Djokovic greater than any other player on 2/3 surfaces?

[Lew II]

Hard: Djokovic > Federer (more slams)
Clay: Djokovic > Federer (more masters)

Hard: Djokovic > Nadal (more slams)
Grass: Djokovic > Nadal (more slams)

Hard: Djokovic > Sampras (more slams)
Clay: Djokovic > Sampras (more slams)

Hard: Djokovic > Borg (more slams)
Grass: Djokovic > Borg

Do you agree?

Only debatable may be vs Borg on grass since they have the same number of Wimbledon titles, but Djokovic beat Federer in 3 finals plus he couldn't play the 2020 edition as the favourite. And he's still active.

 

[weakera]

h2h vs. Nadal at USO?

 

[Deleted member 779124]

h2h vs. Nadal at USO?

Djokovic is a better HC player overall.

 

[weakera]

Djokovic is a better HC player overall.

So Nadal's 2-1 is even more impressive and clutch?

 

[Deleted member 779124]

So Nadal's 2-1 is even more impressive and clutch?

It is a good feat but Djokovic is a much greater HC player.

 

[weakera]

It is a good feat but Djokovic is a much greater HC player.

A much greater HC player with a 1-2 h2h at USO and less USO than his primary rival?

 

[Lew II]

A much greater HC player with a 1-2 h2h at USO and less USO than his primary rival?

So you don't think Djokovic is a greater hardcourter than Nadal?

 

[Deleted member 779124]

A much greater HC player with a 1-2 h2h at USO and less USO than his primary rival?

Djokovic has a big lead overall vs Nadal on HC and has done better vs the field it is not close. You could make a case Nadal of 2010/2013 in USO beats Djokovic in 2011/2015 though.

 

[weakera]

So you don't think Djokovic is a greater hardcourter than Nadal?

Nadal is greater at the USO, one of the HC slams.

 

[weakera]

Just imagine if there was a second clay slam and Nadal had a losing h2h and fewer wins there than Djokovic. Just try to conjure up that scenario in your mind lol. Does not compute. And Djokovic fans have the audacity to try to draw an equivalence by stating "Djokovic is the greatest on HC, Nadal is the greatest on clay" - as if the two statements are in any way similar.

lol... yikes!

 

[Deleted member 758560]

Nadal is greater at the USO, one of the HC slams.

one of doens't mean overall, don't act like a fool please, 12 and 5 feel the difference

 

[Lew II]

Just imagine if there was a second clay slam and Nadal had a losing h2h and fewer wins there than Djokovic. Just try to conjure up that scenario in your mind lol. Does not compute. And Djokovic fans have the audacity to try to draw an equivalence by stating "Djokovic is the greatest on HC, Nadal is the greatest on clay" - as if the two statements are in any way similar.

lol... yikes!

No one compared Djokovic on hard to Nadal on clay in this thread.

 

[weakera]

one of doens't mean overall, don't act like a fool please, 12 and 5 feel the difference

Refer to my post above yours, and then have a seat.

 

[Deleted member 758560]

no, bjorn is greater than djokovic on 2/3 surfaces (grass and clay)

 

[weakera]

No one compared Djokovic on hard to Nadal on clay in this thread.

It's completely implied (as always). But thankfully we have the US Open to bring everyone back to reality.

 

[Hitman]

no, bjorn is greater than djokovic on 2/3 surfaces (grass and clay)

I'd agree with this, I think Borg is the only one greater than Djokovic on two of the three surfaces. Djokovic has a chance to pass him this Wimbledon.

 

[Ganstaz003]

Djokovic is a better HC player overall.

Djokovic is a better Australian Open player, but certainly hasn't proven to be a better US Open final. US Open hardcourt =/= Australian Open hardcourt.

 

[RF-18]

Djokovic is a better Australian Open player, but certainly hasn't proven to be a better US Open final. US Open hardcourt =/= Australian Open hardcourt.

Here comes the new convenient arguments

 

[tennis_pro]

Dude Djokovic isn't better than Borg on grass, come on now.

 

[Ganstaz003]

Here comes the new convenient arguments

Funny how you can't offer any counter-arguments.

 

[travlerajm]

Hard: Djokovic > Federer (more slams)
Clay: Djokovic > Federer (more masters)

Hard: Djokovic > Nadal (more slams)
Grass: Djokovic > Nadal (more slams)

Hard: Djokovic > Sampras (more slams)
Clay: Djokovic > Sampras (more slams)

Hard: Djokovic > Borg (more slams)
Grass: Djokovic > Borg

Do you agree?

Only debatable may be vs Borg on grass since they have the same number of Wimbledon titles, but Djokovic beat Federer in 3 finals plus he couldn't play the 2020 edition as the favourite. And he's still active.

One of your better threads.

 

[Street]

Just imagine if there was a second clay slam and Nadal had a losing h2h and fewer wins there than Djokovic. Just try to conjure up that scenario in your mind lol. Does not compute. And Djokovic fans have the audacity to try to draw an equivalence by stating "Djokovic is the greatest on HC, Nadal is the greatest on clay" - as if the two statements are in any way similar.

lol... yikes!

Not a fan of any particular player but based on stats, both of those statements are correct. I don't see the problem in stating them. When you say that Djokovic is the best player on HC that doesn't mean that he is as dominant on HC as Rafa is on Clay. I've actually never seen anyone say that Djokovic is as dominant on HC as Nadal is on clay, not even on these boards.

 

[Linelicker]

If using "beat Federer" and "no Wimbledon 2020" are actual arguements, then Borg retiring at 26 is also an actual arguement:

He would have been more successful than Novak on grass and clay "had he continued playing"

 

[Lew II]

If using "beat Federer" and "no Wimbledon 2020" are actual arguements, then Borg retiring at 26 is also an actual arguement:

He would have been more successful than Novak on grass and clay "had he continued playing"

It's on him if he retired.

 

[RS]

Probably tbh.

 

[Sunny014]

GOAT on HCs don't get bageled at Cincinatti at the hands of the real GOAT.

Faster HC : Federer > Djokovic
Slower HC : Djokovic > Federer
Grass (All types of Grass) : Federer > Djokovic
Clay : Federer = Djokovic

So thats 2-1 for Federer

 

[Linelicker]

It's on him if he retired.

No, it's on the Zeitgeist.

 

[Nole_King]

Even though being a Nole fan, my stomach churns at arguments suggesting him greater than Borg on grass .. This is what happens when people believe that it takes mere counting to understand who is greater.

 

[Deleted member 779124]

Djokovic is a better Australian Open player, but certainly hasn't proven to be a better US Open final. US Open hardcourt =/= Australian Open hardcourt.

Overall he has.

 

[Villain]

GOAT on HCs don't get bageled at Cincinatti at the hands of the real GOAT.

Faster HC : Federer > Djokovic
Slower HC : Djokovic > Federer
Grass (All types of Grass) : Federer > Djokovic
Clay : Federer = Djokovic

So thats 2-1 for Federer

That’s weird, because the AO has been faster than the USO for awhile now and we know who does the better there. Novak has a clearly better resume on clay. Higher winning percentage, more Masters, more tournament wins.

 

[helterskelter]

That’s weird, because the AO has been faster than the USO for awhile now and we know who does the better there. Novak has a clearly better resume on clay. Higher winning percentage, more Masters, more tournament wins.

Djokovic also now has a (slightly!) better record at Roland Garros than Federer, even if we don't count "has beaten Nadal" as a tiebreaker:

Titles: Djokovic 1-1 Federer
Losing Finals: Djokovic 4-4 Federer
Losing Semi-Finals: Djokovic 5-3 Federer
Losing Quarter-Finals: Djokovic 4-4 Federer

Making the Semi-Finals > Not Making the Semi-Finals

 

[NoleIsBoat]

Some delusion and coping mechanism going on in this thread

Djokovic absolutely owns Nadal on HC and grass, in his peak year is also 4 -0 on clay too

he is also better than Fed on all surfaces too. More HC slam+master+h2h. More clay masters. 3-0 in Wimbledon finals

BOAT

 

[Beckerserve]

Hard: Djokovic > Federer (more slams)
Clay: Djokovic > Federer (more masters)

Hard: Djokovic > Nadal (more slams)
Grass: Djokovic > Nadal (more slams)

Hard: Djokovic > Sampras (more slams)
Clay: Djokovic > Sampras (more slams)

Hard: Djokovic > Borg (more slams)
Grass: Djokovic > Borg

Do you agree?

Only debatable may be vs Borg on grass since they have the same number of Wimbledon titles, but Djokovic beat Federer in 3 finals plus he couldn't play the 2020 edition as the favourite. And he's still active.

Only 3 USOs prevents him being best on HC. Period. USO is more important than Australia. Every pro and ex pro will say the same

 

[Phoenix1983]

Borg is greater than Novak Djokovic on clay (by far) and grass (marginally).

Fail thread.

 

[Villain]

USO is more important than Australia.

Wrong again. We don’t live in the 70s anymore.

 

[Beckerserve]

So according to OP hard courts are the same. Another Djokovic fan i corrected yesterday also erroneously made predictions about USO based on AO.
However if we indulge them for the moment and agree all hardcourts are equal. That means Djokovic is only player amongst ATGs to have TWO majors on his best surface. I.e double than say Sampras Nadal Borg and Federer. Yet he is only on 18 Majors.
So it is fair to say that Djokovic is not the 3rd wheel but actually the 5th wheel. Imagine how many Majors Nadal and Borg would have with two on clay . How many sampras and federer with two on grass. All would have way more than 18 probably.
Worthy of its own thread if anyone wants to articulate the above better than i have while working.

 

[Beckerserve]

Wrong again. We don’t live in the 70s anymore.

USO is bigger than AO. Look at viewing figures and sponsorship deals and media coverage.

 

[Third Serve]

Djokovic isn't better than Borg on grass. At best, they're equal.

 

[SinneGOAT]

So Nadal's 2-1 is even more impressive and clutch?

Djokovic’s 2-0 at Aussie Open finals as well as 9 Australian Opens now makes that a little irrelevant.

 

[Deleted member 758560]

Djokovic’s 2-0 at Aussie Open finals as well as 9 Australian Opens now makes that a little irrelevant.

yes, 3-2 overall score, so nadal loses again

 

[Villain]

USO is bigger than AO. Look at viewing figures and sponsorship deals and media coverage.

It’s called the advantage of being in NYC instead of Melbourne and in a time zone that allows for more viewers. Even so, the above list doesn’t make one more “important” than the other.

 

[weakera]

Djokovic’s 2-0 at Aussie Open finals as well as 9 Australian Opens now makes that a little irrelevant.

Suuuure it does

 

[Beckerserve]

Some delusion and coping mechanism going on in this thread

Djokovic absolutely owns Nadal on HC and grass, in his peak year is also 4 -0 on clay too

he is also better than Fed on all surfaces too. More HC slam+master+h2h. More clay masters. 3-0 in Wimbledon finals

BOAT

Federer 8 Wimbledons bud. Wimbledon is grass. Djokovic 5. Federer has that.
Nadal better on North american hard courts...4 USO 3 USO.
Borg is way better on grass than Djokovic. 5 W in a row. He is also better on clay.
Djokovic is 5th of all time bud. Sorry to tell ya mate. Kyrgios agrees as well.

 

[Beckerserve]

It’s called the advantage of being in NYC instead of Melbourne and in a time zone that allows for more viewers. Even so, the above list doesn’t make one more “important” than the other.

It does. More media coverage more exposure means more kudos. Find me one player who would prefer more AOs than USOs!! Even aussies wouldnt.

 

[NoleIsBoat]

Federer 8 Wimbledons bud. Wimbledon is grass. Djokovic 5. Federer has that.
Nadal better on North american hard courts...4 USO 3 USO.
Borg is way better on grass than Djokovic. 5 W in a row. He is also better on clay.
Djokovic is 5th of all time bud. Sorry to tell ya mate. Kyrgios agrees as well.

Djokovic is better at Wimbledon than Fed. 3-0 in finals confirms this.

let’s count their slams when they’re all finished. Djokovic has many many slams to come

 

[Beckerserve]

Djokovic is better at Wimbledon than Fed. 3-0 in finals confirms this.

let’s count their slams when they’re all finished. Djokovic has many many slams to come

In Djokovic la la land it seems less is more lol.

 

[Villain]

It does. More media coverage more exposure means more kudos. Find me one player who would prefer more AOs than USOs!! Even aussies wouldnt.

Careful, if these are your metrics for one slam being more important than another, those French Opens aren’t going to count for much.

 

[NoleFam]

So Nadal's 2-1 is even more impressive and clutch?

I hear a lot of people on here say tennis didn't start in 2011, but it also didn't stop in 2013. When Nadal can't even win sets against Djokovic on any hardcourt in the world since that match, it's hard to imagine him keeping that 2-1 lead if they had met more there in the last 8 years.

 

[Third Serve]

I hear a lot of people on here say tennis didn't start in 2011, but it also didn't stop in 2013. When Nadal can't even win sets against Djokovic on any hardcourt in the world since that match, it's hard to imagine him keeping that 2-1 lead if they had met more there in the last 8 years.

Untestable, therefore unprovable, therefore irrelevant

 

[NoleFam]

I agree with others that Borg is greater than Djokovic on grass because for me, when two players are tied at a Slam, you have to give to the player who was more dominant. The same reason Djokovic was greater than Federer at AO when Federer was tied with him at 6.