Does Federer Actually Play With the RF97?

jackcrawford

Professional
The SW number is very hard to believe when you compare it to:
- his previous racquet specs
- the other players specs
- the way RF is serving
- the way RF is able to simply flick the racquet and create bullet shots. The plow-through.

It smells like conspiracy to me... To sell more RF97A.
It's only hard to believe if you bought into the tinfoilhat crowd nonsense posted by crackpots about SW2, etc. Is it hard to believe he also upped his string tension quite a bit when he changed frames from 90 to 97? Is it also hard to believe he went from 85 to 90 to 97 sq in through the years?
 

sureshs

Bionic Poster
Then you pay attention about what you claim.
From Wilson site:

Pro Staff RF97 Autograph Tennis Racket

Co-designed by Roger Federer, the Pro Staff delivers the pure, classic feel players have come to love but with an all-new uncontaminated design. meticulous in detail and bold in its beauty, the new Pro Staff introduces a whole new dimension of engineered paint finishes and textures with matte black velvet, chrome touches, and laser engraving never before seen in tennis.

About Pro Staff RF97
Roger’s heart and soul lives in the new Pro Staff RF97. Roger worked tirelessly with Wilson designers across the globe to breathe new life into the iconic Pro Staff. Every detail was pored over to create a racket that provides an edge for players bold enough to pick one up and inspires players everywhere to go further than they’ve ever gone before.


I don't see any claim that Roger plays with the same racquet as retail, or similar. All they claim is that Roger helped them design it, the rest are vivid marketing descriptions which say nothing.

Roger may claim he plays with exactly this racquet and that he wanted players to play with his exact specs, but that's what Roger claims. Not Wilson.
I think they did, but even if they didn't, it maybe because of the legal stuff, since customization may be taken to mean that it is a different frame.
 

zalive

Hall of Fame
I think they did, but even if they didn't, it maybe because of the legal stuff, since customization may be taken to mean that it is a different frame.
Of course it's legal stuff.
We'd then need to inspect all they ever claimed as Wilson and see what it was.
And then see if any claim made by Wilson conflicts with him playing, for example, with a different layup within a same mould.
 
Would have been great if the twistweight was also measured and released. Because according to TWU, there is a big difference between the first(red/black) and second(all black) rf97 as well. Would be great to know the twistweight of the real rf97 federer is using.
 
I am natural born skeptic so I have to ask:What is the proof that this is actual racquet that Roger plays matches with?

Sounds like an easy $12350 euros
Well TW is not just some small time operation in this field. To me it seems unlikely and unneeded they would/should run the risk of a shady transaction.
 

zalive

Hall of Fame
Well TW is not just some small time operation in this field. To me it seems unlikely and unneeded they would/should run the risk of a shady transaction.
TW runs an honest business completely for what I can tell.
On the other hand, Wilson, I don't trust them least.
If Wilson delivered 'Roger's' racquets to TW...then you understand. In this case TW simply cannot know for sure are those real, all they can do is trust Wilson.
All this really looks like a small Wilson marketing campaign. And clever ones will understand why Wilson would want to do this.
 
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bkfinch

Semi-Pro
TW runs an honest business completely for what I can tell.
On the other hand, Wilson, I don't trust them least.
If Wilson delivered 'Roger's' racquets to TW...then you understand. In this case TW simply cannot know for sure are those real, all they can do is trust Wilson.
All this really looks like a small Wilson marketing campaign. And clever ones will understand why Wilson would want to do this.
Would you believe it if I told you the MGR/I is >21 with that spec? :p

IDK man this seems pretty legit and it's been added to Greg Raven's website as well.
 

TW Staff

Administrator
TW works with Roger's team on these RF Foundation items directly. Not Wilson.
Yes, just to clear things up, correct -- we work directly with RF's team -- his agent, his father, his manager, etc., not with Wilson or Nike for this specific gear.

I don't want to ruin the fairytale for you guys, but yes, this is an actual racquet used by Roger at several tournaments -- scuffed up by RF, the RF specific butt cap, RF's string setup, and what we are assuming (waiting for confirmation) are RF's stringing instructions as well.

Just as the rest of his autographed gear we offer is straight from RF's player's bag and from his personal wardrobes. And just how all of the Foundation items come with proof of authenticity, so does this racquet.

Let me know if you have any further questions,

Michelle, TW
 

TW Staff

Administrator
TW works with Roger's team on these RF Foundation items directly. Not Wilson.
Yes, just to clear things up, correct -- we work directly with RF's team -- his agent, his father, his manager, etc., not with Wilson or Nike for this specific gear.

I don't want to ruin the fairytale for you guys, but yes, this is an actual racquet used by Roger at several tournaments -- scuffed up by RF, the RF specific butt cap, RF's string setup, and what we are assuming (waiting for confirmation) are RF's stringing instructions as well.

Just as the rest of his autographed gear we offer is straight from RF's player's bag and from his personal wardrobes. And just how all of the Foundation items come with proof of authenticity, so does this racquet.

Let me know if you have any further questions,

Michelle, TW
 

PeterFig

Professional
Yes, just to clear things up, correct -- we work directly with RF's team -- his agent, his father, his manager, etc., not with Wilson or Nike for this specific gear.

I don't want to ruin the fairytale for you guys, but yes, this is an actual racquet used by Roger at several tournaments -- scuffed up by RF, the RF specific butt cap, RF's string setup, and what we are assuming (waiting for confirmation) are RF's stringing instructions as well.

Just as the rest of his autographed gear we offer is straight from RF's player's bag and from his personal wardrobes. And just how all of the Foundation items come with proof of authenticity, so does this racquet.

Let me know if you have any further questions,

Michelle, TW
More importantly Michelle, did you secretly sneak the racquet onto the TW court for a quick hit? :) I promise I won't tell anyone if you did. ;)
 

TW Staff

Administrator
More importantly Michelle, did you secretly sneak the racquet onto the TW court for a quick hit? :) I promise I won't tell anyone if you did. ;)
Tempting, very tempting!

But no...Chris was trying to egg me on to throw a natural gut hybrid into my frames!

Michelle
 

PeterFig

Professional
Tempting, very tempting!

But no...but Chris was trying to get me to throw a natural gut hybrid into my frames!

Michelle
Oh you should do it!!!
That's what I have in my RF97's - Luxilon Gut in mains (56lb) Luxilon Alu Power Feel in crosses (54lb). I'm even RF-geeking out with the powerpads :)

PS. I'm happy you guys posted the specs of Roger's frame on here. Facts are facts :)
 

mr.torrence

Rookie
Love it. So the people that have been hating on the RF97 saying it's too harsh, boardy and just too damn stiff because of what the rating is, and that there's no way RF uses this racquet, are all going to use the whole 'buttery smooth' defense now and say they're incredibly plush and hits like a dream...I also wonder if lead tape enthusiasts are going to be ripping off layers of strips off of their unplayable frames and bump them down to a mere 340 sw too?
 
I cant remember who posted a while back a comment that RF must have lowered his SW- it was after AO iirc. Nice assumption. That said, the RF racquet had people fighting over 2 things imho and now we can address both: MgR/I and if RF's is the retail customized.

As for 1, MgR/I is not 21 but 21.16. Old school depolarized racquet. It may have been 21 at another era, but this proves MgR/I is not/should not be a constant but a useful tool.

As for 2, i used the avg specs of retail RFA97 on the customization and the RF's targeted ones. Definately, you can get there BUT the place to put the lead is close to the throat. From RF's frame there was no visible lead. And since those specs are apart from the averages, then there is some lead, most likely under the grommets ( since RF's frame SW is higher than the retail RFA). But if this is true, then we are talking about different weight distribution between the two frames. And if this is true then in my playbook, the retail is not RF's racquet. If we saw the lead on RF's racquet at the same place the auto tool suggests, then i would say that he is using a customized retail frame. But we dont and therefore i believe he uses a custom racquet.
 
I cant remember who posted a while back a comment that RF must have lowered his SW- it was after AO iirc. Nice assumption. That said, the RF racquet had people fighting over 2 things imho and now we can address both: MgR/I and if RF's is the retail customized.

As for 1, MgR/I is not 21 but 21.16. Old school depolarized racquet. It may have been 21 at another era, but this proves MgR/I is not/should not be a constant but a useful tool.

As for 2, i used the avg specs of retail RFA97 on the customization and the RF's targeted ones. Definately, you can get there BUT the place to put the lead is close to the throat. From RF's frame there was no visible lead. And since those specs are apart from the averages, then there is some lead, most likely under the grommets ( since RF's frame SW is higher than the retail RFA). But if this is true, then we are talking about different weight distribution between the two frames. And if this is true then in my playbook, the retail is not RF's racquet. If we saw the lead on RF's racquet at the same place the auto tool suggests, then i would say that he is using a customized retail frame. But we dont and therefore i believe he uses a custom racquet.
 
I cant remember who posted a while back a comment that RF must have lowered his SW- it was after AO iirc. Nice assumption. That said, the RF racquet had people fighting over 2 things imho and now we can address both: MgR/I and if RF's is the retail customized.

As for 1, MgR/I is not 21 but 21.16. Old school depolarized racquet. It may have been 21 at another era, but this proves MgR/I is not/should not be a constant but a useful tool.

As for 2, i used the avg specs of retail RFA97 on the customization and the RF's targeted ones. Definately, you can get there BUT the place to put the lead is close to the throat. From RF's frame there was no visible lead. And since those specs are apart from the averages, then there is some lead, most likely under the grommets ( since RF's frame SW is higher than the retail RFA). But if this is true, then we are talking about different weight distribution between the two frames. And if this is true then in my playbook, the retail is not RF's racquet. If we saw the lead on RF's racquet at the same place the auto tool suggests, then i would say that he is using a customized retail frame. But we dont and therefore i believe he uses a custom racquet.
 

zalive

Hall of Fame
I cant remember who posted a while back a comment that RF must have lowered his SW- it was after AO iirc. Nice assumption. That said, the RF racquet had people fighting over 2 things imho and now we can address both: MgR/I and if RF's is the retail customized.

As for 1, MgR/I is not 21 but 21.16. Old school depolarized racquet. It may have been 21 at another era, but this proves MgR/I is not/should not be a constant but a useful tool.

As for 2, i used the avg specs of retail RFA97 on the customization and the RF's targeted ones. Definately, you can get there BUT the place to put the lead is close to the throat. From RF's frame there was no visible lead. And since those specs are apart from the averages, then there is some lead, most likely under the grommets ( since RF's frame SW is higher than the retail RFA). But if this is true, then we are talking about different weight distribution between the two frames. And if this is true then in my playbook, the retail is not RF's racquet. If we saw the lead on RF's racquet at the same place the auto tool suggests, then i would say that he is using a customized retail frame. But we dont and therefore i believe he uses a custom racquet.
Fed's racquets have custom handle made by P1, meaning its weight distribution might be different as well, which includes moulded handle, silicone inside the handle and lead (possibly) added to the top of the handle.

The second aspect is, when you receive a large quantity of racquets, retail or pro stock, it's unlikely all the hairpins will be nearly identical, having identical SW. So P1 have a job making those racquets identical. SW will be corrected at 12 o'clock (the easiest place and this was shown on P1 pics as well AFAIK) to become identical. Then you have to make them swing identical as well which is achieved through identical specs, but this is where lead at the top of the handle can serve well because it's impossible to match all three specs coming from even slightly different hairpins (different SW and weight) just by siliconing - you need top of the handle to match specs. Looking from MgR/I angle, once SW is matched through 12 o'clock it will not make the hairpins identical (god knows how the difference is distributed through the hoop), but swing can nevertheless be made the same by using lead at the top of the handle and matching all three specs will be possible.

Eventually Roger's racquets even if they were from retail hairpins because of realistic reasons have to be matched to bit higher SW than average retail (or average provided to P1) because of letting enough room to customize them to identical specs. Provided handle will not be the problem, it goes to garbage, but hairpin's SW is. Anyway racquets have to be picked and minimum variance in SW is desireable with necessary upper SW limit set.

Some of what I've written above is speculation of the customization/matching process, but I think it's quite logical.
 

terminator97

New User
I just picked up a scale and checked my RF97's.. all stock with the following..


1. Grip size 3 / Wilson Gut Main 26kg Alu Rough 24.5kg Cross / Wilson Pro OG/ Wilson Dampener (1g) = 366g

2. Grip size 3 / Wilson Gut Main 26kg Alu Rough 24.5kg Cross / Wilson Pro OG/ Wilson Dampener (1g) = 360g

3. Grip size 2 / Wilson Gut Main 26kg Alu Rough 24.5kg Cross / Wilson Pro OG/ Wilson Dampener (1g) = 363g

4. Grip size 2 / Wilson Gut Main 26kg Alu Rough 24.5kg Cross / Wilson Pro OG/ Wilson Dampener (1g) = 364g

5. Grip size 3 / NXT Power Main 26kg Alu Power 24.5kg Cross / Wilson Pro OG/ Wilson Dampener (1g) = 360g

6. Grip size 3 / NXT Power Main 26kg Alu Power 24.5kg Cross / Wilson Pro OG/ Wilson Dampener (1g) = 359g

7. Grip size 2 / NXT Power Main 26kg Alu Power 24.5kg Cross / Wilson Pro OG/ Wilson Dampener (1g) = 359g

8. Grip size 2 / NXT Power Main 26kg Alu Power 24.5kg Cross / Wilson Pro OG/ Wilson Dampener (1g) = 359g


The gut is heavier than NXT..
And considering the P1 custom grip and leather may add a few grams, it is close enough to retail.
 

Lambsscroll

Hall of Fame
I just picked up a scale and checked my RF97's.. all stock with the following..


1. Grip size 3 / Wilson Gut Main 26kg Alu Rough 24.5kg Cross / Wilson Pro OG/ Wilson Dampener (1g) = 366g

2. Grip size 3 / Wilson Gut Main 26kg Alu Rough 24.5kg Cross / Wilson Pro OG/ Wilson Dampener (1g) = 360g

3. Grip size 2 / Wilson Gut Main 26kg Alu Rough 24.5kg Cross / Wilson Pro OG/ Wilson Dampener (1g) = 363g

4. Grip size 2 / Wilson Gut Main 26kg Alu Rough 24.5kg Cross / Wilson Pro OG/ Wilson Dampener (1g) = 364g

5. Grip size 3 / NXT Power Main 26kg Alu Power 24.5kg Cross / Wilson Pro OG/ Wilson Dampener (1g) = 360g

6. Grip size 3 / NXT Power Main 26kg Alu Power 24.5kg Cross / Wilson Pro OG/ Wilson Dampener (1g) = 359g

7. Grip size 2 / NXT Power Main 26kg Alu Power 24.5kg Cross / Wilson Pro OG/ Wilson Dampener (1g) = 359g

8. Grip size 2 / NXT Power Main 26kg Alu Power 24.5kg Cross / Wilson Pro OG/ Wilson Dampener (1g) = 359g


The gut is heavier than NXT..
And considering the P1 custom grip and leather may add a few grams, it is close enough to retail.

What about string savers?
 

moon shot

Hall of Fame
I have a new P1 leather grip I can weigh if anyone is interested. The P1 leather grips are thinner than Wilson grips.
I would think his buttcap without trap door weighs less too. Most of my loose buttcaps without trap doors are 4-6 grams lighter. Of course that could easily be made up inside the grip.
 
Tempting, very tempting!

But no...but Chris was trying to get me to throw a natural gut hybrid into my frames!

Michelle
It plays great with Champions Choice and the Rogi spec. Mine just kinda found its way there through fiddling (sans power pads or string savers) [emoji471][emoji462][emoji471]. BHBH


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
 

jmacdaununder2

Hall of Fame
I just picked up a scale and checked my RF97's.. all stock with the following..


1. Grip size 3 / Wilson Gut Main 26kg Alu Rough 24.5kg Cross / Wilson Pro OG/ Wilson Dampener (1g) = 366g

2. Grip size 3 / Wilson Gut Main 26kg Alu Rough 24.5kg Cross / Wilson Pro OG/ Wilson Dampener (1g) = 360g

3. Grip size 2 / Wilson Gut Main 26kg Alu Rough 24.5kg Cross / Wilson Pro OG/ Wilson Dampener (1g) = 363g

4. Grip size 2 / Wilson Gut Main 26kg Alu Rough 24.5kg Cross / Wilson Pro OG/ Wilson Dampener (1g) = 364g

5. Grip size 3 / NXT Power Main 26kg Alu Power 24.5kg Cross / Wilson Pro OG/ Wilson Dampener (1g) = 360g

6. Grip size 3 / NXT Power Main 26kg Alu Power 24.5kg Cross / Wilson Pro OG/ Wilson Dampener (1g) = 359g

7. Grip size 2 / NXT Power Main 26kg Alu Power 24.5kg Cross / Wilson Pro OG/ Wilson Dampener (1g) = 359g

8. Grip size 2 / NXT Power Main 26kg Alu Power 24.5kg Cross / Wilson Pro OG/ Wilson Dampener (1g) = 359g


The gut is heavier than NXT..
And considering the P1 custom grip and leather may add a few grams, it is close enough to retail.
Just curious, why the two different grip sizes? Also, why no power pads? They soften the feel as well as protecting the gut, at the expense of a little additional swing weight.
 

terminator97

New User
Just curious, why the two different grip sizes? Also, why no power pads? They soften the feel as well as protecting the gut, at the expense of a little additional swing weight.
Good question, I always played with a #3 but switched from a 2H backhand to a 1H and found the #2 grip better so transitioning to the #2's (plus OG). Maybe next string job I'll try the power pads.
 

moon shot

Hall of Fame
Saw this in another thread, if he changed his strokes it stands to reason he could have changed his specs to facilitate that.

Which version of the strokes are you talking about OP? Federer's serve and forehand have changed dramatically throughout the years. His forehand now looks way different than it did 10 years ago.

(skip to 1:18)

With a lower swingweight he would be able to react quicker in taking the ball on the rise.

It’s also possible he began playing the 97 a higher swingweight and lowered it after he had a to lose control and overhit. His average rally shot does seem less potent and deep than with the 90.

As far as the racquet specs I’m still amazed TW lists the two versions of the RF as having exactly the same average. I doubt two sets of 10 frames of the same model from Wilson would average to exactly the same numbers. Mine ranged from 323 to 341 swingweight before I sold the lot.
 

TennisHound

Legend
Wasn't someone saying RF was still playing with the 90 under a pj? His racquet is so different from anything ever made in the racquet industry that even the Wilson engineers and employees at Wilson don't know exactly what it is.
 

PeterFig

Professional
Wasn't someone saying RF was still playing with the 90 under a pj? His racquet is so different from anything ever made in the racquet industry that even the Wilson engineers and employees at Wilson don't know exactly what it is.
I'm pretty sure it's actually the Pro Staff 85 under a pj. I heard from someone that heard from someone that shared the same bus as a second-cousin of a Wilson rep that Federer has never actually switched racquets in his career. ;)
 

PeterFig

Professional
It plays great with Champions Choice and the Rogi spec. Mine just kinda found its way there through fiddling (sans power pads or string savers) [emoji471][emoji462][emoji471]. BHBH


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
I started with that combo.... but found the Alu Feel felt a little more crisp/responsive and had a more feel than the Alu Rough. Then when the Lux Gut came out i switched to that as it's not too different from Wilson gut but it's crazy durable! :)
 
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