Diffrence between topspin serve and kick serve?

What is the diffirence between the topspin serve and kick serve as far as how you hit them like from 12 o'clock to 6 o'clock stuff like that
 
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LuckyR

Legend
Here we go again... You'd better define your terms first or your advice is going to be difficult to collate.
 

Koaske

Rookie
The usage of these terms vary between persons. Some call any serve with decent topspin a kick serve while others use kick as a synonyme for the twist.
 

dave333

Hall of Fame
Kick serve is more 8-2 or 7-1 and when it hits the ground, it'll go the opposite direction it was traveling in, usually to the left if you are a righty.
 

Bagumbawalla

Hall of Fame
First of all, forget the "topspin serve. All that a topspin serve does is cross the net slower than a flat serve and sit up nice and high so that it is easier to pound away for an agressie return. There is really no advantage to a topspin serve and several dis advantages. The disadvantages are-- it is more difficult to hit, harder on the back and arm/wrist.

Ust the kick serve for doubles or a second serve in singles.

There are many threads on this, even within the last few days. Look them up or do a search.

Good luck,

B
 

hasema

Rookie
I dont' think the flat serve really works for a second serve. There is more margine for error, with the topspin second serve.
I think it is all about variety when coming to serves. Keep your opponent guessing how the ball is going to jump off the court.

But i'm a 4.0 club level player. Maybe more advanced players will see into it. But i have very good success even at the 4.5 doubles play.
 

samizram

Rookie
First of all, forget the "topspin serve. All that a topspin serve does is cross the net slower than a flat serve and sit up nice and high so that it is easier to pound away for an agressie return. There is really no advantage to a topspin serve and several dis advantages. The disadvantages are-- it is more difficult to hit, harder on the back and arm/wrist.

Ust the kick serve for doubles or a second serve in singles.

There are many threads on this, even within the last few days. Look them up or do a search.

Good luck,

B
"Sit up" doesn't mean "bounce high." It means "bounce straight up." Usually it's underspin shots that sit up. And yes, when they do that they bounce higher than normal. Which I suppose is why sloppy thinking got "sit up" confused with "bounce high."

The only time topspin shots sit up is on very fast surfaces if you don't get enough topspin on them. Then they bounce almost straight up instead of driving the opponent deep.

So where are you getting that all topspin serves "sit up"? Baloney. To say that such a penetrating shot "sits up" is ludicrous. True, you'd have to be an idiot to hit topspin on second serve to a strong forehand, but high-bouncing serves to the backhand or at the body are often very good serves.

So the topspin serve isn't at all useless.

And as for the back problems, yikes. The back breaking serve is the twist serve, not the topspin serve. If players don't learn to get the heels up and bend back at the knees instead of arch the back, they are asking for back trouble.

"Kick" is another such mushup job. "Kick" has always refered to the long, penetrating (and yes high too) bound of a topspin shot. Just watch. The court seems to kick the ball at whoever the shot is going to. In fact "kick" wasn't used exclusively for topspin serves. It was sometimes used for any heavy topspin shot.

That's why most authorities regard both the topspin serve and the twist serve as kick serves. But there is a minority that keeps screwing up terms like "sit up" and "kick." And no matter what, they just will not get it straight.
 

LuckyR

Legend
In addition to the observations in samizram's posts (which I would have phrased differently). A lot of the possible effectiveness of the pure topspin serve (by whatever name) has to do with whom you are hitting it to. An 18 year old full Western FH baseline basher will run around topspins to the backhand and crush them. However oldschoolers with Eastern grips often have trouble with high bounding/kicking serves. In addition the extra distance traveled by the topspinning serve will easily give you and extra step on the S&V and perhaps 1 1/2 or two steps depending on your quickness. That can make all the difference.
 
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