Djokovic took Alcaraz's soul at the Olympics

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messiahrobins

Legend
Make no mistake about it, Alcaraz will regret that loss for his entire career, even if he gets OG eventually. It was a huge match and the only chance Alcaraz would get to beat the statistical GOAT at the Olympics. He may beat Djokovic many times moving forward, but the reality is as time passes Djokovic obviously will be declining due to age. That Olympic final against a still formidable Novak was a real chance for Alcaraz to absolutely cement himself as a potential future GOAT no questions asked if he goes on to have the career most expect him to given his talent. Now, there will always be the question mark as to who was actually greater out of the two of them irrespective of what Alcaraz does, and i think that realisation may have hit home hard, as does the reality that he didn't take the event seriously enough preparation wise (partying apparently a fair bit) and underestimating Djokovic thinking he could turn up and win.(his comments pre-match were evidence of that)
People can disparage the Olympics all they like, but the players clearly have them as prestigious as any slam if not more so.
What we are seeing now is broken Alcaraz with little appetite to scrap in matches as we saw last night and v Monfils in Cincinatti. I'll call it now, Alcaraz wont win a slam next season. The hang over effect will last a long time unless he has a Toni Nadal type guy come into his team and read him the riot act and make him suffer in training and learn how to scrap for every point like the Big 3 did in their pomp.
The first set last night in particular was shameful by Alcaraz. So many tweener attempts as if it was an exhibition event. His head i think is still on Chatrier!!
Carlos off court is a lovely guy and a credit to the sport, but he definitely needs somebody in his team to say some tough words to him.
 
Mustard said:
It's no different to the 2023 Cincinnati final, or even their 2023 French Open semi final.
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FO 2023 was irrelevant as Alcaraz was so young still so it was a learning experience.
Cincinatti 2023 ive no idea why Alcaraz bothered so much about it tbh. Still baffles me that. The main event was a week away!
 
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Djokovic_is_the_best#1 said:
Alcaraz isn’t as good as the big 3. That’s all really! No shame in it.
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Thats sort of my point to a degree..he has the talent to be better than all 3, but he is wasting that talent as while people say 'oh he is young give him a break' if he truly wants to get the numbers of the Big 3 which he has stated he does, then there is no room for error and missed opportunities through complacency.
 
messiahrobins said:
FO 2023 was irrelevant as Alcaraz was so young still so it was a learning experience.
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It was built up a lot, and a lot of people fancied Alcaraz's chances with him being 20 and Djokovic 36. Instead, it was Alcaraz who cramped. A lot of people said afterwards that Alcaraz wouldn't recover from that, but he beat Djokovic in 5 sets in the 2023 Wimbledon final, after losing the first set 1-6.

messiahrobins said:
Cincinatti 2023 ive no idea why Alcaraz bothered so much about it tbh. Still baffles me that. The main event was a week away!
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Alcaraz still got to the semi final of the 2023 US Open, losing to Medvedev in the 2021 US Open champion vs. 2022 US Open champion clash. That's a hell of a lot better than how he did at this year's US Open.
 
Not everything is about Djokovic...

Just a typical slump, he is physically and mentally drained after having very successful summer. It's normal, especially at such a young age. He is just 21 and already has 4 slams, which is testament of his brilliance.

Since 2022 he had periods when he couldn't sustain high level. I think he will learn how to manage this type of things once he gets older.

Alcaraz does not look like a type of guy who is thinking for months about his bad losses. Wimbledon 2023 when he immediately beat Novak after incredibly disappointing RG 2023 is a testament for that.

Inconsistency is complete normal, even Big Three members experienced that.
 
messiahrobins said:
Thats sort of my point to a degree..he has the talent to be better than all 3, but he is wasting that talent as while people say 'oh he is young give him a break' if he truly wants to get the numbers of the Big 3 which he has stated he does, then there is no room for error and missed opportunities through complacency.
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He isn’t as smart as them and doesn’t play the percentages as well. He has incredible raw talent and awesome A game. However, he doesn’t manage the dips in his performance as well. He turns into an error machine and gets impatient when his game doesn’t work.
 
SpinWizard said:
Not everything is about Djokovic...

Just a typical slump, he is physically and mentally drained after having very successful summer. It's normal, especially at such a young age. He is just 21 and already has 4 slams, which is testament of his brilliance.

Since 2022 he had periods when he couldn't sustain high level. I think he will learn how to manage this type of things once he gets older.

Alcaraz does not look like a type of guy who is thinking for months about his bad losses. Wimbledon 2023 when he immediately beat Novak after incredibly disappointing RG 2023 is a testament for that.

Inconsistency is complete normal, even Big Three members experienced that.
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For me he’s just not as good as the big 3. He isn’t as consistent as them and their era was tougher too. Alcaraz has did well but even in the slams he won he’s carried a bit of luck to win them. He deserved them but he’s far from dominant. He clearly has a weakness on hard courts and he’s still not fully dominant on clay or grass either.
 
Mustard said:
It was built up a lot, and a lot of people fancied Alcaraz's chances with him being 20 and Djokovic 36. Instead, it was Alcaraz who cramped. A lot of people said afterwards that Alcaraz wouldn't recover from that, but he beat Djokovic in 5 sets in the 2023 Wimbledon final, after losing the first set 1-6.


Alcaraz still got to the semi final of the 2023 US Open, losing to Medvedev in the 2021 US Open champion vs. 2022 US Open champion clash. That's a hell of a lot better than how he did at this year's US Open.
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FO 2023 i had no worries about as knew he could put that behind him.
USO 2023 v Medvedev is exhibit A of my constant allegations of Carlitos being arrogant and taking liberties. That 1st set v medvedev he was clowning around on big points. The worry for me is he has not learnt as last night he was at it again in the 1st set.
 
Djokovic_is_the_best#1 said:
For me he’s just not as good as the big 3. He isn’t as consistent as them and their era was tougher too. Alcaraz has did well but even in the slams he won he’s carried a bit of luck to win them. He deserved them but he’s far from dominant. He clearly has a weakness on hard courts and he’s still not fully dominant on clay or grass either.
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Good post that if we add context about level of competition.
 
Djokovic_is_the_best#1 said:
He isn’t as smart as them and doesn’t play the percentages as well. He has incredible raw talent and awesome A game. However, he doesn’t manage the dips in his performance as well. He turns into an error machine and gets impatient when his game doesn’t work.
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Exactly, and a sign of a big champion is winning matches when you aren't playing well. Alcaraz doesn't win as many matches when he isn't playing well.
 
For all the good natured, and not so good natured, trolling between the Big 3 fanbases those three are on a level by themselves. They can only be compared to each other. Alcaraz so far has not shown he’s in that same category. No shame, (at least) 4 slams and YE1 be the season he turned 21 is a huge accomplishment. And he has plenty of time to win more.
 
Djokovic_is_the_best#1 said:
For me he’s just not as good as the big 3. He isn’t as consistent as them and their era was tougher too. Alcaraz has did well but even in the slams he won he’s carried a bit of luck to win them. He deserved them but he’s far from dominant. He clearly has a weakness on hard courts and he’s still not fully dominant on clay or grass either.
Click to expand...
Grass is his best surface, in my opinion. It rewards his aggressive and instinctive play the most.
 
Mustard said:
Exactly, and a sign of a big champion is winning matches when you aren't playing well. Alcaraz doesn't win as many matches when he isn't playing well.
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Totally spot on. This is where Nadalovic excelled a lot. Fed was also great in this department. It not always about flashy winners or winning when everything flowing. He needs to learn to win ugly more or change things when his A game isn’t on.
 
messiahrobins said:
Make no mistake about it, Alcaraz will regret that loss for his entire career, even if he gets OG eventually. It was a huge match and the only chance Alcaraz would get to beat the statistical GOAT at the Olympics. He may beat Djokovic many times moving forward, but the reality is as time passes Djokovic obviously will be declining due to age. That Olympic final against a still formidable Novak was a real chance for Alcaraz to absolutely cement himself as a potential future GOAT no questions asked if he goes on to have the career most expect him to given his talent. Now, there will always be the question mark as to who was actually greater out of the two of them irrespective of what Alcaraz does, and i think that realisation may have hit home hard, as does the reality that he didn't take the event seriously enough preparation wise (partying apparently a fair bit) and underestimating Djokovic thinking he could turn up and win.(his comments pre-match were evidence of that)
People can disparage the Olympics all they like, but the players clearly have them as prestigious as any slam if not more so.
What we are seeing now is broken Alcaraz with little appetite to scrap in matches as we saw last night and v Monfils in Cincinatti. I'll call it now, Alcaraz wont win a slam next season. The hang over effect will last a long time unless he has a Toni Nadal type guy come into his team and read him the riot act and make him suffer in training and learn how to scrap for every point like the Big 3 did in their pomp.
The first set last night in particular was shameful by Alcaraz. So many tweener attempts as if it was an exhibition event. His head i think is still on Chatrier!!
Carlos off court is a lovely guy and a credit to the sport, but he definitely needs somebody in his team to say some tough words to him.
Click to expand...

Terrible post as per usual. Carlitos has struggled off and on with his game all year. It was for sure a painful loss but there wasn’t a “soul taking.”
 
GabeT said:
For all the good natured, and not so good natured, trolling between the Big 3 fanbases those three are on a level by themselves. They can only be compared to each other. Alcaraz so far has not shown he’s in that same category. No shame, (at least) 4 slams and YE1 be the season he turned 21 is a huge accomplishment. And he has plenty of time to win more.
Click to expand...
Great post. The sheer will to die on court the Big 3 had for such a long period of time even when playing crap we will never see again. That also meant they no doubt trained harder than everyone else as well.
Djokovic has won literally everything and yet here he is NY looking more hungry than anyone else in the event. Truly awe inspiring and banter aside pleasurable to see and soak up.
 
ghostofMecir said:
Terrible post as per usual. Carlitos has struggled off and on with his game all year. It was for sure a painful loss but there wasn’t a “soul taking.”
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I think it more he’s not as unstoppable as maybe some people think. The era has been kind to him and he’s still making hard work of his wins and still has a lot to improve on.
 
This soul taking stuff is hyperbole..ppl said the same thing after Cincy last year when he cried etc. Strong 2024 by all means and outpacing the Big 3. No one knows how the future will unfold of course, but if he can remain injury free he will legit break some serious records. He is that talented with great speed and creativity as well. Managing his schedule, physical abilities and tactics especially when his C game is needed is missing in his armor - but he is 21 and will learn pretty quickly, I have no doubt. Speaking of the other hyperbole, the Raz fanatics who are no more smarter than the Big 3 fanatics will say their guy can moonwalk on water, so some losses like today will be good humble pie.
 
messiahrobins said:
Make no mistake about it, Alcaraz will regret that loss for his entire career, even if he gets OG eventually.[...] a real chance for Alcaraz to absolutely cement himself as a potential future GOAT no questions asked if he goes on to have the career most expect him to given his talent. Now, there will always be the question mark as to who was actually greater out of the two of them irrespective of what Alcaraz does, and i think that realisation may have hit home hard
Click to expand...
Uh, no. Only a few tennis fans who are endlessly obsessed with records will even remember that match.

Alcaraz himself has probably already forgotten about the match
 
SpinWizard said:
Of course. Especially that it was BO3 final. BO5 Olympics were so much better and more prestige in general.
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Yes. In 2012, people almost remember the Olympic final (at Wimbledon) as much as the Wimbledon final, probably because Murray won the Olympics against the same opponent who beat him in the Wimbledon final.
 
Alcaraz got embarrassed at the last 2 hard court slams from impatient hitting and being unable to lock things down when he needed to. He's been a mess on the surface for over a year now.

Djokovic didn't do anything to him. At one point playing Djokovic was so much for Alcaraz that he seized up on court and had uncontrollable cramping from the stress. That caused zero long term damage, as he rebounded to outclutch Djokovic in a slam final less than a month later. That Olympic final is not why he lost last night.
 
Djokovic_is_the_best#1 said:
He isn’t as smart as them and doesn’t play the percentages as well. He has incredible raw talent and awesome A game. However, he doesn’t manage the dips in his performance as well. He turns into an error machine and gets impatient when his game doesn’t work.
Click to expand...
Very well said. His highs are high and unlike Nadal and Djokovic, he gets impatient too quickly when things don't go his way.
 
GabeT said:
For all the good natured, and not so good natured, trolling between the Big 3 fanbases those three are on a level by themselves. They can only be compared to each other. Alcaraz so far has not shown he’s in that same category. No shame, (at least) 4 slams and YE1 be the season he turned 21 is a huge accomplishment. And he has plenty of time to win more.
Click to expand...

Heh, heh, like your distinction between good natured trolling / not so good natured trolling ( and that there is a choice!). Spot on observations regarding Carlitos. Huge accomplishments and if he stays fit, stays committed - could add to his achievements.

pirhaksar said:
This soul taking stuff is hyperbole..ppl said the same thing after Cincy last year when he cried etc. Strong 2024 by all means and outpacing the Big 3. No one knows how the future will unfold of course, but if he can remain injury free he will legit break some serious records. He is that talented with great speed and creativity as well. Managing his schedule, physical abilities and tactics especially when his C game is needed is missing in his armor - but he is 21 and will learn pretty quickly, I have no doubt. Speaking of the other hyperbole, the Raz fanatics who are no more smarter than the Big 3 fanatics will say their guy can moonwalk on water, so some losses like today will be good humble pie.
Click to expand...

Agree that. Fascinating how some people tout their views as fact - for / against a player, often by ignoring the facts. Carlitos is developing as a young person / player and adding to his armoury should be a priority, which he recognises. Looking forward to seeing how Caritos reviews / develops his game


am1899 said:
..........Has nothing to do with Djokovic.

Alcaraz is still very young. This is just part of his journey and learning experience.
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Yah man. Been a great journey so far, promises more success, all else being equal. Love his game when he can play it.
 
Remember how Federrer was bad when he has match up with Benneteau at Wimbledon R2.
With horrible back pain occurred during the match, he almost couldn’t move, but finally overcome that thing in the match and win, and grabs his another wimbledon title. This is how goat candidate works.
Alcaraz, who still prays for his opponent’s free point rather than trying to find own alternate weapon, doesn’t have right to be goat candidate yet. Although he is already great player of tennis history, but not goat candidate yet.
 
I'm a scientist. Trust me bro when I say everyone ages equally, and I know for a scientific fact what primes and post-primes are.

This pre-peak Alcaraz thrashing Djokovic in Wimbledon makes him better than post-peak Djokovic who was held by the sack by older Rog.

Similarly, Alcaraz who can beat Novak outside clay is already clear of Nadal who couldn't post-2013 against Novak.

Thus none of you know jacksht and any of us can sound utterly confident with our assertions because none of it is a scientific discourse.
 
messiahrobins said:
Make no mistake about it, Alcaraz will regret that loss for his entire career, even if he gets OG eventually. It was a huge match and the only chance Alcaraz would get to beat the statistical GOAT at the Olympics. He may beat Djokovic many times moving forward, but the reality is as time passes Djokovic obviously will be declining due to age. That Olympic final against a still formidable Novak was a real chance for Alcaraz to absolutely cement himself as a potential future GOAT no questions asked if he goes on to have the career most expect him to given his talent. Now, there will always be the question mark as to who was actually greater out of the two of them irrespective of what Alcaraz does, and i think that realisation may have hit home hard, as does the reality that he didn't take the event seriously enough preparation wise (partying apparently a fair bit) and underestimating Djokovic thinking he could turn up and win.(his comments pre-match were evidence of that)
People can disparage the Olympics all they like, but the players clearly have them as prestigious as any slam if not more so.
What we are seeing now is broken Alcaraz with little appetite to scrap in matches as we saw last night and v Monfils in Cincinatti. I'll call it now, Alcaraz wont win a slam next season. The hang over effect will last a long time unless he has a Toni Nadal type guy come into his team and read him the riot act and make him suffer in training and learn how to scrap for every point like the Big 3 did in their pomp.
The first set last night in particular was shameful by Alcaraz. So many tweener attempts as if it was an exhibition event. His head i think is still on Chatrier!!
Carlos off court is a lovely guy and a credit to the sport, but he definitely needs somebody in his team to say some tough words to him.
Click to expand...
this is true he did the same to him at cincy last year and did nothing rest of the year. also he only cries if he loses to Nole
 
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