Djokovic should be subject to disciplinary action

Bobby Jr

Bobby Jr

G.O.A.T.
I'm going to go further with the Adria Tour covid-19 happenings and suggest Djokovic should be subjected to Tour disciplinary action on with integrity and ethics grounds.

As both an event organiser and as a player's representative he has a duty of care to operate responsibly and consider the welfare of the audience, staff, volunteers and the players themselves. Whatever efforts he/they went to fell well short of even the most casual health advice from virtually any government or sporting body.

This may be a far more serious failing than people currently seem to be seeing it as. Elderly relatives or people with compromised immune systems have been reliably put at unreasonable additional health risk because of the event being held without any genuine effort to avoid it causing a new cluster of infections - which is appears to now have done. Djokovic should be embarrassed about this event - especially given he's such a role model. And the tennis bodies (ATP, ITF) should not let him get a free pass for how irresponsibly the event was run, if even on the optics of having a player's party and letting fans come on the court, sit side-by-side in the stands.
 
It was a super dumb event but the stupidity extends to everyone who showed up. Djokovic didn’t force a single person to come.

That said, he was arrogant and contributed to the current crisis as much as anyone. He should resign from the ATP council and be subject to some type of fine.

But if the ATP isn’t going to suspend Kyrgios for his clown show and robbing people of competition they paid for then I can’t see how Djokovic can be suspended here
 
I agree :)

tenor.gif
 
vex said:
It was a super dumb event but the stupidity extends to everyone who showed up. Djokovic didn’t force a single person to come.
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The organiser of events has a basic duty of care to adhere to the minimum safety requirements of that country's government health advisors. And then they have a further duty of care (health and basic ethics) to protect both locals from overseas visitors who may be importing the disease, and for overseas visitors (talent) who will be leaving shortly afterwards and potentially taking the disease with them.

Forcing people to attend isn't even a consideration - a duty of care exists regardless, for the safety of fans, staff, volunteers and talent.
 
Bobby Jr said:
The organiser of events has a basic duty of care to adhere to the minimum safety requirements of that country's government health advisors. And then they have a further duty of care (health and basic ethics) to protect both locals from overseas visitors who may be importing the disease, and for overseas visitors (talent) who will be leaving shortly afterwards and potentially taking the disease with them.

Forcing people to attend isn't even a consideration - a duty of care exists regardless, for the safety of fans, staff, volunteers and talent.
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No offense but this sounds like arm chair Serbian lawyering. Do you have a firm grasp of Serbia’s local “minimum safety requirements” and how Djokovic violated them? I don’t and I’m not going to pretend to. If he broke any law then he should face the consequences, but I haven’t seen that alleged
 
vex said:
No offense but this sounds like arm chair Serbian lawyering. Do you have a firm grasp of Serbia’s local “minimum safety requirements” and how Djokovic violated them? I don’t and I’m not going to pretend to. If he broke any law then he should face the consequences, but I haven’t seen that alleged
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No, he doesn't. He's just joining in with the peanut gallery to bash Djokovic for doing something that was kosher with the local health authorities, that had people voluntarily attend
 
FedFosterWallace said:
It's shockingly irresponsible.

Talk to non-tennis people who are even moderately aware of these guys and the circumstances around the world, and they just shake their heads in bewilderment.
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The pics of them playing basketball in sleeveless jerseys sweating all over each other and shirtless in the club were the worst. The tennis part would have been fine if they hadn't been so careless like with fans out there with no masks practically. Only a couple of old guys I noticed. I'm not sure about punishment though. I do think he should resign from the council or be pushed out at this point. Maybe some sort of fine. I'd like to see how he handles it first. Regardless, it's bad for his image. There will be a long road ahead for him.
 
vex said:
Super duper dumb. There’s no way around it. They (he especially) were so cavalier and arrogant about this thing
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"Dumb" isn't the word I'd use to describe it.

It's astounding hubris, sure... but for the life of me I cannot imagine what is going through the heads of his brain trust.

Nobody pulls off something like this by themselves; what universe are his advisors living in?
 
FedFosterWallace said:
"Dumb" isn't the word I'd use to describe it.

It's astounding hubris, sure... but for the life of me I can not imagine what is going through the heads of his brain trust.

Nobody pulls off something like this by themselves; what universe are his advisors living in?
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I got nothing man. I just enjoy his tennis skills. Preach
 
vex said:
It was a super dumb event but the stupidity extends to everyone who showed up. Djokovic didn’t force a single person to come.

That said, he was arrogant and contributed to the current crisis as much as anyone. He should resign from the ATP council and be subject to some type of fine.

But if the ATP isn’t going to suspend Kyrgios for his clown show and robbing people of competition they paid for then I can’t see how Djokovic can be suspended here
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Kyrgios attracts non-tennis viewers and fans which is why he didn’t get suspended in 2019 even though most of his actions were definitely bad enough to warrant discipline. ATP is smart.
 
He should resign from the ATP Council immediately
plus be forced to legally change his name to ***** ******** for a full year. He should also be placed at the service line and be pelted with Karlovic serves for 25-30 minutes (internationally televised). Also his post-match boob throw and other corny antics banned for 5 years minimum.

That will definitely sort him out.
 
I don't need Serbian-specific arguments. Djokovic held a tennis event which attracted tour pros, and was aired on TV widely and sought to capitalise commercially on the sport. A reasonable expectation for any ethical business activity is created regardless of local norms.
vex said:
No offense but this sounds like arm chair Serbian lawyering. Do you have a firm grasp of Serbia’s local “minimum safety requirements” and how Djokovic violated them? I don’t and I’m not going to pretend to. If he broke any law then he should face the consequences, but I haven’t seen that alleged
Click to expand...
 
The hamster wheel is turning but the hamster is truly dead.

One person missing the obvious cues is bad enough, but for a whole group of people to organise an event like this without at least some injecting some sense to the planning shows Kyrgios was bang-on with his "bonehead" comment.
FedFosterWallace said:
"Dumb" isn't the word I'd use to describe it.

It's astounding hubris, sure... but for the life of me I cannot imagine what is going through the heads of his brain trust.

Nobody pulls off something like this by themselves; what universe are his advisors living in?
Click to expand...
 
FedFosterWallace said:
"Dumb" isn't the word I'd use to describe it.

It's astounding hubris, sure... but for the life of me I cannot imagine what is going through the heads of his brain trust.

Nobody pulls off something like this by themselves; what universe are his advisors living in?
Click to expand...

Was not particularly following this Adria tour. Thought it might be held with no fans or fans separated. But we then find that the stands were packed...

This might have been the first event of any kind since the pandemic with thousands packed in the stands.

All the while the French are planning to play with possibly half empty stands. USO with no fans. all the while Djoker is vigorously campaigning for rrelaxed USO restrictions.

Naieve?... Or was this event intentionally trying to make a statement here?
:unsure:

 
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For those of you wondering how Djokovic (and the others) could possibly be punished...you need to review the ATP Player Code of Conduct. In Section 8.05 A (Player Major Offenses/Procedures), item 2 states:
ATP Player Code of Conduct said:
The favorable reputation of ATP, its tournaments and players is a valuable asset and creates tangible benefits for all ATP members. Accordingly, it is an obligation for ATP players and Related Persons, to refrain from engaging in conduct contrary to the integrity of the game of tennis.
a) ...
b) A player, or related person, that has at any time behaved in a manner severely damaging to the reputation of the sport may be deemed by virtue of such behavior to have engaged in conduct contrary to the integrity of the Game of Tennis and be in violation of this Section.
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One could argue that their behavior (i.e., showing blatant disregard for almost all recommended health guidelines while the tour has been suspended due to a pandemic), could do irreparable harm to the 'ATP Brand' as it tries to resume operations in August. The code does not qualify that a player's questionable behavior must be at a tournament, it is their behavior in public as well. And given the video circulating of them partying at the club, well, it’s not a very good look for any of them.
 
Bobby Jr said:
I don't need Serbian-specific arguments. Djokovic held a tennis event which attracted tour pros, and was aired on TV widely and sought to capitalise commercially on the sport. A reasonable expectation for any ethical business activity is created regardless of local norms.
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That’s just a bunch of hippy garbly-gook sorry. How is any of that going to impact Djokovic?
 
McLovin said:
For those of you wondering how Djokovic (and the others) could possibly be punished...you need to review the ATP Player Code of Conduct. In Section 8.05 A (Player Major Offenses/Procedures), item 2 states:

One could argue that their behavior (i.e., showing blatant disregard for almost all recommended health guidelines while the tour has been suspended due to a pandemic), could do irreparable harm to the 'ATP Brand' as it tries to resume operations in August. The code does not qualify that a player's questionable behavior must be at a tournament, it is their behavior in public as well. And given the video circulating of them partying at the club, well, it’s not a very good look for any of them.
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It was terrible, but no one is going to be using this section against Djokovic
 
It's not, and anyone who has any basic understanding of the ethical obligations of running a business would understand it's not hippy speak.

Rejoin the conversation when you've bothered to be informed about basically anything related to this topic.
vex said:
That’s just a bunch of hippy garbly-gook sorry. How is any of that going to impact Djokovic?
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Bobby Jr said:
It's not, and anyone who has any basic understanding of the ethical obligations of running a business would understand it's not hippy speak.

Rejoin the conversation when you've bothered to be informed about basically anything related to this topic.
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Sorry man ur just spouting nonsense. Nothing u said will have any impact on this situation

@McLovin at least presented a cognizable argument
 
Bobby Jr said:
Oh, I get it. You're ignorant AND you can't be bothered reading.

My reply to your reply was specifically about the ethics of running business activities responsibly. McLovin was talking about how the event might relate to a specific part of the tour Code of Conduct. They're different things, which would be fairly clear to anyone who put more than 5 second's thought into it.
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okie dokey. Carry on in fantasyland
 
Bobby Jr said:
It's not, and anyone who has any basic understanding of the ethical obligations of running a business would understand it's not hippy speak.

Rejoin the conversation when you've bothered to be informed about basically anything related to this topic.
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This is complete baloney and not actionable by any stretch of the imagination

It's like businesses reopening while complying with the bare minimum of local health regulations, whatever those are. In some places, this may mean not much at all.

If it's a complete sh**show then it's up to the customers to avoid the place. As long as they complied with the law, the business has no ethical or moral obligation to enforce or introduce further restrictions. If a bunch of people get infected as a result, that's not on the business but on the willing patrons
 
The more times I see that movie the less dumb they seem compared to the average person I meet.

Then I watch Idiocracy and it hits home that we are on the fast path to that future. :-D
Kevin T said:
Just when I thought Joker wasn’t the biggest wanker on tour...

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As far as getting the USO and RG played, Djoker and these fools might have done the tour a huge favor. They just successfully created the best public service announcement possible on exactly what not to do at every tournament moving forward, pre-vaccine.
 
There is no chance of a fine or temporary ban.
I wouldn't be surprised if someone handed out some street justice in this case.
 
jm1980 said:
It's like businesses reopening while complying with the bare minimum of local health regulations, whatever those are. In some places, this may mean not much at all.
Click to expand...
Not so at all where the business has broader, outside implication and impact. Organisations the world over operate both within their local environment and also to obligations and expectations of other environments when those environments matter in the bigger picture to that event.

Chocolate companies, as one example, can use any ingredients they wish within reason but many now chose to not use palm oil for ethical reasons that have nothing to do with local rules or customer expectations. Similarly, clothing companies pledge adherence to their own lofty ideals which are usually far ahead of current laws by pledging to only deal with suppliers which pay a living wage to staff wherever they may be in the world.

Some of this may be part ethics, part marketing, but they show that organisations without any doubt do not use local regulations, laws or expectations as their ceiling for operation. In fact, the larger the organisation or the more international their operation the more likely they are to operate at levels which exceed the local legal or ethical ones.

jm1980 said:
If it's a complete sh**show then it's up to the customers to avoid the place. As long as they complied with the law, the business has no ethical or moral obligation to enforce or introduce further restrictions. If a bunch of people get infected as a result, that's not on the business but on the willing patrons
Click to expand...
That argument is flawed though. The business centre (i.e. the organisation doing the event) should set a standard such that IF they offer something potential customers shouldn't even have to worry about whether it's safe, ethical or legal - they should be able to trust those things are already sorted. And using Djokovic's name/brand strongly implies they have, which is the whole essence of endorsements/athlete marketing. Putting the onus on people to know and check all this themselves might seem like common sense, but it's not real world thinking. If a restaurant is open you expect they can meet safety standards for food - you don't go and check. If a car is sold you expect it meets some basic safety standard (brakes, steering etc). Only when failings are obvious do you blame the customer for not noticing.

In this instance the local climate for events may have been far less stringent than most places in Europe but it's is the obligation of the organisers to understand and cater for the fact that it would attracts lots of players from other countries who would be serious risk-factors for spreading the virus. In that respect - especially seeing the players party pics - they appear to have failed miserably to act responsibly.
 
Bobby Jr said:
I'm going to go further with the Adria Tour covid-19 happenings and suggest Djokovic should be subjected to Tour disciplinary action on with integrity and ethics grounds.

As both an event organiser and as a player's representative he has a duty of care to operate responsibly and consider the welfare of the audience, staff, volunteers and the players themselves. Whatever efforts he/they went to fell well short of even the most casual health advice from virtually any government or sporting body.

This may be a far more serious failing than people currently seem to be seeing it as. Elderly relatives or people with compromised immune systems have been reliably put at unreasonable additional health risk because of the event being held without any genuine effort to avoid it causing a new cluster of infections - which is appears to now have done. Djokovic should be embarrassed about this event - especially given he's such a role model. And the tennis bodies (ATP, ITF) should not let him get a free pass for how irresponsibly the event was run, if even on the optics of having a player's party and letting fans come on the court, sit side-by-side in the stands.
Click to expand...

Wow!
I used to like most of your posts, but this is total hate posting!

Disciplinary action for what? And by who? He ran an exo event that had nothing to do with ATP or ITF. I never heard of ATP coming forward with any official objections to the event going ahead. Serbian and Croatian governments were fine with it. Attending players came voluntarily and were preising the events and hosts, for huge fun.

Now, if the players wanted to vote him off the Players Council, that's fine - it's democracy. But a disciplinary action? Give me a break.

Sent from my SM-G965W using Tapatalk
 
FedFosterWallace said:
"Dumb" isn't the word I'd use to describe it.

It's astounding hubris, sure... but for the life of me I cannot imagine what is going through the heads of his brain trust.

Nobody pulls off something like this by themselves; what universe are his advisors living in?
Click to expand...

His advisors basically share the same views as the lunatic end of his fanbase - that any criticism comes from jealousy or anti-Serb prejudice. They can't advise him properly because they don't see the world in a rational way. Look at his father! It isn't Nole's fault what his father says but I suspect the mentality is shared by others around him.

If Nole had admitted to an error of judgement right away and just apologised a lot of this fuss would have calmed down immediately. And ironically most of the journalists and the lower ranked players who are being particularly vocal are partly doing so not because they hate Novak but because they've been attacked by his trolls.

https://twitter.com/Noahrubin33/status/1274877238836592642
 
They are trying to get the tour back underway on the basis that they can manage the pandemic, and along comes Djokovic who stages this mismanaged PR disaster for tennis.

There is no legal basis for disciplinary action, but what a prize dick!

BlueB said:
Wow!
I used to like most of your posts, but this is total hate posting!

Disciplinary action for what? And by who? He ran an exo event that had nothing to do with ATP or ITF. I never heard of ATP coming forward with any official objections to the event going ahead. Serbian and Croatian governments were fine with it. Attending players came voluntarily and were preising the events and hosts, for huge fun.

Now, if the players wanted to vote him off the Players Council, that's fine - it's democracy. But a disciplinary action? Give me a break.

Sent from my SM-G965W using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
 
Bobby Jr said:
Fantasyland where average adult-level reading comprehension is the minimum standard required.
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Its funny how two other people called you out for having no substance to your argument in that your mythical corporate ethics (lol) will result in absolutely no reprecussions here. But nah you continue to just name call and then question my intelligence.

"No dig UP you fool!"
 
Bobby Jr said:
I needn't question your intelligence further. You have demonstrated where you sit on the curve by repeated inability to comprehend what was written versus what you think was written. I answered cleared, over a series of replies, the main questions people had about the idea of the tour holding Djokovic's woeful level of duty of care to tennis players and fans to some sort of account.
Click to expand...

Bobby Jr said:
I'm going to go further with the Adria Tour covid-19 happenings and suggest Djokovic should be subjected to Tour disciplinary action on with integrity and ethics grounds.
Click to expand...

And then everyone questioned the basis for the connection between the two concepts and you gave us a bunch of drivel about nebulous "business ethics" which have zero percent chance of factoring into the reprecussions for Djokovic - as multiple people explained to you.
 
Bobby Jr said:
I answered cleared, over a series of replies, the main questions people had about the idea of the tour holding Djokovic's woeful level of duty of care to tennis players and fans to some sort of account.
Click to expand...

And what to make of these thousands of fans jam packed in the stands. No distancing. No masks.

Everybody on the planet has been informed about safe practices countless times.
Do these people not bear personal responsibility for their actions?

Or do we need a Nanny State to force these hapless Dunderheads to practice proper safety measures?

Discuss.
:(

 
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