Djokovic at AO vs Federer at Wimbledon

Who was Better?

  • Djokovic as the Wizard of Oz

    Votes: 52 61.9%

  • Federer as the Master of Grass

    Votes: 32 38.1%
  • Total voters
    84
Berrettini_Fan

Berrettini_Fan

Professional
Who was better at their pet slam, the Djoker down under or the Fed at the home of tennis?

In Djokovic's favor:
  1. He has more titles (10 >8)
  2. He has a winning record vs Federer in Oz (4-1). In contrast Federer has a losing record vs Djokovic on the Lawns (1-3).
In Federer's favor:
  1. Higher peak. Federer won once without dropping a set (2017) and 3x dropping only 1 set (2003, 2005, and 2006). In contrast, Djokovic has never had a flawless run at AO and only won 2x dropping a single set (2011 and 2023).
  2. Longer winning streak. Federer won 5 in a row from 2003 - 2007. Djokovic's longest streak is 3, albeit he did it twice (2011 - 2013 and 2019 - 2021).
  3. More Finals made (12 > 10)
Level of competition is about equal. Federer's opponents in the Finals comprised of Roddick 3x, Nadal 3x, Djokovic 3x, Philippousis, Murray, and Cilic. Djokovic's opponents in the Finals comprised of Murray 4x, Nadal 2x, Tsonga, Thiem, Medvedev, and Tsitsipas.
 
Novak, off course, not even a question. 10 is much bigger than 8. Also, winning AO many is much harder task, overal competition is much tougher because hard is best surface for most players so Novak has 10 titles and second best only 6. Federer has 8 followed by two players with 7, and Novak has a chance to equalise 8 and he would already do it without Alcaras greatness.
 
Novak

0 defeats in the AO final

Federer was defeated on Wimbledon grass in 2008, 2012 (OI edition), 2014, 2015, 2019
 
Berrettini_Fan said:
Who was better at their pet slam, the Djoker down under or the Fed at the home of tennis?

In Djokovic's favor:
  1. He has more titles (10 >8)
  2. He has a winning record vs Federer in Oz (4-1). In contrast Federer has a losing record vs Djokovic on the Lawns (1-3).
In Federer's favor:
  1. Higher peak. Federer won once without dropping a set (2017) and 3x dropping only 1 set (2003, 2005, and 2006). In contrast, Djokovic has never had a flawless run at AO and only won 2x dropping a single set (2011 and 2023).
  2. Longer winning streak. Federer won 5 in a row from 2003 - 2007. Djokovic's longest streak is 3, albeit he did it twice (2011 - 2013 and 2019 - 2021).
  3. More Finals made (12 > 10)
Level of competition is about equal. Federer's opponents in the Finals comprised of Roddick 3x, Nadal 3x, Djokovic 3x, Philippousis, Murray, and Cilic. Djokovic's opponents in the Finals comprised of Murray 4x, Nadal 2x, Tsonga, Thiem, Medvedev, and Tsitsipas.
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Djokovic met Federer 5 times at AO. Only lost in 2007, after that Fed couldn't really touch him, just like Nadal. So why you only using finals opponents in this context I don't know.
 
10 wins + ban is much ahead than 8 wins.

There is no realistic argument left for fed at Wimbledon over Djokovic at AO. Some fanatics will still defy the truth and choose fed but it's their issue.
 
Berrettini_Fan said:
But Federer peaked higher at Wimbledon!
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There is no real way to measure peak at all. You say fed won wimby without dropping a set. His finalist was literally crying , it was embarrassing. Really embarrassing moment in history.

So yes some cirfumsstances can make someone look better like djokovic facing weaponless Ferrer or Federer facing worthless competition on grass. That means not much to me.
 
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Both great records but Djokovic's at the AO is only 2nd to Nadal's at RG. It's hardcourt as well which is the neutral surface and at the beginning of the year when everyone is well rested. The fact that he won 10 on that surface at that time of the year is astonishing. Level of competition equal? I thought the bad competition at Wimbledon was how Djokovic won 7? At least that's what the brainiacs said so many times.

Also the OP is incorrect. Djokovic won the AO 3 times while dropping only one set: 2008, 2011, 2023. This doesn't matter though because it only matters who's holding the trophy at the end.
 
NoleFam said:
Both great records but Djokovic's at the AO is only 2nd to Nadal's at RG. It's hardcourt as well which is the neutral surface and at the beginning of the year when everyone is well rested. The fact that he won 10 on that surface at that time of the year is astonishing. Level of competition equal? I thought the bad competition at Wimbledon was how Djokovic won 7? At least that's what the brainiacs said so many times.

Also the OP is incorrect. Djokovic won the AO 3 times while dropping only one set: 2008, 2011, 2023. This doesn't matter though because it only matters who's holding the trophy at the end.
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The "brainiacs" with low double digit IQ
 
Federer is my GOAT, so I'm gonna go with him.

4-8 (12) in finals > 10-0 in finals.

Djokovic just benefited from the lack of younger ATG competition. As a long-time Federer fan, this is my final answer on the issue.
 
Ace7 said:
matches won against top 5 opponents while also winning the title.

Federer at Wimbleon = 7

Djokovic at AO = 17

dont let me write down the names against who cuz it aint pretty for fed compared to Novak.
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Djokovic has lost to fed + Nadal + Murray + wawrinka combined of 4 times in AO , IW, Miami sweeps , total of 21 titles.

Probably had 25 or so matches and lost just 4 times. 1 time each. His losses to fed and Rafa Nadal came far before his 2011 season. Fed in 2007 when he was 19.

It's not funny at all. Fed has lost to Djokovic himself 3 times in wimby. And played Halle where none of the top guys play.
 
These and similar topics always show how miserable Federer's fans really are.

All roads lead to Novak, yet they always get lost on that road and go astray.
 
Djokovic played 35 matches vs his competition in ao iw and miami , won 31.

How many did fed played in Halle Wimbledon and Stuttgart vs these guys.
 
With the Establishment fully backing Fed and working against Nole throughout their career, it's absurd to compare them at face value.
And guess what? Even at face value, it's already overwhelmingly in Nole's favor. o_O

Is that so hard to comprehend?
In the Rock-Paper-Scissors dynamic, the Establishment can almost guarantee:
  • One dominates all trophies and 100% of the H2Hs.
  • Another wins only the runner-up plates and 50% of the H2Hs.
  • The last loses everything with 0% of the H2Hs.
It's that crazy—and that simple.
 
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Djokovic dominated the AO much more than Federer dominated Wimbledon. Djokovic just about had a Nadal at RG level aura at AO.

We can go on about quality of competition etc. but the numbers and my eye test at least saw Djokovic as the more dominant player on his favorite surface.
 
NYTennisfan said:
Djokovic dominated the AO much more than Federer dominated Wimbledon. Djokovic just about had a Nadal at RG level aura at AO.

We can go on about quality of competition etc. but the numbers and my eye test at least saw Djokovic as the more dominant player on his favorite surface.
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Not so much, but it's the closest nonetheless.
 
Neptune said:
If Rafa had to be Nole's top competitor at the AO, just as Nole has been Rafa's at RG, you might see the truth. :cool:
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I wasn't talking about the Rafovic rivalry specifically, but rather about the dominance of the field in general.

Nadal at RG: 97% winning percentage.
Novak at the AO: 91% winning percentage.
Federer at the AO: 87% winning percentage.

Djokovic's winning percentage at the AO is closer to Federer's, than to Rafa at RG. Saying this I'm not being disrespectful toward Novak, quite the contrary. I say this with the uttermost respect. Novak is not as dominant at the AO as Nadal at RG, BUT, as @NYTennisfan pointed out, he's the closest we have seen. 10-0 in AO finals is simply magnificent, and certainly the second greatest dominance of a Slam ever seen.
 
Post 2013, across all his wins at the AO did Djokovic even beat someone playing better than 2015 Murray at Wimbledon? Yet he's won title after the title. Says it all about those top 5's lol.
 
NatF said:
Post 2013, across all his wins at the AO did Djokovic even beat someone playing better than 2015 Murray at Wimbledon? Yet he's won title after the title. Says it all about those top 5's lol.
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Let's not pretend like the top 5 was in great shape for most of Fed's winning Wimbledon runs either.
 
MeatTornado said:
Let's not pretend like the top 5 was in great shape for most of Fed's winning Wimbledon runs either.
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But we should pretend like "top 5" is a meaningful qualifier for grass which has such a short season? I was obviously being a bit facetious there but I would hope you could show a bit more nuance than this if you're going to try and have a serious discussion.
 
Federer lost his 3 Wimbledon finals against his main rival. That alone is a huge argument against him. + one against Nadal. He lost many matches he should have never lost... Berdych, Raonic, Tsonga, Anderson, Stakkovicci.

Disagree about the higher peak when you see how dominant Djokovic has been in Australia in seasons like 2011, 2015, 2019 or 2023.
2019 final he obliterated Nadal who reached the final without dropping a set. When did Federer destroy Nadal or Djokovic in Wimbledon? Never.
2023 he wins the tournament at 36 on 1 leg, dropping only 1 set. Sure, Federer won Wimbledon at 36 too, but did he have a torn harmstring?

Djokovic is practically unbeatable in Australia between 2008 and 2023, barring withdrawals and injuries (2009, 2017, 2018). Tsonga and Wawrinka are the only 2 players who defeated a healthy Djokovic in Australia, in 2010 and 2014. Add Sinner 2024 if you want, but imo this match doesn't change anything unless you also count Hurkacz bagelling Federer in Wimbledon.
Ultimately 10>8 is the only factor that matters. Would likely be 11>8 if not for Hawke's tyranny.
Federer's streak arguments doesn't help him. Win 8 Wimbledon in a row or 8 in 25 years with big holes..., it's still 8 Wimbledon in the end. His 237 weeks streak doesn't add anything when his main rival has 430 and he has 310...

Better question is who is better at Wimbledon. If not for the 2020 cancellation it would likely be 8-8, with Djokovic leading 3-0 in finals. Federer is lucky the covid and GrassCaraz happened or his Wimbledon record would most certainly be toast today. It might not be over anyway. Djokovic's 8th Wimbledon is still something I wouldn't rule out.
 
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Rafa4LifeEver said:
I mean, wouldn't Federer love to play Paul, Tsitsipas, Medvedev, Fritz, Karatsev etc in the SF-F of Wimbledon instead of Novak & Rafa?
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Djokovic beat just past Peak Federer at the AO, although I believe that was Year Mono for Fed, also beat Federer in 2011, 2016 and 2020.
Djokovic beat Nadal in the 2012 AO classic and in 2019.
Only lost to Fedal once at the AO and that was in 2007 when he was a pup and against absolute Peak Fed so, yes, he beat Fedal a lot at the AO, it wasn't just fattening up on weak competition. Not to mention that Murray, an ATG, was his pigeon on that surface destroying him every time. Utter dominance on this surface against the best competition.

Also, lets not act like Federer was beating up on a bunch of juggernauts during his Peak Wimbledon run.
Also, of note Federer 0-3 in Wimbledon Finals against Djokovic.
 
Fed had already won 6 Wimbledons before even facing Djokovic at the tournament (7 before he lost to him). By the time he finally lost to prime Djokovic—in five sets too—he was almost 33 and two years removed from a remotely prime-level performance.

Now flip this around. Let’s say Djokovic is the one six years older and he’s playing an up-and-coming Federer in his late career at the AO.

By the time Fed becomes a relevant opponent for the elder ATG, Djokovic would already be around 29 years old (that would put him at 2016–right before he left his prime).

Djokovic would basically have to deal with a younger, fitter Fed for the rest of his career at the AO. So some of his later Slams, like 2019, 2020, 2021, and 2023–may vanish.

Fed doesn’t have those late career Slams because he never had the chance to thrive in a field absent a younger ATG who was also a force to reckon on the surface. There was always Djokovic waiting for him. But who has Djokovic had waiting for him? Sinner? Zverev? Medvedev?

You know, Fed showed up and lost in four different Wimbledon finals (three after he left his prime), and all four of those could easily have been won against a field equivalent to that which Djokovic faced at the AO beyond 2016.

They’re two completely different eras, and it’s to the point where any number that gets quoted needs to be backed up with surrounding context.

For sure Djokovic is very good at the AO but I just don’t know.
 
roysid said:
i hate these obvious threads.
10 wins vs 8 wins
0 final loss vs 4 final loss.

And the worst of it all,
Novak lead Fed 4-1 and 3-1 at AO and W respectively.

I don't think you call a pet slam if you lose to someone more than you win
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If you completely ignore context, then sure
 
NYTennisfan said:
Djokovic dominated the AO much more than Federer dominated Wimbledon. Djokovic just about had a Nadal at RG level aura at AO.

We can go on about quality of competition etc. but the numbers and my eye test at least saw Djokovic as the more dominant player on his favorite surface.
Click to expand...
No need to go on, Djokovic won 2 AO’s while injured
 
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