Does Nadal deserve the YE#1?

peakin11mugs

Semi-Pro
Nadal is the best player in the world has had the best resume across all the surfaces. Federer chose to skip the clay, and it cost him the coveted YE1. His choice, he seems ok with it and acknowledges Nadal as the best of 2017 not sure why his fans are struggling so much.

Nadal in fact got the trophy for best player yesterday, I think it's been posted on another thread on here.
Ok I agree with your logic completely since it closes the GOAT debate from you permanently. By your own logic Fed is best player ever he has most titles and most finals and semi finals (you have suddenly stressed the importance e of semi finals etc). Just as fed has won more titles this year, Even if nadal wins 5 more slams he still isn’t as good as fed as he will have less titles and less finals, semi finals etc at slams.

Best overall resume as you say too only player to win 10titles on 4 surfaces and lol even only player to do it on 3 surfaces.
 

Federer and Del Potro

Talk Tennis Guru
Ok I agree with your logic completely since it closes the GOAT debate from you permanently. By your own logic Fed is best player ever he has most titles and most finals and semi finals (you have suddenly stressed thei pittance of semi finals etc). Just as fed has won more titles this year, Even if nadal wins 5 more slams he still isn’t as good as fed as he will have less titles and less finals, semi finals etc at slams.

Best overall resume as you say too only player to win 10titles on 4 surfaces and lol even only player to do it on 3 surfaces.
Don't bother arguing with him, high probability it's TennisATP, a former banned member who echoed a Federer-Nadal fandom but only ever spoke highly of Nadal. He's laying low on his secret account (no thread making), but the sentiments are similar.
 

peakin11mugs

Semi-Pro
Don't bother arguing with him, high probability it's TennisATP, a former banned member who echoed a Federer-Nadal fandom but only ever spoke highly of Nadal. He's laying low on his secret account (no thread making), but the sentiments are similar.
Definitely smells like a second even third or fourth account. Trying to play a persona which he has learned from but failed at it as logic falls apart but too late to change it now @Johnnypeacock
 

Federev

Hall of Fame
Of course he does. The year-end #1 should never be a player who runs away from playing his main rival on his main rival's favourite surface.
Fed: I dont want to play clay cause I don't want to hurt my knee I just had surgery on and I'm wiped out from winning pretty much everything so far this year = Running Away

Nadal: I lose to Fed in Shanghai - ouch my knee. Immediatly next I withdraw from Paris - ouch my knee. Immediatly next I withdraw from WTF - ouch my knee = Amazing Hero
 
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Federev

Hall of Fame
Of course he does. The year-end #1 should never be a player who runs away from playing his main rival on his main rival's favourite surface.
Fed: I dont want to play clay cause I don't want to hurt my knee I just had surgery on and I'm wiped out from winning pretty much everything so far this year = Running Away

Nadal: I lose to Fed in Shanghai - ouch my knee. Immediatly next I withdraw from Paris - ouch my knee. Immediatly next I withdraw from WTF - ouch my knee = Amazing Hero

Nadal is the best player in the world has had the best resume across all the surfaces. Federer chose to skip the clay, and it cost him the coveted YE1. His choice, he seems ok with it and acknowledges Nadal as the best of 2017 not sure why his fans are struggling so much.

Nadal in fact got the trophy for best player yesterday, I think it's been posted on another thread on here.
Number one is a mathematical proposition. Your award means for being number 1 in points - means for sure - that you are number 1 in points.

It does not tell you who the actual best player is in my opinion.

Nadal was the best player in 2010 and 2013 without a doubt. And he was #1. So it often happens, but not always.

But Simona Halep is #1 and didn't win any major tournament.

And sorry - She is not the best player in the world.
 
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Towser83

G.O.A.T.
Fed: I dont want to play clay cause I don't want to hurt my knee I just had surgery on and I'm wiped out from winning pretty much everything so far this year = Running Away

Nadal: I lose to Fed in Shanghai - ouch my knew. Immediatly next I withdraw from Paris - ouch my knee. Immediatly next I withdraw from WTF - ouch my knee = Amazing Hero
Brave sir Robin, who nearly stood up to the vicious chicken of Bristol...
 
If Roger can skip entire clay season and still get come back of the year award why not Nadal...such thread make no sense even if you are a fan of any player...
 

Towser83

G.O.A.T.
Of course he does. The year-end #1 should never be a player who runs away from playing his main rival on his main rival's favourite surface.
Nadal deserves number one. Just about. It was close so who ever is mathmatically ahead deserves it.

All this avoid Nadal on clay stuff is rubbish though. If he was worried about playing Nadal on clay he could have turned up, won a few matches and either tanked, or gone "ouch my back, I'm withdrawing" In fact one round at RG would have got him the number one ranking and not dented his H2H with Nadal at all.

Federer didn't play clay because

1. At 36 he doesn't trust his body to play a whole season so he's got to sacrifice some events. He sacrifices Paris indoors which he could have easily won, to play Basel at the WTF. He sacrificed Cinci, his best master where he's 7 times champ to give himself a chance at the USO. He was perhaps too confident with trying to play Canada and it came back to haunt him. So the choice not to play clay is an obvious one because -

2. If he played RG he'd have to play at least one master on clay, if he played one master on clay he'd have to play RG. Logically that meant Rome, RG, then two grass warm ups and wimbledon. He'd probably get a decent run at RG then be knackered for Wimbledon, so he sacrificed clay season. It paid off with a record breaking 8th Wimbledon.
 

octobrina10

Talk Tennis Guru
Fed: I dont want to play clay cause I don't want to hurt my knee I just had surgery on and I'm wiped out from winning pretty much everything so far this year = Running Away

Nadal: I lose to Fed in Shanghai - ouch my knew. Immediatly next I withdraw from Paris - ouch my knee. Immediatly next I withdraw from WTF - ouch my knee = Amazing Hero
Hmm. Fed had knee surgery at the beginning of 2016.

Speaking of withdrawals, Fed withdrew from Cincinnati & Paris Masters, citing back injury...
 

peakin11mugs

Semi-Pro
Hmm. Fed had knee surgery at the beginning of 2016.

Speaking of withdrawals, Fed withdrew from Cincinnati & Paris Masters, citing back injury...
LMAO at you comparing a 36 year father of four at end of his career who got 18 out 19 finals and never retired a single match vs nadal who well is nadal lol

Mentioning nadal in the same breath as fed in these kind of areas is ridiculous. Don’t go down injury, scheduling route. Stick to talks of weak era and h2h. But remember not too much since nadal has piled up weak era slams by the dozen and don’t talk too much about h2h now that Djokovic is ahead.

Nadal scheduling, body awareness, health and ability to adapt game particularly to reduce toll on body are absolutely atrocious. Even mentioning nadal in same breath as fed or other player on tour in these regards is like me comparing my forehand to nadals.
 
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peakin11mugs

Semi-Pro
Hmm. Fed had knee surgery at the beginning of 2016.

Speaking of withdrawals, Fed withdrew from Cincinnati & Paris Masters, citing back injury...
LMAO at you comparing a 36 year father of four at end of his career who got 18 out 19 finals and never retired a match vs nadal who well is nadal lol

Mentioning nadal in the same breath as fed in these kind of areas is ridiculous. Don’t go down injury, scheduling route. Stick to talks of weak era and h2h. But remember not too much since nadal has piled up weak era slams by the dozen and don’t talk too much about h2h now that Djokovic is ahead.

Nadal scheduling, body awareness, health and ability to adapt game particularly to reduce toll on body are absolutely atrocious. Even mentioning nadal in same breath as fed or other player on tour in these regards is like me comparing my forehand to nadals.
 
Fed: I dont want to play clay cause I don't want to hurt my knee I just had surgery on and I'm wiped out from winning pretty much everything so far this year = Running Away

Nadal: I lose to Fed in Shanghai - ouch my knew. Immediatly next I withdraw from Paris - ouch my knee. Immediatly next I withdraw from WTF - ouch my knee = Amazing Hero


Number one is a mathematical proposition. Your award means for being number 1 in points - means for sure - that you are number 1 in points.

It does not tell you who the actual best player is in my opinion.

Nadal was the best player in 2010 and 2013 without a doubt. And he was #1. She it often happens, but not always.

But Simona Halep is #1 and didn't want any major tournament.

And sorry - She is not the best player in the world.
Nadal won two Majors and the USO is more prestigious than AO which gives kudos to Nadal given Federer skipped the FO. People forget that before the USO it was being hailed as the tournament that will decide the best player of 2017. Since Nadal won there has been a lot of backtracking.

Murray was the best player last year and he had one less major than Djokovic. On every level this year Nadal is the best player as he ended no.1. Even Federer admitted that.
 

octobrina10

Talk Tennis Guru
LMAO at you comparing a 36 year father of four at end of his career who got 18 out 19 finals and never retired a match vs nadal who well is nadal lol

Mentioning nadal in the same breath as fed in these kind of areas is ridiculous. Don’t go down injury, scheduling route. Stick to talks of weak era and h2h. But remember not too much since nadal has piled up weak era slams by the dozen and don’t talk too much about h2h now that Djokovic is ahead.

Nadal scheduling, body awareness, health and ability to adapt game particularly to reduce toll on body are absolutely atrocious. Even mentioning nadal in same breath as fed or other player on tour in these regards is like me comparing my forehand to nadals.
I posted facts about Fed.
 

octobrina10

Talk Tennis Guru
Nadal is the YE #1, but Federer is the best player in 2017. The stats don't lie.


Winning percentage
Federer 50-4(93%)
Nadal 67-11(86%)

Single titles
Federer 7(8 if he wins the WTF)
Nadal 6

Record against top 10
Federer 12-1(92%)
Nadal 11-6(65%)

H2H
Federer 4
Nadal 0
The ATP rankings do not lie, the best player in 2017 is:
 

Federev

Hall of Fame
Nadal won two Majors and the USO is more prestigious than AO which gives kudos to Nadal given Federer skipped the FO. People forget that before the USO it was being hailed as the tournament that will decide the best player of 2017. Since Nadal won there has been a lot of backtracking.

Murray was the best player last year and he had one less major than Djokovic. On every level this year Nadal is the best player as he ended no.1. Even Federer admitted that.
Fed's being kind.
 

donquijote

G.O.A.T.
His YE No1 is a very well deserved, a result of commitment and hard work. Very good role model for the kids as well.
 

Federev

Hall of Fame
Hmm. Fed had knee surgery at the beginning of 2016.

Speaking of withdrawals, Fed withdrew from Cincinnati & Paris Masters, citing back injury...
Fed did play Cincinnati
Fed did not play Paris
Hurt at Montreal he finished
Hurt at USO he finished
When Fed entered a tournament this year he finished.

Why did Nadal even bother with Paris? Why did he bother w WTF?

I don't get him. As a Fed fan who wants to like him it's disillusioning.

Not that anybody cares. But there it is.
 

Federev

Hall of Fame
Hmm. Fed had knee surgery at the beginning of 2016.

Speaking of withdrawals, Fed withdrew from Cincinnati & Paris Masters, citing back injury...
Fed did not play Cincinnati
Fed did not play Paris
Hurt at Montreal he finished
Hurt at USO he finished
When Fed entered a tournament this year he finished.

Why did Nadal even bother with Paris? Why did he bother w WTF?

I don't get him. As a Fed fan who wants to like him it's disillusioning.
 
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Ok I agree with your logic completely since it closes the GOAT debate from you permanently. By your own logic Fed is best player ever he has most titles and most finals and semi finals (you have suddenly stressed the importance e of semi finals etc). Just as fed has won more titles this year, Even if nadal wins 5 more slams he still isn’t as good as fed as he will have less titles and less finals, semi finals etc at slams.

Best overall resume as you say too only player to win 10titles on 4 surfaces and lol even only player to do it on 3 surfaces.
Given Agassi recently said Nadal is GOAT I'm inclined to consider his argument carefully especially after seeing so many Federer fans seem to consider h2h the deciding factor.

Nadal has won at least two majors on each surface. Federer hasn't done that. Nadal has Olympic singles Gold Federer hasn't done that. Nadal has 16 majors when there were two other goat contenders at their peak compared to Federers seven. Nadal has a winning h2h on outdoor hard court and clay against Federer.

The above is what Agassi and other pros look at when comparing the two. The Majors are what define players and the era in which they were won.

Federer is a legend is a class act and a gentleman. But he hasn't won a USO in a decade in which time Nadal has won three.

The point Agassi has been making is to be the greatest it is unusual to not have done so many things your greatest rival has done.

Anyway Nadal is the player of year for 2017 so the year is done and dusted early.
 
Ok I agree with your logic completely since it closes the GOAT debate from you permanently. By your own logic Fed is best player ever he has most titles and most finals and semi finals (you have suddenly stressed the importance e of semi finals etc). Just as fed has won more titles this year, Even if nadal wins 5 more slams he still isn’t as good as fed as he will have less titles and less finals, semi finals etc at slams.

Best overall resume as you say too only player to win 10titles on 4 surfaces and lol even only player to do it on 3 surfaces.
Given Agassi recently said Nadal is GOAT I'm inclined to consider his argument carefully especially after seeing so many Federer fans seem to consider h2h the deciding factor.

Nadal has won at least two majors on each surface. Federer hasn't done that. Nadal has Olympic singles Gold Federer hasn't done that. Nadal has 16 majors when there were two other goat contenders at their peak compared to Federers seven. Nadal has a winning h2h on outdoor hard court and clay against Federer.

The above is what Agassi and other pros look at when comparing the two. The Majors are what define players and the era in which they were won.

Federer is a legend is a class act and a gentleman. But he hasn't won a USO in a decade in which time Nadal has won three.

The point Agassi has been making is to be the greatest it is unusual to not have done so many things your greatest rival has done.

Anyway Nadal is the player of year for 2017 so the year is done and dusted early.
The ATP rankings do not lie, the best player in 2017 is:
Some of these salty Federer fans are going to have the worse Christmas and new year ever. I'm stunned by the bitterness on here to Nadal. Envy one of the seven deadly sins as well
 

Towser83

G.O.A.T.
Nadal won two Majors and the USO is more prestigious than AO which gives kudos to Nadal given Federer skipped the FO. People forget that before the USO it was being hailed as the tournament that will decide the best player of 2017. Since Nadal won there has been a lot of backtracking.

Murray was the best player last year and he had one less major than Djokovic. On every level this year Nadal is the best player as he ended no.1. Even Federer admitted that.
Wimbledon is more prestigeous than any of the other slams, it doesn't matter. They're all slams.

Nadal's got the most points and he deserves the number one ranking, but he's not been the best player on EVERY level, neither would Federer have been if he had taken number one at the end of the year, they both have their strengths and both did well enough to be a deserving number one, Nadal however was the one that managed to play enough matches to win it by a nose. No complaints there.

When Murray got to number one he had more points but I'd still say Djokovic was the better player. In this case with possibly 140 points between Nadal and Federer, it's really debatable. Nadal got most points, Federer won most big titles, who was the better player in terms of playing better tennis? That's debatable, what isn't though is that both players can hold their heads up high and anyone putting the other guy down for what they did or didn't play is a bit of an idiot.
 

Rod Laver

Professional
Deserve does not come into it. Deserve is a useless word in this context. Like it or not rafa earned #1 by gaining the most points this year.
 

peakin11mugs

Semi-Pro
Given Agassi recently said Nadal is GOAT I'm inclined to consider his argument carefully especially after seeing so many Federer fans seem to consider h2h the deciding factor.

Nadal has won at least two majors on each surface. Federer hasn't done that. Nadal has Olympic singles Gold Federer hasn't done that. Nadal has 16 majors when there were two other goat contenders at their peak compared to Federers seven. Nadal has a winning h2h on outdoor hard court and clay against Federer.

The above is what Agassi and other pros look at when comparing the two. The Majors are what define players and the era in which they were won.

Federer is a legend is a class act and a gentleman. But he hasn't won a USO in a decade in which time Nadal has won three.

The point Agassi has been making is to be the greatest it is unusual to not have done so many things your greatest rival has done.

Anyway Nadal is the player of year for 2017 so the year is done and dusted early.
Lol Aggassi didn’t recently say nadal was GOAT. Hahaga. By your own arguement Djokovic is GOt and better than nadal. Nadal hasn’t had strong competition when he won ska,s againzt berdych, ferrer and Anderson. Djokovic has had harder comp. Also nadal has Olympic gold vs feds silver hagaha so is GOAT. LMAO. Firstly Murray has two golds. Next By your own arguement nadLs 0 WTF v fed, djoker, Murray’s titles mean they are better than nadal

Djokovic got four in a row on all three surfaces something no man not even Laver did so is again better than nadal. Nadal is also absolutely not just relatively poor on indoors. He has 1 title. Davednko has 6 fed has over 20 for reference. As he is absolute,y not just relatively poor on a whole type of tennis he is never going to be GIAT by your definition. For reference fed has around 20 titles each surface. Nadal has 1 indoor lol. He doesn’t even have 10 grass. Lol does he even have 10 yes 10 HC?

All your silly arguements make nadal even worse then he already is andprop up Djokovic and loads of past champions above nadal
 

big ted

Hall of Fame
Rafa deserves it but he seemed to definitely play the point game to clinch it by playing one match in Paris then withdrawing... if he wasn't in contention he may have ended his season much earlier
 

peakin11mugs

Semi-Pro
I posted facts about Fed.
put it this way Fed at 36 and a father of four this season has played more tennis, has adapted better and has more but awareness and scheduling skills than nadal has pretty much in every single year of his career even his twenties lol. Nadal is so bad at at scheduling compared to fed it’s ridiculous why are you trying to compare?

LMAO you’re still trying to compare fed and nadal in terms of injuries, retirements, tanks, body awareness etc. hahahaha. Put it this way Nadals record is so pathetic in this regard that you’re literally resorting to have to say look I know nadal sucks but hey look at this 36 year old

It’s like a fed fan having to use fognini or Anderson in some way to prop up fed. Yeah at least serve percentage is better than 136 ranked fognini.
 

octobrina10

Talk Tennis Guru
put it this way Fed at 36 and a father of four this season has played more tennis, has adapted better and has more but awareness and scheduling skills than nadal has pretty much in every single year of his career even his twenties lol. Nadal is so bad at at scheduling compared to fed it’s ridiculous why are you trying to compare?

LMAO you’re still trying to compare fed and nadal in terms of injuries, retirements, tanks, body awareness etc. hahahaha. Put it this way Nadals record is so pathetic in this regard that you’re literally resorting to have to say look I know nadal sucks but hey look at this 36 year old

It’s like a fed fan having to use fognini or Anderson in some way to prop up fed. Yeah at least serve percentage is better than 136 ranked fognini.
I post facts.
 

peakin11mugs

Semi-Pro
Given Agassi recently said Nadal is GOAT I'm inclined to consider his argument carefully especially after seeing so many Federer fans seem to consider h2h the deciding factor.

Nadal has won at least two majors on each surface. Federer hasn't done that. Nadal has Olympic singles Gold Federer hasn't done that. Nadal has 16 majors when there were two other goat contenders at their peak compared to Federers seven. Nadal has a winning h2h on outdoor hard court and clay against Federer.

The above is what Agassi and other pros look at when comparing the two. The Majors are what define players and the era in which they were won.

Federer is a legend is a class act and a gentleman. But he hasn't won a USO in a decade in which time Nadal has won three.

The point Agassi has been making is to be the greatest it is unusual to not have done so many things your greatest rival has done.

Anyway Nadal is the player of year for 2017 so the year is done and dusted early.

Some of these salty Federer fans are going to have the worse Christmas and new year ever. I'm stunned by the bitterness on here to Nadal. Envy one of the seven deadly sins as well
Oh and lol at you saying nadal did it in a harder field when he has just become no 1 and got 2slams in one of the weakest fields of all time and now that he has around 10 weak slams by your own definition. We know nadal wouldn’t get extra slams in an era even if he had to face ferrer in all 4 slam finals and in every single round because 2017 is the proof. He can’t even get 4 slam finals in this era he isn’t winning more in any era lol

lol at you pointing out weird obscure things like an Olympic gold as to why nadal is better despite 20 less titles, less slams etc but similtanelusly saying nadal has to be best player of 2017 years as he has most points (you don’t say most titles as you can’t even though you want to as fed has more titles) by your own logic Fed is better player no questions asked by being more successful.
 

peakin11mugs

Semi-Pro
I post facts.
You think you do. You don’t

You also miss the bigger picture such as nadals record is so bad you’re using a 36 year old as comparison. It’s like saying hey guys nadal isn’t that bad indoors look at fognini

Biggest picture you’re missing is that the 36 year old actually has played more consistent, has better scheduling, body awareness etc than a peaking nadal in 20s
 

aman92

Hall of Fame
Sad I have to ask such a question, but it is reality. Sorry, but 6 titles, 0-4 head to head against main rival, losing on a consistent basis to the likes of Querrey and Goffin-it just looks too bad. I started to watch tennis in 2008, and this is the first time I think a year end world number one is undeserved. In 2008, 2010, 2013 Nadal was the best player in the world, no question about that-Federer and Djokovic fans can complain as much as they want, it doesn't change. In 2016 Djokovic was the best player of the year, and yet Murray gave it all in the end and really fought to take it. However, in 2017 the best player (and it's not even close) is Federer. He dominates the tour and has just 4 loses, just 2 in important tournaments. Nadal had a good clay season, but on other surfaces he only played a good USO. Federer fans can say as much as they want that it is peak Nadal and Federer is a hero that he is beating him. But it's not true. Nadal's season can be called good only compared to 2015-2016. Compared to his prime it is a terrible season. And that loss to Goffin didn't surprise at all. I just feel like even he understands his world number one spot does not look good with the way he plays. What do you think?
Yeah he played a full season..was the best player in slams and deserved his ranking. It's ridiculous you claim yourself to be a Nadal fans with posts such as these
 

SQA333

Hall of Fame
Technically yes as he grabbed more points than anyone.

VB has to remember that WTF is not a joke. You need to beat atleast 4 top 8 players.
You can win a GS without facing any top 25 player but WTF is a different league competition.
No wonder Bull has not managed to win it...
May be this is his best chance with no Djokovic & Murray
His record against the top 10 outside clay is woefully average.
 

SQA333

Hall of Fame
He deserves it as much as Azarenka deserved her year-end #1 spot in 2012. We all know there was a player with a more impressive resume that season, although it's a bit different because said player did play the whole season. She was just trash at in the first half of the season.

This year, however, we have Fed who played the same number of events as Stan did, even though he missed half the season. By that token, Federer also missed half the season.
 

NatF

Bionic Poster
Nadal topped the rankings so he obviously deserves the #1 ranking. If Federer wins the WTF he'd deserve it more though regardless of the couple of hundred ranking points between them ;)
 

User123

Hall of Fame
Yeah he played a full season..was the best player in slams and deserved his ranking. It's ridiculous you claim yourself to be a Nadal fans with posts such as these
I'm just saying it doesn't feel too good given his results. In 2008, 2010 and 2013 his YE#1 were much more impressive.
 
D

Deleted member 77403

Guest
LOL at this whole thread, Federer and Nadal fans going at it full throttle. :)

Time for Djokovic to return and set the record straight for both of them. :cool::)
 

Jackuar

Hall of Fame
Nadal deserves it. He's a much better YE1 than 2016's Murray. Unlike Murray (or other instances, if any, in the past), Nadal didn't get YE1 by simply playing too many but rather he played a full season, competitively and fairly (except now the ugly show-face at WTF) and basically he participated in the full season. And rightfully, got more points and hence deserves it. There's no question on whether he deserves it.

Whether he IS the no.1 player - by quality ? That's a completely different discussion.
 

limmt

Rookie
Imagine a parallel world where there is one M1000 on grass, and three on clay. It would still be a Nadal-favoring calendar. But in that world, Federer finishes 2017 #1.
 

Gazelle

G.O.A.T.
He received far too many ranking points for winning the USO '250' Open. Sry, biggest fluke ever. There's a reason he hadn't won a HC title in 3 years. Without that mathematical error he wouldn't be number one right now.
 
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