Djokodal would have conquered the “weak era” even more than Fed did, and ended up with better stats than his by 2008

[RS]

Dw I’ll do the Fed in 1987 one as well soon which will be even more conclusive

I have ruined your thread sorry

 

[Mustard]

In what way was Norton Ali's kyrptonite? If i am right they only fought in the late 70's

Ali and Norton fought each other 3 times, i.e. twice in 1973 over 12 rounds, and then in 1976 in a 15 round world title fight where Ali was defending champion. Norton got the decision in the first fight (where Norton broke Ali's jaw) and Ali got the decision in the second and third fights. Many people, myself included, thought Norton won all 3 fights, and I'd say a clear majority of people had Norton winning the first and third fights. In October 1976, Ali said about the third fight "Kenny's style is too difficult for me. I can't beat him, and I sure don't want to fight him again. I honestly thought he beat me in Yankee Stadium, but the judges gave it to me, and I'm grateful to them." Norton was bitter, stating after the fight: "I won at least nine or ten rounds. I was robbed."

When Frazier beat Ali i think Ali was very rusty as he had been in the armed forces and hadnt fought for a while, is that right?

No, that's not right. Ali refused to be drafted into the armed forces in Vietnam in April 1967. At the time, Ali was undefeated at 29-0 and had been world champion for over 3 years. Ali was stripped of his title and his boxing licence, and his passport, and threatened with all sorts of other punishments. Frazier was one of the people at that time who, while never directly opposing the Vietnam War publicly, spoke up for Ali and gave him financial support. Ali eventually came back to the ring in October 1970, and won 2 fights into his comeback before facing Frazier in 1971 in the Fight of the Century. Both men were undefeated, Frazier the reigning champion at 26-0 and Ali the former champion who had been stripped was now at 31-0. Ali used mind games in the run up to the fight that basically called Frazier an "Uncle Tom" and a "white man's champion", which made Frazier mad. Even though Frazier grew up poorer than Ali and had actually helped Ali during his exile from boxing, Frazier was seen as the "establishment" candidate during their 1971 fight, getting support from pro-Vietnam War people. That Frazier later took Ali's bait and started calling him "Cassius" just played into Ali's hands even more about "Uncle Tom" and "establishment". The rivalry between Ali and Frazier was very, very bitter as a result.

May i ask how you would rank the four of them?

Hard to do, but I think I have Foreman at the top, at least for the aura of dominance. Ali for resiliency and comebacks.

And may i also ask how you would see a peak Tyson Fury v Lennox Lewis?

Probably Lewis on points, because he's more disciplined on the whole. That chin however is always suspect.

 

[msc886]

I disagree. Djokodal dominated the recent years because the conditions favoured being solid at the baseline and having a physical game which Djokodal do best.

Contrast that to Fed’s time when aggressive play, serve/volley had more effectiveness. I can’t see Fed doing any worse as the conditions suit him more.

Its no surprise that Fed even still past his prime can still beat Djokodal on faster BO3 situations. Djokodal beats Fed usually by grinding him out and I can’t see a more mobile and stronger Fed doing worse against prime Djokodal.

 

[RS]

Ali and Norton fought each other 3 times, i.e. twice in 1973 over 12 rounds, and then in 1976 in a 15 round world title fight where Ali was defending champion. Norton got the decision in the first fight (where Norton broke Ali's jaw) and Ali got the decision in the second and third fights. Many people, myself included, thought Norton won all 3 fights, and I'd say a clear majority of people had Norton winning the first and third fights. In October 1976, Ali said about the third fight "Kenny's style is too difficult for me. I can't beat him, and I sure don't want to fight him again. I honestly thought he beat me in Yankee Stadium, but the judges gave it to me, and I'm grateful to them." Norton was bitter, stating after the fight: "I won at least nine or ten rounds. I was robbed."


No, that's not right. Ali refused to be drafted into the armed forces in Vietnam in April 1967. At the time, Ali was undefeated at 29-0 and had been world champion for over 3 years. Ali was stripped of his title and his boxing licence, and his passport, and threatened with all sorts of other punishments. Frazier was one of the people at that time who, while never directly opposing the Vietnam War publicly, spoke up for Ali and gave him financial support. Ali eventually came back to the ring in October 1970, and won 2 fights into his comeback before facing Frazier in 1971 in the Fight of the Century. Both men were undefeated, Frazier the reigning champion at 26-0 and Ali the former champion who had been stripped was now at 31-0. Ali used mind games in the run up to the fight that basically called Frazier an "Uncle Tom" and a "white man's champion", which made Frazier mad. Even though Frazier grew up poorer than Ali and had actually helped Ali during his exile from boxing, Frazier was seen as the "establishment" candidate during their 1971 fight, getting support from pro-Vietnam War people. That Frazier later took Ali's bait and started calling him "Cassius" just played into Ali's hands even more about "Uncle Tom" and "establishment". The rivalry between Ali and Frazier was very, very bitter as a result.


Hard to do, but I think I have Foreman at the top, at least for the aura of dominance. Ali for resiliency and comebacks.


Probably Lewis on points, because he's more disciplined on the whole. That chin however is always suspect.

Norton arguably won 2/3 but I think fight 2 was the right call.

 

[Deleted member 758560]

 

[RS]

If only he had a better chin.

 

[Deleted member 758560]

If only he had a better chin.

whos a greater boxer, him or his older brother, the latter?

 

[RS]

whos a greater boxer, him or his older brother, the latter?

I think Vitali would have probably won if they faced.

 

[Mustard]

I think Vitali would have probably won if they faced.

I saw Wladimir flattened by Corrie Sanders. That was a proper beating over two rounds, allegedly because Sanders was a southpaw. Sanders went into the fight as a 40-1 underdog, and put Wladimir down 4 times on the way to a 2nd round TKO.

 

[RS]

I saw Wladimir flattened by Corrie Sanders. That was a proper beating over two rounds, allegedly because Sanders was a southpaw. Sanders went into the fight as a 40-1 underdog, and put Wladimir down 4 times on the way to a 2nd round TKO.

Sanders was really fun to watch. Wlad couldn't deal with his power were as Vitali could.