Does Federer at times hit with a Semi Western Grip? (Photo/Video Analysis)

[drakulie]

There has for a long time been much discussion regarding what grip Federer uses for the forehand. Although I a firm believer he primarily hits with an eastern, I also believe he at times slides the base knuckle of his index finger over a bevel, which results in the particular forehand being a modified semi-western.

Before I go into breaking down Federer's forehand, we must first define the different grips.

http://www.waileatennis.com/grips.htm

The following are photos found here:
http://tennis.about.com/od/forehandbackhand/ss/fhgripclosewt.htm

Eastern Grip:

Note the top of the index knuckle is clearly above bevel #3, which would also place the base of this knuckle on bevel # 3).

Also note the "V" shape created by his index and thumb. The base of the "V" is on the edge of bevel 1 and 2.




Semi Western Grip

Note how the top of his index knuckle is now been moved over one bevel clockwise, and on top of bevel # 4.

Also note that the base of the "V" is now overlapping the edge of bevels 2 and 3.





The aforementioned, are the two grips I will be focusing on.

 

[drakulie]

Federer Grip

Notice in this photo, where his index knuckle is positioned. It is clearly over bevel 3. Also, note where the "V" shape of his hand is. In this photo, the base of the "V" is clearly on the edge of bevel 1 and 2 as described above, under "Eastern Grip".

Pretty clear cut right?? Federer hits with an eastern. Not exactly.

 

[drakulie]

As I will describe, he at times does indeed shift his hand over. The following photographs, taken at 60 frames per second clearly demonstrate he is NOT in an eastern position, rather, in a more semi-western position as evidenced by the position of the top of his index knuckle. (For an Eastern, the top of his knuckle would be over bevel # 3, rather than bevel 4. )

 

[drakulie]

The above are three different photographs taken from a sequence of photos shot at 60 Frames per second. The following video of Federer hitting a low forehand was created from 25 photographs taken at 60 frames per second (FPS).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pb9l0HPdypg

When I posted some of the above photos in another thread, one of the reason given of why his hand appears to be in a semi, is because he probably mishit the shot, resulting in his hand shifting over. I purposely chose this particular sequence to rule out that theory.

PHOTO NUMBER 1
Here is the second photo in this video sequence. As you could see, he has yet to make contact with the ball.

In this close up from the above still, please take note of the following:
1. As pointed out by the red arrow, one could clearly see the base of his heel. It is overlapping the edge of bevel 3 and 4.
2. Also note his index knuckle protruding out, as shown by the yellow arrow. It is clearly off to the side of the grip and in view, rather than out of sight and behind his hand, as it should be if he were hitting with an eastern grip. I will come back to this photo later on in PHOTO NUMER 4.

 

[drakulie]

PHOTO NUMBER 2
Here is the contact point, and although the video may play tricks on our eyes because of the severe “twisting” we see, which would lead us to believe it was a mishit, as you could see from this shot, he is hitting the ball fairly close to the center of the string bed.

PHOTO NUMBER 3
The next photo is telling when looked at closer.

Note that the “V” is not in the eastern position overlapping bevels 1 and 2, rather is overlapping bevels 2 and 3, like in the semi-western position. Also note that the tip of his index finger is on bevel # 7.

 

[drakulie]

PHOTO NUMBER 4
In this next photo, as he continues to bring the racquet out in front of him we look at top of his index knuckle. As pointed out by the red arrow, one could see it is clearly not on top of bevel number 3. It is off to the side, and clearly on top of bevel number 4. If he were hitting with an eastern grip, the top of his knuckle would be behind the grip and out of view, rather than off to the side and in view.

Now, if you go back to PHOTO NUMBER 1, which was before contact with the ball, and compare it to this photo (after contact), one could see the position of the top of his index knuckle has not changed. It is in the same position and in view, rather than out of view would he have been hitting with an eastern grip.

PHOTO NUMBER 5

Looking at the close up of the above still, as pointed out by the red arrow, his heel is still in the same position as it was in Photo Number 1,,,,,, Overlapping bevel 3 and 4. Again, like with his index knuckle, his heel has not changed pre and post contact.
As pointed out by the yellow arrow, note where the tip of his index finger is lying (Bevel 7). In a semi western position, with a pistol grip, it is normal to have this finger in this position. If it were an eastern grip, it would be on bevel 6.
Also, note the blue arrow pointing at the middle knuckle of his index finger. It is clearly protruding out, like in close up of Photo Number 1. Once again, there has been no change pre and post contact.



One last point I would like to make. As evidenced by this, and a numerous amount of photos and videos, Federer hits his forehand with a “pistol grip”. Meaning his index finger is separate from the rest of his fingers, as if he were holding a pistol in his hand. This separation from the rest of his fingers allows him to have greater maneuverability with his index finger and greater coverage of the grip. This results in him being able to adjust his index finger very quickly to hit an eastern, or slide it over one bevel into a semi-western grip, which gives him more leverage when pronating.

 

[samster]

And anyway, what exactly is the purpose/point of this thread. I ask in an inquiring and not a chastising manner. I just want to know why you're interested.

Because there is ongoing debate, hm...for years now, whether Fed uses an Eastern forehand exclusively.

 

[autumn_leaf]

i thought this was put to rest last year... eastern/modified eastern. photos and vids posted by tennisplayer and fyb showed it. i believe federer was even quoted that he changes grips depending on different balls (height of the ball or what he's trying to accomplish with that particular shot).

 

[Jonny S&V]

Before I say anything, I actually don't really care what grip he uses, it's still the greatest forehand of all time, and this argument is dumb. But since you started it...

I believe if you were to see where his fore-finger knuckle is in this pic, it is on bevel #3. I believe his wrist, being ridiculously flexible (as his entire body is one big rubber-band), is being turned and layed back so much, via the insane torso rotation, that it gives the optical illusion that he is using an eastern.

Here is the contact point, and although the video may play tricks on our eyes because of the severe “twisting” we see, which would lead us to believe it was a mishit, as you could see from this shot, he is hitting the ball fairly close to the center of the string bed. [/SIZE][/FONT]

Though his contact point is close to the center, the ball is still not in the center. In fact, it is slightly below the ball. Where the ball is, it is logical that the racquet could, and probably did, rotate in a counter-clockwise direction, relative to Federer himself, clockwise to a spectator on Federer's right, switching his grip to a semi-western.

I don't think that people realize truly how loose Federer holds onto the racquet. Im surprised that the racquet doesn't turn in his hand more often. Could this be the secret to Federer's forehand? Twisting of the racquet in his hand on purpose? ;-)

 

[sh@de]

Nice analysis drak. I must say I'm now convinced that Fed uses multiple grips, although eastern is still his primary one and SW only comes in rarely.

Thanks mate!

 

[drakulie]

i thought this was put to rest last year... eastern/modified eastern. photos and vids posted by tennisplayer and fyb showed it. i believe federer was even quoted that he changes grips depending on different balls (height of the ball or what he's trying to accomplish with that particular shot).

Actually, FYB states he does not modify his grip, and only hits with an eastern. As for Fed's comment, I have read that as well, but can't find the interview where he talks about his grip. You could read the comments here:

http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=318579

Though his contact point is close to the center, the ball is still not in the center. In fact, it is slightly below the ball. Where the ball is, it is logical that the racquet could, and probably did, rotate in a counter-clockwise direction, relative to Federer himself, clockwise to a spectator on Federer's right, switching his grip to a semi-western.

I have plenty of vids where Fed's racquet does exactly what you descirbe, and he is hitting dead center. Its called pronation.

All pros do this. Here is a vid of Gonzo: He is also doing it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DAeMcNXoIKs

I don't think that people realize truly how loose Federer holds onto the racquet. Im surprised that the racquet doesn't turn in his hand more often. Could this be the secret to Federer's forehand? Twisting of the racquet in his hand on purpose? ;-)

If this were the case,,,,, returning shots that are coming with 2000+ RPMs of spin, and nearing 100 mph, all photos of him post contact would be in a semi position. Additionally, all his bbackhand shots would also be a semi western position.

 

[drakulie]

Nice analysis drak. I must say I'm now convinced that Fed uses multiple grips, although eastern is still his primary one and SW only comes in rarely.

Thanks mate!

sh@de, you're welcome. You already know how I feel about it. Not only has Fed hmself stated he modifies his grip, but yandell has confirmed, as well as my own experience of shooting photos/videos of him up close for the last 3 years is enough to confirm he swicthes his hand around somewhat.

Never the less, it is an interesting discussion, and FYB's analsysis is interesting as well.

 

[pvaudio]

Because there is ongoing debate, hm...for years now, whether Fed uses an Eastern forehand exclusively.

I still don't see why it's even important, and no pro player sticks to exclusively one grip for every shot, so I'm not understanding why this is so controversial, or perhaps I've missed some prior threads?

 

[Jonny S&V]

I have plenty of vids where Fed's racquet does exactly what you descirbe, and he is hitting dead center. Its called pronation.

All pros do this. Here is a vid of Gonzo: He is also doing it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DAeMcNXoIKs

Umm, he's not pronating in that pic. The picture you are referencing is before pronation. The racquet head is naturally laying back his wrist, and with Federer's extreme racquet head speed, it might be turning his wrist slightly to create the optical illusion of a semi-western grip (you need a pick of where his base knuckle is in this exact instance to clear this up).

If this were the case, returning shots that are coming with 2000+ RPMs of spin, and nearing 100 mph, all photos of him post contact would be in a semi position. Additionally, all his bbackhand shots would also be a semi western position.

This is a pic taken in practice. Do you really think he is going all out in this pic? I don't. He's falling backward. It looks (to me) like he short-hopped the ball. If this is the case, you can't take this photo seriously. This is not his normal groundstroke. Give me a pic of his weight neutral/moving forward with a semi-western, and I might reconsider.

 

[Cross-court]

You can't take this 1 picture where you can't even see his grip from behind (which would clearly show where exactly is his base knuckle which is what determines a grip) to say that he uses semiwestern. All the photos I've seen of his forehand (and I've seen hundreds, almost all from match play), and even all the videos I've seen, show an eastern. Not once a semi-w.

 

[drakulie]

Umm, he's not pronating in that pic.

You obviously are not aware of what pronation is. "prone" means face down. Therefore, the act of turning your palm to the ground is the act of pronation. Now go back to 28 seconds of that vid, and he is clearly pronating.

This is a pic taken in practice. Do you really think he is going all out in this pic? I don't.

Nah, he is just lollipopping his shots back. :roll:

Have you ever seen a pro up close praticing?

 

[drakulie]

You can't take this 1 picture where you can't even see his grip from behind (which would clearly show where exactly is his base knuckle which is what determines a grip) to say that he uses semiwestern. All the photos I've seen of his forehand (and I've seen hundreds, almost all from match play), and even all the videos I've seen, show an eastern. Not once a semi-w.

There isn't one photo of him in a semi. I posted 3. http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showpost.php?p=4537234&postcount=3


But, you are welcome to explain why he is clearly in a semi in all 3 photos, including being in a semi prior to contact in my analysis.

 

[Jonny S&V]

You obviously are not aware of what pronation is. "prone" means face down. Therefore, the act of turning your palm to the ground is the act of pronation. Now go back to 28 seconds of that vid, and he is clearly pronating.

Pronation means the opposite of supination correct? To supinate is to turn inwards, towards the body. To pronate means to turn outwards, away from the body. On the serve, the palm turns outward, away from the body. The palm is not turning away from the body, therefore, that forehand is technically not pronation.

Nah, he is just lollipopping his shots back. :roll:

Have you ever seen a pro up close praticing?

Yes I have, and I have seen Federer practicing, at Cincy 2007. He's ridiculously loose when he practices, to the point that he is sloppy (in a good way), hence why I wouldn't gauge his strokes from practice.

I like how you blatantly ignored my comment on the short-hop. Might want to attack that little point, as it could blow up your entire argument. :roll:

 

[Ultra2HolyGrail]

Who would honestly think he had a eastern to begin with. It's obvious with his wiper motion he is using a more extreme grip.

 

[iamke55]

You obviously are not aware of what pronation is. "prone" means face down. Therefore, the act of turning your palm to the ground is the act of pronation. Now go back to 28 seconds of that vid, and he is clearly pronating.

Wow I never knew that's where pronation comes from. Thanks for the English lesson! I always got it confused with supination, then just drilled into my head that pronation is what you do when serving and supination is what you do when hitting a forehand.

Interested in seeing FYB's response. Looking at all evidence, I will conclude for now that Will just happened to capture all of the eastern forehands for his analysis.

 

[Cross-court]

There isn't one photo of him in a semi. I posted 3. http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showpost.php?p=4537234&postcount=3


But, you are welcome to explain why he is clearly in a semi in all 3 photos, including being in a semi prior to contact in my analysis.

I don't know if it is the same with every person, but in my case:

In an eastern grip, at contact, my upper hand (I'm not sure if that's how it's called, the opposite of your palm...) is facing almost to my back.

If I use a semi-western grip, my upper hand faces straight down at contact. This is obviously because of the grip change.


Federer's upper hand in the contact photo is facing almost completely to his back, like if he's shaking someone's hand. If he were using a semi-western, it would be facing down and it isn't. A semi-western grip at contact looks like if you just turned a doorknob. Federer's grip screams eastern.

 

[Cross-court]

And since the photo at contact is a low ball, it is even more pronounced and noticeable if you use a sw.

 

[drakulie]

Pronation means the opposite of supination correct? To supinate is to turn inwards, towards the body. To pronate means to turn outwards, away from the body. On the serve, the palm turns outward, away from the body. The palm is not turning away from the body, therefore, that forehand is technically not pronation.

If you stick your right arm straight out in front of you, with your thumb pointing up, and turn your arm so that your thumb is now pointing to the left, you have just pronated, putting your palm in a "prone" position (facing down).

If you do the same, but turn your arm so that your thumb is facing to the right, you have just supinated, putting your palm in a supine position (facing up). When a pro "rolls over the ball" they are pronating, that is the act of "pronating".

As I said, nearly every pro "pronates", as does gonzalez in the video I provided.

Yes I have, and I have seen Federer practicing, at Cincy 2007. He's ridiculously loose when he practices, to the point that he is sloppy (in a good way), hence why I wouldn't gauge his strokes from practice.

Did he serve with a pancake grip in this pracitce? :roll:

I like how you blatantly ignored my comment on the short-hop. Might want to attack that little point, as it could blow up your entire argument. :roll:

It is insignificant. I posted three different photos of him in a semi position. If you go to my youtube page, you will see high speed video of him shot at 600 frames per second, and his racquet path is the same in some shots where he isn't hitting a "short hop".

 

[Jonny S&V]

If you stick your right arm straight out in front of you, with your thumb pointing up, and turn your arm so that your thumb is now pointing to the left, you have just pronated, putting your palm in a "prone" position (facing down).

If you do the same, but turn your arm so that your thumb is facing to the right, you have just supinated, putting your palm in a supine position (facing up). When a pro "rolls over the ball" they are pronating, that is the act of "pronating".

As I said, nearly every pro "pronates", as does gonzalez in the video I provided.

Ok, I'm wrong.

However, Fed's "pronation" in his forehand has not happened yet. He's only laid the wrist back (please note that I'm only talking about the pre-contact pic, as it is the only relevant one in my opinion). Hence, you are also wrong.

Did he serve with a pancake grip in this pracitce? :roll:

I'm sorry, I'm not familiar with this terminology. Does adding a layer of maple syrup help with spin production?

It is insignificant. I posted three different photos of him in a semi position. If you go to my youtube page, you will see high speed video of him shot at 600 frames per second, and his racquet path is the same in some shots where he isn't hitting a "short hop".

Are the picture and video of the exact same shot? If so, you're argument is valid in the sense of the shot-selection Federer utilized (IE, whether or not Fed short-hopped the ball or not). I still believe the 2nd pic, one taken at contact, is most likely short-hopped.

 

[Cross-court]

Pronation is radial deviation.

 

[tricky]

Pronation is radial deviation.

Typically, WW action will have both pronation and radial deviation. The radial deviation is the primary wiping movement, and the pronation facilitates both the range of motion and kinetic impetus for the radial deviation.

When there's radial deviation, the wrist flexion angle doesn't change much, even with the forearm pronating. However, when the upper arm starts to pivot off the swing plane, this inhibits radial deviation. If there's still forearm pronation, the wrist flexion angle will decrease. Ergo, wrist release.

 

[Cross-court]

I find I do this WW/radial deviation/pronation/whatever without even focusing or thinking about it. I don't even think about the wrist. I simply think in the swingpath I want and that's it.

Sometimes I do purposely pronate/radial deviate, to get an angle/more spin/more raquet-head speed, but just to compare and experiment, I don't rely on this.

 

[Cross-court]

And a friend of mine who is a very good player (maybe a 5.0), says that it's all in the wrist. He says that on many occasions he only uses the wrist and not much of a swing, that during a rally he will only use the wrist and then for the winner use the whole swing or vice versa.

 

[tricky]

I find I do this WW/radial deviation/pronation/whatever without even focusing or thinking about it.

And you shouldn't either. Wiping action is a good thing to have, but it doesn't preclude striking through the ball.

 

[KenC]

It almost sounds like Fed has invented a new secret grip. If we unlock the secret to Fed's grip we will all be able to hit forehands like Fed? Fed uses what best suits Fed. Nadal uses what best suits Nadal. What tennis needs is not a lot of Federer or Nadal clones, but people who take their own particular style, based on what works best overall for them, to a higher level than Fed and Nadal and keep the game progressing.

 

[AJK1]

Yeah, i think the GOAT has invented a new grip, it's called the "Swiss/South African" hybrid grip.

 

[drakulie]

However, Fed's "pronation" in his forehand has not happened yet. He's only laid the wrist back (please note that I'm only talking about the pre-contact pic, as it is the only relevant one in my opinion). Hence, you are also wrong.

I am well aware in the "pre-contact" photo, pronation has not occurred yet. Not sure why you are bringing this to my attention. However, in the later photos posted, such as the one at contact he has already begun to pronate, and then in the "after contact" photo, his racauet and/or hand is prone.

PHOTO NUMBER 2
Here is the contact point, and although the video may play tricks on our eyes because of the severe “twisting” we see, which would lead us to believe it was a mishit, as you could see from this shot, he is hitting the ball fairly close to the center of the string bed.

PHOTO NUMBER 3
The next photo is telling when looked at closer.

Note that the “V” is not in the eastern position overlapping bevels 1 and 2, rather is overlapping bevels 2 and 3, like in the semi-western position. Also note that the tip of his index finger is on bevel # 7.

Are the picture and video of the exact same shot? If so, you're argument is valid in the sense of the shot-selection Federer utilized (IE, whether or not Fed short-hopped the ball or not). I still believe the 2nd pic, one taken at contact, is most likely short-hopped.

Did you see the video I posted of the photo sequence?? Go back and look at it.

 

[drakulie]

Federer's upper hand in the contact photo is facing almost completely to his back, like if he's shaking someone's hand. If he were using a semi-western, it would be facing down and it isn't. A semi-western grip at contact looks like if you just turned a doorknob. Federer's grip screams eastern.

I agree Federer's grip, "screams eastern". This is because he doesn't necessarily move the heel of his hand. He keeps it fixed. However, what makes it into somewhat of a hybrid, is the position of his index finger, which I have explained, and that would be place his grip into a semi-western.

Also, in the semi position, his hand (back of his hand as you describe) would still be facing back, not down (that would be a full western).

 

[wihamilton]

PHOTO NUMBER 2

It looks like the racket has shifted in Federer's hand due to contact. Doesn't necessarily have to be a miss-hit. Off-center contact can cause the racket to shift in his hand as well. Consider these two slow-motion videos --

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GG0p-GJzR28

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ImeQaAyFPc#t=0m28s

The racket is clearly shifting in his hand right after he hits -- and the position of the racket when that happens perfectly matches the racket position in the pics above. For this reason (and others) I don't think that sequence is a good indication of Federer's grip.

For comparison's sake, the first few forehands in the video below demonstrate how Federer's racket releases when he makes solid contact / the racket doesn't shift in his hand --

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=59lhCBI6xvk

 

[drakulie]

Will, post some photos of Fed hitting with a semi western backhand, eastern or semi western volleys and serves.

Fact is, if it shifted in his hand as you theorize, his hand would be in a different position pre contact, as it is post contact. Its not. They are in the same position.

The heel
The Index
The potruding middle knuckle
etc.

 

[wihamilton]

drak is also familiar with my objection of the angle from which he took these pictures. My opinion is that you can't get a clear perspective of Federer's index knuckle from the angle drak shot these pics from. Rather, you need to shoot from the back perspective (images have been downgraded quality-wise to make them easier to load) --

Obviously, the pictures above show an eastern. We'll be using this picture and several others from this year's Indian Wells in an upcoming video about Roger's grip.

 

[wihamilton]

Will, post some photos of Fed hitting with a semi western backhand, eastern or semi western volleys and serves.

Fact is, if it shifted in his hand as you theorize, his hand would be in a different position pre contact, as it is post contact. Its not. They are in the same position.

The heel
The Index
The potruding middle knuckle
etc.

Do you agree -- or disagree -- with my earlier post? Is the racket shifting in Federer's hand immediately after contact in the videos I linked in? And -- if so -- don't you think the post-contact position of the racket in his hand strongly resembles the one in your pic?

 

[drakulie]

Do you agree -- or disagree -- with my earlier post? Is the racket shifting in Federer's hand immediately after contact in the videos I linked in? And -- if so -- don't you think the post-contact position of the racket in his hand strongly resembles the one in your pic?

Can't tell from the video you posted.

Now, backup your theory and post photos of him hitting with a Western grip on his backhand. With how much he shanks/mishits on the side, it shouldn't be too hard for you to find if your theory is true.

 

[Thiseas]

there is no doubt that the racquet shifted in his hand

 

[wihamilton]

there is no doubt that the racquet shifted in his hand

Ya I agree -- that's why I think it's so important to get pics that establish someone's grip prior to contact.

 

[drakulie]

^^Again, if the racquet is shifting, then explain why his hand is in the same position (pre and post contact).

Also, if this "theory" is true, then it is true for all player, not just Federer.

So why is so hard to find a photo of Federer hitting with a semi-western or western backhand?

Why has no one been able to post a photo of Agassi hitting with a full western forehand.

Sampras with a semi western FH.

etc.
etc,
etc.

 

[Thiseas]

deleted...

 

[Djokovicfan4life]

there is no doubt that the racquet shifted in his hand

Really? I have plenty of doubt about that. I agree with Will that it's a terrible angle for grip analysis, but still, most of the movement I see in that picture is the wrist and forearm pronating.

Not sure where Johnny S & V got this "palm turned away from the body" thing on pronation. All it means is that your wrist/forearm turn counterclockwise. For serves, yes, if you have a lot of racquet head speed you'll naturally pronate enough to where the palm is facing away from your body towards the side fence, but there's no rule that says it has to be away from the body. For groundstrokes the racquet is *more or less* square or perpendicular to the ground at contact, so any pronation after contact would turn the palm towards the ground.

Pronation = counterclockwise. Supination = clockwise. Simple.

 

[Thiseas]

deleted...

 

[wihamilton]

^^Again, if the racquet is shifting, then explain why his hand is in the same position (pre and post contact).

Also, if this "theory" is true, then it is true for all player, not just Federer.

So why is so hard to find a photo of Federer hitting with a semi-western or western backhand?

Why has no one been able to post a photo of Agassi hitting with a full western forehand.

Sampras with a semi western FH.

etc.
etc,
etc.

So you're saying that the racket never shifts in your hand on off-center hits? I think most players @ any level -- simply based on their own experiences -- would disagree w/you if that's what you're saying.

 

[Thiseas]

deleted...

 

[wihamilton]

if you freeze the above video at the right moment then you can tell people that richard is using Hawaian in his fh

Good find. Here's the video on Youtube --

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wk_eCLU_qnU#t=0m40s

And a non-shanked follow through --

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wk_eCLU_qnU#t=0m23s

 

[Djokovicfan4life]

look at his hand it is hardly turning, wlile the racquet turns almost 90 degrees

Again, bad angle, but the hand looked like it turned a lot to me as well.

 

[Thiseas]

[deleted...

 

[drakulie]

http://s134.photobucket.com/albums/q87/teosoph/?action=view&current=Gasquet-1.flv

LOL. Good vid.

However, his racquet doesn't twist, it spins lmao. Very different.

I have shown 3 differerent photos of fed in a semi position, all from 3 different shots. Additionally, contrary to the photo/video I provided, I show his hand up close pre and post contact to show key points in his hand and prove it has not moved, shifted.

1. heel,
2. index knuckle
3. middle knuckle
4. where his index finger is lying (bevel 7)

They have not moved pre and post contact.

So you're saying that the racket never shifts in your hand on off-center hits? I think most players @ any level -- simply based on their own experiences -- would disagree w/you if that's what you're saying.

Sure it does. There are always times a racquet will move in ones hand, including the racquet flying out of the hand at times completely.