Does Djokovic have any chance of beating Medvedev from the baseline?

NADALalot

Hall of Fame
Well he'll need to, because Medvedev is the superior server.
Unless Djokovic can become a net player overnight, because that is how Nadal beat Medvedev at 2019 US Open Final....

2019 Wimbledon Final had 422 points.
Federer came to the net 65 times (won 51).

2019 US Open Final had 341 points.
Nadal came to the net 66 times (won 51).
 

NADALalot

Hall of Fame
Tsitsipas on Medvedev-

"He's a player who has unlocked pretty much everything in the game," Tsitsipas said this time around.

"It's like he's reading the game really well. He has this amazing serve which I would describe close to John Isner's serve. And then he has amazing baseline which makes it extremely difficult. So even if you return the serve, you don't guarantee that you're going to win the point.

"You have to really work hard for it. It's difficult…and I'm sure all the hard work that he has been putting and the hours on the court have benefited a lot. He tricks you. You know, he plays the game really smart. It's really interesting to see that."

 

Beckerserve

Legend
Well he'll need to, because Medvedev is the superior server.
Unless Djokovic can become a net player overnight, because that is how Nadal beat Medvedev at 2019 US Open Final....

2019 Wimbledon Final had 422 points.
Federer came to the net 65 times (won 51).

2019 US Open Final had 341 points.
Nadal came to the net 66 times (won 51).
No. Medvedev will thrash him if it is a slug fest. Djokovic has to keep rallies short. Tsitsipas made the fatal error of trying to engage in long rallies and by the time the match was effectively over mid way through the 2nd set the stats were 10-1 points won for Medvedev for rallies over 9 shots.
Djokovic has to end points quickly and serve volley a lot. He also must hit winners off 2nd serves.
 

James P

Legend
If Medvedev's serve is on, he's the better server. But he's only had one or two matches this fortnight where he didn't serve poorly, imo. He's bailed out by his superior grinding skills against most players, but that might not be good enough against Djokovic. Guess we'll see...
 

Jonesy

Hall of Fame
Sorry peps, if Djokovic is gonna win is going to be at being the better baseliner, that is his game in case you guys didn't know already. When he is confident there is no one better than him.

Hold his serve with consistency and beat Med serve by making him make mistakes and blast winners when the opportunity arise. There is no secret. All the other tricks are to make his adversary doubt themselves.
 

Beckerserve

Legend
Sorry peps, if Djokovic is gonna win is going to be at being the better baseliner, that is his game in case you guys didn't know already. When he is confident there is no one better than him.

Hold his serve with consistency and beat Med serve by making him make mistakes and blast winners when the opportunity arise. There is no secret. All the other tricks are to make his adversary doubt themselves.
Nadal 10-6 Djokovic best of 5 sets. Nadal clearly better at a war of attrition.
Medvedev 3-1 Djokovic past 2 years.
Djokovic can win. It wont be by grinding. He will need an attacking all court game like the Great Federer.
 

NoleIsBoat

Hall of Fame
Prime Djokovic? Losing sets to Tiafoe Fritz Zverev and Raonic? Are you a Djokovic fan or a burthurt Nadal hater?
I have seen Djokovic many times live. This event is as bad as i have ever seen him. He can of course win. But he needs to go up a few notches.
Remember, Djokovic is carrying an injury. It’s a miracle he’s managed to conjure prime form at times this tournament in his condition.
 

NoleIsBoat

Hall of Fame
Nadal 10-6 Djokovic best of 5 sets. Nadal clearly better at a war of attrition.
Medvedev 3-1 Djokovic past 2 years.
Djokovic can win. It wont be by grinding. He will need an attacking all court game like the Great Federer.
That H2H is based entirely on RG matches vs baby glutenvic who could barely finish matches. Since both peak from 2011 they’re about even.
 

MeatTornado

G.O.A.T.
If Medvedev's serve is on, he's the better server. But he's only had one or two matches this fortnight where he didn't serve poorly, imo. He's bailed out by his superior grinding skills against most players, but that might not be good enough against Djokovic. Guess we'll see...
Idk about better. Bigger, sure. He'll hammer down more aces, but Novak's going to get more first serves in and be more accurate with them.
 
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Beckerserve

Legend
That H2H is based entirely on RG matches vs baby glutenvic who could barely finish matches. Since both peak from 2011 they’re about even.
Djokovic won 3 of his 6 Majors matches v Nadal within 6 months in 2011-2012. So actually for the vast majority of their careers Nadal has utterly owned Djokovic at the Majors. Best of 3 sets it is the other way round.
 

Beckerserve

Legend
Great news. A fully fit Djokovic will destroy medvedev ! :love:
he was injured in the Fritz, Zverev and Raonic matches.
But if he loses the injury flared up again? You do realise you are actually proving what most think about Djokovic? That he has faked his injury.
 

NoleIsBoat

Hall of Fame
Djokovic won 3 of his 6 Majors matches v Nadal within 6 months in 2011-2012. So actually for the vast majority of their careers Nadal has utterly owned Djokovic at the Majors. Best of 3 sets it is the other way round.
Since Djokovic peaked in 2011, Nadal has 1 win at USO and 4 at RG

Djokovic has 2 at AO, 1 at RG, 2 at Wimbledon, 1 at USO. He has defeated Nadal everywhere and utterly dominated the h2h . Nadal racked up plenty of wins over baby Djokovic who had a gluten allergy.
 

Beckerserve

Legend
Since Djokovic peaked in 2011, Nadal has 1 win at USO and 4 at RG

Djokovic has 2 at AO, 1 at RG, 2 at Wimbledon, 1 at USO. He has defeated Nadal everywhere and utterly dominated the h2h . Nadal racked up plenty of wins over baby Djokovic who had a gluten allergy.
Djokovic peaked 2008 onwards bud. Problem was he then had peak Nadal and Federer and was never good enough to topple them. Once they were post peak from 2010 onwards he had success v Federer and limited success v Nadal in 2011 and 2012. 2015 you contradict your own argument. W2018 was indoors and AO 2019 Nadal was not match fit.
So by your own rules Nadal utterly owns Djokovic at the Majors. Not by my rules...by yours.
 

Beckerserve

Legend
You’re joking right? If Djokovic is fit in 17 and 19 that’s another 2 USO titles and 2 easy wins over his HC pigeon. What is it, 15 sets in a row on HCs?:-D
Djokovic cannot handle Nadal at USO as the records show. Less titles losing h2h. You keep losing these debates for one reason. You argue hypotheticals. I rely on statistics.
 

Benben245

Professional
Djokovic’s game these days mimics Lendl’s more than ever. His strokes are less violent more cautious; allowing the small extended leverage of the new frame to do the work for him while avoiding the increased variance on his down the line backhand. Unless he has good margins, he won’t risk the down the line backhand. I miss the razor edge shots corner to corner. I miss the controlled violence of the greatest groundstroke artist of all time. Bring back the old PT113b1.
 

NoleIsBoat

Hall of Fame
Djokovic peaked 2008 onwards bud. Problem was he then had peak Nadal and Federer and was never good enough to topple them. Once they were post peak from 2010 onwards he had success v Federer and limited success v Nadal in 2011 and 2012. 2015 you contradict your own argument. W2018 was indoors and AO 2019 Nadal was not match fit.
So by your own rules Nadal utterly owns Djokovic at the Majors. Not by my rules...by yours.
You’re mistaken bud. Djokovic peak was 2011, that’s a fact.

Djokovic destroyed Nadal since 2011 apart from 1 uso match and RG.
 

NoleIsBoat

Hall of Fame
Djokovic cannot handle Nadal at USO as the records show. Less titles losing h2h. You keep losing these debates for one reason. You argue hypotheticals. I rely on statistics.
Did you see their 2011 match? Djokovic at his best destroys any Nadal on any hard court, sorry to tell you that.

15 sets in a row :whistle: :whistle:
 

GabeT

Legend
Djokovic won 3 of his 6 Majors matches v Nadal within 6 months in 2011-2012. So actually for the vast majority of their careers Nadal has utterly owned Djokovic at the Majors. Best of 3 sets it is the other way round.
I get we all like to troll but can we stop talking of the “Majors’ as if they were one homogeneous unit? They aren’t. Nadal is clearly better at the FO and half of their slam matches where at the FO.

here’s the slam h2h:

FO : Nadal 7-1
Outside FO: Novak 5-3

Imagine if they had met 8 times at the FO instead of just 2.
 

James P

Legend
Idk about better. Bigger, sure. He'll hammer down more aces, but Novak's going to get more first serves in and be more accurate with them.
I guess the difference in my mind is that Medvedev uses his serve to win matches at times, whereas Djokovic uses it to maintain leads he builds. Djokovic is definitely a more precise server, I'll hand him that. But he doesn't usually overwhelm people.
 

Beckerserve

Legend
I get we all like to troll but can we stop talking of the “Majors’ as if they were one homogeneous unit? They aren’t. Nadal is clearly better at the FO and half of their slam matches where at the FO.

here’s the slam h2h:

FO : Nadal 7-1
Outside FO: Novak 5-3

Imagine if they had met 8 times at the FO instead of just 2.
Outside AO it is Nadal 10-4 Djokovic. Imagine if they had played W2018 outdoors in the 100f heat. Would be 11-3.
We can all play the imaginery games. I prefer the statistical analysis. 20-17 10-6.
 

GabeT

Legend
Outside AO it is Nadal 10-4 Djokovic. Imagine if they had played W2018 outdoors in the 100f heat. Would be 11-3.
We can all play the imaginery games. I prefer the statistical analysis. 20-17 10-6.
There is no 10-6. There is, if you want to look at h2h, 29-27. And the difference isn’t greater because they played so much more in clay.
 

Beckerserve

Legend
There is no 10-6. There is, if you want to look at h2h, 29-27. And the difference isn’t greater because they played so much more in clay.
Majors are best of 5 sets. That is why they are majors. 10-6.
Not really interested in Qatar and beijing bud but if they mean alot to you then all good.
 

NoleIsBoat

Hall of Fame
USO is hard court. Not clay.
Djokovic is better at the USO too. Him having 3 and Nadal on 4 is an anomaly and just luck. Djokovic defeated many more ATG and top 10 than Nadal there, very bad luck to be injured in 16,17,19 the a freak accident in 20.

Nadal won his recent 2 USO because the best HC players of the year were both injured. 2017 - Federer. 2019 - Djokovic.Superb vulturing.
 

Beckerserve

Legend
Djokovic is better at the USO too. Him having 3 and Nadal on 4 is an anomaly and just luck. Djokovic defeated many more ATG and top 10 than Nadal there, very bad luck to be injured in 16,17,19 the a freak accident in 20.

Nadal won his recent 2 USO because the best HC players of the year were both injured. 2017 - Federer. 2019 - Djokovic.Superb vulturing.
Lol stay salty. Hypotheticals sadly do not really amount to much.
 

GabeT

Legend
He is the best USO player past 10 years. Djokovic is good at AO. But he is not GOAT HC player. That is Federer. 5 consecutive USOs. Sorry to tell you.
Fed is HC Co Goat, and maybe soon not even that. Novak clearly superior to Nadal in HC (As is Fed, for that matter)
 

NoleIsBoat

Hall of Fame
Lol stay salty. Hypotheticals sadly do not really amount to much.
Not really hypothetical. Djokovic utterly owns Nadal on HC for 7 years now. What is it, 19 sets in a row? o_O

2017 Fed also owned Nadal on HC. 4-0 whitewashing. If he’s fit then he would trash Nadal in 4.

be grateful fate allowed your hero to vulture a couple more USO:whistle:
 

Beckerserve

Legend
Fed is HC Co Goat, and maybe soon not even that. Novak clearly superior to Nadal in HC (As is Fed, for that matter)
No. nadal is better than Djokovic at USO. That is a HC event.Djokovic is better in australian conditions. We are talking Majors here not qatar and beijing. Federer is GOAT on hard courts currently. No question about it. The USO is bigger than the AO. More weight has to attach to it. When Federer was in his prime that was not even a debate.
 
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