hand (based on nousername's Alpha Story)
-should have gotten a replacement vs a refund
-you wouldnt get a refund or replacement from Eagnas (unheard of) + you dont get a medal of valor for buying Eagnas
2 cents
-----
happy owner of a mp hercules 680 (made in taiwan)
Alpha gets parts from China and Taiwan (source-Alpha Rep)
as for labor China charges $2 and Taiwan $8
(source:Eagnas "stay out" thread)
Eagnas=china
Alpha=????______
I wish I could advise you to buy Eagnas as it sounds like the machines would be of the same quality anyways...and yet I would like to avoid buyers remorse
on the other hand (based on nousername's Alpha Story)
-should have gotten a replacement vs a refund
-you wouldnt get a refund or replacement from Eagnas (unheard of) + you dont get a medal of valor for buying Eagnas
2 cents
-----
happy owner of a mp hercules 680 (made in taiwan)
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gocard
Semi-Pro
If we're talking about the same thing (I don't know much of the terminology on the machines!), the pads on mine are plastic and press-fit because I could take it on and press it on without a lot of force. They don't just fall off for no reason or anything though. The ones on the X6-FC are blue, whereas the 602FC ones are red, to match with the base.
I didn't order the clamps separately - they came with the machine. I don't know if all the models (602FC, x6-FC) come with these ones now because I remember looking at several sites where the clamps looked to be the composite ones on the X6 model but then metal on other websites. However, I asked the stores that sold the X6-FC version whether or not the clamps were the metal ones and they confirmed that they were metal.
I didn't order the clamps separately - they came with the machine. I don't know if all the models (602FC, x6-FC) come with these ones now because I remember looking at several sites where the clamps looked to be the composite ones on the X6 model but then metal on other websites. However, I asked the stores that sold the X6-FC version whether or not the clamps were the metal ones and they confirmed that they were metal.
nousername
Rookie
the "mounting stock" or "mounting towers" are the 2 large assemblies at 12 and 6 o'clock that tighten directly to the turn-table. on the top of these towers it a somewhat large flat surface. we are wondering about the pad on this large flat surface, we're not referring to the pads on any of the racquet mounting supports (2 vertical ones at 12 and 6 o'clock, and 4 side/shoulder supports).
Gamma Tech
Professional
The Flash 767 is a knock-off of our the Gamma Progression 602FC, it isn't manufactured by our manufacture. i've never seen one in person but in the picture it makes me do a double take. I don't know about the quality.
The 602FC & X-6FC are very similar now, they have the same mounting system, turntable, clamps, gripper and dropweight. the bases are different. the 602FC has an aluminum frame with a ABS red cover on top and the dropweight arm is cast aluminum. the X-6FC parts are made from extruded aluminum.
bret
The 602FC & X-6FC are very similar now, they have the same mounting system, turntable, clamps, gripper and dropweight. the bases are different. the 602FC has an aluminum frame with a ABS red cover on top and the dropweight arm is cast aluminum. the X-6FC parts are made from extruded aluminum.
bret
Who does manufacture machines for Gamma? Long time question on this board. Plus why does Gamma keep it a secret?
nousername
Rookie
knock-off or not, who cares? it's all about quality, cost, and value. it's got better clamps, better bases, and a better price. so i'm happy. it also seems odd that you are not familiar with your competitors quality. i'd learn and know all i can about my competitors if i were in a business like this.
also, it's probably wise that you chose not to bash eagnas quality ... if someone can affirm the quality of a gamma machine to an alpha, we'd have a very good idea of how all three companies compare. b/c i have a first hand, recent comparison of a new alpha machine and an eagnas, and they are definitely on par with each other.
Gamma Tech
Professional
I posted this before about our manufacture, but here it is again. it is just our preference to keep it a secret.
'All GAMMA machines are produced by a factory in Taiwan that GAMMA has partnered with for nearly 15 years. After working with OEM suppliers in Taiwan for much of the '80's, Gamma decided to partner with a start-up factory under an exclusive arrangement, where the factory builds machines to GAMMA's design and specifications. We work hand in hand with the factory personnel to design, develop, and control the quality of the machines so that we have control over the design and production, which allows Gamma to offer the best possible machines with the latest innovations at a reasonable price. That is why you will not find any GAMMA parts on a competitor's machine and visa-versa. This arrangement has also allowed Gamma to be able to provide more immediate response to stringers when they have detailed questions about the operation of their machine, or in the event a problem should arise, be able to diagnose the cause and correct it quickly. I hope this gives you more insight with regard to how Gamma machines are designed and manufactured.'
I would like to be able to tell you that i've seen every machine from every brand but that isn't realistic. I only try to post to questions that ask for facts about machines. I've seen a lot of info on this board about eagnas and it seem hit or miss and also looking at their website that they will knock off any machine out there. if you do a quick search for Gamma or Alpha you will find A LOT of people confirming the quality.
bret
I am an owner of both an Eagnas and Gamma machine, and I have been happy with both. I have no complaints about my Eagnas. For the price, it is a great machine. As far as the Gamma, it was twice as much, but it was also far superior as far as the quality build is concerned. The finish outs and the feel of the machine are so much better. Think Hundai vs. Lexus between these 2 machines. I can get from point A to point B with both, but I sure like that Lexus a whole let better.
shintan17
Semi-Pro
Yeah...it all depends on what you look for in the machines. I am sure Hyundai makes their customers as happy as Lexus does to their customers. Some people don't care what they drive and treat a vehicle as just transportation they need while others may want to feel luxurious and all features..AND LOOKS!!
nousername
Rookie
very fair indeed.
as it does have a little bearing on your evaluation, i'm curious which machines you have? both the eagnas and alpha machines i've had are similar: both on the upper end of the drop-weight spectrum.
nousername,
Here are evaluations and pics of my machines
http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=155567
My Eagnas and Gamma are 2 totally different machines and shouldn't even be compared to each other. For the price, my Eagnas is excellent. My Gamma is much more expensive and it wouldn't even be a fair contest to compare the two. This particular Gamma is far superior.
I really don't see any machine by Eagnas (yet) that one can compare to the Gamma 6004. I say "yet" because I bet you Eagnas will have a knock off soon.
I think one fair comparison would be an Alpha Apex II ($1000) vs Eagnas 6500 ($600). That would be interesting.
Here are evaluations and pics of my machines
http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=155567
My Eagnas and Gamma are 2 totally different machines and shouldn't even be compared to each other. For the price, my Eagnas is excellent. My Gamma is much more expensive and it wouldn't even be a fair contest to compare the two. This particular Gamma is far superior.
I really don't see any machine by Eagnas (yet) that one can compare to the Gamma 6004. I say "yet" because I bet you Eagnas will have a knock off soon.
I think one fair comparison would be an Alpha Apex II ($1000) vs Eagnas 6500 ($600). That would be interesting.
nousername
Rookie
yeah, so i still think it's tough to say eagnas are lower quality, b/c your machines are in such a different price category. likewise, for me, it would be really interesting if i could see a 602fc up close, then i'd really know how their qualities compare.
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