Djokovic, Federer, Alcaraz and Sinner combined have 27 clay masters....Nadal by himself has 26 clay masters....

clayqueen said:
Kudos to Borg. Clearly something he should celebrate. Nadal is the only player to win four Grand Slam titles without dropping a set (2008, 2010, 2017 and 2020 French Opens), surpassing the prior record of three held by Björn Borg.
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Well Borg did stop playing when he was only 25. And didn't Borg do it on two surfaces?

clayqueen said:
Could you tell me if Djokovic has ever won a slam without dropping a set?
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No, Djokovic has never won a slam without dropping a set. He won 24 slams, more than anyone in history, but he has dropped at least one set in each of those wins.
 
Hitman said:
Well Borg did stop playing when he was only 25. And didn't Borg do it on two surfaces?
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Yes, grass in 1976 and clay in 1978 and 1980.

In the '76 Wimbledon final, Borg straight-setted a grass slam winner (Nastase, USO 1972). In the '78 FO final, Borg straight-setted a two-time clay slam winner (Vilas, FO & USO 1977).
 
JMR said:
Yes, grass in 1976 and clay in 1978 and 1980.

In the '76 Wimbledon final, Borg straight-setted a grass slam winner (Nastase, USO 1972). In the '78 FO final, Borg straight-setted a two-time clay slam winner (Vilas, FO & USO 1977).
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Impressive and he did it when surfaces were more polarized.
 
clayqueen said:
I think Borg bitterly regrets storming off into retirement after that 1981 US Open Final when he lost to McEnroe.
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He does. He even tried to make a comeback, but it was too late then. Borg had at least another five good years left at the top.
 
Hitman said:
Sure.
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Yes Federer actually beat Sampras's numbers and won his slams race, for years and years he was the record holder

His numbers were beaten by Djokovic and also Nadal.

If Federer never won the slams race then I am guessing Sampras also never won the slams race ? Looks like Sampras was racing with Federer too and lost it finally in 2009? :-D:-D:-D
 
Razer said:
Federer has better achievements than Djokovic until early 30s, so whatever difference came was after that, Fed faced Rafole in his 30s while Djokovic faced social media influencers and philosophers in his 30s, this plays a role in the final achievements that you are talking about here. So why can't we talk of achievements?
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There are plenty of layers in the GOAT debate, not just stats padding.
 
Rafa is the most accomplished doubles player of the Big 3, and he won most of his doubles on hardcourt. Rafa's got more doubles Masters1000 titles and an Olympic Gold Medal than Jamie Murray and more titles than the majority of full-time doubles players.

 
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Hitman said:
You missed Monfils from the list....
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Well Ruud, 2 times FO finalist and lost to both Djokovic and Nadal, anyone else he probably would have a good chance them years?

Zverev is very good at the French and clay in general with a Finals and Masters etc and his 2022 Semi final against Nadal was a ridiculously high level and probably would have beaten anyone else if he got through Nadal....

Soderling, again 2 finals, probably would have beaten the rest of the draw at the time and beat prime/peak Nadal and Fed on clay in 09/10 respectively and they was both defending champs at the time he beat them. Did you watch the matches he beat them at the French? Monstrous serving and hitting.

Coria and Murray need not much explanation really.

And the rest of the list you already know....

Don't know what Monfils has to do with it though lol.....
 
Razer said:
Yes Federer actually beat Sampras's numbers and won his slams race, for years and years he was the record holder

His numbers were beaten by Djokovic and also Nadal.

If Federer never won the slams race then I am guessing Sampras also never won the slams race ? Looks like Sampras was racing with Federer too and lost it finally in 2009? :-D:-D:-D
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I think now you should go tell all the official governing bodies and tennis networks who kept saying the big 3 slam race. Let me know how it goes. :)
 
Sudacafan said:
Pepe!
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The GOAT :D

Chavo-Guerrero-With-Pepe.jpg


#AmorYPaz
 
Hitman said:
He had chances to win a lot on clay. For instance, he could have won Rome in 2003 and MC in 2014 without Nadal there.

Sure, Nadal stopped him quite a bit, but Federer had several cracks at the clay when Nadal was not around.
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He was injured.

Oh wait wrong player.
 
clayqueen said:

​

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That article largely proves my point "He retired in 1983 at the age of 26".

After the 1981 US Open, Borg flew to Geneva, Switzerland, where he won a clay-court tournament.

Borg apparently left Flushing Meadows early because there had been a death threat directed against him.
 
clayqueen said:
www.tennis365.com

Why Bjorn Borg's retirement was 'stupid decision' as he reveals big 'regret'

Tennis icon Bjorn Borg has revealed his big 'regret' about his early retirement from tennis and why it was a 'stupid decision'.
www.tennis365.com www.tennis365.com

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Yet Borg has also said "I had a great tennis career. I have no regrets. But to find peace with yourself, and to finally be with your family - I'm probably the happiest guy in the world". https://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/bjorn_borg_439950

Borg also said that he had no regrets when asked about whether he regretted not playing the Australian Open for nearly all his career.
 
clayqueen said:
Clearly, you are not old enough to have witnessed it.
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Clearly you have bought into the myths. Borg retired in January 1983, during the Masters tournament. Borg barely played on the tour in 1982 because he was arguing with the ATP over their threats to make him qualify for the majors if he didn't play more tournaments. Borg had already reduced his schedule considerably in 1981.

McEnroe in 1982 didn't win any of the biggest tournaments. Lendl was beating McEnroe badly from 1981 to January 1983, yet Borg was running away from that McEnroe? Really?
 
Mustard said:
That article largely proves my point "He retired in 1983 at the age of 26".

After the 1981 US Open, Borg flew to Geneva, Switzerland, where he won a clay-court tournament.

Borg apparently left Flushing Meadows early because there had been a death threat directed against him.
Click to expand...
Yes, he retired in 1983, but that 1981 USO Final was the last big match he played. I remember it; you probably weren't born. He also regrets it.
 
clayqueen said:
Clearly, you are not old enough to have witnessed it.
Click to expand...

Mustard said:
That article largely proves my point "He retired in 1983 at the age of 26".

After the 1981 US Open, Borg flew to Geneva, Switzerland, where he won a clay-court tournament.

Borg apparently left Flushing Meadows early because there had been a death threat directed against him.
Click to expand...

Mustard said:
Clearly you have bought into the myths. Borg retired in January 1983, during the Masters tournament. Borg barely played on the tour in 1982 because he was arguing with the ATP over their threats to make him qualify for the majors if he didn't play more tournaments. Borg had already reduced his schedule considerably in 1981.

McEnroe in 1982 didn't win any of the biggest tournaments. Lendl was beating McEnroe badly from 1981 to January 1983, yet Borg was running away from that McEnroe? Really?
Click to expand...

DSH said:
Poor sportsmanship from Borg.
Even worse than crying in public and ruining the tournament winner's ceremony.
(n)
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clayqueen said:
Yes, he retired in 1983, but that 1981 USO Final was the last big match he played. I remember it; you probably weren't born. He also regrets it.
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20837979-group-of-happy-friends-having-dinner-at-patio.jpg
 
clayqueen said:
Yes, he retired in 1983, but that 1981 USO Final was the last big match he played. I remember it; you probably weren't born. He also regrets it.
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Why are you getting personal? Borg was fully expected to be back playing. His January 1983 retirement was a surprise.

Here are Lendl vs. McEnroe results in that period:
1981 French Open QF: Ivan Lendl def. John McEnroe (6-4, 6-4, 7-5)
1981 Davis Cup QF (at Flushing Meadows): Ivan Lendl def. John McEnroe (6-4, 14-12, 7-5)
January 1982 Masters SF: Ivan Lendl def. John McEnroe (6-4, 6-2)
1982 WCT Finals F: Ivan Lendl def. John McEnroe (6-2, 3-6, 6-3, 6-3)
1982 Toronto SF: Ivan Lendl def. John McEnroe (6-4, 6-4)
1982 US Open SF: Ivan Lendl def. John McEnroe (6-4, 6-4, 7-6)
January 1983 Masters F: Ivan Lendl def. John McEnroe (6-4, 6-4, 6-2)

7-0 in matches and 19-1 in sets to Lendl. Borg ran away from that McEnroe?
 
MichaelNadal said:
20837979-group-of-happy-friends-having-dinner-at-patio.jpg
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It's a myth that even Bud Collins has perpetuated, i.e. that Borg lost the 1981 US Open final to McEnroe, walked out of Flushing Meadows, out of tennis. No, Borg went to Geneva and won a tournament there right after, feuded with the ATP in 1982 over their threats to make him qualify for the major tournaments, and he retired from full-time tennis in January 1983 during the Masters.

Another similar myth is that Sampras won the 2002 US Open title, beating Agassi in the final, and then rode off into the sunset. In reality, Sampras fully intended to be back playing in 2003, and entered many tournaments in 2003 before pulling out.
 
Mustard said:
It's a myth that even Bud Collins has perpetuated, i.e. that Borg lost the 1981 US Open final to McEnroe, walked out of Flushing Meadows, out of tennis. No, Borg went to Geneva and won a tournament there right after, feuded with the ATP in 1982 over their threats to make him qualify for the major tournaments, and he retired from full-time tennis in January 1983 during the Masters.

Another similar myth is that Sampras won the 2002 US Open title, beating Agassi in the final, and then rode off into the sunset. In reality, Sampras fully intended to be back playing in 2003, and entered many tournaments in 2003 before pulling out.
Click to expand...
Idk anything about it lol I’m just enjoying watching yall talk over dinner :D
 
Mustard said:
It's a myth that even Bud Collins has perpetuated, i.e. that Borg lost the 1981 US Open final to McEnroe, walked out of Flushing Meadows, out of tennis. No, Borg went to Geneva and won a tournament there right after, feuded with the ATP in 1982 over their threats to make him qualify for the major tournaments, and he retired from full-time tennis in January 1983 during the Masters.

Another similar myth is that Sampras won the 2002 US Open title, beating Agassi in the final, and then rode off into the sunset. In reality, Sampras fully intended to be back playing in 2003, and entered many tournaments in 2003 before pulling out.
Click to expand...

Yep. its crazy how these urban legends can get made.
 
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