Do you think “use your core” is a good mental cue/tip to give players?

[HunterST]

We all know every good player uses core rotation to give power to their shots. This isn’t a discussion about that.

My question is if it would be wise to tell players that they should feel their strokes as a core driven movement. That is, feeling like their strokes are intimidated by rotation of the core.

Obviously this could help people who aren’t using the kinetic chain, but I don’t really think top players feel their shots are cited driven. I think the rotation of the core arises naturally.

What do you think? In general, is this a good or bad mental cue? Do you feel like your shots are driven by the core?

 

[S&V-not_dead_yet]

We all know every good player uses core rotation to give power to their shots. This isn’t a discussion about that.

My question is if it would be wise to tell players that they should feel their strokes as a core driven movement. That is, feeling like their strokes are intimidated by rotation of the core.

Obviously this could help people who aren’t using the kinetic chain, but I don’t really think top players feel their shots are cited driven. I think the rotation of the core arises naturally.

What do you think? In general, is this a good or bad mental cue? Do you feel like your shots are driven by the core?

Personally, I never think "use my core" when about to hit a shot. I'm not sure what I'd do if someone gave me instruction like that. "How do I 'use my core'," I'd ask. My crude interpretation would be to tighten my core muscles but there must be more to it than that. Then I'd get bogged down in the minutiae of muscles & bio-mechanics.

It's like racquet lag: one should not focus on achieving racquet lag but instead on solid swing mechanics, which will produce racquet lag as a consequence.

 

[Dragy]

Your question is valid. Feel is very subjective thing and varies from person to person. In practice, core turn might feel like a very moderate effort. More of “I turn my core, and a powerful drive happens” than “I power the drive with core turn”.
Another thing to consider is that best techniques uses core rotation stop before the contact, so if someone misinterprets the concept and rotates the core dragging the arm through the contact, it is a flawed techniques.
On the other hand, if player’s natural contact is good with chest facing the net, just making him prepare with full unit turn will likely, after some tries and practice, will make him use core turn - there’s just no other way to get there.
So to some up, as always, a coach should look at particular student and try to instruct him/her into the correct technique from particular current state.

 

[ByeByePoly]

We all know every good player uses core rotation to give power to their shots. This isn’t a discussion about that.

My question is if it would be wise to tell players that they should feel their strokes as a core driven movement. That is, feeling like their strokes are intimidated by rotation of the core.

Obviously this could help people who aren’t using the kinetic chain, but I don’t really think top players feel their shots are cited driven. I think the rotation of the core arises naturally.

What do you think? In general, is this a good or bad mental cue? Do you feel like your shots are driven by the core?

Here is a “use your core” adjacent response using my 2hbh learning curve. At 3 years, I am in pretty good shape on early initial unit turn (not late). But what I realized is I hit too many 2hbh (including ros) without max-ish unit turn. I hit decent 2hbh with ... say 2/3 unit turn, but every time I remember to turn max, it’s one of those AH HA!!! reminders. Effortless shots come from full unit turn ... not so much with 2/3.

Like your question implies ... it’s one thing to know what we need to do ... it’s another to narrow that to useful swing thoughts. In this example ... the one swing thought that actually helps is the habit of flashing the back of my dom shoulder at the bounce on my side. This is better than a generic thought “rotate max” because it also marries my timing at the appropriate time (my 2hbh does not work if I rotate max early and hold it).

I “thought” this is “use your core” adjacent because I am of the opinion if a player has good stance, full unit turn (hips past feet, shoulders past hips) ... the uncoiling mostly takes care of itself.

Edit: For me, a swing thought has to be pretty specific for it to take. Thinking “watch the ball” hasn’t worked in 40+ years. But recent 1) see bounce on my side ... and 2) see ball HD when I start forward swing works.

Flashing the back of my dom shoulder on 2hbh puts me in a more consistent full turn ... breaks 2/3 turn habit. I even found the flash shoulder at bounce helpful for my fh unit turn ... but aimed at bounce, no back ... not Djokovic.

 

[Chas Tennis]

We all know every good player uses core rotation to give power to their shots. This isn’t a discussion about that.

My question is if it would be wise to tell players that they should feel their strokes as a core driven movement. That is, feeling like their strokes are intimidated by rotation of the core.

Obviously this could help people who aren’t using the kinetic chain, but I don’t really think top players feel their shots are cited driven. I think the rotation of the core arises naturally.

What do you think? In general, is this a good or bad mental cue? Do you feel like your shots are driven by the core?

There is a very strong tendency, in tennis and I guess in other sports, to describe complex 3D tennis stroke motions in a few words.

A few words cannot describe complex motions, you need more information. If the student takes what is said as an easy-to-remember instruction and fills in the missing blanks with their own thoughts, as I usually did for decades, they will not have a description of part of the stroke.

As examples of over simplifying the forehand description - and my words have been over simplified here too - do you 'use your core' using the legs turning the pelvis or do you twist the core (spine) with trunk twist? Use both together? Would "use your core" convey that the line between the shoulders goes back farther than the line between the hips on the take back and both lines have different timing on the forward stroke? This is called 'separation' and it involves stretching muscles in the trunk for the stretch shorten cycle. "Unit turn" seems to be even more misleading - ask yourself what the "unit" is. 'Unit turn' sounds like what a barn door would do, not a twist as the trunk does.

Looking at high speed videos, 2D images, is not straight forward and can easily lead to misinterpretations - but high speed videos are the truth. If you look at a high speed video, the way the legs, hips, pelvis, trunk, uppermost body move can be seen, but you have to look seriously.

Note - the "upper body" is defined as the entire body above the waist. For tennis strokes, the "uppermost body" seems to be the significant part that moves for racket head speed and some degree of trunk twisting is also very important as well as the pelvis rotation. 'Uppermost body turn' is often called 'shoulder turn' or 'shoulder rotation' because the shoulders are seen to move. But they move because of the pelvis and trunk twist and probably other sub-motions.

It is all here in this video, and more, and once you see it in this video you will never forget it when you look again at a forehand video. Take 30 minutes.............

Students should be able to feel the few motions discussed in this post and probably others as you asked in the OP. But the word description "use your core" is not enough.

I watched Djokovic forehands for a long time in TV broadcasts. I noticed that when he wanted to hit pace and had a set up ball, his shoulders line and hips line moved independently. I noticed the timing of his large separation. I tried it one night during warm up for block time. By the second hit, it had worked and felt good. I believe it worked so quickly because it used different muscles for the earliest motions to start the forehand than the muscles of my usual forehand - there was no conflicting 'muscle memory' at the start.

Djokovic uses his exceptional flexibility more than most ATP players. I also recall that for one match some years ago he was treated for back pain, cause unknown, and may have retired. Twisting the spine/trunk may be too stressful for many players.

 

[mad dog1]

We all know every good player uses core rotation to give power to their shots. This isn’t a discussion about that.

My question is if it would be wise to tell players that they should feel their strokes as a core driven movement. That is, feeling like their strokes are intimidated by rotation of the core.

Obviously this could help people who aren’t using the kinetic chain, but I don’t really think top players feel their shots are cited driven. I think the rotation of the core arises naturally.

What do you think? In general, is this a good or bad mental cue? Do you feel like your shots are driven by the core?

Instruction needs to be more specific than simply telling them to “use your core”. Telling them to “use their core” is just as useful as telling them to “hit the ball.”

 

[golden chicken]

Coaching instructions really need to be individualized for each student. You are trying to communicate to your player in a way that they can not only understand but execute. You may need to give instructions to correct one specific aspect in multiple ways until you find one that works for your player. Over the course of coaching many players, you may find certain instructions to be more universally understood, but never 100%.

I imagine that "Use your core" with not much more context would not be a universally understood instruction, but for one player who does not grasp the unit turn or shoulder turn idea, it might be the key instruction that allows them to finally correct their stroke.

 

[Enga]

Well some people aren't very "aware" of all their muscles. The forearms and shoulder are pretty easy ones. But when it comes to how the hips can transfer power/energy into a shot, it can be a difficult concept to understand, because most people keep their body totally disjointed. In their mind, legs are for running, not for swinging. They don't see how the legs can be used in a stroke by transferring the power through the "core" and into the swing.

I think it's an easier concept for kids because they have weaker arms, so they can't just swing from the arm as a quick shortcut, they need to use their whole body.

 

[mad dog1]

Rather than telling them to “use the core,” I tell my students to “coil and uncoil” the hips and shoulders and physically show them what coil and uncoil means while hitting a tennis ball with a racquet.

 

[ByeByePoly]

Rather than telling them to “use the core,” I tell my students to “coil and uncoil” the hips and shoulders and physically show them what coil and uncoil means while hitting a tennis ball with a racquet.

You teach tennis? Excellent ... I did not know that.

 

[fuzz nation]

We all know every good player uses core rotation to give power to their shots. This isn’t a discussion about that.

My question is if it would be wise to tell players that they should feel their strokes as a core driven movement. That is, feeling like their strokes are intimidated by rotation of the core.

Obviously this could help people who aren’t using the kinetic chain, but I don’t really think top players feel their shots are cited driven. I think the rotation of the core arises naturally.

What do you think? In general, is this a good or bad mental cue? Do you feel like your shots are driven by the core?

I don't know if there are any tips or swing thoughts that are universally great for each of us. The really sharp teaching pros and coaches I've seen in action seem to always have the most helpful swing thought or tip for that developing player in that moment the help the light bulb between the ears switch on.

The cue of "use your core" could be a big help let's say when somebody remains sideways too much and just swings their racquet arm like a gate while keeping their legs and "coiling action" too quiet. But I'd probably use a cue more along the lines of our pal mad dog1 above where I encourage a coiling and uncoiling action.

That being said, I'd probably want to explain that cue so that the player I'm coaching understands that we're working toward "using the core" more than the smaller muscles in the arm and shoulder. While "use the core" is a good general idea, I think that the idea of "turn the shoulders" away and through is more of a tangible swing thought to actually make it happen.

Sorry if I'm echoing anybody above - I skimmed my way down and quickly threw in my $0.02

 

[user92626]

You teach tennis? Excellent ... I did not know that.

I was surprised too. D@mn standards have really changed. LOL


Back to the OP, I also use mad dog's method... Instead of using confusing jargons, I show people do this and then do that.

 

[Dartagnan64]

Use your core is a silly way. You maybe have 3 neurons in your cortex dedicated to your core. 90% of core activity runs at a subconscious level.

Fun game: take some calipers and place the two points on various body parts measuring the distance between points at which you can discriminate there are two points and not one. On your fingertips it should be a few millimeters. On your trunk, especially your back its likely to be 10 centimeters. Way more cortical neurons dedicated to sensory input from your hands and not your trunk.

So you teach the core to move by tricking your non-hitting hand to wind it up for you. Why do you think we point up to hit overheads and point to the side to hit FH's? To get those shoulders turned.

 

[Curiosity]

We all know every good player uses core rotation to give power to their shots. This isn’t a discussion about that.

My question is if it would be wise to tell players that they should feel their strokes as a core driven movement. That is, feeling like their strokes are intimidated by rotation of the core.

Obviously this could help people who aren’t using the kinetic chain, but I don’t really think top players feel their shots are cited driven. I think the rotation of the core arises naturally.

What do you think? In general, is this a good or bad mental cue? Do you feel like your shots are driven by the core?

There is a simple "drill" you can do to make the point: Have the player put their racquet down. Ask them to pull in their non-hitting elbow to their side. While they're standing with their knees slightly flexed, torso relaxed, and hitting upper arm out a good bit from their side, ask them to rotate their hitting arm backwards just using shoulder/torso rotation. Tell them to then get their hitting arm to swing forward (shoulder completely relaxed) just using shoulder/torso rotation. Back and forward, back and forward, very relaxed. No muscle in the shoulder or arm should be used, except what is required to keep the hitting upper arm out from their side.

That motion is essentially what should happen in a "real" forehand. The hitting upper arm will, on the backswing, go farther than the torso. On the forward swing the hitting upper arm will lag the shoulder. Of course in the swing as further developed some shoulder/back muscles will come into the thing, but the hitting upper arm will still (on a full forehand) be brought forward by the torso... The hitting upper arm is heavy, and the initiation by the torso provides quicker more reliable acceleration of it than shoulder muscle ever could, which is the "why" of the thing. (This last bit, the "why," is textbook. See, e.g., Cross & Lindsey's "Technical Tennis." They don't give the "drill" but do explain the "why.")