Djokovic, Murray rackets - swingweight 400 g?

kailash

Professional
I heard that Djokovic racket's swing weight is 400 g; anyone knows if that is true?

Murray's racket also seem to be on the heavier side.
 

El_Yotamo

Professional
Djokovic's swingweight I believe is 370 (it's measured in kg*cm^2) and unfortunately, murray's swingweight as of the last couple years is unknown to us, but there are many predictions on it. I think his swingweight is listed at 405 or something back in 2007, but he made his setup lighter, and it's obviously much lower today.
 

kailash

Professional
Ok, got it; thank you all!

Currently experimenting with different weight rackets and curious to see what weight that the top pros play with.
 

anubis

Hall of Fame
Ok, got it; thank you all!

Currently experimenting with different weight rackets and curious to see what weight that the top pros play with.
In order to get a racquet to have a swingweight of 370 or higher, you need to start off with an incredibly light weight frame so that you can add the required lead at the right places.

Basically, you need a racquet that has a strung weight of no more than 280 or 290 grams. Why? Because you'll be adding around 20 grams of lead at 12:00 noon, another 10 grams at 3 and 9, and another 30 grams in the handle to counter balance. That will get you roughly a swingweight of around 370, with a static weight of 350 or less.
 

RanchDressing

Hall of Fame
In order to get a racquet to have a swingweight of 370 or higher, you need to start off with an incredibly light weight frame so that you can add the required lead at the right places.

Basically, you need a racquet that has a strung weight of no more than 280 or 290 grams. Why? Because you'll be adding around 20 grams of lead at 12:00 noon, another 10 grams at 3 and 9, and another 30 grams in the handle to counter balance. That will get you roughly a swingweight of around 370, with a static weight of 350 or less.
Nope.


You can make any frame a 370 sw. Adding at the right place? The pros at P1 don't add X g here and X g there. They vary lead placement based on what the player needs/wants.

Some players like a high sw, with maneuverability (nadal is an example). Some players like a high sw+twistweight for more power/forgiveness (djokovic, Agassi).

But saying you need an ultra light racquet to keep the frame playable is silly. Where you add lead depends totally on what you start with, and what you want the end result to be.
 

anubis

Hall of Fame
Nope.


You can make any frame a 370 sw. Adding at the right place? The pros at P1 don't add X g here and X g there. They vary lead placement based on what the player needs/wants.

Some players like a high sw, with maneuverability (nadal is an example). Some players like a high sw+twistweight for more power/forgiveness (djokovic, Agassi).

But saying you need an ultra light racquet to keep the frame playable is silly. Where you add lead depends totally on what you start with, and what you want the end result to be.
No, it's not silly. I can make any of my frames have a swing weight of 370 or greater, but all of them will be somewhere between 13 and 14 oz and head heavy.

My argument is if you want a swingweight of 370, and maintain 6 points HL balance and keep the static weight under 345g, you need to start off with an ultralight hairpin and at a ton of mass at the polar ends.

My own IG Prestige MP weighs almost 360 grams and has a swingweight of only 320. If I was to add another 15g to the hoop, I'd get a swing weight of 370, but it would be 1 or 2 points HH and weigh 375 g. If I was to counter balance at the handle by adding another 15 grams, bringing it back to about 4 or 5 points HL, it would weigh 390 grams, it would weigh almost 14 ounces. I'm quite sure no one in the top 10 are using 14 ounce sticks. I don't even think they're using 13 ounce sticks, for that matter.
 
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TennisCJC

Legend
There was a spreadsheet of unstrung specs for roughly 44 ATP pros on TT a few years back. I averaged the weight and added .6 oz for strings and the average weight was about 12.6 oz strung and the balance was approximately 6HL strung. It didn't have SW but typical ATP SW is in the 340-380 range with a few outliers above or below the range. Fed, Nadal and Djoko are all in the 350-370 range give or take a bit if you can believe the many postings here on TT.

If you want to try a pro style spec, I would suggest:

weight: 12 to 13 oz
balance: 4 to 8 HL
SW: 350 to 370

I have not gone that high in SW intentionally but I don't know the SW of some of the old wood rackets I used decades ago. It might be fun to try a SW of 360 but I don't think it is optimal for me (old late 50s, now relagated to 4.0 doubles). My SW has been in the 330-338 range for most of last decade which feels very stable and powerful for my level of play.
 

TennisCJC

Legend
No, it's not silly. I can make any of my frames have a swing weight of 370 or greater, but all of them will be somewhere between 13 and 14 oz and head heavy.

My argument is if you want a swingweight of 370, and maintain 6 points HL balance and keep the static weight under 345g, you need to start off with an ultralight hairpin and at a ton of mass at the polar ends.

My own IG Prestige MP weighs almost 360 grams and has a swingweight of only 320. If I was to add another 15g to the hoop, I'd get a swing weight of 370, but it would be 1 or 2 points HH and weigh 375 g. If I was to counter balance at the handle by adding another 15 grams, bringing it back to about 4 or 5 points HL, it would weigh 390 grams, it would weigh almost 14 ounces. I'm quite sure no one in the top 10 are using 14 ounce sticks. I don't even think they're using 13 ounce sticks, for that matter.
I think you are correct, but Sampras was close to 14 oz and Gabriella Sabitini used a 14 oz racket. Daniella Huntachova also was reported to have used a 14 oz racket early in her career. I believe average strung weight on ATP is around 12.6 for top 40 players give or take a bit.
 

anubis

Hall of Fame
I think you are correct, but Sampras was close to 14 oz and Gabriella Sabitini used a 14 oz racket. Daniella Huntachova also was reported to have used a 14 oz racket early in her career. I believe average strung weight on ATP is around 12.6 for top 40 players give or take a bit.
I'm sure those frames that you describe are depolarized. It's a little easier to swing a 14 oz frame if most of the mass is in the center, as opposed to the polar ends. A 370 swing weight frame that is 14 ounces is so beastly that I think even a pro would have trouble swinging consistently for 5 sets.
 

dnj30

Semi-Pro
I'm sure those frames that you describe are depolarized. It's a little easier to swing a 14 oz frame if most of the mass is in the center, as opposed to the polar ends. A 370 swing weight frame that is 14 ounces is so beastly that I think even a pro would have trouble swinging consistently for 5 sets.
I agree. High sw AND high static weight(12.5oz+) is very tough to handle for most people.
 

floydcouncil

Professional
I agree. High sw AND high static weight(12.5oz+) is very tough to handle for most people.
Not for the 3.5 and 4.0 members of TTW. Their vast knowledge of SW and MgrI/2pi.theta is incredible and the highly polarized and depolorized frames will increase their NTRiP by 1.0 factor!!!!

Long live the tinker-ers on TTW!!
 

RanchDressing

Hall of Fame
No, it's not silly. I can make any of my frames have a swing weight of 370 or greater, but all of them will be somewhere between 13 and 14 oz and head heavy.

My argument is if you want a swingweight of 370, and maintain 6 points HL balance and keep the static weight under 345g, you need to start off with an ultralight hairpin and at a ton of mass at the polar ends.

My own IG Prestige MP weighs almost 360 grams and has a swingweight of only 320. If I was to add another 15g to the hoop, I'd get a swing weight of 370, but it would be 1 or 2 points HH and weigh 375 g. If I was to counter balance at the handle by adding another 15 grams, bringing it back to about 4 or 5 points HL, it would weigh 390 grams, it would weigh almost 14 ounces. I'm quite sure no one in the top 10 are using 14 ounce sticks. I don't even think they're using 13 ounce sticks, for that matter.

I can make my frame 370 SW and keep it under 12.9 and 6pt hl.


To go from 340 sw (stock on my frames) up to 370 you need add 9 grams. roughly 332 grams starting strung weight. Add 9 up top, and add 5 under buttcap, and 5 for og. That puts you at 351 grams. Keeps balance at 5pt hl. Add another few grams under the buttcap and viola you're still under 360 grams. Add 4 grams at buttcap for 355 and you're plenty head light. The GPP by no means is a hairframe.

The real purpose of a hairpin is to dial in twistweight, not just swingweight. It's impossible to lower twistweight from a frame once it's been moulded.

Depending on the player they'll prefer the manuverability of low twistweight (rafa and his APD original have an ultra low twistweight, but high swingweight).
Some players like a high twistweight, like novak.

Oh and if you claim that it's impossible to add that much weight to the trapdoor/lower handle you don't have a clue. Last night I added roughly 23 grams to the bottom end of a client's handle. I could add more easily.
 

anubis

Hall of Fame
I can make my frame 370 SW and keep it under 12.9 and 6pt hl.


To go from 340 sw (stock on my frames) up to 370 you need add 9 grams. roughly 332 grams starting strung weight. Add 9 up top, and add 5 under buttcap, and 5 for og. That puts you at 351 grams. Keeps balance at 5pt hl. Add another few grams under the buttcap and viola you're still under 360 grams. Add 4 grams at buttcap for 355 and you're plenty head light. The GPP by no means is a hairframe.

The real purpose of a hairpin is to dial in twistweight, not just swingweight. It's impossible to lower twistweight from a frame once it's been moulded.

Depending on the player they'll prefer the manuverability of low twistweight (rafa and his APD original have an ultra low twistweight, but high swingweight).
Some players like a high twistweight, like novak.

Oh and if you claim that it's impossible to add that much weight to the trapdoor/lower handle you don't have a clue. Last night I added roughly 23 grams to the bottom end of a client's handle. I could add more easily.
Yeah, it's really easy to raise swing weight by 30 points, and keep the overall weight low. You've got a head start there, and can get to the final destination by using only a small amount of weight.

But I use racquets with stock swing weights closer to 300, so I have a lot farther to go. If a stick weighs 345 grams strung, and you still need to add 20 grams at the hoop just to get to 370 swing weight, you're already at 365 grams and you still haven't counter balanced yet.
 

Denis

New User
For pro's SW, you have to start with a very HL(10-12pts) racquet to compensate for lead in a hoop or just pick a badminton stick, add 50g to the hoop and 50g to the handle :)

But honestly, since I've been there myself, don't go for a pro's SW! We don't have nor their strength, nor their timing! It will make you blocking your strokes and force you to take shorter backswings. Instead customize your stick to the SW that doesn't hurt your timing and doesn't fatique your arm and take a full cuts at the ball! I usually go +5 gramm in the hoop until I feel timing problems and then reduce 1 gramm untill I feel my timing is good. If I feel my arm is tired at the end of the match I reduce a little more.
 
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A_Instead

Hall of Fame
On One of my SW blade 104 I added 4 grams of weight across the bumper..using head protection tape..an overgrip and 2 gram dampener.
Not sure what the swing weight ended up to be. Total static weight was only 333 grams.. no issues swinging or playing matches with it..didn't seem sluggish or tankish..
It murdered the ball..
.
 

Denis

New User
My setups by progression:

Aero Pro Drive 2013: +5g at 12 + kimony leather grip + overgrip ---> wilson pro staff 97: +9g under the bumper + head leather grip(+10g) + overgrip ---> Yonex Ezone DR98: +12g at 2 &10 + kimony leather grip + overgrip.

My string if Solinco Hyper G 1.25

I mostly hit with good topspin on both wings(2hbh) and have a very smooth technique. But find your own setup guys, the one that allows you to swing out at the ball!
 

deaner2211

Semi-Pro
In order to get a racquet to have a swingweight of 370 or higher, you need to start off with an incredibly light weight frame so that you can add the required lead at the right places.

Basically, you need a racquet that has a strung weight of no more than 280 or 290 grams. Why? Because you'll be adding around 20 grams of lead at 12:00 noon, another 10 grams at 3 and 9, and another 30 grams in the handle to counter balance. That will get you roughly a swingweight of around 370, with a static weight of 350 or less.
Wrong! You can also have a strung racket that weighs 340 grams and has a swingweight around 320 and add 18 grams to get the 358 gram wieght, then you can add weight in the head and butt to get the desired swunhwswing and balance.
 

jmacdaununder2

Hall of Fame
Swunhwswing? 'I don't know what it means...to be honest I don't think anyone knows what it means any more...scholars maintain that the translation was lost hundreds of years ago...'
 
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