Djokovic has won 48 out of his last 50 matches in grand slam play - 96% win rate

[StrongRule]

Outside the slams yeah, he was better in 2013 and 2014.

But at the slams, he was just much better in 2018/2019, at least mentally. He was still very consistent in 2013-2014 going deep but he was losing tons of finals/semis.

From AO 2012 to Wimbledon 2014 he won only one slam despite regularly making SFs and Fs.

Somehow when it comes to Nadal and Federer, we are supposed to believe (according to your fanbase) they are definitely in great form when they reach the final and lose to Djokovic. But Djokovic is at his prime only when he wins?

 

[abmk]

True, hard to compare different time periods. But the fact he won 3 slams out of 3 in one period (or 4 out of 5 if you extend it a bit) vs 2 out of 8 in the other one is telling enough.

not at all considering the big difference in competition.

Fed in USO 11/AO 12/Wim 12 ~ Djoko in Wim 18/USO 18/AO 19.
Actually fed was better in 2 out of the 3.
USO 11 fed > USO 18 djoko and Wim 12 fed > Wim 18 djoko. and AO 19 djoko > AO 12 fed

But fed won only 1 of those 3, while djoko won all 3. Djoko simply had clearly easier competition

Also fed in USO 11/AO 12/Wim 12 > Fed in AO 17/Wim 17/AO 18.
but fed won only 1 of the first 3, while he won all 3 of the 2nd set.

Fed simply had clearly easier competition in 17-early 18, just as djoko in Wim 18-AO 19.

 

[uscwang]

Make it 49 of the last 51 GS matches.
Four down, three more to go.
I heard John McEnroe saying after one of Novak's matches something like he has arrived for a charge towards history but couldn't find the exact line. Novak is the trailblazer for men's tennis now, as Borg, Sampras, Federer, and Nadal once were. The Big 3 set the biggest stage together. It is showtime.

 

[TMF]

Guys who are washed-up don't win two slams the very next year.

Nadal was nothing in 2021. He won a total of 24 matches and 2 titles against a weak field.

 

[DSH]

EPO is a miracle drug.

There is someone with many magic potions at his disposal.

 

[TMF]

If those generations had multiple multislam winners (as they would in the absence of the Big3) no one would talk of weak eras

They should be winning slams even with the big old 3(especially Federer). Athletes are at the best in their 20s, but since these 90's born players can't hold a candle against them til this days is the testament of their incompetence.

Federer, Sampras or Borg and all their respective peers don't allow any old men to dominate the sport. The best players are all in their 20's which is an ideal age for the athletes. The career inflation era is so weak that they allow not 1, not 2, but 3 old men dominate the tour.

You need to wake up !

 

[DSH]

Nadal was nothing in 2021. He won a total of 24 matches and 2 titles against a weak field.

Nadal played a maximum of 5 points in that edition of Roland Garros.
But he would have won the tournament had he been the second seed.
French Open final on a sunny day: Bull against anyone in straight sets!

 

[GabeT]

They should be winning slams even with the big old 3(especially Federer). Athletes are at the best in their 20s, but since these 90's born players can't hold a candle against them til this days is the testament of their incompetence.

Federer, Sampras or Borg and all their respective peers don't allow any old men to dominate the sport. The best players are all in their 20's which is an ideal age for the athletes. The career inflation era is so weak that they allow not 1, not 2, but 3 old men dominate the tour.

You need to wake up !

Can’t help but remember your prediction about Nadal and Djokovic relative to Federer

“They will combined to have more slam count and total titles, but few things that they will not match:

1. weeks #1.
2. WTF
3. Wimbledon
4. Total hard court titles”

yeah, maybe I’ll skip your explanations and forecasts if you don’t mind.

 

[TMF]

Can’t help but remember your prediction about Nadal and Djokovic relative to Federer

“They will combined to have more slam count and total titles, but few things that they will not match:

1. weeks #1.
2. WTF
3. Wimbledon
4. Total hard court titles”

yeah, maybe I’ll skip your explanations and forecasts if you don’t mind.

Can't counter any of my point. That's a cop out.

 

[GabeT]

Can't counter any of my point. That's a cop out.

You made no points other than repeat ’weak era” endlessly. But we know you have no ability to measure relative levels so your opinion about the strength of the eras is basically worthless. Luckily this forum is free for all!

 

[TMF]

You made no points other than repeat ’weak era” endlessly. But we know you have no ability to measure relative levels so your opinion about the strength of the eras is basically worthless. Luckily this forum is free for all!

Actually, many people here have watched tennis well before 2011 have presented a lot of insightful information about tennis but people like you don't want to admit the fact.

Learn history !

 

[BauerAlmeida]

not at all considering the big difference in competition.

Fed in USO 11/AO 12/Wim 12 ~ Djoko in Wim 18/USO 18/AO 19.
Actually fed was better in 2 out of the 3.
USO 11 fed > USO 18 djoko and Wim 12 fed > Wim 18 djoko. and AO 19 djoko > AO 12 fed

But fed won only 1 of those 3, while djoko won all 3. Djoko simply had clearly easier competition

Also fed in USO 11/AO 12/Wim 12 > Fed in AO 17/Wim 17/AO 18.
but fed won only 1 of the first 3, while he won all 3 of the 2nd set.

Fed simply had clearly easier competition in 17-early 18, just as djoko in Wim 18-AO 19.

Djokovic had to face Nadal in Wimbledon 2018 and AO 2019 so I don't think he had a particularly weak draw in those. He had a weakish draw at the USO 2018 but had to face del Potro who was a former champion and still won in straights. Also, beat Nadal in straights at the AO when everyone was talking about how brilliant Nadal was playing those two weeks. So even if the competition had been a bit better can't say it would have had much of an impact when he won both finals in straights and they weren't easy opponents at all.

Djokovic's problem in 2013 and 2014 was mostly mental, not competition. That's why he won only one slam per year. In 2012 yeah, he only won one mostly because of competition because he faced great versions of Nadal at RG and Federer at Wimbledon and they're better there (and that strange final with Murray at the USO with the wind and having two play consecutive days). In 2013 he blew RG SF with the net touch, was a no-show at the Wimbledon final and blew the 3rd set at the USO final time and time again. In 2014 he was poor in the final vs Nadal at RG and lost to Nishikori who is a vastly inferior player at the USO (H2H is 18-2). And the lost vs Wawrink at the AO 2014 doesn't look bad in hindsight because of the player Stan ended up becoming, but at the time it did look like he lost to a player he usually beats and who never did much at slams before that.


I don't think 2018/2019 Djokovic loses vs Nishikori at the USO (he did face him at the USO 2018 but it was a worse Nishikori). And given Nadal hasn't beaten him in HC for a while and he won comfortably at the AO soon after, I think he would have beaten Nadal at the USO 2018 had he made the final.

 

[abmk]

Djokovic had to face Nadal in Wimbledon 2018 and AO 2019 so I don't think he had a particularly weak draw in those. He had a weakish draw at the USO 2018 but had to face del Potro who was a former champion and still won in straights. Also, beat Nadal in straights at the AO when everyone was talking about how brilliant Nadal was playing those two weeks. So even if the competition had been a bit better can't say it would have had much of an impact when he won both finals in straights and they weren't easy opponents at all.

Nadal played very well in Wim 18. never mentioned that as anywhere near weak.

Nadal played like utter sh*t in the AO 19 final - his worst slam final by far, not even close.
Form prior to final was good, but over-rated.

So yeah, pretty weak draw in AO 19.

Delpo in USO 18 final was a meh opponent. not a significant test mentally.
nishi was meh as well. so weak draw overall.
its a flat out weak draw just like fed's AO 18 draw. Actually Cilic played better did Delpo did. Cilic took it to fed in the 2nd set TB and in the 4th set, while delpo UFEd his way to oblivion in the 2nd set TB vs djoko (including FH UEs)
and berdych better than Nishi. (though not particularly good).
Djoko of USO 18 better than fed of AO 18, but doesn't change the above.

the impact would be if USO 18 Djoko/19 AO Djoko faced competition like AO 13/14 Wawa and USO 13 Nadal.

Djokovic's problem in 2013 and 2014 was mostly mental, not competition. That's why he won only one slam per year. In 2012 yeah, he only won one mostly because of competition because he faced great versions of Nadal at RG and Federer at Wimbledon and they're better there (and that strange final with Murray at the USO with the wind and having two play consecutive days). In 2013 he blew RG SF with the net touch, was a no-show at the Wimbledon final and blew the 3rd set at the USO final time and time again. In 2014 he was poor in the final vs Nadal at RG and lost to Nishikori who is a vastly inferior player at the USO (H2H is 18-2). And the lost vs Wawrink at the AO 2014 doesn't look bad in hindsight because of the player Stan ended up becoming, but at the time it did look like he lost to a player he usually beats and who never did much at slams before that.

Djokovic went 5-sets twice vs Wawa in 13 and was due a loss. nothing hindsight about his loss in AO 14. in fact he could've lost in AO 13 itself.

The AO 19 and Wawa points are just flat out nonsense from you. Sorry. There is no 2 ways about it.
Even your USO 18 point is just trying to butter over Djokovic's draw there.
bold part is not accurate either. explained above already.

In 2013 RG, Djokovic was really clutch to take it to a 5th set in the first place. Nadal serving for the match in the 4th set and was clearly better till then.
Even in the 5th set, Nadal was anyways the better player after the 1st game in the 5th set with or without the net touch.

I already agreed on USO 14 vs Nishi.
USO 13 - Djokovic had a significant mental dip, but even USO 18 Djoko would've lost to USO 13 nadal anyways.

Wim 13, well, he'd be just as bad, if not worse if his 18 version had to play a 4hr 48 min match vs delpo and he had to face peak Murray instead of mediocre Anderson. That is even assuming, he gets past Wim 13 Delpo in the first place.

RG 14 final, Djoko was meh, not poor. and still much better than RG 19 from him anyways. So what's your point?

I don't think 2018/2019 Djokovic loses vs Nishikori at the USO (he did face him at the USO 2018 but it was a worse Nishikori). And given Nadal hasn't beaten him in HC for a while and he won comfortably at the AO soon after, I think he would have beaten Nadal at the USO 2018 had he made the final.

I'm talking about USO 18 djoko facing off vs USO 13 Nadal. Nadal beats him.
USO 18 djoko obviously beats USO 18 nadal, no question.

 

[RS]

Incredible scenes by The Earth's Mightiest Warrior that in his mid 30s he has put up devastating numbers like this.

Who knows what the next 50 will look like, but the last 50 have been insane. It gave him a winning streak of 27 matches, a current winning streak of 17 matches, and five grand slam titles.

Sleep well Earth's Citizens

Your thread tipped upside down.

 

[jackson vile]

Son of God baking that pie for the haters

 

[GabeT]

Actually, many people here have watched tennis well before 2011 have presented a lot of insightful information about tennis but people like you don't want to admit the fact.

Learn history !

Iots of people have posted lots of information and opinions, yes

 

[Third Serve]

In 2013 he blew RG SF with the net touch.

Djokovic was insanely clutch to take that match to a fifth set in the first place to be honest. The stats reflect a four set victory rather than a five-setter.

And obviously the net touch was bad but Djokovic was hitting terrible overheads the whole match so it wasn’t really too much out of character for him.

Overall, I think that match was a mentally strong performance from Djoker on the whole.

 

[BauerAlmeida]

Nadal played very well in Wim 18. never mentioned that as anywhere near weak.

Nadal played like utter sh*t in the AO 19 final - his worst slam final by far, not even close.
Form prior to final was good, but over-rated.

So yeah, pretty weak draw in AO 19.

Delpo in USO 18 final was a meh opponent. not a significant test mentally.
nishi was meh as well. so weak draw overall.
its a flat out weak draw just like fed's AO 18 draw. Actually Cilic played better did Delpo did. Cilic took it to fed in the 2nd set TB and in the 4th set, while delpo UFEd his way to oblivion in the 2nd set TB vs djoko (including FH UEs)
and berdych better than Nishi. (though not particularly good).
Djoko of USO 18 better than fed of AO 18, but doesn't change the above.

the impact would be if USO 18 Djoko/19 AO Djoko faced competition like AO 13/14 Wawa and USO 13 Nadal.




Djokovic went 5-sets twice vs Wawa in 13 and was due a loss. nothing hindsight about his loss in AO 14. in fact he could've lost in AO 13 itself.

The AO 19 and Wawa points are just flat out nonsense from you. Sorry. There is no 2 ways about it.
Even your USO 18 point is just trying to butter over Djokovic's draw there.
bold part is not accurate either. explained above already.

In 2013 RG, Djokovic was clutch enough to take it to a 5th set in the first place. Nadal serving for the match in the 4th set and was clearly better till then.
Even in the 5th set, Nadal was anyways the better player after the 1st game in the 5th set with or without the net touch.

I already agreed on USO 14 vs Nishi.
USO 13 - Djokovic had a significant mental dip, but even USO 18 Djoko would've lost to USO 13 nadal anyways.

Wim 13, well, he'd be just as bad, if not worse if his 18 version had to play a 4hr 48 min match vs delpo and he had to face peak Murray instead of mediocre Anderson. That is even assuming, he gets past Wim 13 Delpo in the first place.

RG 14 final, Djoko was meh, not poor. and still much better than RG 19 from him anyways. So what's your point?


I'm talking about USO 18 djoko facing off vs USO 13 Nadal. Nadal beats him.
USO 18 djoko obviously beats USO 18 nadal, no question.

Djokovic in USO 2014 lost to a worse player than the one he beat in USO 2018. Del Potro is much better than Nishikori, yet in 2014 he lost to Nishikori and in 2018 he beat del Potro. Worth mentioning he couldn't even take it to a fifth vs Nishikori and beat del Potro in straights.

I don't think the Djokovic that won USO convincingly (and it wasn't a tough draw but not many players would straight-set del Potro on HC Bo5. Del Potro was having a great year and reached #3 winning Indian Wells) loses to Nishikori. I never said it was a tough draw, but it wasn't a tough draw in 2014 either and still lost.

Djokovic in the SF and F of AO 2019 was brilliant, I think among the best Djokovic has ever played at the AO. He loses to the 2011 version for sure, and 2012 probably too (And 2016 which is one of his finest as well in the SF and F). But it was at least in similar level to 2013-2014-2015. Nobody expected a demolition before the final because of how good Nadal was playing. In fact, before the SF many were thinking Nadal was going to win. After the SF where both played great more people were considering Djokovic the favorite but expecting a close match like they had in 2012.

Well, all in all, it's pure speculation and hypotheticals and nothing of this is provable, but I don't think Djokovic wins 3 slams in a row and 4 out of 5 in 2013/2014 form. He wasn't there mentally at the tail end of slams. Even if he was better in certain aspects overall I'd place him slightly below because of that. I don't think the Djokovic of that period that was struggling mentally wins in straights consecutive finals vs del Potro and Nadal. And that Wimbledon 2018 SF was very clutch too, the Djokovic of 2013-2014 probably doesn't take it. Djokovic was also mentally shaky in the Wimbledon 2014 final even if he ended up winning.

 

[abmk]

Djokovic in USO 2014 lost to a worse player than the one he beat in USO 2018. Del Potro is much better than Nishikori, yet in 2014 he lost to Nishikori and in 2018 he beat del Potro. Worth mentioning he couldn't even take it to a fifth vs Nishikori and beat del Potro in straights.

I don't think the Djokovic that won USO convincingly (and it wasn't a tough draw but not many players would straight-set del Potro on HC Bo5. Del Potro was having a great year and reached #3 winning Indian Wells) loses to Nishikori. I never said it was a tough draw, but it wasn't a tough draw in 2014 either and still lost.

I already agreed on USO 14 loss, so why are you wasting your time repeating that?

oh and while delpo is a clearly player than nishi, nishi in USO 14 semi was playing better than delpo in USO 18 final

Djokovic in the SF and F of AO 2019 was brilliant, I think among the best Djokovic has ever played at the AO. He loses to the 2011 version for sure, and 2012 probably too (And 2016 which is one of his finest as well in the SF and F). But it was at least in similar level to 2013-2014-2015. Nobody expected a demolition before the final because of how good Nadal was playing. In fact, before the SF many were thinking Nadal was going to win. After the SF where both played great more people were considering Djokovic the favorite but expecting a close match like they had in 2012.

Djoko in AO 13 > Djoko in AO 12 firstly.
start to finish AO 13 is 3rd best after 11 and 08.
Djoko AO 13 better than Djoko AO 19 physically and would outlast him at the very least IMO.

Djoko AO 14 a little lower than AO 13. So I can accept about same level as AO 19. But Wawa would be even more confident vs a ~32 yo old Djoker and would beat that Djokovic as well IMO.

nadal's form before final in AO 19 was over-rated (faced no one who played half-decent vs him) and he played a sh*t final. weak opponent. stop denying the reality.

Djokovic was excellent in AO 19 SF/F, but just wasn't tested. Cannot give him the edge over a well playing prime djokovic with better physicality in AO 14.

Well, all in all, it's pure speculation and hypotheticals and nothing of this is provable, but I don't think Djokovic wins 3 slams in a row and 4 out of 5 in 2013/2014 form. He wasn't there mentally at the tail end of slams. Even if he was better in certain aspects overall I'd place him slightly below because of that. I don't think the Djokovic of that period that was struggling mentally wins in straights consecutive finals vs del Potro and Nadal. And that Wimbledon 2018 SF was very clutch too, the Djokovic of 2013-2014 probably doesn't take it. Djokovic was also mentally shaky in the Wimbledon 2014 final even if he ended up winning.

Djoko was clutch enough to take 3rd set vs federer serving bonkers in Wim 14. yes, did have a clear letdown in the 4th set, but recovered in the 5th set to clutch it out.
Overall a net +ve mentally. ground game and return clearly better compared to Wim 18. serve similar. so Wim 18 djokovic really has nothing game-wise over Wim 14 djokovic.

nothing wrong with djoko in Wim 13 semi vs delpo. defended like crazy AND raked up in the winners column as well. that djoko edges out nadal of Wim 18 semi again.
ground game, return better clearly better in Wim 13, serve better in Wim 18. similar level I'd say. if anything the Wim 13 semi was better level IMO.

AO 14 djoko crushes AO 19 nadal, no question.
USO 13 djoko beat a tougher matchup in stan, he'd beat delpo of USO 18 as well who was playing no better than USO 13 Stan (clearly worse if we just consider the 2 matches). Nadal of USO 13 is well well above delpo of USO 18.

Djoko was very much there mentally at the tail end of slams in 13 and 14 save for USO 13 final and 14 semi (&well Wim 13 final - partly physical, partly metal)
and USO 18 djoko loses to USO 13 nadal anyway. and 18 wim djoko does no better after a ~5hr match vs delpo than Wim 13 djoko. probably does worse. (if he does edge out delpo of WIm 13 that is)

when you crib about less significant downs vs actual competition like RG 13 nadal, 14 Wim fed (when it was net +ve mentally in these both) and start ignoring how mediocre competition was in USO 18 and AO 19, that's just Zverible analysis..

about his mental toughness in Wim 18-AO 19 stretch, like I said:

If you want more proof about Wim 18- AO 19, Djokovic was outclutched or outdone mentally in Bo3 multiple times in Wim 18-AO 19: tpas in Canada 18, Khachanov in Paris 18, Zverev in YEC 18, RBA in Doha 19. Aka opposition atleast somewhat capable to push him in Bo3 unlike in Bo5.

And if you want to bring in Djoko only cared more about the slams, Cincy 18, Shanghai 18 and YEC 18 disprove that. He won his first Cincy, was dominant in Shanghai. Djokovic was dominant in YEC 18 till the final. Lost 8 games max in first 4 matches.It took 8 games in the YEC 18 final for Zverev to crack open djoko mentally by being relentless and serving really well.

Yeah, djoko had moments of toughness on Bo3 in Wim 18-AO 19, like Cincy couple of matches, Paris semi vs fed, but cracks also showed clearly as mentioned above

moving on ->

Djoko of Wim 13 edges out Nadal of Wim 18 and beats Anderson in the final
Djoko of USO 13 beats delpo of USO 18. he beat a better playing, tougher matchup in Wawa in 13 after all.
Djoko of AO 14 thrashes Pouille and Nadal of AO 19 again
Djoko of Wim 14 obviously beats fed of Wim 19. doesn't have to depend on fed mediocrity in 3 fricking TBs and having to save MPs.

so how doesn't he win 4 of 5?