Djokovic RN is proof Fed was right all along

[Jonesy]

This is important.

“I think I'm a better player now than when I was at 24 because I've practised for another 10 years and I've got 10 years more experience,” Federer said. “Maybe I don't have the confidence level that I had at 24 when I was winning 40 matches in a row, but I feel like I hit a bigger serve, my backhand is better, my forehand is still as good as it's ever been, I volley better than I have in the past. I think I've had to adapt to a new generation of players again.”

What! Roger Federer Says He’s Better Now Than He Was 10 Years Ago!

Is Roger Federer better now than when he was 24.

www.tennis-x.com

 

[Lleytonstation]

All that said...

I still think a fed from 04-07 beats this djoker more often than not.

 

[Kralingen]

I’d take 2011-16 Djokovic over this Djokovic 7 days a week and twice on sundays.

 

[Jonesy]

All that said...

I still think a fed from 04-07 beats this djoker more often than not.

I feel Federer knows more about tennis than any of us in this forum, and reality is proving once again that he is right.

 

[Milanez82]

All that said...

I still think a fed from 04-07 beats this djoker more often than not.

Could he beat no cramps Alcaraz

 

[initialize]

I feel Federer knows more about tennis than any of us in this forum, and reality is proving once again that he is right.

Nah, Verdasco and Davydenko are right, not Fed. They've stated many times already this is the weakest era of all time

 

[Jonesy]

Nah, Verdasco and Davydenko are right, not Fed. They've stated many times already this is the weakest era of all time

Do you take the word of two slamless players over the 20 slams legend? I'm with the latter.

 

[DogInSpace]

What a laughable thread. Djokovic competition in the 2nd weeks of the last 4 slams he won:

wimbledon21
QF Fucsovics
SF Shapovalov
F Berrettini

wimbledon22
QF Sinner
SF Norrie
F Kyrgios

Australian Open23
QF Rublev
SF Paul
F Tsitsipas

Roland Garros23
QF Khachanov
SF Alcaraz
F Ruud

This is so ridiculous that words can't describe how stupid it is to compare his version who was beating players written above to his version in his 20's.
36 year old Nadal was literally beating the same guys too (and beating Djokovic himself also at RG), nobody sane would say that Nadal last year was even close to his prime.

By that logic 35 year old Djokovic would demolish Nadal at 2013 Roland Garros since his inferior younger version almost won that SF. It is insane.

 

[Jonesy]

I’d take 2011-16 Djokovic over this Djokovic 7 days a week and twice on sundays.

That is ok. I'd rather trust Federer words than your knowledge as a spectator and gambler.

 

[Federev]

This is important.

“I think I'm a better player now than when I was at 24 because I've practised for another 10 years and I've got 10 years more experience,” Federer said. “Maybe I don't have the confidence level that I had at 24 when I was winning 40 matches in a row, but I feel like I hit a bigger serve, my backhand is better, my forehand is still as good as it's ever been, I volley better than I have in the past. I think I've had to adapt to a new generation of players again.”

What! Roger Federer Says He’s Better Now Than He Was 10 Years Ago!

Is Roger Federer better now than when he was 24.

www.tennis-x.com

If you wanna know if I'm extremely smart, very charming, and devastatingly handsome...just ask me.

Or my mom.

We're completely unbiased.

 

[TheNachoMan]

36 year old Nadal was literally beating the same guys too

Yeah, and yet Nadal fans complain about a weak era..the irony is lost on them.

 

[Towny]

I love how Djokovic beating the world number 88 on his worst surface in straights in the 3R is meant to constitute evidence Djokovic is playing better now than in 2015. Totally reasonable conclusion

 

[The Guru]

It's actually insane how often that quote has been posted on here

 

[DogInSpace]

Yeah, and yet Nadal fans complain about a weak era..the irony is lost on them.

I don't get it. Nadal fans cannot point out that today's field is weak as **** because what? Because old Nadal was beating them too?

 

[TheNachoMan]

I don't get it. Nadal fans cannot point out that today's field is weak as **** because what? Because old Nadal was beating them too?

Because they seem to think it only applies to Djokovic when it applies to their guy too. Novak was just better at beating the field than Nadal was.
Only Fed fans can complain, really.

 

[ChrisRF]

I’d take 2011-16 Djokovic over this Djokovic 7 days a week and twice on sundays.

Then maybe 2 or 3 times you would be lucky.

Seriously, the improved serve, the more aggressive forehand, the better touch at the net and the absurd mental toughness in tiebreaks now would seal the deal more often than not. Only 2011 and 2015 Djokovic would have a chance.

The 2012-14 Djokovic often looked shaky, especially in those matches against Wawrinka. Of course Wawrinka has declined, but I doubt current Djokovic would lose a match like 2014 AO. He's way more variable and rock solid nowadays.

 

[Thetouch]

Federer proved his own words right. He had to adapt and work much harder at 30+ than at 23/24.

 

[tex123]

This is important.

“I think I'm a better player now than when I was at 24 because I've practised for another 10 years and I've got 10 years more experience,” Federer said. “Maybe I don't have the confidence level that I had at 24 when I was winning 40 matches in a row, but I feel like I hit a bigger serve, my backhand is better, my forehand is still as good as it's ever been, I volley better than I have in the past. I think I've had to adapt to a new generation of players again.”

What! Roger Federer Says He’s Better Now Than He Was 10 Years Ago!

Is Roger Federer better now than when he was 24.

www.tennis-x.com

Djokovic has never had a credible younger challenger like Nadal and Fed. He's evolved but there's no one younger to challenge him.

 

[DogInSpace]

Because they seem to think it only applies to Djokovic when it applies to their guy too. Novak was just better at beating the field than Nadal was.
Only Fed fans can complain, really.

He wasn't better. He is just younger and naturally is the last man standing.

Also of course it applies to Nadal too. What is happening with men's tennis since ~2016/17 is a joke.

 

[TheNachoMan]

He wasn't better. He is just younger and naturally is the last man standing.

Also of course it applies to Nadal too. What is happening with men's tennis since ~2016/17 is a joke.

He’s 11 months younger than Nadal. Hardly a massive difference.

 

[The Fedfather]

What a laughable thread. Djokovic competition in the 2nd weeks of the last 4 slams he won:

wimbledon21
QF Fucsovics
SF Shapovalov
F Berrettini

wimbledon22
QF Sinner
SF Norrie
F Kyrgios

Australian Open23
QF Rublev
SF Paul
F Tsitsipas

Roland Garros23
QF Khachanov
SF Alcaraz
F Ruud

This is so ridiculous that words can't describe how stupid it is to compare his version who was beating players written above to his version in his 20's.
36 year old Nadal was literally beating the same guys too (and beating Djokovic himself also at RG), nobody sane would say that Nadal last year was even close to his prime.

By that logic 35 year old Djokovic would demolish Nadal at 2013 Roland Garros since his inferior younger version almost won that SF. It is insane.

It's not really the names of players in the draw, but how they performed in those matches. Without being even close to ATGs, there are still players on the tour who can show up and deliver. Sinner and Kyrgios, for example, had the ability but choked. Alcaraz had the ability but cramped. Ruud - the guy can bring the heat on clay, but his best is just not found in Slam finals.

That's gotta be the most frustrating part of watching this field. It's not that the top player are helpless on the court in principle. They can play like the elite players they are, and it's the sheer inconsistency and mental flailing at the first sign of pressure that's beyond frustrating. It robs tennis of many exciting and tense matches, that's for sure. What happens is that with every bad loss they become even less confident. You could see the snowball effect in action with Tsitsipas who had 0 belief in that AO final after however many losses he suffered against Djokovic.

 

[DogInSpace]

He’s 11 months younger than Nadal. Hardly a massive difference.

So 2023 is what 2022 was for Nadal.

If Djokovic is fit, healthy and demolishing the field in 2024 then he will prove that he outlasted Nadal.

 

[Silverbullet96]

I really wonder what made Federer say that. Even if you remove all of his losses to Djokovic in 2015, his winning % was still lower in 2015 compared to 2004-06.

Something that's also weird is that here he says his FH is as good as ever, but then a few years later he said how the new racket has weakened his FH. It's proof (if we don't have enough from the other ridiculous things that Tennis legends say sometimes) that we shouldn't take these words as gospel just because Federer says them.

 

[Matrix968]

It's actually insane how often that quote has been posted on here

Give 'em some time bro, they'll accept... It's party time, let's enjoy it

 

[Poisoned Slice]

 

[SonnyT]

All that said...

I still think a fed from 04-07 beats this djoker more often than not.

Fedfans never discuss mental toughness when talking about his match up with Djokovic! May I interrupt you and say that's one item that Djokovic burns more brightly than his rivals.

 

[RS]

It's actually insane how often that quote has been posted on here

Relative level vs absolute

 

[Silverbullet96]

Fedfans never discuss mental toughness when talking about his match up with Djokovic! May I interrupt you and say that's one item that Djokovic burns more brightly than his rivals.

I think Rafa is mentally tougher than Djokovic.

 

[The Fedfather]

I really wonder what made Federer say that. Even if you remove all of his losses to Djokovic in 2015, his winning % was still lower in 2015 compared to 2004-06.

Something that's also weird is that here he says his FH is as good as ever, but then a few years later he said how the new racket has weakened his FH. It's proof (if we don't have enough from the other ridiculous things that Tennis legends say sometimes) that we shouldn't take these words as gospel just because Federer says them.

Roger doesn't like admitting/showing vulnerability. What do we think stands behind his principle of not retiring from matches? Because it's one thing being respectful toward the opponent, but another when Federer would play while very clearly being hindered but bulldoze on trying not to show any discomfort. He is very tough in that sense.

 

[SonnyT]

What a laughable thread. Djokovic competition in the 2nd weeks of the last 4 slams he won:

wimbledon21
QF Fucsovics
SF Shapovalov
F Berrettini

Djokovic did more in his first 5 Wimbledons than Federer in his 8 titles. And he could only defeat those across the net.

 

[SonnyT]

I think Rafa is mentally tougher than Djokovic.

Not! Djokovic has much better record in five setters, and much better record in tiebreaks. Two of the standards of clutch measurement.

In personal terms, Djoko leads 2-1 in 5 setters.

 

[DogInSpace]

Djokovic did more in his first 5 Wimbledons than Federer in his 8 titles. And he could only defeat those across the net.

Can you even comprehend the post you are replying to? Or stay on topic? We are not discussing overall Djokovic career here. We are comparing his 34-36 year old self to him in his 20's. Or are you making an argument that he was much better in the past because

Djokovic did more in his first 5 Wimbledons

 

[Silverbullet96]

Not! Djokovic has much better record in five setters, and much better record in tiebreaks. Two of the standards of clutch measurement.

In personal terms, Djoko leads 2-1 in 5 setters.

I wouldn't say so. Nishikori had a great record in deciding sets at one point, but I'm sure no one will call him particularly mentally strong.
You can also counter-argue those stats, saying that Djokovic lets matches get to a TB or a 5th set that he shouldn't have let in the 1st place.

 

[SonnyT]

I wouldn't say so. Nishikori had a great record in deciding sets at one point, but I'm sure no one will call him particularly mentally strong.
You can also counter-argue those stats, saying that Djokovic lets matches get to a TB or a 5th set that he shouldn't have let in the 1st place.

Nishikori is a special case, because he often let inferior opponents drag him into five setters. And wouldn't enough gas for QFs and SFs.

But 5 setters are common measurement of clutchness. In personal terms, Djokovic outlasted Nadal in '11 UO, '12 AO and '18 W.

Or Djokovic emerged as winner of '11 and '12 UO and '18 W against Federer. Nadal never saved match points against Federer.

 

[Milanez82]

Nishikori is a special case, because he often let inferior opponents drag him into five setters. And wouldn't enough gas for QFs and SFs.

But 5 setters are common measurement of clutchness. In personal terms, Djokovic outlasted Nadal in '11 UO, '12 AO and '18 W.

RG21 too. That dropshot in 3rd set was uber clutch.

 

[Tennfan123]

Djokovic is only 11 months younger than Nadal indeed.
Which begs the question - where was he on the champion's table from 2006-2010? We only saw him a couple of times. Nadal had completed the Golden slam by then.

 

[jm1980]

Nah, Verdasco and Davydenko are right, not Fed. They've stated many times already this is the weakest era of all time

Two of the biggest choke artists tennis has ever seen, lmao

 

[initialize]

Two of the biggest choke artists tennis has ever seen, lmao

... until the Career Inflation Era came along. Now they might as well be ATGs LOL

 

[DogInSpace]

... until the Career Inflation Era came along. Now they might as well be ATGs LOL

Exactly. I think that peak Verdasco or Davydenko from the days he was winning WTF would win a slam against this draw:

QF Rublev
SF Paul
F Tsitsipas

easily

 

[initialize]

Exactly. I think that peak Verdasco or Davydenko from the days he was winning WTF would win a slam against this draw:

QF Rublev
SF Paul
F Tsitsipas

easily

Yep 100%. Peak versions of either would wipe the current field clean

 

[duaneeo]

It's a good thing Djokovic is playing better now than he played 10 years ago. His peak grass tennis is needed to beat the formidable competition he's faced at Wimbledon during the 2020s:

Draper, Anderson, Kudla, Garin, Fucsovics, Shapovalov, Berrettini
Kwon, Kokkinakis, Kecmanovic, Rijthoven, Sinner, Norrie, Kyrgios
Cachin, Thompson, Wawrinka

 

[Sampras-Bruguera 1993]

As always Federer is wrong. (Or just being political with canned PR responses ) probably the latter. . What else is new. Just like "Djokovic dominating 40 slams in a row at 40 years old is good for the game"

No 36 year old is going to better than their 24-26 year old selves. Its foolish to even think that.. This Djokovic would win maybe 5 games total against his 24 year old self. Anyone that thinks otherwise is delusional

 

[DogInSpace]

It's a good thing Djokovic is playing better now than he played 10 years ago. His peak grass tennis is needed to beat the formidable competition he's faced at Wimbledon during the 2020s:

Draper, Anderson, Kudla, Garin, Fucsovics, Shapovalov, Berrettini
Kwon, Kokkinakis, Kecmanovic, Rijthoven, Sinner, Norrie, Kyrgios
Cachin, Thompson, Wawrinka

Lucky for Novak that he was born earlier. His 25 year old self would get spanked by those quality players. Thank god that he had all those years to get better, be more experienced so he can stand a chance against them now.

 

[Backspin1183]

This is important.

“I think I'm a better player now than when I was at 24 because I've practised for another 10 years and I've got 10 years more experience,” Federer said. “Maybe I don't have the confidence level that I had at 24 when I was winning 40 matches in a row, but I feel like I hit a bigger serve, my backhand is better, my forehand is still as good as it's ever been, I volley better than I have in the past. I think I've had to adapt to a new generation of players again.”

What! Roger Federer Says He’s Better Now Than He Was 10 Years Ago!

Is Roger Federer better now than when he was 24.

www.tennis-x.com

He's at his best right now. I don't think he's lost a match since that Wimbledon loss to Hurkacz in 2021. Unbeaten for 2 years now.

 

[Holmes]

It's actually insane how often that quote has been posted on here

Truth always has a way of surfacing no matter how hard some try to stuff it down.

 

[Holmes]

I mean obviously, Federer was just a lying, self-glorifying clown in denial of his ascendant rivals.
Or at least this is what you get called a troll for saying in any context but that of disputing his verbatim assessment of his level. For some reason when you call that into question you rise to the level of a forum hero.

 

[brewcrew]

It’s going to be pretty cool when AI gets to the point we can watch Feds and Djokers of different eras play themselves.

 

[DogInSpace]

I mean obviously, Federer was just a lying, self-glorifying clown in denial of his decline in the face of his ascendant rivals.
Or at least this is what you get called a troll for saying in any context but that of disputing his verbatim assessment of his level. For some reason when you call that into question you rise to the level of a forum hero.

No, he could just be wrong. It is really that simple you don't have to ridicule it to make a point.

What is interesting is if you think that Djokovic in his mid 30's is better than he was in his 20's then naturally by this logic nowadays he would be better against prime Nadal at RG than he was back then since he supposedly improved so much. He could even won against 27 year old Nadal on Chatrier now since his younger inferior self was so close to winning it.

On the other hand we have Nadal himself who said that he was much better player when he was younger. Yet his current version won against supposedly PEAK Djokovic in 4 sets last year. Something doesn't add up here. Maybe Nadal is more realistic and the others are more delusional?

 

[Holmes]

No, he could just be wrong. It is really that simple you don't have to ridicule it to make a point.

What is interesting is if you think that Djokovic in his mid 30's is better than he was in his 20's then naturally by this logic nowadays he would be better against prime Nadal at RG than he was back then since he supposedly improved so much. He could even won against 27 year old Nadal on Chatrier now since his younger inferior self was so close to winning it.

On the other hand we have Nadal himself who said that he was much better player when he was younger. Yet his current version won against supposedly PEAK Djokovic in 4 sets last year. Something doesn't add up here. Maybe Nadal is more realistic and the others are more delusional?

Or maybe the principle is simply that levels are relative to each player, and that the player in question is the best authority for determining their level? In other words, the fact that Federer improved in his 30s doesn't mean that improvement into your 30s is a given for everyone else, or vice versa.

 

[Third Serve]

It’s difficult to overstate the damage that quote has dealt to intelligent tennis discussion on these boards (or at least the small fraction of intelligent discussion that existed here before then).

Is it completely meaningless? Probably not, there’s always some value to be found in quotes like these. But even the players themselves have their own biases, especially players performing in the heat of the moment. In my opinion, you would probably get a more accurate assessment from Fed if you asked this question today, now that Fed’s completely separated from the context of 2015 and has had ample time to look back on things. He said the same thing about his 2013 season, if I recall correctly.

He was asked a very similar question regarding 2017 Fed vs. 2006 Fed back in 2021(?), years after both seasons had concluded. He picked 2006. Of course, you could probably find reasons to dispute the veracity of even that quote, and that’s good. It shows you’re considering more sources of information rather than blindly standing by this shaky one.